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Heresiarch posted:we ask if something "still holds up" not because of how sf gets more inaccurate over time but because we tend to read a lot of sf as teenagers and in later years we realize that most of it was utter garbage yeah this we changed and the genre fiction remained dumb/gross or we didn't and we need it to be more dumb and gross can someone gently caress a blue alien with a light saber that transforms into some giant black genitals eh, rick and morty probably did that when i wasn't looking
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Nov 17, 2015 08:38
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Heresiarch posted:we ask if something "still holds up" not because of how sf gets more inaccurate over time but because we tend to read a lot of sf as teenagers and in later years we realize that most of it was utter garbage and even in the situation you describe it's not a question of the book "holding up" as if a changing reader is some property of the book itself
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Nov 17, 2015 08:50
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payphones aren't anachronistic anyway, you just don't notice them like you don't notice mailboxes
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Nov 17, 2015 08:59
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SmokaDustbowl posted:payphones aren't anachronistic anyway, you just don't notice them like you don't notice mailboxes they built a new one on the corner of my block next to the streetcar stop last week. i sure as hell noticed
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Nov 17, 2015 09:14
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infernal machines posted:they built a new one on the corner of my block next to the streetcar stop last week. i sure as hell noticed I think they do that for wifi now
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Nov 17, 2015 09:37
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vOv posted:this reminds me of a thing i read about during my Internet Skeptic days where people would claim they could help people with severe learning disabilities communicate by moving their hand around a board or whatever and waiting for them to 'signal' the right letter. turns out that this has all the problems you think it does. it gets worse    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/25/magazine/the-strange-case-of-anna-stubblefield.html
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Nov 17, 2015 10:21
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im starting the years of rice and salt audiobook again, did you motherfuckers somehow miss my last post about Balki being the narrator?
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Nov 17, 2015 11:28
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Sham bam bamina! posted:btw it's really irritating when people in this thread ask if something old "holds up" as if good books or movies have some kind of expiration date, it's such an awful way of thinking about things they absolutely do john carter was great for 1912, not so much in 2012
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Nov 17, 2015 14:35
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Heresiarch posted:we ask if something "still holds up" not because of how sf gets more inaccurate over time but because we tend to read a lot of sf as teenagers and in later years we realize that most of it was utter garbage There are still some otherwise decent stories out there that you just can't take seriously because of how things have unfolded though. Like the book 'The Immortals" by Tracy Hickman, which is mostly about the US Government rounding up everyone with AIDS (well, a thing related to it) but since it was written in 1996 part of what drives the story is that the internet ends up "dying" in the late 90s and is replaced by interactive cable, which allows the evil conservative government to exert massive control over it. And then the book was re-released in the late 2000s with the timescale moved up ala the revised The Stand and everything feels even more out of place. It's actually still a pretty good story, but a lot of the stuff on how the main action is possible creaks like hell. Pretty good commentary on how Regan deliberately mishandled the AIDS epidemic though. People should read it. Another thing that doesn't hold up due to technology changing: pretty much every Cory Doctorow book within 18 months of being released. Not that them tending to not be very good from the start helps, but still.
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Nov 17, 2015 15:58
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axolotl farmer posted:it gets worse yeah i learned about facilitated communication in school and its hilarious to watch a teacher ask a kid who doesnt even look remotely like theyre paying attention a question, pick up the kids hand, then smack some keys with it (all while the kid is staring off into space), then say "very good" like really, who the gently caress has any illusion about this?
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Nov 17, 2015 16:43
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Yeah basically the other reason to ask "does this hold up" in regards to sci-fi is a way of saying "do the story and characters make this worth reading on their own?" because remember SF stands for speculative fiction too and pretty often the Big Idea a book is built around becomes out of date or passe or mundane, so short of a good accompanying story there is no point to reading it even if it was considered a classic of its time. For example, even though it was an integral part of Star Trek tOS, no one today really watches it for the multicultural aspect. Its not fresh or shocking or notable that there is a black woman in space or a russian working alongside westerners. Its still holds up because the characters and plots were well written enough though. On the other hand, I struggled a bit reading Gibson. I recognize and respect his books because they were so far ahead of their time, but by the time I read them the world was at a point where I could only think "yeah, this would have been mindblowing if I read it when it came out." The stories/characters were only okay.
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Nov 17, 2015 18:19
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oh poo poo its about to get all scifi/skiffy/spec fic itt
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Nov 17, 2015 18:32
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MANIFEST DESTINY posted:Star Trek tOS ... Its still holds up because the characters and plots were well written enough though. you, uh, certainly have some unique opinions
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Nov 17, 2015 18:40
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hey kirk hosed blue and yellow chics okay, he's a really deep character
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Nov 17, 2015 18:59
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gibson holds up really well actually
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Nov 17, 2015 19:00
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MANIFEST DESTINY posted:I struggled a bit reading Gibson. I recognize and respect his books because they were so far ahead of their time, but by the time I read them the world was at a point where I could only think "yeah, this would have been mindblowing if I read it when it came out." The stories/characters were only okay.
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Nov 17, 2015 19:32
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It wasn't meant to be a direct comparison, and I wasn't saying Gibson is bad, its just that you can tell a large part of what made it classic is how people reacted when it was released at the time it was. You will never be able to fully appreciate why he is revered the way he is coming to it late, and that feeling might permeate the whole reading. It did for me anyways. The setting is still strong, but the plots are simple noir twists for the most part, when you get down to it. and Star Trek OS is being evaluated here on a TV sci-fi scale, okay? Its not the same standard as literature from 30+ years later or literature at all. It does hold up, its decently watchable outside the context of one of its core tenants being a then-radical multiculturalism.
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Nov 17, 2015 19:53
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SmokaDustbowl posted:hinterlands is one of my favourite short stories ever motherfucking same its so good
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Nov 17, 2015 21:03
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MANIFEST DESTINY posted:You will never be able to fully appreciate why he is revered the way he is coming to it late, and that feeling might permeate the whole reading. i think you have to read gibson now to appreciate how spot-on he was  so much of our language for even talking about computers is straight outta gibson
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Nov 17, 2015 21:06
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scifi discussion thread: straight outta gibson
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Nov 17, 2015 21:06
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schöne maschine...
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Nov 17, 2015 21:06
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Cocoa Crispies posted:i think you have to read gibson now to appreciate how spot-on he was Yeah in a way, but at the same time someone could pick it up and not even realize that so many of the terms were being coined right then and there, which is part of what I'm getting at. Its like how many people can read Shakespeare and have no idea that most of the turns of phrase that are common speech now originated there. To a degree, its the fault of the reader not having the context to fully appreciate something, but its also never as powerful experience going into a work backwards like that, no matter what you know.
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Nov 17, 2015 21:38
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man there's a load of new posts in the scifi thread, lemme just https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBSixNblakE
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Nov 17, 2015 21:59
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vOv posted:how do the neuromancer books hold up? like i get that they're classics and i should read them, but are they still good in their own right or is it just going to look silly yeah they're real good. Gibson is a good writer
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Nov 17, 2015 22:00
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Improbable Lobster posted:gibson holds up really well actually gibson is a boring twat
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Nov 17, 2015 23:09
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You Am I posted:gibson is, a boring twat don't sign you're posts!
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Nov 17, 2015 23:14
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later gibson isn't as interesting as early gibson because he stayed in one place while the world caught up and passed him the peripheral was really good though
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Nov 18, 2015 00:20
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apparenly everyone is clamouring for a sequel to the gritty snow white reboot  
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Nov 18, 2015 00:38
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it's actually a prequel so they can avoid having to use kristen stewart because she had an affair with the director
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Nov 18, 2015 00:39
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leading to the angry tumblr fangirls renaming the movie "ho white and the cuntsman" (not even kidding)
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Nov 18, 2015 00:41
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I'm so sad those pretty people will be bathed in teal and orange saturation for ninety one minutes
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Nov 18, 2015 00:43
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fargo is as good as true detective season 2 should have been
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Nov 18, 2015 00:49
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the new ghost in the shell movie is old cyberpunk as hell and awesome
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Nov 18, 2015 02:08
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deus ex: huntsman revolution
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Nov 18, 2015 03:05
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where would furiosa even get a dress made out of broken glass and birds
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Nov 18, 2015 03:09
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computer parts posted:it's actually a prequel so they can avoid having to use kristen stewart because she had an affair with the director she might as well have been a prop in the first one
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Nov 18, 2015 03:12
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JawnV6 posted:she might as well have been a prop in the first one more blatant misogyny in the scifi thread women are not objects
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Nov 18, 2015 03:14
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at the date posted:more blatant misogyny in the scifi thread don't
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Nov 18, 2015 03:21
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lttrIPDFplU
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Nov 18, 2015 03:21
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Nov 18, 2015 03:23
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