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Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Egregious posted:

This pretty much sums up my experience with Battletoads playing with a neighbor as a kid. In fact I remember the rappelling part a bit more irritatingly than the infamous Wind Tunnel segment.

For me it begins and ends with the wind tunnel: when one of you dies, you both die. Total bullshit. Considering how infamous the game is in this regard, if Arino and say, Inoko MAX do co-op on that particular section of the game, it would seem too coincidental and scripted. There are plenty of places where two players are actually a handicap (read: the entire game), so having them beat each other up "accidentally" while swarmed with enemies would seem more genuine.

I'm happy they're doing Battletoads though, as it's a legit, insanely tough game. I was watching the raws of Super Mario World, and the one thing that really gets my goat is when Arino continually fails on the easiest games ever made in the history of people making and playing games. He lost 60 lives (SIXTY!) on the 4th castle. It's infuriating!

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Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

AnotherGamer posted:

Speaking of VC episodes, is anyone working on the Super Metroid one? That one's pretty much a full lenght one and the raws in the blog are tagged as private.

Here's a megaupload link to the Super Metroid raw http://www.megaupload.com/?d=M2LT436G Note: not my link and I haven't watched it yet (but I'm dling it now). Still finishing up the Super Mario World two-parter, and I don't know if I can watch it all the way through. We all already know how it ends, and seriously, no one can be this bad at platformers. Arino has to be killing himself on purpose. It's like the Homer Simpson "Jebus" line. In hindsight, kinda funny. But no one can be that stupid.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

zari-gani posted:

Yeah everyone keeps saying Super Mario World is easy, but I don't get it. One of the biggest appeals of this show to me is how much I can relate to Arino's experience with these games, asides from his tenacity. I see some people think he's dying on purpose but his efforts look completely genuine to me.

Part of the problem, for me, is that for example, I'm watching him fight Bowser (Koopa). Through painful lurching and contortions, he's made it to the boss' third form. How can he be unable to time the cadence of his bouncing attack? I mean, Arino can write his own name, yes? Wasn't he a musician, a drummer, in a past life? (I remember this being mentioned when he played a drumming game in an arcade somewhere.) He runs right into Bowser, losing his Super status, and then runs right into him again, dying.

I'm yelling at the screen at this point! Look, I'm no super genius video game player and I don't want to sound like (too much of) a dick, but I didn't even know there was a Game Over screen to Super Mario World. I can barely watch this, but I need something to do while the Battletoads raw downloads. I suppose a big part of the appeal, as you say, is watching him struggle with game we ourselves struggled with. Watching him fail constantly with a game we could play with our arms tied behind our backs is pure agony!

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Ineffiable posted:

If anything, GCCX is just Top Gear with lovable, endearing characters.

I think both arguments are sound, certainly the cultural celebration of games/cars comparison. I'll definitely admit I clicked on the banner because I enjoy Top Gear, and at first I didn't see the connection: my hang up was that Clarkson, May and Hammond are complete, stone-cold gear heads (petrol heads?). They are automotive experts. Arino doesn't display that obsessive quality when it comes to games; if he never played another game on camera again, I don't think he'd be too miffed. I don't think he'd be too miffed at anything, really, because he's Arino.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Crotch Bat posted:

Quest of Ki down in a little under 6 hours. The 80s and 90s are really weird in that you'll breeze through a couple levels and then get stonewalled out of nowhere for 20-30 minutes. Then clear another 3 levels in under 10 minutes and hit another wall. Not impossible but can get immensely frustrating and it's easy to see why Arino acted like he did during parts of that video. Definitely recommend to anyone looking for an old-school challenge.

Also it's apparent my console gaming "muscles" vanished with my childhood and the advent of PC gaming because my thumb was killing me last night and it still hurts a little. Arino's thumbs must be in sad shape after some of these games.

Wow, congrats dude. I could only imagine playing Quest of Ki if the President had been kidnapped by ninjas and that was in their list of demands (it could happen, people). Now why don't you take that diaper off and try a REAL CHALLENGE: Super Mario World.

Because, you know, according to the consensus in the thread, it's like hard. Or something. :rolleyes:

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Bocc Kob posted:

Toejam & Earl + Streets of Rage 2 made the whole thing worth it!

I like how Kibe is a huge Sega fanboy. Makes him even more :3: imo. Also, when they did that "Aces of Hardware" bit, all those retro consoles have to be his (Kibe's), right? Seems like it would make sense.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Shlapintogan posted:

Okay, so, remember how a lot of people were kind of adverse to the amount of cheese in cartoon meat? Well, I found this today. Now you can make your own. Even better, it's based on Golden Axe's meat, so it's related to another GCCX challenge! :buddy:

Game Center CX: The Iron Chef of Video Games

Thinking about it, in addition to all the treats he normally gets while playing games, Arino does get some funky, game-specific stuff. From cartoon meat to all the neat snacks from 53 Stations, to when Inoko MAX brought him some cake inspired by Bio Miracle.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Snot Man posted:

What I hate is when they end a big, attention-grabbing headline and end it with a question mark, so you can't see it from a RSS feed and it turns out it's just commenting on some dumb internet rumor for Portal 3 or whatever.

Fun thing I learned working in super market tabloid journalism: if a headline ends in an exclamation point, it's true; if it ends in a question mark, it's false. I can't write "Snot Man Raped and Killed a Young Girl in 1990!", because you'd then sue us for libel. But I can certainly pose the question, "Did Snot Man Rape and Kill a Young Girl in 1990? Turn to page 26 to find out!" That issue would sell like hotcakes. Hotcakes I tell ya!

Gawker and kotaku certainly fit the mold of super market tabloids on the internet.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Obeast posted:

This. Aside from "Mario vs. Airman", which is a one level Mario 1 romhack that takes place in Airman's stage in Mega Man 2, I imagine most "crossover" hacks are pretty lovely. I kinda wish that the guy who made it could make a full rom of the game so people could play it in any emulator (which would be really good for people with softmodded Wiis), or put it on a PowerPak or reproduction cart to play it on an actual NES.

Edit: For anyone who enjoyed Mario Crossover, there's also the recently released Abobo's Big Adventure, which is really well done and actually pretty tough.

On the Abobo page they have instructions on how to play with a gamepad/NES controller. It helps, of course, to actually have one you can plug into the USB port, but I'm playing Abobo right now, and their instructions were good enough.

joek0 posted:

I thought his quickest challenge was Hi No Tori(6 Hours. I didn't know Ninja Spirit was done in about 2+ hours. But he played the game in PC Engine Mode. I don't have the Turbo Grafix version, but the Arcade version for PC from the Irem Arcade Collection. The Arcade version is much harder. You only get 1 hit per life. The PC Engine version gives you 5 hits per life.

I know it wasn't his quickest challenge, but Arino completely smoked Battle Golfer Yui. We all know Arino has a knack for puzzle games, but does he also have an aptitude for sports games? I was watching him play a famicom baseball title, and while the computer smacked him around quite a bit (the computer cheats!!!), I was impressed with his pitching and fielding ability (hitting... not so much).

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Shlapintogan posted:

The Bomberman episode was absolutely excellent. There weren't too many points where I didn't have at least a big grin on my face.

Bomberman was top shelf. I think 53 Stations is my favorite, but Bomberman is right there. Right at the beginning, when Arino is describing the challenge when he reveals he's played the game before, with his friend and eventual Yoiko partner Masaru Hamaguchi, during a wake for Hamaguchi's grandfather. (They were still kids then, so it wasn't as disrespectful as it sounds.) Arino starts laughing, a little ghoulishly, but his laugh is so infectious the staff starts laughing as well, and of course so am I. It's all so morbid, but hilarious at the same time.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Obeast posted:

Takeshi's Castle was pretty great, but I can see why that was the only real physical game they did for a challenge. I'm sure present day Arino would probably die after the first run of that game unless he's been working out (which I doubt). My favorite part had to be Arino's reaction to the game crediting Sasano for beating the game.

Anyways, thanks for the past few episodes, SAGCCX. You guys are total saviors to us non-Japanese speaking/reading goons. :)

For all the past discussions we've had with whether or not such and such episode is edited a certain way, or if Arino is really trying, this latest challenge there's not much room for debate!

For a relatively short, five-hour challenge, by the end Arino is hands-on-knees, huffing and puffing. What was most impressive to me was just how flush he was by the end. On the other hand, I guess they could have just had him run laps around the building... :haw:

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Das_Ubermike posted:

I wouldn't be surprised if it was Arino's. It's a funny lamp, in a tacky sort of way. The sort of thing you'd expect to find tucked away in the corner of your grandfather's basement once you had to help clean it out after he had died.

I'm reminded of the Seinfeld episode, when Kramer accidentally burns down Susan's grandfather's log cabin, and all that's left was an iron box that contained her father's love-letters to another man.

Oh! I'm also reminded of this Onion article, too!

Wandering Knitter posted:

That lamp leads to so many questions. Was it already at the office? Did someone buy it as a joke for that segment? Did someone own one and said "Hey guys, you have GOT to use my lamp for this segment!" Was it Arino?

And deftly segueing from the homoeroticism hinted at above, just once I'd like someone to send in a tip to The Romance Never Ends segment, Arino gets his camera phone ready, and it's like Zangief in a hot tub with a bunch of guys. What a twist!

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Keyboard Kid posted:

To be fair, most games don't send you back far as a penalty for dying, unless it's a full game over (restart the game), or it's something notably 'gently caress you' like Ninja Gaiden 1. And if you're playing in an emulator, it sounds like you want save states? It's more fun to play through the game naturally, otherwise you'd be stuck with dumb autosave-every-minute progression, which really has no challenge.

In one of the most recently broadcasted episodes (the Detective Jinguji murder mystery one I think from last week or the week prior to that), they had that "Project CX" vignette where they feature old console peripherals. In this one, Kibe produced this thing that was basically an external flash cart or something that plugged into the Famicom and could record your sessions. You could then replay it back and watch how you did. But the neat thing was that if you were in replay mode, and then switched it over to record mode on the fly, you could commandeer your character again and play right from that point in the recording!

The segment was in Japanese, so the only thing I could catch was that it retailed for about 70 bucks when it came out, and Kibe acquired it for a dollar. But the technology stunned me, I never knew something like that existed. It's sort of a precursor to the kind of emulator/save state stuff we're used to now.

edit: it's called the Hori Game Repeater. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QECS8Jy3_YQ Pretty neato.

Jimmy Colorado fucked around with this message at 19:55 on Feb 8, 2012

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

zari-gani posted:

I have decided that Nakayama is my new favourite AD. I'm sorry, Inoue. Maybe if you had won that wrestling match.

I don't know if I have a favorite AD. I love love love Kibe though. :swoon:

Per the wrestling match, not experiencing the full backstory or hate Inoku MAX got, other than that fax calling him a bastard, if I was him, I would have played up the heel angle and worn a Team No Respect t-shirt or something. Really hammed it up like in pro wrestling during the promo. And then yeah, get beat in the wrestling match, and hammed it up some more. Have fun with it!

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Shlapintogan posted:

So I'm watching the Pac Man 2 episode and Arino just gave up on a crane game.

What kind of sick alternate dimension have I just walked into?

I expected Takahashi to Johnny-on-the-spot a stop watch or something. Personally, I think the prizes were haunted. Clearly, the only explanation.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

zari-gani posted:

Nearly 9 AM. Looks like there's 50 seconds left in the live show...for the sake of the rerun. But they're gonna hold an extension. Huzzah!

By the way, this is the box I was referring to when I said I think I know what it holds. I was right!



Sorry, from last page, but I have a goober publishing question: so you printed out your image, mounted it and shipped it flat? That must have cost a fortune!

I also love Emoto as the ref, with his stripes pealing off. Tremendous. Tremendous!

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

redmercer posted:

Y'all need to look this up, yo. It's worth it to see a gang of Japanese comedians eat a pizza with marinara, cheese, and breath mints.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3iAsdYifxg

Frisk Mint pizza. :gonk:

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Djarum posted:

I ended up getting my SB for $20 about 5 years ago or so. Only issue mine has is I need to find some new screws/bolts as I found out when I finally got to play it a few years ago that they were missing.

Anyone know of a place that sells replacements?

Home Depot? Honestly, I don't know if they're specialty screws, or wacky sizes or whatever, but maybe a hardware store would carry the kind of screws you need.

Vlaphor posted:

Though the Doom cart not working is unfortunate (though I believe that was actually due to the fact they were using C64 monitors), I really would've love to seen Arino's reaction to games like Yo Noid!, Super Mario Bros 2, and Dragon Power. Games that got drastically altered for their American release.

I remember on the Korea trip, he got a chance to play God of War, and he really enjoyed it. Obviously, the game's violence borders on the pornographic and isn't fit for a show like GCCX, but along those lines (of games they'd never play, but I'd like to see Arino play) it got me thinking... could Grand Theft Auto: Vice City be completed in one sitting? I don't think it could, but considering Arino's age, maybe he'd get a kick out of the soundtrack and the mid-80's setting. And the hookers.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Djarum posted:

That's my problem. I don't know if they are special or not. I can't get a lot of info online about them either.

Here's the manual (PDF) for the game, with instructions on how to assemble the controller. The screws look like they're alan head, but really I'm sure any screw the right length and diameter would fit. Maybe take the plate (or the controller) to a hardware store and see if they have loose screws in the screw isle (I patronize establishments with only the finest screw isles :colbert:). Or ask one of the people working there. Folks walk into Home Depot with mundane design and repair projects all the time. I'm sure they'd get a kick if you walked in with a quasi-futuristic post-apocalyptic death machine console, with the idea of the only thing standing between you and world domination being a loose screw. One too many, that is.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Random Stranger posted:

Edit: Ha ha, from the Amazon product review: "The Genji and the Heike Clans is a joke. Calling this an arcade classic is preposterous. [...] This one is a real loser."

The whole time watching, I totally got a Bart vs The Space Mutants vibe. Not so much the game was hard thanks to clever level design and enemy placement, but rather due to it being a "poo poo game". Also, was there a famicom version of this game, or something similar? The side-scrolling levels where the character is tiny reminds me of Getsu Fuuma Den, but that was made by Konami. (Mainly, the way the character swings his sword... but now that I'm looking at youtubes of the game, they have the same old hag with the crystal ball, the gates you have to go through, the sorta non-linear choose-your-path overworld map, similar power-ups for your sword, etc.)

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Stefan Prodan posted:

Oh if they made an English version maybe it was in English and I just forgot as I attempted to block that game from my mind, haha

Also instead of "poo poo game" I think the code word you have to use with this show is "hidden masterpiece"

Forgive me, a "unique game" that "impressed many players" through it's "realistic portrayal of hell". Haha.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Potsticker posted:

If you liked the look and setting and such, you'd do much better to check out Getsu Fuuma Den. It's a Famicon game by Konami and while still difficulty, it's much more of a "fair" game.

The character from Getsu Fuma Den also appeared as a DLC character in Castlevania Harmony of Despair, which confused me when I went to find youtube links of the famicom game! But it makes sense as both games are made by Konami.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010
I just thought he didn't have his tv on at the moment. But yeah, I'm getting that too right now.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

shrgnatlas posted:

Yeah, it looks like Arino will need all the support he can get!



Super Scope segment too, what a treat!





I've putzed around here as well as the freshverse site, but is there a solution to the "stream not found" problem some of us have been getting? Not that I already haven't missed the rebroadcast by a day! But I like having the stream on in the background. Thanks!

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

rdbbb posted:

Sure, but I wouldn't call it "rushed." How about just "a freshman effort where not everybody knew what they were doing until they blew it all out for the next time."

I remember seeing or reading (possibly both: a subtitled interview!) with the Capcom guys responsible for Street Fighter II, how they were surprised that players comboed hits together, as they didn't realize that's how they programmed the hit detection. The programmers considered it a bug.

Huzzah! posted:

Yeah, the game really didn't get rushed till Mega Man 3.

This is clever. I like this.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

zari-gani posted:

Yesterday I got another Famicom puzzle-action game he challenged -- Tower of Babel. Again, I'm struggling with the very first stage... Arino's brain is truly made for puzzles. Maybe because he's so patient.

I've seen the Babel episode and I also remember Arino carved that game up like a Thanksgiving turkey, but it still took two days to beat. That ending was kinda cheap though!

I remember Zelda II being the kind of game that took a lot of trial and error, and exploration. I'm pretty sure I only beat it back in the day thanks to generous Nintendo Power coverage. Arino I think could beat it, eventually, but it would be a multi-day event sort of thing.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010
It's an xbox exclusive, so I wonder if you could get it to work with that giant gently caress-off Steel Battalion controller.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

quote:

108. Picks for worst: Shiren = [spoiler]. Ocarina of Time = [spoiler]. Kirby Superstar = It was way too easy. Super Mario Bros 2 = Akita was ugly

That is rough. The opposite of tender. :drat:

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010
I say go for it. But with the caveat that Arino's live challenges were among the most-disliked according to that 2chan thread zari-gani graciously translated for us! Haha!

Plus, it has to be a game that's beatable within a couple of hours, but that's hard enough that you don't just blow through it on the first time through (when was the last time you played Contra? Without the Konami code, for example?).

I think the greatest strength of the show, other than Arino's wit, is the editing. Imagine being in the room when Arino sits there silently dieing over and over again. For hours. Probably not that entertaining. And Arino is a top-shelf comedian with decades under his belt.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010
Wowee. Top-shelf effort, all around.

More than anything, these last episodes have gotten the "I don't remember that game being that hard" head-scratcher from me, only to load up the rom and be weeping within minutes.

Pilotwings! :arghfist:

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

7c Nickel posted:

Gunstar Heroes would be cool.

The first thing I thought of (which makes it automatically wrong) was "GunCon". I know Arino has played PSX games before, but it looks like they use an LCD monitor. In order to get a light gun game to work, they'd have to dust off an old CRT TV. Talk about retro! :downs:

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Shock Trooper posted:

Wow, I didn't know that was the Japanese title either. Great game, I don't thikn Arino will have too much trouble with it but for all we know it could end up being another two-parter...

The game is side-scroller, but the very first stage is a top-down vertical shooter (you're in a car), and as has been documented, Arino is AWESOME at shooters. Or was that the opposite of that...? I anticipate several deaths from Arino on that alone! Haha.

Early on, I forget which stage, once you're into the side-scrolling action part, there are places where the floor drops and you have zero warning that they'll fall. The saving grace (someone correct me) is that there are unlimited continues.

The game looks and sounds great, reminded me of the first Batman title on the NES, with the "lived-in" city-scapes and the cyberpunk atmosphere.

Prediction: victory.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010
Alright, played through Gun-Dec, and it's pretty rough! There are a couple spots that approach "Ninja Gaiden level 6-2" heights of frustration, but I'm confident Arino will emerge victorious.

There should certainly be a visit or two from the ADs, and some whiteboard coaching for the boss patterns, but this is a game he'll be able to beat on sheer force of will. It's his greatest strength!

I probably should have played the NA version, but I wasn't sure if the ports had differences and I wanted to play the one that Arino was going to play, thus, I don't know how cheesy the plot of the game was. Hopefully Arino can have some fun with the dialog: the cutscenes seemed kind of ridiculous at times. (Ok, all the time.)

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010
Just finished watching the Gun-Dec episode. I hadn't seen the Japanese box art before, which is a shameless ripoff clear homage to Bruce Willis. The American box art has what looks like Mel Gibson and Sharon Stone circa Total Recall. But I guess there's a long history of videogame box art using then-action stars like Stallone, Schwarzenegger (Contra) and the guy who played Kyle Reese from terminator (Metal Gear). Eh. Reference images are reference images, but I wonder what the rules are for that sort of thing?

Per the actual episode and challenge I knew he'd win! I also knew he'd have trouble at the stage 5-2 birds. But he completely blew past areas that gave me fits, like the stage 5 and 7 bosses. Maybe creative editing was involved, but I doubt it. I sort of wanted to see him struggle, but he pretty much crushed the game, so good for him.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

Mister Chief posted:

I think it's more Kurt Russell than Mel Gibson personally.

Ok, I see it too. The hair is all Gibson though.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

victrix posted:

I seem to remember going through the _whole_ game actually being pretty loving exhausting. It was a long rear end game if you did every level.

It's sort of a mixed bag. He didn't open up the star warps, but he also didn't appear to open any of the switch palaces. That's going to make for a rough experience. Also, iirc, he was only helped by an AD once: the "infinite" lives trick.

That said, he must have lost over a thousand lives when it was all said and done. When I watched the raws, certainly there was a lot I was missing, so I'm super thankful for the excellent translation, definitely. But now I know that it took a third day, the last solely dedicated to fighting Bowser, and it still took him over 80 lives, that was just... yikes! haha The ultimate conclusion I came to, maybe some would agree, it's tough to watch Arino struggle with a game I personally find easy.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010
Also, it seemed Arino never figured out the spin jump (the X button iirc?). In the episode they focus on his trouble with the guy who shovels small boulders at Mario. I know you can spin jump and bounce off of almost anything that would kill you (including the bolders and the guy shoveling them). Definitely handicapped himself there!

e: and you know, at the end, he seemed surprised there were all those different-colored Yoshis. Imagine playing the game without the spin jump and without using Yoshi's cousins. Would you lose 1000 lives? Probably not, but the game would present a challenge.

Jimmy Colorado fucked around with this message at 19:54 on Aug 20, 2012

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010
That's what I've found when I wanted to get my friends into the show: find them a game that they'll connect with, not necessarily the "best" episodes. One of my friends was really into the quirky, never-heard-of-it Japanese titles. The one he really liked was Wagan Land. He also like Dynamite Headdy (even though it had a NA release). Another one of my friends was nonplussed by stuff like that, but was really into the Street Fighter II episode. He used to play SF competitively back in the day, and the character he'd dedicated himself to: Dhalsim.

Another one of my buds I've only mentioned the show to in passing, but lately has been obsessed with Super Mario 2. The US version. He was a Sega fanboy back in the day, so never played a lot of the classic NES/SNES titles. Considering Arino has challenged pretty much every retro SMB game (as well as Doki Doki Panic), maybe that's a place to get him addicted introduced to the show.

Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010
I totally understand: that's how I felt with Arino's struggles with SMW. But with regards to SFII, my friend approved of the Yoga Fire cheapness! Haha. He did wish that Arino would throw a low fierce after a Yoga Fire, but gave him a pass because he wasn't a fighting game player, clearly. Plus, SFII was during an era when fighting games were much more accessible. Normal arcade goers had had a shot at not being totally humiliated for their 25 cents, not like the fighting games of today. You sit Arino in front of MVC3 or something, he would last as long as it took his opponent to hit him once.

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Jimmy Colorado
Apr 16, 2010

KNITS MY FEEDS posted:

Anyone who can sleep 20 hours a day is a real hero.

This reminds me of a blog post from a blog that I certainly got from this thread (or an earlier iteration) about how a lot of folks in Japan consider sleeping a hobby. The blog author I think correctly correlates necessary behaviors like eating, sleeping and going to the bathroom as things that can't be hobbies, but on the other hand, if someone was a gourmand of a particular cuisine, or food in general, yeah, I'd consider that a hobby. Do Japanese folks put sleep in a certain category that westerners don't? A "When in Rome" sort of thing? First blush it sounds kinda silly. Haha.

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