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Yeah. I think I said it before in this very thread, but it breaks verisimilitude to believe anyone would tolerate the Ironmen in general or the Greyjoys in particular. Like especially given how brutal many of the Targ kings were. It's not remotely plausible in the world GRRM created that Maegor or someone didn't turn the isles to glass.
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Apr 6, 2024 01:29
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Especially funny since Martin has since gone back and created two seperate times post-Conquest where the Ironborn have ravaged the Westerlands specifically. Nobody likes these idiots
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Apr 6, 2024 02:00
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Waltzing Along posted:Sometimes I am reminded of TS Morgensterns, The Princess Bride. Garth Ennis makes absolutely no secret that he didn't read superhero comics as a kid, and the Boys is just his natural state as a miserable bastard applied to taking the piss out of a genre he doesn't love and resents being the defining one in comics. He still uses sex and shocking violence way better than GRRM, though.
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Apr 6, 2024 02:17
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Mad Hamish posted:I'm trying to remember now and I feel like the iron mines were exhausted? Or am I confusing that with the gold at Casterly Rock? Casterly Rock was only running out of gold mines in the show, and it had barely any effect in the story even there. In the book, Kevan was pretty much dipping into the Lannister treasury to pay for the Crown expenses during his tenure as Hand because things were so hosed. Until Varys decided he was too competent. And yeah, Cersei's only good notion during her reign was thinking that Robert should have made another island out of ironborn skulls.
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Apr 6, 2024 02:30
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Sephyr posted:And yeah, Cersei's only good notion during her reign was thinking that Robert should have made another island out of ironborn skulls. This is white city dream erasure.
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Apr 6, 2024 05:14
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Libluini posted:My knowledge of real-life history forces me to disagree here, Robb was a good king, a smart king. Just not a Riverlanders-king and a lot of real-life kings would have sacrificed as many Riverlanders as necessary to keep their Northerners safe. Hell, IRL-Robb would have probably expected Edmure to slowly retreat while burning his own lands, to make Tywin's army starve on the march. Vikings got most of their ore from bog iron. Japan is famous for using iron sand, maybe you were thinking of that? Regardless, all of that is irrelevant because those are ways to avoid mining for iron. The charcoal is for smelting and forging and it doesn’t really matter where you got the iron, you still have to make a fire that burns hotter than wood can burn at all, ever. Charcoal, absolute rear end tons of it, is a basic requirement of ironwork. That’s why people used shittier-in-every-way bronze first : having a whole complex trade network between copper and tin mines is significantly easier than getting fire hot enough to melt iron. I can’t recommend that article series enough. (NB : I linked the second) It’s an ancient historian step-by-step walking you through the logistical steps involved in getting an actual iron tool. Absolutely fascinating stuff. He’s got another on food and another on clothes. You will entirely change how you think about pre-modern life. (Preview : really think about the idea that every piece of clothing or cloth you ever used in your whole life would have been entirely grown/sheared, woven, dyed and sewn by an immediate female family member or your wife. All of them.)
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Apr 6, 2024 05:27
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Obviously the Ironborn burn each other and especially their women and even more especially their victims (especially the women victims) to make iron. Human sacrifice is as common as trees in GRRMWorld so it can be used as a tree substitute in most circumstances.
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Apr 6, 2024 07:01
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Xiahou Dun posted:Vikings got most of their ore from bog iron. Japan is famous for using iron sand, maybe you were thinking of that? What's his take on Aragorn's tax policy?
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Apr 7, 2024 00:22
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Woodpile posted:What's his take on Aragorn's tax policy? I misread this as Angron's tax policy and thought briefly I'd clicked on the 40K thread by mistake. It's a head tax 
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Apr 7, 2024 00:44
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Xiahou Dun posted:Vikings got most of their ore from bog iron. Japan is famous for using iron sand, maybe you were thinking of that? I have done medieval-era weaving. It cannot be overstated how much loving work went into clothes before modern automation took some of the labor. I still do tablet-woven trim sometimes, and it's 30-40 hours to get a shirt's worth, and that's with someone else shearing, carding, spinning, and dying the wool I use. Hell, consider the labor required to do laundry in pre-modern society. Just an example, and this is 18th century, so a bit more available in the way of metal goods and chemicals. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xenLzd2-Dk Liquid Communism fucked around with this message at 06:14 on Apr 7, 2024 |
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Apr 7, 2024 06:11
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Me, every time anyone does anything: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=waf46eBajkw
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Apr 7, 2024 06:39
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The Jon Snow sequel show is officially poo poo canned because they couldn't find the right story to tell with it. Who'da thunk
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Apr 9, 2024 22:41
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Nice to know they planned a series before they had a story to tell. That's always a good sign. Not like a series is a storytelling medium.
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Apr 9, 2024 23:08
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Josuke Higashikata posted:The Jon Snow sequel show is officially poo poo canned because they couldn't find the right story to tell with it. Literally what could they have done with it, the show ending wrote every character into an unresolvable corner. Maybe they could've done the thing where Jon Snow stumbles upon a white walker art installation or a secret portal to Valyria but even then where does any of that go without the fat man actually writing new pages. Hopefully the show getting axed doesn't send Kit Harrington back into a depressive alcoholic spiral.
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Apr 10, 2024 05:48
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The show was called "Jon Snow Knows Nothing." And every episode he wanders into a new town, falls in love with a hot babe, and learns a new trade or skill and helps the locals with whatever their problem is. Oh wait, that's Golden Boy.
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Apr 10, 2024 06:35
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I do like how Jon got away with killing the Queen and convincing her fanatically devoted followers to just let him go North, which is basically what he wanted anyways.
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Apr 10, 2024 15:07
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Stupid Arya. Harrenhal gets taken over by her dudes and she doesn't say anything.
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Apr 11, 2024 05:15
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bobjr posted:I do like how Jon got away with killing the Queen and convincing her fanatically devoted followers to just let him go North, which is basically what he wanted anyways. What proof did they even have that he did it besides a melted chair and something possibly humanoid in Drogon's foot as he flies away at speed and great height. They literally can't disprove "Daenerys brohke thuh chain and floo of. Yur all free now". There's plausible deniability and reasonable doubt on all sides of that and the only reason they even know what happened is because he confessed, clearly. Why confess if he has no intent of serving his punishment? He just wanted to go back beyond the wall to gently caress wildlings and that's what he got. Apparently, the Unsullied didn't want him dead cos they didn't kill him despite executing Lannister soldiers for being soldiers who stood against them. He didn't clear himself in a trial of combat because that would make sense. The Unsullied just say cool bro and go die en masse to butterfly plague because Missandei  I think the show might be a bit dumb tbh
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Apr 11, 2024 06:44
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Josuke Higashikata posted:I think the show might be a bit dumb tbh Who are we to judge? Were all iddiots with double d for picking up the books in the first place
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Apr 11, 2024 09:21
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Rotten news. Stephen Attewell who was basically the guy to go go for AsoIaF writing as well as being an all round good guy and SF fan writer died. https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2024/04/steven-attewell-rip https://racefortheironthrone.wordpress.com/ gently caress cancer.
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Apr 11, 2024 18:21
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Zippy the Bummer posted:for some loving reason i remember it being the opposite actually I can't remember which is which, but Jaime and Catelyn have different opinions on Jayne's hip size. This caused readers to ask George if the one that Jaime met was a decoy. He copped to it being a mistake.
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Apr 11, 2024 23:57
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Deptfordx posted:Rotten news. Oh man this really bums me out. I have been reading his RftIT posts for YEARS. I thought the entire premise of the analyses as well as the quality of them were great. RIP my dude. e: I noticed the frequency of his posts was heavily reduced but had figured he was busy busy, and not cancer busy. Trivia fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Apr 12, 2024 |
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Apr 12, 2024 00:26
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Josuke Higashikata posted:I think the show might be a bit dumb tbh My headcanon is that Tryion talking a bunch of horseshit made Grey Worm realize none of these people would possibly be worth it and that their kingdom was 100% going to dissolve into another civil way in under a year. The biggest joke amongst all the bullshit with the ending is that they installed Bran as king but then also let the North -- his most obvious supporter and one of the key surviving factions they would want to keep in the realm -- become an independent state. So this means what, that Bran has no actual family support to back him or even an heir to the throne because his 3 surviving family members are exiled, sailing off the edge of the world, and the head of another country respectively.
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Apr 12, 2024 00:32
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Up to the "Theon takes a poo poo where he used to be fed" timeframe in my rerererereread, and for the life of me I STILL cannot grasp what the point of Reek's character is. Hoat cuts off feet, Timmet cuts off dicks and feeds them to goats, Bolton is all flaying people. Maybe I always had a certain number of characters that were decent enough to care about, and stinky-pee-hair never made the cut to devote brain power to. Ranks up there with ~Darkstar~ on the pointless character list. Book is so much better since I decided to not bother reading any Dany chapters.
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Apr 12, 2024 01:24
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I'm a bit confused at this point. There is a guy named Reek who is helping Theon. Ramsay got killed during some raid. I'm guessing Reek is actually Ramsay in disguise or something. And in a bit things will gel with the TV show? As long as there are sausages, I'll be good.
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Apr 12, 2024 01:35
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Reek is Ramsay
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Apr 12, 2024 01:57
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Hasselblad posted:Book is so much better since I decided to not bother reading any Dany chapters. My favourite re-read was, I think, suggested by this thread: quote:If you don't ready any Dany, Jon or Sam chapters at all, or any Bran or Davos chapters after Clash of Kings, it actually makes for one hell of a self-contained trilogy. The series ends with Tyrion realizing that Westeros just can't actually be saved so he just nopes the gently caress out while it burns to the ground behind him.
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Apr 12, 2024 02:06
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Guy A. Person posted:My headcanon is that Tryion talking a bunch of horseshit made Grey Worm realize none of these people would possibly be worth it and that their kingdom was 100% going to dissolve into another civil way in under a year. The biggest joke amongst all the bullshit with the ending is that they installed Bran as king but then also let the North -- his most obvious supporter and one of the key surviving factions they would want to keep in the realm -- become an independent state. So this means what, that Bran has no actual family support to back him or even an heir to the throne because his 3 surviving family members are exiled, sailing off the edge of the world, and the head of another country respectively. To be 100% clear, I am in no way defending the show, it’s caustic dog poo poo. That being said, inside the stupid framework of the show, Bran being a weird orphan with no power base works great. He’s not an actual king. He’s an elected king, so the houses electing him have a strong incentive to vote for a weak monarch who can’t boss them around. This explicitly isn’t why they voted for him, that’s way dumber, but that specific part of it makes perfect sense from a real-world perspective. But even if they’d rewritten that to be why Bran was chosen, they hosed that up and he’s still an omniscient tree-wizard who can possess anyone around you and make them kill you slowly. Because the show is loving dumb and written by hacks.
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Apr 12, 2024 03:24
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Pennsylvanian posted:I can't remember which is which, but Jaime and Catelyn have different opinions on Jayne's hip size. This caused readers to ask George if the one that Jaime met was a decoy. He copped to it being a mistake. When Catelyn first meets her she think Robb hosed everything up, but notices her wide birthing hips so things balance out a little. When Jaime meets her later he thinks Robb is dumb for throwing the war away for a woman with such tiny birthing hips. Since it was one of about three things we knew about her, people thought it was a fake Jayne since it was such a wide difference in description. Or Jaime just has a radically different view on hip size.
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Apr 12, 2024 04:33
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Jaime is dyslexic in the show, in the books he just has Hip Blindness. Maybe Qyburn can cure him with techniques banned at the Citadel.
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Apr 12, 2024 04:52
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There's an original Reek who is an unpleasant servant of Ramsay's. I don't think he ever appears in the story; he's caught doing something bad with Ramsay and they exchange clothes and Reek is executed insted of Ramsay, and that's still all backstory. Then Ramsay plays the Reek role for quite a while, and becomes Theon's advisor at winterfell, teaching him all kinds of evil stuff. Finally, Reek-Ramsay betrays Theon and makes him take on the role of Reek, while Ramsay is active under his original identity again.
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Apr 12, 2024 05:53
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Kylaer posted:Realism is not important, and indeed can often be detrimental to the story someone wants to tell, but internal consistency is important if you want your story to built on something other than handwavey bullshit. Hasselblad posted:~*Darkstar*~ on the best character list.
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Apr 12, 2024 06:26
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Guy A. Person posted:My headcanon is that Tryion talking a bunch of horseshit made Grey Worm realize none of these people would possibly be worth it and that their kingdom was 100% going to dissolve into another civil way in under a year. The biggest joke amongst all the bullshit with the ending is that they installed Bran as king but then also let the North -- his most obvious supporter and one of the key surviving factions they would want to keep in the realm -- become an independent state. So this means what, that Bran has no actual family support to back him or even an heir to the throne because his 3 surviving family members are exiled, sailing off the edge of the world, and the head of another country respectively. As the Glidus video puts it - Not Asha's support for the Targaryen invasion was on the premise that the Iron Islands would be independent, and then when this entire bullshit happens, Sansa declares she's independence and nAsha is like "wait, we can do that? it'd be awkward to speak up now, whatevs". Highgarden also belongs to Bronn, a mercenary whose entire character is that he'll do anything for power or money - the odds of him going to war to take the crownlands/throne and it's not that hard to blame him, the Starks can clearly do what they want. What's Bran gonna do? He can see poo poo coming but he can't actually do anything about it as an individual person. An assassin would gently caress him entirely up eventually.
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Apr 12, 2024 08:55
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I forgot, was Show Bronn also married to the mentally disabled pregnant heiress? I think that's where Book Bronn ended up?
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Apr 12, 2024 10:19
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pidan posted:I forgot, was Show Bronn also married to the mentally disabled pregnant heiress? I think that's where Book Bronn ended up? he was, for about one scene until he randomly went to dorne with Jaime and then ended up in every single episode as if he were a pov character.
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Apr 12, 2024 10:28
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pidan posted:I forgot, was Show Bronn also married to the mentally disabled pregnant heiress? I think that's where Book Bronn ended up? Yeah, poor Lollys Stokesworth, who was raped during the riots in Kings Landing. He names the child Tyrion Tanner, which annoys Cersei, then sets about cheerfully offing all the Stokesworth relatives between him and full control of the Stokesworth lands, which annoys Cersei even more, and through his wife he has a claim on the Rosby lands too, I think (the question of the Rosby inheritance keeps cropping up over and over, and all the Lannisters keep putting it to one side, which makes me think it's going to blow up in their faces at some point) Probably by the end of the books the intention was to have this utterly amoral lowborn sellsword in charge of two very important holdings in the Crownlands, which would have been hilarious. But the show translated that into him getting Highgarden, which is just...extremely dumb.
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Apr 12, 2024 11:56
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Irisi posted:Yeah, poor Lollys Stokesworth, who was raped during the riots in Kings Landing. He names the child Tyrion Tanner, which annoys Cersei, then sets about cheerfully offing all the Stokesworth relatives between him and full control of the Stokesworth lands, which annoys Cersei even more, and through his wife he has a claim on the Rosby lands too, I think (the question of the Rosby inheritance keeps cropping up over and over, and all the Lannisters keep putting it to one side, which makes me think it's going to blow up in their faces at some point) It's better than that, Cersei keeps hatching plots to off him, but instead he keep beating her plots and advances because of her half baked drunken plots, the failure of which she blames on the people she has hosed over by bullying them into these plots. One of whom she hands over to Quiburn, because they are loudly unhappy that Cersei has got her husband killed and lost her lands. They keep failing because she just isn't anywhere near as good at plotting as she thinks she is.
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Apr 12, 2024 12:58
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Collateral posted:They keep failing because she just isn't anywhere near as good at plotting as she thinks she is. This is the best thing about Cersei.
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Apr 12, 2024 15:48
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Xiahou Dun posted:Vikings got most of their ore from bog iron. Japan is famous for using iron sand, maybe you were thinking of that? Oh yeah, that was it. For some reason my mind went "mud... mud sand? something like that, I think", and then I typed "iron sand" like a dumbass instead.  About the charcoal... yeah, you're right. One of the reasons the Viking colonization of Greenland eventually failed was that when the connection to the homelands was disrupted and then the natives of North America aggressively disrupted the Viking's wood raids, there was after some point no iron available, and like the Iron Islands, there was no way to make iron locally. In hindsight, this must have been weird for the average kid growing up on the "Iron Islands" after the wood was gone, and the mines were depleted. Quite the ironic naming. They should have just renamed their lands to the "Salt Islands", imho
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Apr 13, 2024 20:58
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Libluini posted:
So does Westeros, since it's not landlocked.
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Apr 14, 2024 09:57
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