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Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Brother Entropy posted:

Well, if she can air X-Factor will she even need to teleport? No chip damage during X-Factor and all.


Air XF won't get her out of it if it still works, it's a 1f setup and doesn't allow for any action since it happens specifically after her revival animation. Spidey UWT resets are better now since they're actually impossible to airdash out of now too, so the question is simply if the hitbox will still hit Phoenix.

Spidey is looking buff as gently caress in Ultimate though. Off a UWT you can solo combo into a 850k damage combo. He's still got the same frame advantage off his web zip now instead of being negative so he's basically got a really disgusting way to get in and start pressuring.

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Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Jmcrofts posted:

Firebrand
-Firebrand feels really "derpy", you can press a lot of buttons and get a lot of damage. He kind of feels like Taskmaster, where he doesn't actually have very potent mixup, but his normals are so huge and he is so fast that he can get a lot of hits just by being a bully.
-His lv3 is really loving fun. I had him in slot 3, so a common strategy was try to come back with lv3 x-factor and lv3 super active. He can just mash fierce to make his clone attack, and fly around mixing the other guy up.
-His moves that transition him between air and ground are pretty sweet, and I'm looking forward to getting time in with him to figure out all his movement options (he has a lot).

Hold on, what? From everything I've seen Firebrand's normals and damage have been really god awful looking. Like for an extended combo be barely breaks 600k for one meter.

Also. The correct name for Vergil's super is "sword dance".

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 08:36 on Nov 14, 2011

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Alteisen posted:

Those alts are loving fantastic, finally the Spencer alt everyone's always wanted.

It's close, but it's missing one vital aspect...

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

The quality on that cinematic trailer is really astonishing.

You could pretty much freeze the video on a random frame and it'd look straight out of a comic.

I mean, check it out:









It straight up looks better than the actual official art for the game.


Bonus Magnetoface:

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 00:21 on Nov 15, 2011

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Where the heck was Nidd!!

I wanted to expose your fraudulent Doom!!!

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

The dumb thing about some of the new teleporters is that due to how their teleports position them they're at no risk whatsoever when doing teleport mixups, even from fullscreen. It makes them really disgustingly good against keepaway and folks who actually have to risk something when throwing out projectiles, especially since if the projectile assist hits em it usually leads into a full combo off the derp rear end mixup.


Niddhogg posted:

Says the Phoenix player.

Says the Strange player!!

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 13:54 on Nov 17, 2011

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Niddhogg posted:

"Strange is the most fraudulent character in the game"

-Freyedun, in a natural state of saltiness.

Doctor Strange owns!!!


I beat you more times using him for the first time I had ever picked him than you beat me using him during that set.


That's how brainless he is.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

I've got a great reset too it's called "kill them in one combo" here let me show you

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ED6qZK2lVII&feature=youtu.be

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

It probably helps that Haggar and Nemesis have inescapable (if you don't have an airdash) resets..

But generally yeah if you have 2 meters at the start of a combo then you should go for a kill combo. If you've got one meter it's on you to decide whether it's worth spending the meter for the kill (if it's guaranteed) and leaving yourself open to XF2 momentum because you more or less have to take some form of risk (reset, TAC, sacrifice XF) to finish off their second character.


Obviously top tier teams and really good combos can somewhat bypass this, but overall that's the general pace the game currently follows.

Also spending a meter at the end of a combo tends to leave you in a neutral/reset state instead of continuing to have momentum so it's very favorable to not super at all and go for the reset.

By sacrificing meter you're also sacrificing the ability to shut down assists/punish assists effectively if you're a character with a projectile super, and generally losing out on whatever specific tools your supers provide.

An easy example would be Hawkeye, whom without meter you can basically superjump for free and press buttons all day in the air on. However, with even one meter the prospect suddenly becomes far riskier because he can blow you out of the sky and place the momentum at his advantage instead of neutral.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

You can't reset 360s so you must be playing a PS3 and therefore already automatically lost

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Tae posted:

Did Viscant retract his comment later in boxarena, or does he still think Wesker got nerfed?

He's technically nerfed as a character it's insignificant against the general system changes that all help him and his counterpicks (and other top tiers) being nerfed in the ways they counter him. If you had the choice between vanilla Wesker and ultimate Wesker you'd choose Vanilla every single time.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

bouncyman posted:

He just looked utterly broken that he lost the tournament on what was essentially an input error. If I remember the play correctly, he was in X-Factor and doing an unsafe Hyper that whiffed, Rog's Wolverine was about to divekick him so ChrisG tried to DHC to Shinku hadouken to catch Wolvie mid dive kick (and probably would have killed him coz of Xfactor) but got Ryu's lvl 3 instead so he whiffed it, lost all his meters and lost the tournament like 15 seconds later. Rog was already down a character, and Wolvie was at like 30% health so if the hadouken landed, Rog woulda been down to one char with no meter to Chris G's two chars and three bars.

Apparently it's actually an input bug with Ultimate's input buffer where it will input DP instead of QCF unless you hit HCF. I know I've run into a few times when doing Hawkeye poo poo and it's absolutely infuriating that he basically lost because of Capcom's stupidity. I sincerely doubt that someone on his level input a DP instead of a QCF with that much time to spare in the input.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Elephunk posted:

Anybody figure out those Chris G combos with Hawkeye/Ryu assist? And like 5 net arrows?

His combo is really intuitive to the point of where it's probably the first thing you try as Hawkeye/Ryu. The net arrow loop is kinda tight but it shouldn't be a problem for someone who doesn't have rear end execution like mine. (it also works fullscreen and is an infinite in xf3)

The specific combo he does is: slide+call ryu assist->l trick shot into poison tip (timing is always the same, if it's blocked you're safe if it hits or the slide hits ryu carries them)->net arrow->single h shot xx net arrow looped 3 times (or 2 if he's feeling unsafe about his timing since each rep has tighter timing)-> l/h trick shot (spacing dependent) into ice arrow -> launch -> j.mhs -> mash firebrand assist while falling -> delayed l trick shot poison tip -> launch -> j.hs -> poison tip

The reason you don't slide after the ice arrow ground bounce is because it severely increases your hitstun decay and causes the opponent to stay way longer on the ground as to allow for the assist+poison tip section of the relaunch.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Chill Penguin posted:

Has anyone experimented with tigerknee'ing Taskmaster's Aim Master? I don't know if it's just me, but the timing seems really weird, resulting in him doing a full jump rather than a short hop.

You will never get a short hop off a tiger knee'd aim of hawkeye because Taskmaster keeps his momentum from previous movement during all his actions other than mighty swing and his supers. Even if you tiger knee it perfectly he will just accelerate really quickly upwards when he fires the arrows.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Orange Crush Rush posted:

Do all command grabs in this game have the same scaling? I know all grabs scale 50%, but combos started off Skrull's or Haggar's or Felica's grabs seem to not scale nearly has much, do they all scale differently? Is it different for each character?

Nope, Nemesis's command grabs supposedly scale extremely little and if it's the same as vanilla MVC3 Felicia's just straight up doesn't scale at all.

I think just about everyone else's command grabs scales their hitstun a lot alongside their damage.

Except maybe Thor.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

dat fukkin dog!! posted:


It sounds like people get real caremad when teams have Wesker as an anchor, so it sounds like the real issue here isn't necessarily Wesker, but Xfactor being a really lovely and dumb mechanic.

It's actually both because the system compounds with his design to create "A Really Good Character". Anchors got stronger in this game but the first person to x-factor with them is only relevant in regards to what they are (at the moment) because every single good anchor kills people on incoming mixups.

The argument of "he's a veteran top tier who has been played for awhile vs other characters!!" justifying his position as "best anchor" is really strange because it doesn't really have anything to do with experience. It's his team functionality, strong overall tools and ability to make the entire other team irrelevant once he lands a hit (even if they have Wesker anchor oh noooo)that makes him the best anchor. You know, his character design.

There are obviously other characters like this, but none of them have the overwhelming overall strength he has as an anchor due to his complete lack of necessities for doing anything as an anchor and team functionality.

Overall I don't believe Wesker should be nerfed as a character tool-wise, because there's obviously going to be good characters one way or another (and if you nerfed him, I'd argue that you would have to nerf many of the potential top tier who don't "work" for their damage) but specifically HIS anchor potential is a problem at the moment and it isn't simply due to one factor. The only nerf I'd argue for is nerfing his x-factor duration but who knows what other stupid characters ( ZERO DORMAMMU ZERO DORMAMMU ZERO DORMAMMU the real best characters in the game ) would take his place.

edit:
Also people saying that nerfing his glasses change would make him "ok again" are morons and don't understand why he's currently so strong in the first place.

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 06:41 on Dec 15, 2011

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Obviously in exchange they're going to give him a gun.

A gun that fires adventure game bullets and kills people in one shot.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Give Maya Shield an active hitbox that doesn't degrade it's blocking power.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Buff Taskmaster


if you don't agree you're a Hitler

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Just putting this here for future reference:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsvmKtTG9m0

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Zero was straight up the best keepaway character in vanilla Marvel 3 by an extreme long shot due to the buster raindrop poo poo he could pull. A good Zero could (and would) sit at the top of the screen for the entire match raining level 1/2 busters on you while calling assists because almost every single character in the cast had no answer for it.

He's definitely in the top of keepaway characters in Ultimate too, though it's because his lightning buster cancels and how they lead into full combos. He's at more risk but also covers far more space for a longer amount of time so it ends up evening out.

If people are really looking for a "counter" to anchor Wesker the answer is Zero because he's basically untouchable by Wesker (and almost every single rushdown character) outside of a major fuckup and has been since the original game.


edit:

He's also easily top 3 in the game, and probably fighting Dormammu for the spot as "best character" (his only weakness is that he can't threaten assists as much as Dormammu can so people can call them on him more often, though it's probably useless because he won't be in their control area)

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 01:47 on Dec 16, 2011

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

A bunch of jumbled notes on Hawkeye because I'm tired:

His air normals are all kinda rear end-y, but generally they can somewhat trade or beat out people who are being reckless and not respecting them. The general rules go: if they are coming at you horizontally in the air, hit j.m->j.h->net arrow into a full combo. If they're coming at you from above, j.h->net arrow. If from before, j.l->j.s. Remember that his throws are absolutely godlike so use them as much as possible when seeing gaps in your opponent's strings.

Net Arrow is the best anti-rushdown tool in your arsenal. Abuse the gently caress out of it because it's much scarier than triple arrow, which is only good for controlling the screen when they're advancing carefully. If they're advancing at a breakneck pace without giving a drat, throw out net arrows because you absolutely need to put the fear into them of not advancing carefully (and therefore eating more arrows). Piercing bolt is great when it hits because it knocks them back nearly fullscreen, but remember to mostly do it off near-ground normal jumps or else you're probably gonna be eating normals due to it's slow startup.

In fact, do most of your arrows close to the ground when jumping so you can chain more of them together. Remember that Hawkeye's arrows in the air extend his landing box vertically so he lands faster, so you can do more arrows. Air net arrow -> shot ground arrow covers the entire normal jump area with an extremely dangerous projectile. Triple arrows for speed, net arrows for effectiveness. Learn when to alternate between the two because it is the key difference between being a poo poo Hawkeye and a dangerous Hawkeye.


DHC into super scatter shot if they aren't being hit. It's safe and pushes them back fullscreen. If they press any button other than throw they'll get hit and eat ~200k-300k worth of damage. Remember to tag on the air piercing bolt at the end, or fire triple piercing shots so they don't immediately begin advancing on you upon teching out.

Unless you are escaping over an assist call or going for a throw never, EVER enter the superjump height. Hawkeye's effective toolset is grounded, and triple piercing shot is extremely good at forcing people to respect the superjump area because it covers the entire superjump area while scatter only covers a small area. Don't use scatter shot. DON'T USE SCATTER SHOT. Triple piercing shots force the opponent down quicker, which is what you want most of the time. It's good for certain ranges and if you know they like to jump upwards and press buttons/incoming character pressure but because it doesn't cover you while you fire the arrow it is complete garbage for a true lockdown assist. If they move forward at all during your shot, Hawkeye dies.


The primary strength of scatter shot is that it causes untechable soft knockdown, meaning that before they touch the ground no matter what height they are at they won't be teching out of the fall, which means if you do it meaty against people waking up (at the right distance) or incoming characters if they press ANYTHING you can net arrow them and begin a full combo.

Stuff about his trick shot: if you do trick shot M immediately canceled into speed shot I'm almost 100% certain it is the absolute fastest projectile in the game. The speed at which the arrows come out is nearly instant, and is a good way to begin advancing on people and pushing your way out of a corner because you can cancel into it from a single shot.

Speaking of which, don't ever charge your h shot. The strength in it lies in the speed, not any of the other goofy gimmick poo poo that it offers. The single shot makes it so that whatever option the other player wants to outzone you with will lose because of how fast that tiny rear end single shot is. Aimed shots are marginally useful against Ammy but that's about it.

When using exploding arrow, don't get cocky. The hitbox on the explosion is really garbage, and isn't as much of a threat as most people think. More often than not it's very safe for characters to stick their limbs in there and hit Hawkeye while you think you're safe. Think of it instead as a method to threaten pressure with (when you corner someone) or a way to gain a little bit of ground. Also important: if they are dumb enough to get hit by the grounded explosion, net arrow them and go into your combo.

edit: Spacing is important, don't let people fool you otherwise. As Hawkeye you generally don't want to be pushed into the corner slowly because that's where people can run free on you. Learn his ranges for slides and arrow slaps, force people to either retreat or gain ground slowly (by pressuring them) rather than simply upbacking your way to your eventual death. Hawkeye's corner pressure game is actually really disgusting because of the exploding arrow and ability to chip/lockdown very hard.

Despite what people think, against good players Hawkeye requires knowledge of when and where to use his tools- if you gently caress up with them it's extremely likely that he is going to crumple into a tiny ball and die because his defensive options are garbage. Which means if they are getting close to you, start thinking about how you're going to get out because mashing buttons as Hawkeye doesn't work as an escape option. Abuse his slide and autocorrecting trick shots to get out of people who like to jump/SJ to advance. Pushblock and threaten them with st.M if they're doing grounded stuff. But mostly, BLOCK. As Hawkeye you need to know when to press your buttons or else you are gonna die.


And always remember the number 1 rule for Hawkeye: Don't waste your meter because reaction Gimlet (NOT RANDOM GIMLET) will scare people out of a LOT of stuff and punish even more.

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 14:32 on Dec 17, 2011

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Heroes and Heralds is the loving most amazing thing and Capcom is retarded for not including offline versus mode support for it because IT'S SO GOOD.

Multiple Man + Cyclops + Stephen =
MANGO SENTINEL RIDES AGAIN

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Shinku ABOOKEN posted:

I have a problem fighting my buddy's Vergil.

When I block Vergil's magic series he just spams SHSHSHSHSHSHSHSH... until I push block him. This block string builds him a ton of meter.

Is that punishable?

Pushblock him and kill his rear end because Vergil whiffing H or S is a death sentence.
If he's someone who does teleports in blockstrings then once you're in the middle of his blockstring, start holding down forward. The autoguard will make it so he can't actually mix you up as long as you pushblock properly.

The thing you have to remember about Vergil's offense is that it has to end, and every single way he can end it is completely unsafe if he doesn't disengage before his assists recover.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Eldred posted:

And the second anyone gets anywhere in a tournament with Firebrand I'll eat crow

She-Hulk was a top tier character because people place top 8 consistently in tournaments with her.

Is Viper a bad character because so few top players used her?

Is Zero a bad character because so few top players used him?

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Brosnan posted:

All the arguments in favor of Firebrand being good look a whole lot like the arguments in favor of Jill being good, and she's still not.

The difference is that Firebrand dances all the time and has real tools beyond "a cool teleport mixup".


but mostly the dancing.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Jamikaze posted:

Hey I'm streaming some Marvel casuals tonight if you guys want to watch. http://www.twitch.tv/boomgorillas - Fellow goon Fereydun is here!

Edit: Fixed the link!

Stop revealing all my secret teams by streaming me picking them!!


edit: I also noticed something drastic that they changed with Ryu in Ultimate:


They took out the jetplane sound for his Shin Shoryuken.

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Dec 31, 2011

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

tynam posted:

Up guns at full screen doesn't hit Wesker's sj.gun spam, which is what this guy does. Beam assist doesn't help either, since Wesker is always in the air. SJ.guns is risky as hell since it's recovery frames all the way down to the ground. Wesker then gets in on ME and I'm boned.

I've tried a quick dash-toward to up guns to catch Weskers out of the air, but if I mistime or mis-judge it even a little (the Wesker doesn't actually jump), then they get in on me and either punish or I'm in mixup hell.

Now that I think about it, I should probably try missiles assist instead.


Edit: Also, Deadpool is actually more of a hybrid keepaway+rushdown now, given his new teleport cancel. Keepaway to zone them to max distance, then guns/teleport mixup or quickwork/teleport mixup to get in.

It just doesn't work against people that live in the air.

He's always been an all rounder. It's nothing new.

Just normal jump forward, or double jump forward then H guns.

The real secret to fighting Wesker is to not let him play his game, which is either a. running away in the air (air OK characters like Zero or Trish can do this) or b. pressuring him. He's simply more effective than most characters in other situations.

Also don't burn XF against Zero because you won't be able to hit him due to the multi hitting nature of his moves and his ability to throw you out of XFGC if he's close enough. Same with Wesker on the throw stuff.

Against people in the air as Deadpool just harass them with jumping H gun, throw grenades, and continue to try and get advantageous positioning while they're up in the air where they can't see you.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Niddhogg posted:

He's really bad. Just like with every low tier character in umvc3 you can kill an enemy who doesn't know what your character can do (ie, the last tournament I was at I saw a Wright player hit people with overhead finger because they thought crouching finger hits low) but in the end all his gimmicks are worthless compared to the good characters.

I got to witness one of the best Phoenix Wright players in the country last Saturday and even he admitted PW is basically one of the worst characters in the game. (The best Zero player in the country also admitted his character is blatantly broken)

On the other hand, he sent a shitload of good players to the losers bracket including Stone, who placed 9th at EVO last year.

...but the tournament was so poorly run that the match didn't even make it on stream.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Nah, it was at a tournament in Killeen where a lot of folks from around Texas showed up.

The Phoenix Wright player you're talking about is the same guy though (Poltergust).

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

It's hilarious that Rashaan fell right for that after Frank didn't capitalize off the first kneedrop. I'm guessing it's a corner specific thing, which is why Spidermankid was backing himself into the corner after that hit.


Also, the guy who OCVed EMP is apparently Predator1a, who used to (and maybe still does?) play online. He's been running his team since Vanilla and boy howdy will I tell you that his team is really loving annoying online. (and apparently offline!)

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Block if they've got a setup.

If their setup doesn't have any kind of meaty, gimlet and XF to escape/mixup.

If they meaty you without any mixup or you block their meaty and they're close XF grab them.

Hawkeye's close range options are still pretty awful against all the good characters.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Doom. The answer is Doom because it gives Nova a real neutral game (that is, "press doom assist") and doom/strider is a pretty dope combination too.

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Okami shuffle does less damage than hailstorm, and doesn't OTG. He said team super, as in THC.

It's also not active first frame after the flash like hailstorm.

From what I've seen Storm isn't amazing or anything, but she's got pretty decent utility in her DHC/THC doing monstrous damage, a decent assist, and having a relatively good mixup/reset game. Her instant overhead float is one of the best overheads in the game, and her j.S is insanely active which is pretty useful considering her movement.

Honestly the best strength she has from what I've seen is her movement speed, which is vital in this game. She's basically got the best mobility in the entire game, alongside having the longest airborne time thanks to hover and flight.


Also you can't upback a good Zero without the right characters, his mixup game is loving ridiculous if you let him get under you without hassle. You need to be able to challenge him horizontally in the air (normal jump height mostly), or have extremely good mobility while still being able to stay above him and shoot projectiles (you need to be able to move after firing projectiles.).

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Niddhogg posted:

I've gone through Vergil and Dr. Strange, but I still can't find a good third character to complement my Mag/Doom duo. Any suggestions?

Depends on what assist you're using with Doom. If you're using Plasma Beam then you need some form of lockdown assist- dog ice, sent drones, eye, that kinda stuff.

I think if you use hidden missiles you basically get a similar effect to the lockdown stuff (minus the space control which is a pretty important aspect of those assists) so you probably want some version of a "get in" type assist like (any projectile assist), akuma assist, or whatnot..

You've got a pretty large selection of characters for who can go into that third slot. I personally think that doom beam + lockdown is better combination wise for Magneto, so your choices are like.. Akuma, Sentinel, Strange, and Dog?

I'm sure there's a few others, but generally requiring a lockdown assist limits your choices somewhat as anchor- you won't get a universally strong anchor out of it, though guys like Akuma and Dog are your best choices if you want a competent third.

However, I also feel as if Doom needs more of a projectile/getting in assist than a lockdown assist though, so I guess that would open your choices for anchor to "anyone with a projectile assist" and more which allows for poo poo like Hawkeye anchor (and hawkeye + missiles).

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Transient People posted:

There's a rumor? Did somebody talk about it anywhere? Haven't heard about it, and while possible, it's very unlikely without any further details.

Filipino Champ mentioned it on the FGTV stream a few days ago. It was just an offhanded mention, where he was like "too bad zero's being nerfed~ i got some good sources on this".


I hope it's true because gently caress that midget.


in bigger hopes i hope it buffs ghost rider because that guy is my homie.

edit:

http://www.twitch.tv/fgtvlive/b/310721205

12 hours 23 minutes in.

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 07:32 on Mar 7, 2012

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

SpaceBees posted:

I'd rather they'd buff the lower tier characters than just nerf all the high tier ones.

If you buffed any "lower tier" character to Zero, Dormammu or Wesker's level they'd just be really retarded too. That's not a good thing..

Like, realistically how the gently caress are you gonna buff someone like say.. Ghost Rider(yesss) to Zero's level? He doesn't have amazing assists, he doesn't have bullshit retarded fullscreen pokes/mixups that are safe, he doesn't have the absolute best projectile in the game... Nothing in his design could be "buffed" to that level- understand?



edit:

vv ahahahaha you think dante is bad now


also removing xfactor would own but not really fix wesker, dormammu and their ilk because they're still insanely good despite x-factor (in fact, dormammu would be BETTER without x-factor)

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 07:38 on Mar 7, 2012

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

Transient People posted:

Let's see...who'd be nerf-worthy, anyway? Zero, Wesker (no glasses buff/glasses buff reduced to a third or half), Dorm's MastaCJ mixup, and what else?

Spencer's unscaled damage on his zipline (and the ability to confirm off his movement grapples from fullscreen... seriously what the gently caress is that nonsense?), Wolverine st.L AA hitbox and damage output, Doom's FOOTDERP/the ability to dash cancel it on block.

I'm sure there's more I'm forgetting but those are the serious offenders that can be tweaked somewhat easily..

And of course, remove X-Factor.

Forever.




edit: For Wesker honestly I'd nerf every single thing about him: his speed, his damage and his hitboxes. He has everything from a great keepaway (not even runaway, loving keepaway) game with ridiculous mobility options to some of the best pokes in the game alongside one of the best dashes in the game. Even if all of those got nerfed his toolset is still so good that he'd easily be high tier- it's strictly in his character design.

ALSO GET RID OF RANDOM CROSSUP PHANTOM DANCE WHAT THE gently caress

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 08:05 on Mar 7, 2012

Fereydun
May 9, 2008

darealkooky posted:

dante


His tools are still better in combination than every single character you mentioned. Also he still builds really good amounts of bar for every combo and every single combo of his leaves you in an extremely favorable reset position. If you asked someone who they would rather have point if they could play a characters at their top level no one in their right mind would pick Doom over Dante unless they were really lovely.

Like seriously do you really think Dante is "comparatively bad" to most of the "high tier" characters because seriously he's not.

You need to stop looking at his damage/combos and look at the fact that he controls the match extremely well, can confirm off almost everything alongside that and then turn whatever he just confirmed off of into a really hard to block reset that can't be mashed out or tagged out of that then probably turns into a kill combo.

edit: Also Phoenix really isn't that large of an issue anymore for a shitload of reasons, so I'm not really sure why you mentioned her...


vvhe blocks everything that's faster than 5? frames after the flash if he's grounded too thanks to bold blocking lol

Fereydun fucked around with this message at 08:23 on Mar 7, 2012

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Fereydun
May 9, 2008

S-Alpha posted:

Yes, but what could they do? He already dies in one combo from any member of the cast, and changing his soft knockdown stuff would gut his damage down to abysmal, since that's entirely what he relies on.

Remove his buster cancel, or make lightning not cancelable by buster. Also lower his damage scaling from .3 to like .1.

His damage scaling is actually obscenely high regardless, and the fact that he's got incredible tools outside of the lightning poo poo (buster, great movement, great normals, insane insane reset game) would keep him pretty high up there still.

If you scaled down his maximum damage scaling he wouldn't have his ridiculous damage off his lightning loops, and if you removed buster canceling he wouldn't have fullscreen crossups and pokes that lead into death combos/nearly unblockable resets.

You gotta remember that his reset game is still one of the best in the business, and that he's still got the buster->lightning reset at the end of his combos that safely lead into his mixup game/a combo if they mashed.


He would still have the shadow super, which basically gives him control of the match because once he turns it on he stops giving a gently caress about everything that could match or beat his options.

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