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DrVenkman
Dec 28, 2005

I think he can hear you, Ray.

Khablam posted:

I'm glad they both bounced hard off the idea of making up generic countries to fill a stereotype. Qumar & Equatorial Kundu are lovely stand ins.
I liked the episode when I first saw it, but it does not stand up to any scrutiny at all.
CJ is put across as a histrionic woman complaining about a women's issue, when we've seen her character already be so much smarter.
Why not give her a logical argument? There's a huge case to be made that trade, of arms or anything, can be used as leverage to bring about human rights; whether or not this works or not would make a more interesting discussion than the weird single-issue situation the episode presents.

I like that they note that CJ is thoroughly less concerned about the Native Americans and their issues in the previous episode. If anything she's slightly bemused by it. Yet now, she's going off the rails with concern.

I can see why they would consider putting the argument in Sam's mouth instead because it should be an ideological argument: The US is making deals with some really lovely people. Instead though it's an argument about women, and as a result CJ just starts to sound hysterical while everyone else has to explain that's just the way things are done. Until of course another woman has to come along and explain things.

I think if the argument was made by Sam, and it was more about them being an oppressive and violent regime then it might've worked better than it did.

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Khablam
Mar 29, 2012

pokeyman posted:

Also I'm rewatching the show for the nth time, and I don't know if it's the podcast or the changing times or what, but it's really hitting me how Sam does not miss an opportunity to be a piece of poo poo sexist. It would be an interesting character flaw except the show takes his side in every instance. I know that's not a revelatory observation or anything. Dude's just relentless.

He's Sorkin's Mary Sue.

myron cope posted:

I haven't finished this episode of the podcast yet, but one thing that stuck out to me was them being mad that CJ had to be the one talking about the women's issue, and it would have been nice to have Sam or someone else be the one who is advocating for it here. My problem is I feel like if it was Sam's issue (or any of the men) they would have probably been mad about how the show always needs a man to solve a problem and doesn't let the women contribute.

I mean, they still aren't wrong in their criticism. I just don't think that part specifically was an honest suggestion
It's an awkward complaint to justify on the face of it, but you can take the reading that "only women think this is bad" and that's disingenuous to the men who largely think similar, and to the women who are supposedly feeling the same but acting it out more.
The whole subject shouldn't have been attempted in ~45mins because you end up with this half-pitched piece where half the valid readings of what you're seeing have issues.

I like the podcast, because instead of just rolling my eyes at the bad optics in the episode we get to discuss it.

Khablam fucked around with this message at 00:22 on Jun 4, 2017

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust

There was one episode where Sam made it sound like he'd rather kill himself than go to a Chinese opera with Leo's daughter. Racist piece of poo poo.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Have you seen Chinese opera? I have and would also rather kill myself than repeat the experience.

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011


Lipstick Apathy
The more I think of it its kinda amazing that one episode can be attacked from so many ways at once.

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009


Grand Fromage posted:

Have you seen Chinese opera? I have and would also rather kill myself than repeat the experience.
Have you seen Western operas?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8OHbbmfnW8&t=1657s

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?



Yeah. I don't care for them either but it's not a comparable level of pain.

There is this show where I live where they cut the good bits out of all the Sichuan operas and do them on their own, like a highlights reel, so there's no screeching and it's just like two hours of fighting and spitting fire and stuff. That might be okay.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Mu Zeta posted:

There was one episode where Sam made it sound like he'd rather kill himself than go to a Chinese opera with Leo's daughter. Racist piece of poo poo.

Should have been a Klingon opera

DrVenkman
Dec 28, 2005

I think he can hear you, Ray.
Ron Silver was a gift and it's a shame they didn't use him more. Also, as amusing as it is that Sorkin drops Mandy, everyone forgets about Gianelli's team.

Also, I have to think his performance here got Mark Harmon that NCIS gig.

thrawn527
Mar 27, 2004

Thrawn/Pellaeon
Studying the art of terrorists
To keep you safe

DrVenkman posted:

Ron Silver was a gift and it's a shame they didn't use him more. Also, as amusing as it is that Sorkin drops Mandy, everyone forgets about Gianelli's team.

Also, I have to think his performance here got Mark Harmon that NCIS gig.

Well I doubt it was Summer School.

McNally
Sep 13, 2007

Ask me about Proposition 305


Do you like muskets?

thrawn527 posted:

Well I doubt it was Summer School.

It was Intimate Agony, actually.

thexerox123
Aug 17, 2007

The latest episode of The West Wing Weekly has Justin Trudeau in it, pretty good get.

WeAreTheRomans
Feb 23, 2010

by R. Guyovich

thexerox123 posted:

The latest episode of The West Wing Weekly has Justin Trudeau in it, pretty good get.

Yeah it's a pretty cool that he was an obvious WW nerd and was throwing out callbacks to random eps

WampaLord
Jan 14, 2010

The latest episode did something so loving frustrating though.

They mention that Donna uses a big word in one line, and Hrishi says he looked it up but doesn't say what the definition is!

:argh: How are you so bad at loving podcasting? They do this all the time, just drop points or go on tangents or interrupt each other when the other one is saying something really interesting.

Like, I want to like the show but I find myself yelling at them "JUST TALK ABOUT THE EPISODE YOU FUCKS!"

Also, I find myself skipping through every guest appearance unless they were someone who worked on the show. I don't want to hear about what people in government are doing, I'd watch the news for that, I want to hear about The West Wing TV show.

WeAreTheRomans
Feb 23, 2010

by R. Guyovich
I mean the word was "badinage" , and not to be too :eng101: but it's a pretty cromulent word, and the meaning is easy to parse from the context.

The podcast is pretty self-indulgent but I roll with it, and the latest episode was top-notch

WeAreTheRomans fucked around with this message at 14:36 on Jul 29, 2017

WampaLord
Jan 14, 2010

WeAreTheRomans posted:

I mean the world was "badinage" , and not to be too :eng101: but it's a pretty cromulent word, and the meaning is easy to parse from the context.

It really wasn't. She says the party will have badinage. That doesn't give me near enough context.

But thanks for spelling it so I can look it up, you're better at communication than two podcast hosts.

withak
Jan 15, 2003


Fun Shoe
I found the definition linked in the episode description.

WampaLord
Jan 14, 2010

withak posted:

I found the definition linked in the episode description.

It would have been nice if either of them had mentioned that, or just taken 5 seconds and said it.

I dunno, it seems like such a basic mistake.

Khablam
Mar 29, 2012

WeAreTheRomans posted:

The podcast is pretty self-indulgent but I roll with it, and the latest episode was top-notch
It has gotten a bit worse at this lately. They appear to finish discussing an episode, and I look and it often has 15-20 minutes left.
They need an editor pretty badly.

Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back
Grimey Drawer
I've felt the same way. WW is my favourite series of all time and I was thrilled for this podcast, but they just aren't very good podcasters. They're not super engaging and I don't feel they really add too much to the discussion of the episodes. It reminds me a lot of the commentary tracks on the episodes themselves. A lot of self-congratulating and not enough focus on providing interesting stories or being entertaining for the people listening.

I haven't listened to the lastest season's worth or so, but it doesn't sound like they've gotten much better.

TheBigBad
Feb 28, 2004

Madness is rare in individuals, but in groups, parties, nations and ages it is the rule.
They just whine and nitpick and it isnt entertaining. I just listen to the guest segments, and even those arent very interesting anymore.

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009


I'm so glad I didn't get a lapel pin or that stupid The Signal t shirt.

Also that this will be the only TWW podcast.

WeAreTheRomans
Feb 23, 2010

by R. Guyovich

TheBigBad posted:

They just whine and nitpick and it isnt entertaining. I just listen to the guest segments, and even those arent very interesting anymore.

Trudeau was great

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011


Lipstick Apathy
Am I the only one who had an insane nostalgia trip with all the Television Without Pity stuff?

edit: Oh huh it was about Sexism in the west-wing. That is super super interesting. :stare:

algebra testes fucked around with this message at 09:14 on Aug 11, 2017

WillMcAvoy
Sep 2, 2017
Because of TWW, I bought the Bach cello suites....

WillMcAvoy fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Sep 3, 2017

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011


Lipstick Apathy
"We're getting on too well, they're going to kill you."

Khablam
Mar 29, 2012

Mark Harmon 4 Allison Janney 4eva

WeAreTheRomans
Feb 23, 2010

by R. Guyovich

Khablam posted:

Mark Harmon 4 Allison Janney 4eva

"and then she backed her butt up into my crotch". so much for that non-explicit podcast rating

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011


Lipstick Apathy
As much as I hate the Warm Centrist Takes on the west wing weekly, Sorkin is always a good guest.

"The squibs are set so he could survive those gun shots!"

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algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011


Lipstick Apathy
New West Wing Weekly up with Martin Sheen. As always the pod is arguably the best when the hosts aren't actually reviewing the show.

edit: if you don't want to listen the biggest take away is they were talking about a season 8 on another network with Vinnick winning.

That and Martin thinks The Vietnam War Ken Burns doc is great, and he's right.

algebra testes fucked around with this message at 09:44 on Oct 4, 2017

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