China Megathread - Their navy can be taken seriously or taken littorally

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > China Megathread - Their navy can be taken seriously or taken littorally

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

Great OP, it's nice to know about the mechanism of China's government.

# ¿ Feb 14, 2012 20:32

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# ¿ May 6, 2024 10:44

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

computer parts posted:

That's remarkably close to how Americans see the Chinese/Asians in general. Interesting.

I think both views have roots in imperialism. Vietnam was China's vassal state/colony for a short while before they broke away in a bloody war.

# ¿ Jun 6, 2012 07:39

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

az jan jananam posted:

Informants, as mentioned. Intimidation, terror tactics, blackmail, exclusionary pressure.

This seems hard to believe. Would the Chinese government really go to extraordinary lengths just to make you put rice in your mouth?

For instance, what if you just said you ate food during the day, but you really didn't. How would the know if you were lying?

# ¿ Aug 2, 2012 20:31

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

The dog whistles in this thread are so loud I'm going deaf.

# ¿ Oct 3, 2012 19:27

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

Bloodnose posted:

Some more LegCo fun with Leung �Long Hair" Kwok-hung, Hong Kong's favorite radical social democrat legislator. Once again he has managed to piss off a pro-Beijing legislator, this time fancy-schmancy barrister from the DAB, Lawrence Ma Yan-kwok. The fun starts at about 2:32. (direct link)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFY8yQuPUOo

I couldn't find the whole video with English subtitles, but the significance of this is that they start yelling at each other in (mostly) English and it reaches its zenith when Lawrence Ma declares to Long Hair that "you are not even loving Chinese!"

It's good television.

And I was impressed with Long Hair's English. I assumed the guy couldn't speak at all, but he's holding his own with Australian-educated fancy man over there.

My Cantonese still sucks pretty bad, so I don't understand most of what started the argument. I just know it was about the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights. Anyone with better Canto who can fill me in?

All in English:
"I am a professional, you're not!"
"What is wrong with being a patriot!"
"You do not love your country!"
"You are not a bloody Chinese! I'm telling you, you are not a bloody Chinese! Tell me that you are Chinese!"

It would have been awesome if Leung had just said, "u mad brah?!"

# ¿ Feb 24, 2013 16:54

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

Pro-PRC Laowai posted:

...get your meat from the halal butchers and you'll be fine.

Why is this true? I keep hearing halal meat is better - is it because they have higher quality standards? It's more expensive, for sure.

# ¿ Mar 17, 2013 09:38

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

Bloodnose posted:

It's in the charter of the Chinese Patriotic Catholic Association, along with their right of bishop investiture (the reason they don't get along with the Vatican)

Not worth it for the -30 opinion malus with the Pope, IIRC.

# ¿ Mar 12, 2015 02:51

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

Fritz the Horse posted:

If the US and China got into real military conflict it would be ruinous to the economies of both nations. Ain't gonna happen.

If I was Xi, and I thought starting a war over Taiwan was the only way to preserve my personal popularity and by extension personal safety, I might do it. Wars have been started for less. Rational thinking about preserving good economies isn't a factor by large groups of people high on nationalistic, jingoistic hate.

# ¿ Oct 9, 2021 08:50

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

MikeC posted:

Lots of interesting stuff

Agree with most of what you said, except on the part with the potential of Americans to be unwilling to intervene directly in Taiwan. Since the end of WW2 Americans have viewed themselves as the guardians of democracy. Unless America was extremely distracted with internal problems (like the January 6 attack on the capitol), there would be soldiers shipped to Taiwan, despite the risk of a nuclear escalation. America has a deep vein of militarism embedded in the national consciousness, and has started wars on flimsier pretexts (Iraq). Simply put, Americans thirst for a "just war" to participate in.

Taiwan's best defense would be to portray themselves as a victim similar to the surprise attack of Pearl Harbor in WW2, and America would find joining the war to be irresistible. They could in fact lose to an attempted fait accompli military takeover by China as long as they had some sort of government in exile, and probably expect to win the war over time.

# ¿ May 25, 2022 07:50

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

i fly airplanes posted:

Short answer: because science.

Science relies on peer review, and many Chinese scientific journals are notorious for poor data and faked data at the least.

It's nothing to do with Sinophobia or anti-Chinese bias. The impact factors speak for themselves, and while Chinese journals are improving, top notch research will always publish in a "Western" journal.

Like baby formula, nobody trusts the possibly adulterated Chinese stuff, even if that particular sample is okay.

# ¿ Dec 20, 2022 05:02

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

chabuduo weather balloon would be a more convincing explanation

# ¿ Feb 6, 2023 21:08

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# ¿ May 6, 2024 10:44

enigma74: Aug 5, 2005; a lean lobster who probably doesn't even taste good.

ronya posted:

The not entirely quiet part out loud:

https://twitter.com/HuXijin_GT/status/1734150597207576908

Nationalist bluster aside Beijing seems to be absorbing that there are limits to the strategy of gray zone tactics to avoid seeming like an aggressor when the other party is willing to risk lives. For example, the Philippines can keep sending tiny chartered civilian boats with journalists and officials so that the oversized Chinese Coast Guard cutters look massive (instead of deploying the handful of equivalently-sized ships that Manila does have). There's precedent for outcries leading to moderation, e.g., lasers (which the Chinese used in Feb) seem to not have been tried again. There are not many other options besides water cannons for ranged enforcement of presence (short of acts of war, anyway). Weakness is its own kind of advantage in grey zone conflict; many ASEAN countries want to be able to keep using cheap civilian charter craft rather than invest in a costly standing fleet for coastal monitoring tasks (being disinterested in maritime security in general is, ahem, one reason naval piracy remains a problem in Southeast Asia, despite the region not being dysfunctional in the way e.g. Somalia or Nigeria are). Aligning a mini-pact on this would be in e.g. Malaysia's and Vietnam's especial interest (I mentioned the proposed pact upthread).

The logical Chinese strategy would be to apply a level of force sufficient to make Philippine claims expensive to sustain (by e.g. continually maintaining a massive fleet presence in Philippine EEC claims and asserting, but not automatically enforcing, the right to enforce Chinese law, save on bona fide pirates that Manila can't much complain about). Actual confrontation is probably not desirable, or at least not paying off in the way Beijing might like; it has to force Manila to chase them away instead of vice versa. Eventually a government in Manila (being democratic, and subject to electoral capriciousness) may lose interest and write it off.

So much for China's soft power strategy in Manila. It seemed to be working well when Duterte was pro-China earlier in his career, it seemed like he was pushing the Philippines slowly towards neutrality or being pro-China. China just had to concede in the SCS, and maybe the American military bases would have slowly disappeared as their leases stopped being renewed. It may have broken the first island chain, given enough time.

Instead, we have mouthpieces like Hu Xijin just going full wolf warrior, to maybe appease some internal nationalist audience...who probably don't even care that much about the SCS to begin with. It's like cutting down a forest to gain a toothpick.

# ¿ Dec 12, 2023 10:17

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