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Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


everyone's lacp implementation is awful, from "why do i have 1/n packet loss for n links" to literally unusable

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Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Not gonna lie, you're the first I've bumped into the year deploying sp infrastructure on vmware at "vROP isn't enough" scale

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


how do you get onprem san with meaningful redundancy for less than a quarter of a million dollars though

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Happiness Commando posted:

I have 35 TB of active/active storage and I think we paid $100k. Some of it is rotational though. I guess the secret is to not need high performance?

One of my clients has five vSAN nodes for $150,000 with similar capacity, all on SSDs. That includes compute and licensing, not just storage.

I kind of don't get it?

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


YOLOsubmarine posted:

It’s also very feature poor as storage, with no zero impact snapshot capabilities, no native replication, no zero space clones, etc...it’s pretty bare bones storage

aaaaaaaah I wasn't thinking about this right

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


DPU -- placing security decisions right on the network and remote memory/storage card -- is excellent and an extension of the sorts of functionality previously only available to hyperscalers

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Veeam's forums and QA staff largely consisted of men who are now AFK fighting to protect their families and towns, so it was never as bad as you may think.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Zorak of Michigan posted:

Q: Why is this good for VMware customers?
A: It's not. We simply judge that you have no choice.

We are now committed to a shift to Azure Stack HCI hyper-v, so gently caress these nerds.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Zorak of Michigan posted:

Please god let me not find out that support actually could be worse.

let me tell you about that time VMware support brought down our entire network

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


I'm still not sure how we haven't sued them yet

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


DevNull posted:

I have worked at VMware for over 16 years. Broadcom quickly came out with with a return to office mandate and a new employment contract that is horrific. We had one of our most senior team members quit with 0 days notice, and a lot of people that are refusing to sign the new contract and are looking for a new job. So expect the virtualization quality to take a hit. Enjoy!

thanks for your work, especially on the flings that have made my life substantially easier

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


DevNull posted:

Thanks. I actually worked on the VNC server/client fling that was release over 10 years ago. I think they pulled it from the site eventually since it wasn't getting updates. I left that team but still used that fling myself.

I remember you mentioning you worked with that team, well, many many years ago

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Pile Of Garbage posted:

Relevant to the Broadcom buyout of VMware, they're already moving to transition everything to a subscription-based model and as part of that they're killing the perpetual license model for vSphere: https://www.thestack.technology/broadcom-is-killing-off-vmware-perpetual-licences-sns/.

Can't say I'm surprised, Broadcom only bought VMware to capture and exploit their revenue stream. As they've already demonstrated anything that can be considered a cost centre is on the chopping block. It's kind of similar to the corporate raiders in the 80s only instead of immediately liquidating they just bleed em dry.

I'm a little busy this morning, does this mention whether existing perpetual licenses are under the gun

I have expressly avoided moving those under our ELA so that we don't have to accept predatory new terms for those licenses

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


I'm really upset that the justice department complaints against the acquisition did not end up surviving political intervention

What American consumers are positively served by the acquisition? None, except for a couple giant shareholders. What American businesses are positively served by the acquisition? None.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Nitrousoxide posted:

If it's a really simple project you could even do something as simple as a bash script and cron job that checks a network shared directory for a folder with data needing processing and spins up a docker compose with some env variables when someone drops a new one in there.

so that's how new, weirdly architected message queuing systems are born

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


largely comes down to whether your business has means and appetite for infrastructure and expanded security payroll imo

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


well, at least in azure's case there's a lot of extra value for cloud too. this is the virtualization thread, so we focus a lot on compute and storage infrastructure. Internal, B2B, and C2B IAM on Azure is pretty slick. having your business productivity/collaboration all in one place too is one hell of a value add for doing virt in Azure.

it's more than just a pure capital versus operational expenses and labor consideration

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


you could use proxmox at home but you won't be learning any skills that are useful for your career imo

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


well yeah

so use a modern hypervisor

there's a free gitlabs tier, put up some teraform and go learn proper cdci

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


does.... anyone use proxmox in enterprise, at scale? maybe it's me who is out of touch

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


I meant go learn KVM

nobody should be learning more VMware rn

proxmox in enterprise? ehhhhhhhhhhh sounds like there's one poster who has it for a kinda standalone thing, that's hardly a vote in confidence for any notion that serious businesses use proxmox in robust devops stacks

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


can you do azurestack HCI homelab for a good price

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


I just don't see a big migration to Hyper-V without a Microsoft vCenter. I absolutely see Microsoft squandering the opportunity to become the virtualization platform of small/medium American businesses by continuing to confound what should be simple interfaces and tools with cloud integrations. Already, 2/3 of what's in Windows Admin Center is functionally nagware to pay for things that SMBs probably aren't ever going to pay for, and it confuses the everliving hell out of the hordes and hordes of general practice IT workers who burn the incense that keeps AA_april2013-gross_FINAL(1)_FINAL DONT REMOVE(1)(1).xls running.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


I'm going to Azurestack HCI but that's because we have the budget for genuine engineers. Half the guys who do IT at my local card shop are just happy to churn through five or six tickets a day and drive to a site to get a laptop deployed without hitting traffic. there's billions upon billions of dollars in the market that serves those dudes, and that's why I continue to insist that, after KVM matured, vmware's core product was actually vCenter.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares



:getin:

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


SlowBloke posted:

Microsoft "vCenter" already exists, it's called System Center Virtual Machine Manager and it's absolute poo poo.

yeah vmm doesn't count

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


the spyder posted:

Yes. Yes we are. I highly recommend exploring alternatives, regardless of the pricing. I dare even say HyperV if you're looking to leverage Datacenter Server 2022/2025 licensing.

I have a multi domain UCS environment coming up on EOL (B200 M4/M5), something like 3000 VM's. I'll sanitize/round for the sake of making it digestible.
My quote for 2,500 cores, standard vSphere, vCenter, and special VDI licensing (10,000 users) went from $1.2m in August to $5.5million last week. 5 years commit.
We're a non-profit and that's money that won't go into patient care. We are obviously exploring options. (edited to include VDI)

They force you into VCF licenses or something?

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


just did the napkin math a very recent Dell quote that I got.

if my VMware licensing goes up by any more than about 2.1x, I might as well scrap my entire current generation of server hardware and go with somebody who gives you a whole appliance, like Scale Computing or Nutanix.

Nutanix in particular might be an interesting choice for one of my gigantic vdi environments

God drat it I had just spent five years getting all of our virtualization onto the same platform.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


At least VMware by VMware was giving people good jobs with our license money.

The thing that feels worst about this is that the lion's share of the VMware buyout is sitting in the offshore accounts of Michael Dell, his private capital buddies, and a few large investment firms. Some bank in Aruba is flush with like $25B of that sale price.

Worthless, unproductive waste.

Nope our license money is going to be at $fuckyou cost, and it's going purely to backfill buyout debt, vulture capitalists, and a far reduced workforce. poo poo, remember when VMware laid off much of its dedicated support team in anticipation of buyout, and suddenly their engineers started getting pulled into T1 issues?

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Zorak of Michigan posted:

VMware had a dedicated support team? The way they treated our tickets, I assumed they just printed them, left on the street, and trusted that someone curious would pick them up and call us.

They used to. It was friggin great, too.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Broadcom is asking for enough that, in a perverse way, I can afford to replace all of my gear for every customer still on vsphere, gratis

what the absolute gently caress

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Wibla posted:

OpenStack is a no-go, but it sounds like XCP-ng is worth investigating? At least for professional use. I'm happy with proxmox for home use / single host stuff.

xosan v2 is around the corner, god I hope it's around the corner

think S2D or VSAN, but tightly integrated with the hypervisor's control panels

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


skipdogg posted:

Anyone here with a very large Nutanix deployment? (3K+ VM's?).
...

I'm sure it's gotten better in the last 4 years, but is it really ready for big enterprise?

an MSP adjacent to me just got done moving a maaaaaaassive customer OFF of Nutanix in order to have some essentials (like uptime) and better features (like useful support). Idk man.

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Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


Kaddish posted:

I feel like the best use case for HCI is smaller installations with no or little existing infrastructure.

agreed, and that's where we use it

propping up a new environment with VMware and, say, Pure storage introduces a lot of single points of failure (that also prevent maintenance during business hours) unless you are spending above half a million dollars. ESXi + VSAN or Hyper-V + S2D allows you to give somebody storage and compute at, heck, $30-60k per node depending on how much storage and ram density is needed. replace old nodes on a rolling basis and suddenly you have a situation that resembles a cloud deployment but way cheaper.

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