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jase1 posted:I never really think about the things I do as unethical. I never really stay in contact with most of the people that I hustle. I never see the impact I am causing by taking their money. I think my actions are fine and see nothing wrong with it. It's gambling and anyone who knowingly enters in a bet regardless of how bad they are at disadvantage they still made the choice themselves to take a risk. It's the same thing as casinos in my opinion. They don't know how bad their customers are in debt or that joe blow is using his rent money to gamble they just want your money. The only line I won't cross is cheating. I will not switch pool cues or use rigged equipment. I use what is provided unless I bring my own stick then I use that. Does that answer your questions? I have no problem talking about ethics it's just that I don't think about it very often so its hard to explain my position on it. I work in a job that cause a lot of people to hate my guts some people think it is unethical what I do but I don't. Thanks for the thoughtful reply. I think I agree with everything you say here. I certainly don't think there is anything unethical about gambling. Maybe it is idealistic, but, for me, I think the part that strikes me as unethical is deceiving people about your skill level. I think that is when things go from gambling to scamming. For me, that seems no different than a pump and dump stock scam or any other type of scam in which one party knowingly manipulates or conceals information to take advantage of someone else. In your reply, you talk about people entering the bet of their own free will, which is true. However, through deception or manipulation, they don't know how much of a disadvantage they are at. I think it is easy to rationalize that as "Buyer Beware," but it does strike me as a rationalization. What do you think?
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Apr 3, 2012 01:52
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confused posted:Thanks for the thoughtful reply. I think I agree with everything you say here. I certainly don't think there is anything unethical about gambling. When I play poker I purposefully try to hide the strength of my hand in order to get people to put more money in the pot. I am deceiving someone through deception or manipulation to get all their money. Does that mean playing poker is unethical? That's really the only way I can describe it. In my opinion its the same thing.
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Apr 3, 2012 03:06
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jase1 posted:When I play poker I purposefully try to hide the strength of my hand in order to get people to put more money in the pot. I am deceiving someone through deception or manipulation to get all their money. Does that mean playing poker is unethical? That's really the only way I can describe it. In my opinion its the same thing. Well, you could say one difference is that you are deceiving someone in order to persuade him to gamble, whereas in poker they have already decided to gamble.
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Apr 3, 2012 03:21
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jase, hopefully you don't mind me chiming in here. I'm not even a half decent pool player, but I used to tend bar in a pool hall for a while and I have some fair insight to chip in.squeakygeek posted:Well, you could say one difference is that you are deceiving someone in order to persuade him to gamble, whereas in poker they have already decided to gamble. Even without having hustled someone myself, I can tell you this much, the kind of guys that usually end up getting hustled generally aren't the best sort of people. As a general rule, I found that the guys who got hustled were either assholes who deserved it, guys who were so stupid they'd bet you even without the deception, or guys who were so cocky they'd put money down even if they could tell you were better. I saw countless guys get "hustled" by the same person who had beat them over and over on previous nights. Most of these players just seemed so dumb that it's almost difficult to avoid hustling them. It requires a lot less deceit then you can possibly imagine. poo poo, I knew one girl whose entire hustle was just the fact that she was a female. Nothing else to it. Dumb guys would line up all night long to lose money to her because: 1. They were sad barflies and just wanted an excuse to chat with one of the few cute girls in the bar 2. They were just too prideful to consider that a girl was a better player than they were
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Apr 3, 2012 04:28
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squeakygeek posted:Well, you could say one difference is that you are deceiving someone in order to persuade him to gamble, whereas in poker they have already decided to gamble. That seems like its just mincing words at that point. When you go to gamble in a pool hall, or anywhere its being played, I guess, its a known risk that you might get hustled. Its just a part of the culture of it.
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Apr 3, 2012 05:08
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Just wanted to say great thread. I started playing pool three months ago and bought my own cue about a month ago. I can beat the once every week or two player almost every time, but I would get crushed by a 7. Are there any drills you would recommend doing? When I'm not playing games I usually just practice shots I miss frequently and practice hitting the cue ball with no spin. How do you approach shots and visualizing how to run a table? How do you know when to play a safety or take a risky shot? Do you primarily think about whether the other player could run out?
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Apr 3, 2012 05:48
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What's the worst you've ever handicapped yourself in a game (to hustle somone or not)? You said about having races where you had to win 10 before someone got 7 but have you ever bet you could beat someone one handed or something like that?
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Apr 3, 2012 14:58
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A lot of places I see have "NO GAMBLING" signs up by their tables. Is that just for show? Have you ever been playing a money game and been busted by the owner? Also, and I know you've touched on it some, but what do you do if someone stiffs you or tries to run out on you? Ever had anyone trying to play with fake bills?
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Apr 3, 2012 15:11
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ripped0ff posted:jase, hopefully you don't mind me chiming in here. I'm not even a half decent pool player, but I used to tend bar in a pool hall for a while and I have some fair insight to chip in. Thanks for the insight and I always appreciate input from anyone. I just want to be clear on a few things I really don't ever think about things being ethical. I don't know if that makes a bad person but it's something that never crosses my mind. I personally feel that as long as I am not cheating I am not doing anything wrong. Now I am sure that gambling in a pool hall is probably illegal. I don't know for sure but if it is then I guess I am breaking a law and if I get caught then I deserve the punishment I get. I have gambled with police officers before because I am quite friendly with a few and they have never said anything. To clarify a few things I said about poker, millions of poker players work on their image that includes their image away from the table. They want to look like something they are not in order to get their opponent to gamble with them. I have watched guys in a casino pretend to be drunk sit down at a table and the next thing you know the table is full of people trying to take the drunks money. He deceived everyone including people who weren't even at the table into believing he was going to lose a lot of money. Hope that helps you guys understand my view on the ethics question. Omerta posted:Just wanted to say great thread. I started playing pool three months ago and bought my own cue about a month ago. I can beat the once every week or two player almost every time, but I would get crushed by a 7. When I first started shooting pool my uncle just gave me a stick and showed me the fundamentals on how to hold a stick and said now practice making shots. He would set up pool balls in certain positions on the table and I just practiced making shots without any english over and over again. The key is to have the same stroke on every shot it's a little like muscle memory that your body learns when you do a golf swing. I learned to keep my head down through the shot and do the exact same stroke every time. Putting a coke bottle on the table and touching the back of the inside of the bottle without your stick touching any other part of the bottle is a good drill. I still do that every once if I haven't played for awhile and need to get back to my normal stroke. Here is exactly what I do when I play a pool match. This routine never changes for me. Right after I break I grab the chalk and chalk my stick while I walk around the table and see if IO can run out. If I can run out without any trouble balls I do that. If I can't run out I decide what I am going to do I visualize my whole run up to trying to break up my trouble balls. If I see an opportunity to play a really good safe on my opponent I do that only if I can't run out. My first thought at the table is to run out on someone. If the other player has trouble balls I will attempt a risky shot I also will do that if I fell the other player is not very good skill wise too. I am always studying the table visualizing what I think my opponent will do. I make sure that he can't run out on me if he is a high skill level. Some of the things I do that are safeties is I leave my ball in the pocket so he can't shoot his in there, I push a ball into the 8 ball or in front of it to prevent my opponent from making the 8. There are times when I can't run out so I miss a ball on purpose to let my opponent make the next move. All of these things can backfire on you and you have to really look 2 or 3 shots ahead to see the whole picture but nothing is a given. Sometimes I miscue or leave the ball in a bad place and start my plan all over again. Olewithmilk posted:What's the worst you've ever handicapped yourself in a game (to hustle someone or not)? You said about having races where you had to win 10 before someone got 7 but have you ever bet you could beat someone one handed or something like that? I once was so confident against a a guy that I gave him a 10-3 race for $200, he gets all the breaks and he only has to make it to the 8 ball to be considered a win. He was just a really bad shot and gets frustrated very easily when someone safes him. He hates safeties and says it ruins the game. So the first match I played a safety after every shot just to piss him off. By the end of the first match he was so furious he just played horribly and I beat him 10-1. That was probably the most weight I ever gave to anyone. I usually don't handicap myself to bad. I am always looking for an edge and if I give my opponent to much weight it defeats the point of hustling someone. Playing to someones weakness is a huge part of hustling. I was gambling with a guy once and I remember Garth Brooks song about friends in high places came on the jukebox. This guy hated that song so much for some reason so I went to the jukebox and put a 20 in and played it over and over again. The funniest thing happened the whole bar including me just kept singing it over and over again at the top of their lungs while we shooting our match. The guy was so furious he could hardly even finish the match. It amazes me that people let stupid poo poo like that get to them especially if they are gambling for money.
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Apr 3, 2012 17:36
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This thread's probably for guys who know a lot more about pool than me(which is everyone), but...what's an 8? What's the significance? What's a safety? These common terms confuse the hell out of me...I could look them up to some success, but to be real, there's probably a lot of us looking at this thread with interest and while some online pool place could tell us all that, it may not give us the whys... My dad's a lot like you in that Jase1, he could beat anyone in pool at any hall, but said he'd never beat a real pro. Considering the time over my life we've spent together it's no surpise that I know next to nothing, but I've always considered trying it out for fun. Sorry, no money. I know how good I am.
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Apr 3, 2012 21:22
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ZoneManagement posted:This thread's probably for guys who know a lot more about pool than me(which is everyone), but...what's an 8? What's the significance? What's a safety? These common terms confuse the hell out of me...I could look them up to some success, but to be real, there's probably a lot of us looking at this thread with interest and while some online pool place could tell us all that, it may not give us the whys... Yeah, I don't know anything (at all) about pool, but this thread is wicked. I had to look up the word English in this context (Like a curve ball... right?) this thread is a great read, but if you could translate some stuff that'd be great! Zone, safety was mentioned in this thread already... it's when you make a play that... although doesn't pot anything for you, it leaves the cueball in an undesirable place for your opponent. (right?)
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Apr 3, 2012 21:31
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ZoneManagement posted:This thread's probably for guys who know a lot more about pool than me(which is everyone), but...what's an 8? The 8 Ball, it's kind of a big deal when playing pool. Some of them are also magical and can predict the future.
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Apr 3, 2012 21:37
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Sometimes when I am discussing pool with someone I completely forget that some of the terms I use make no sense to people who don't follow pool. Let me break down some of the terms and their significance. I don't know to much about the history of pool or how the words came about but I do know their meaning. Safety is in my opinion the most important part of pool. It is basically playing defense against your opponent. Let's say that my opponent has 2 balls left and I have 6 balls left on the table. If I feel my opponent can run out on me I will play a safe shot. I take the cueball and put it in a position to make my opponents next shot tougher. I try to leave the cueball behind one of my balls or in the path so my opponent can't make his next shot or he has a really tough shot to make. Sometimes a safe includes pushing one of my balls in front of one of his balls or the 8 ball. Sometimes I will make one of his balls that is blocking the pocket that I want to shoot one of my balls into. I especially do this if he has other balls that are blocked or in tough places on the table. This is the APA's tutorial on safeties. If you go to the 1:50 mark they show you a couple of ways to play safes. It's a long video but it does a good job explaining what is a safe and what isn't. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzfvYHM3CEs Scratch is when you pocket the cueball at anytime. In most instances it gives your opponent ball in hand. Foul is when you knock the cueball off the table, scratch the cueball, or hit any other object ball before you hit your object ball. So for instance lets say I am solids and my opponent is stripes. I am aiming at my solid ball but I hit the stripe ball first. That is a foul and gives my opponent ball in hand. Ball in hand is when your opponent fouls or scratches then you get to take the cueball and put it anywhere on the table you want for your next shot. This is why safeties are such an important part of the game. If I can get someone to give me ball in hand it gives me a huge advantage at running my balls out or taking care of my trouble balls. People who play pool casually or bar pool don't use the ball in hand rule you just lose your turn if you don't pocket one of your balls. When you scratch in bar pool the cueball goes behind the break line. 8 ball is a standard game of pool. When you break and make a ball whatever ball you made will be what your balls are for that game whether its stripes or solids. The object of 8-ball is to make all your balls then hit the 8-ball in to win the game. You must first hit all your object balls in then hit the 8-ball last. 9-ball is when you take the pool balls 1-9 and you have to make those balls in numerical order. So when the game starts I have to make the 1 ball first, 2-ball and so on up to the 9 which you make last. In 9-ball at anytime you can make any other ball on the table as long as you hit the correct ball first. For instance say the 9 ball is blocking the 1 ball in the corner pocket. I can hit the 1-ball into the 9-ball and pocket the 9-ball and win the game. English is striking the cueball either on the top, bottom, or either side to get it to spin and move to a place on the table where you want it to be. If you can master english it will help your game tremendously. Hopefully those explanations help. If you need more I am happy to explain anything you guys want. I am glad everyone is enjoying the thread I didn't think it would be so popular. I am hanging out with my uncle Frank this weekend and I told him he has to give me his best couple of stories so I can share them with in this thread. Some of the stories he will be telling me include him getting stabbed in the back with a pool stick. Him and my grandfather hustling the sheriff of a small town in North Carolina and being arrested for it. I remember the stories I just don't remember all the details so I will get them this weekend.
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Apr 3, 2012 22:21
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Wait so in 9 ball you can hit the 1 ball into the 9 on say, the third shot of the game, and win the game? Just circumvent the rest of the balls? Did I read that right? Also, if I fail to make my shot, but do not foul, you get ball in hand? So I am trying to hit my solid in, hit a solid, but miss the pocket..that gives you ball in hand? This is really interesting and I play pool sometimes when we're out and about. I am not the kind of person that is willing to bet on it but I find something.....shady about hustling people I guess. Your story of the beautiful girl and you kind of brought that up for me. You were all playing but it wasn't about seeing who is better, it was about deceiving about who was better. I think what squeak said is right, when you are playing poker you're already agreeing to deceive one another-it's how the game is played. With this its about hiding how good you are in order to take someones money. I'm genuinely interested in it and it's a great thread, I just thought the ethical question was an interesting one. Then again, like someone said, the type of person that gets hustled its often hard to feel sorry for them because of other characteristics. Last question-do you smoke? Is smoking allowed when playing? Has anyone used the environment to mess with you like cigarette smoke, excessively loud music, hitting the light over the table, etc.?
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Apr 3, 2012 22:40
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How common is people playing by house/non-standard rules, like using the kitchen instead of ball in hand on a scratch? Follow up: how many times have you gotten in to arguments with people about these rules? I ask because everyone I tend to play with (outside of a pool hall) thinks that if they scratch, you have to put the ball in the kitchen. I don't know why I can't convince people of that otherwise, but it kind of ruins the game when you can scratch on purpose in order to screw up your opponent's shot. Kind of related, what is the typical skill level of the people you hustle? Are you usually taking on people who play once every few months at the bar, or are they people who seem like they play often enough to consider themselves good, or at least better than most? Great thread, by the way. I tried to get in to pool a while back but the only real pool hall is about a 30 minute drive. I need to start playing again, because I really enjoy it.
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Apr 4, 2012 00:00
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DaveSauce posted:I ask because everyone I tend to play with (outside of a pool hall) thinks that if they scratch, you have to put the ball in the kitchen. I don't know why I can't convince people of that otherwise, but it kind of ruins the game when you can scratch on purpose in order to screw up your opponent's shot.
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Apr 4, 2012 00:11
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Jastiger posted:Wait so in 9 ball you can hit the 1 ball into the 9 on say, the third shot of the game, and win the game? Just circumvent the rest of the balls? Did I read that right? Yes but you have to strike the balls in order: 1,2,3,4, etc. As long as you do make contact with the next ball and the 9 drops, you win. Which is why I hate 9-ball. Too much junk counts and there's no artistry to it. Jastiger posted:Also, if I fail to make my shot, but do not foul, you get ball in hand? So I am trying to hit my solid in, hit a solid, but miss the pocket..that gives you ball in hand? No. In 9-ball, if you fail to strike your object ball first (1,2,3, see above) then it's ball-in-hand for your opponent. Anything you drop as long you strike your object ball first counts, as long as you call it. In 8 ball, it's ball-in-hand if you miss your ball entirely, but they get it from behind the break line.
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Apr 4, 2012 01:17
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jase1 posted:Thanks for the response. I'm actually a single digit golfer, so I think that really helped with the transition to pool. I have a very set routine for my golf swing, so I wanted to hear what a good pool player did for a routine since you never really need to think more than two shots ahead on a hole.
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Apr 4, 2012 02:53
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Jastiger posted:Last question-do you smoke? Is smoking allowed when playing? Has anyone used the environment to mess with you like cigarette smoke, excessively loud music, hitting the light over the table, etc.? I smoked for 18 years and quit cold turkey on January 10th 2011. It's my first year smoke free and I have never felt better. Ohio passed a law that banned smoking inside bars and buildings. Most pool halls around here will allow smoking they usually don't have windows or they are blacked out the door is locked too. I have been around smoking all my life so even now that I quit it doesn't bother me. This reminds me of a guy I love to hustle. Every guy who shoots pool with a cigarette either in his hand or in his mouth while shooting I can guarantee I will be taking at least $50 off him in a night. Those guys seem to have big egos and love to try and impress friends. That's easy money I will be drinking free for sure that night. Some of the things that people do to try and distract you can get pretty crazy. You just can't pay attention. I get people who try to be intimidating like stand close to me or close to the table when I am shooting. Stand directly in front of my sight line and move right as I am going through my pool stroke. I once played a guy for 1k race to 3. It was tied 2-2 and I am on the 8-ball and as soon as I started my pool stroke he said good game and started walkng towards me trying to get me to miss the shot and I made it. I have seen it all people try any advantage they can get. I just don't see it. I don't hear the music, I don't hear anyone talking, I only see the table and I hear myself reminding me to keep my head down and visualize the shot going in. I may sound a little crazy but I talk to myself a lot at the table. Just tell myself to calm down, stay focused, I give myself a little lecture after a bad shot all types of poo poo. DaveSauce posted:How common is people playing by house/non-standard rules, like using the kitchen instead of ball in hand on a scratch? Follow up: how many times have you gotten in to arguments with people about these rules? I always ask what rules they play by. I don't care either way it actually helps me. If they play bar rules with no ball in hand I know that it will be an easy night. If the want to play league rules I usually have to work harder to win money from this person. I can adjust my game accordingly to however anyone wants to play it. It really varies it's whatever action I can get. I have an open challenge out to anyone. All they have to do is ask me to play we set it up and play. There are guys I gamble with on regular basis they beat me a few times I beat them a few times. I have been playing this one guy race to 3 for $100 going on 10 years. I am pretty sure he is ahead because for like the first 5 years he kicked my rear end alot. If there are no road players in town, or pool tourneys then I have lately been going downtown to this suit bar. I call it a suit bar because everyone in it wears a suit and its across the street from a hotel so its buisness people in town and every week it's a whole new crew of drunk rich guys who could care less about losing $40 or $50 bucks. 3 weeks ago I made $300 and last week I made $30 bucks so the action varies. BiggerBoat posted:Yes but you have to strike the balls in order: 1,2,3,4, etc. As long as you do make contact with the next ball and the 9 drops, you win. Which is why I hate 9-ball. Too much junk counts and there's no artistry to it. I disagree completely there is plenty of artistry to 9 ball. It's all about the safeties in that game. If anyone ever gives me ball in hand on a 9-ball game it's an almost instant win and I will call every shot to prove its not junk. 9 ball is harder than 8 ball your cue ball control has to be top notch to be a good 9-ball player. I don't get many 9-ball challenges people don't like to gamble on 9-ball because there is no room for mistakes. In 8-ball ball in hand means I can place the cueball anywhere on the table not just behind the break line. Bar rules is no ball in hand if your opponent scratches you get the cueball behind the break line or kitchen. There are no fouls in bar rules. In league rules any time a player commits a foul its ball in hand anywhere on the table. jase1 fucked around with this message at 05:00 on Apr 4, 2012 |
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Apr 4, 2012 04:58
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Is pool still fun for you? Like not the hustling part of it, but just shooting a game for kicks.
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Apr 4, 2012 05:17
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What does "run out" mean?
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Apr 4, 2012 05:34
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Awesome thread... it inspired me to watch some pro games on Youtube and do some practice drills on my lunch break since we have a table in the break room. I just had a few questions about playing at a high level. Can you learn to masse well enough that you can even make consistent shots using it on worn out, knappy public tables? Out of the 3 hours of games I watched last night, even though they had nice, new, clean Diamond tables that there was only one masse attempt and he missed. I always imagined having a nice table would make it easier, but now I'm thinking it may not be the case. Why do you try to make the 8 ball on the break? I looked it up and it looks like if that happened, you would just re-rack. Is there an auto-win rule you throw in when gambling to better your odds, or is this something that would happen in competition as well? Finally, do the "pros" use the tips that screw on, or the ones you have to glue on? I have a cheapo cue from the local sporting goods place... would it benefit me to change the tip? It has an ideal shape but it's too hard to take chalk. I would try to "pick" it with one of those special tools, but I don't even know if it's real leather. Thanks for sharing! squeakygeek posted:What does "run out" mean? To finish the game, one ball after another, so your opponent doesn't get a chance to shoot.
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Apr 4, 2012 05:50
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Do you use any tactics for shooting on particularly lovely tables?
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Apr 4, 2012 06:57
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All of this talk of hustling reminds me of a story that one of my buds told me that's kind of funny. My dumbass cousin was playing pool against this old mexican(?) guy named Sebastian in Vegas. According to my friend Sebastian is one of the top hustlers that shows up there. This guy is working over my cousin letting him beat him in small races for twenties. Then this happens Hey amigo you're pretty good! Want to up the ante? Nope!And he grabs his cue and leaves. Have you ever played against any good guys from Canada? I'm just wondering if you remember any names. Because there's a small chance I might know them.
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Apr 4, 2012 08:26
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littleorv posted:This guy is working over my cousin letting him beat him in small races for twenties. Then this happens On a completely different note (and a much easier question), from reading the thread female pool players have so far specifically shown up twice, is it therefore safe to assume that they are really rare? If so why do you think there's such a gender line on this, is it the bar/drinking atmosphere and the women sort of being expected to stand around whilst the men prove their manliness on the table? I like 9-ball (I'm awful!) and this thread, thanks for your stories OP.
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Apr 4, 2012 09:33
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Hey I'm interested if you can give us any stories about when the pros come into town and what all that entails.
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Apr 4, 2012 13:10
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How much do you rely on making money by playing pool? Do you go out knowing how much you could lose and cut yourself off? Do you say 'I want an x-box' and go make the money? What would you estimate you make in a year?
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Apr 4, 2012 13:56
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What is "straight pool" exactly? Like what they played in The Hustler? Is it a points thing or something like nine ball where you have to sink balls in order or what> Or is it just another term for 8-ball?
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Apr 4, 2012 15:20
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Nah straight pool isn't 8-ball, it's not as popular at least where I'm from. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight_pool It's a points game and you end up shooting a lot more/faster. It's good practice for beginners, in my opinion. Hell it's probably good practice for anyone.
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Apr 4, 2012 16:23
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Akbar posted:Is pool still fun for you? Like not the hustling part of it, but just shooting a game for kicks. Pool is only fun for me if I am playing someone who is better than me. I enjoy the challenge. Just shooting around is only really fun if I am trying to make stupid shots and betting on them. Just shooting a normal game can get kind of boring because I just run out real quick and it's a waste of quarters at a bar hanging with friends. Sometimes if I am playing a friend who is not good in pool I will try to make the hardest shot on the table every time and that can be fun but really I get easily bored at pool if I am not gambling on it. AgentCow007 posted:Can you learn to masse well enough that you can even make consistent shots using it on worn out, knappy public tables? Out of the 3 hours of games I watched last night, even though they had nice, new, clean Diamond tables that there was only one masse attempt and he missed. I always imagined having a nice table would make it easier, but now I'm thinking it may not be the case. While a good felted table helps your masse' shot it's doesn't make that much of a difference. I rarely use a masse' shot unless I have too, if I can reach a ball by making a bank shot I do that. I have not perfected the masse' shot so its really unpredictable and a low percentage shot for me. I have never gambled with anyone who likes to do that type of shot either it's just really hard to do it and be good at it on a consistent basis. Since I have been playing pool I have always been taught the 8 on the break in 8-ball is a win. In 9-ball it's the same thing if you pocket it on the break it's a win. In league play it's considered a win. There may some other variation that is played that I don't know about. Don't ever buy a cue with a screw on tip. They are cheap and the stick will break easily. Those are pieces of poo poo and I wish people knew that more so they wouldn't be suckered into buying them. Glue on is where it's at. It's secured tightly to the wood and manufactured better in my opinion. I use a glue on and I get it replaced every other year. Ice Phisherman posted:Do you use any tactics for shooting on particularly lovely tables? I usually just give my self 10 or 15 minutes to see how the table plays. I figure if it's a fast table or slow table, if there is any drift or if the table is uneven and I also check for dead rails. If there are those type of things on a table then I try to leave my opponent with shots in that area because they sometimes won't make the proper adjustments. littleorv posted:Have you ever played against any good guys from Canada? I'm just wondering if you remember any names. Because there's a small chance I might know them. Your cousins isn't really that dumb then because he got out of there before he was going to get hustled. That type of thing happens and it's all apart of hustling sometimes you put money into a hustle and they figure it out and leave with your money. Also to answer Ghost of Mussolini's question if I am shooting in a dive bar I will risk around $40 or $50 depending on how much I feel I can take from him. Sometimes I lose the $50 and then the guy leaves. In a pool hall I will risk a little bit more. I also try to figure out how much money this guy has I pay attention to what he keeps in his pockets. If he has a pocket full of money I will risk more to try and take it all. I have shot with a lot guys from Canada but I don't remember any names at all. I went to a pool tourney at a Casino in Windsor and played a lot of really good players in the practice rooms. There was some good action there for sure. Ghost of Mussolini posted:On a completely different note (and a much easier question), from reading the thread female pool players have so far specifically shown up twice, is it therefore safe to assume that they are really rare? If so why do you think there's such a gender line on this, is it the bar/drinking atmosphere and the women sort of being expected to stand around whilst the men prove their manliness on the table? Women pool players are rare but they are out their. I am not sure why there isn't a lot of them but I do see guys being assholes towards women in pool halls so that may be why they aren't around as much. If my girlfriend comes with me to shoot pool she hates it guys are dicks to her and constantly hit on any women in the pool hall regardless if she is there with someone or not. It's scum of the earth and a lot of the guys in a pool room think they are king poo poo. There is a lot of ego in a pool hall. I use this to my advantage a lot. A guy with his girlfriend or a group of girls loves to be the center of attention and that sometimes can be a gold mine of money. Some guys just can't accept that they I am better than them at pool and keep dropping money. This reminds me of a story. 2 years ago I went to Texas with my girlfriend to visit her family. Me and my girlfriend went to a bar one night. I went to take a piss and get some drinks and some guy approaches my girlfriend and is hitting on her. While I am in the bathroom she texts me that this guy is trying to get her to shoot pool with him. I tell her to shoot a game with him and just act like you don't know me when I come back to the table. I come back to the table and they are actually shooting a game. I go up to the table and put my quarters down to get next game. My girlfriend beats him because she is actually a decent shot and this guy is a bar pool shooter. I come up to the pool table and we act like we don't know each other. I shoot a game with her and let her win. This guy is back up at the table and I hear him asking her out. She says that she doesn't date guys who can't beat her in pool and in order to get her # he has to beat her. He loses and it's my turn at the table. I say do the same rules apply to me that if I beat you I get your # and she says yes. The guy is kinda getting pissy because he now sees that I am trying to cockblock him. I beat her and right away we are acting like we hit it off she gives me her # and she is hanging all over me. She goes to the bathroom and the guy starts telling me to back off he was talking to her first and I could tell he was pretty pissed. She comes back and the guy is wanting to shoot more games with her. She says I want to see you too shoot and whoever wins can take me home for the night. I beat the dude and throws his stick on the pool table and storms out all pissed off. If only he know how bad he just got hustled and never had a chance with my girlfriend.
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Apr 4, 2012 17:04
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If you don't mind me asking, about how much of your total income is from pool?
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Apr 4, 2012 18:02
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Agro ver Haus doom posted:Hey I'm interested if you can give us any stories about when the pros come into town and what all that entails. Sometimes pro's come into town just looking for action. Most pool halls have a list of local players they will call who will show up to play pros or road players. I talked earlier about a guy named John Brumback who is the best bank shot pool player in the world hustling a kid for 15k. When word go out who he was in town another hustler who some of you might know if you watch poker by the name of David Peat or viffer as he is known in the poker world contacted my uncle on facebook looking for the address to the pool hall where Brumback was shooting. I have known viffer for a real long time but I know him as Dippy Dave he is from my area and kind of goofy but he is a full time gambler. He is a real good shot but he has unlimited pockets of money due ti his poker playing. His way to make money is to just shoot pool with the guy until the guy is tired and starts making mistakes. They decided that they will play banks (which is you have to make a bank shot for the ball to count) for 1k a ball until either of them run out of money. John said he would stay there as long as it takes. After a straight 22 hours of playing John started to get tired and wanted to take a break that is when Dippy made his move and ended up taking a poo poo ton of money of John. I don't know for sure how much because I left after dippy was down 20k at hour 12, but from hearing the stories he took John for quite a bit. spwrozek posted:How much do you rely on making money by playing pool? Do you go out knowing how much you could lose and cut yourself off? Do you say 'I want an x-box' and go make the money? What would you estimate you make in a year? DerLeo posted:If you don't mind me asking, about how much of your total income is from pool? I don't need to make any money off pool at all to live. I have a really good job and I also have a small side buisness buying vehicles fixing them up and reselling them at a profit. I have a gambling bankroll that is kept in a separate bank account and I never mix my gambling money with my bills money, if I ever go broke then I start all over again as long as my bills are paid first. I usually keep anywhere from $500 to 2K on me at all times If my bankroll goes over 2K I take out the extra and put it in my gambling account. I have money stashed in my car, pool case, and if I am gambling on the road I always hide money in the inside of my underwear in a small pocket that I have sewn in, in case I get robbed or jumped and they take every thing I have a small amount of money to get me back home. I have never had to cut myself off if I lose my bankroll that's on me then I am usually done for the night unless I feel like I can win it back. I would prefer not to go into to many specifics of the money I make but I do make enough that if I wanted to and played every night I could make a living off of it. I wouldn't be rich by any means but I could make a decent salary for myself. If I went on the road fulltime I could make really good money but being a road player is a loving tough life and I am at the point in my life where I like coming home to my own place every night and sleeping in the car waiting for a pool room to open just plain out loving sucks. The money I win I use it for other things like gambling on sports, prop bets, poker, vacations, birthdays and holiday presents for my family and things like that. If I have a really good session I also put money into money market accounts so I can make good interest off of it.
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Apr 4, 2012 19:34
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Has anyone ever ratted you out as being a hustler mid game or anything like that?
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Apr 5, 2012 00:42
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jase1 posted:I also put money into money market accounts so I can make good interest off of it. um..... Anyway, I know almost nothing about pool so forgive me if this is a stupid or rude question: how good can you get at pool? Physical conditioning and athleticism aren't really big concerns (I assume); once you can hit the ball straight (or bend it I guess if that is a thing) and so on, what else is there to learn/know? What is it about professional pool players that makes them better than really good amateurs?
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Apr 5, 2012 01:52
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zVxTeflon posted:Has anyone ever ratted you out as being a hustler mid game or anything like that? Nothing really to exciting on that. I have been outed mid game but it just kills the action people will pay up but won't play another game with me. I think someone said earlier in the thread that I make alot of enemies and that is true to an extent. Local pool players hate guys like me we have a ego and if I walk into a pool hall every one knows me and talks to me or wants to gamble with me which in turn helps to inflate my ego I won't deny that, but local pool players get really jealous and petty and stupid. If they have a chance to screw up a hustle for me especially if I have taken money from them they will do it. I don't get pissed or want to fight or anything like that I just leave. In my early 20's I was a dick and got my rear end handed to me several times not only at the pool table but outside getting the poo poo beat out of me for not learning to keep my mouth shut. bewbies posted:um..... So are money market saving accounts a bad thing? I always assumed they were the safest thing to put my money into. I am curious because I don't have a 401k or anything I just save money and put it in a money market savings account. Getting good at pool is all about practice it's been said earlier in the thread the pool stroke is the most important part of it. Yeah you don't really need to be in shape for pool endurance is a big thing if you shoot any type or marathon matches and in gambling for big money it tends to go on long periods of time. You can never practice enough I try to practice every day to keep my pool stroke the same even if I just shoot one game at home before I go to bed or when I wake up in the morning.
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Apr 5, 2012 03:16
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jase1 posted:So are money market saving accounts a bad thing? I always assumed they were the safest thing to put my money into. I am curious because I don't have a 401k or anything I just save money and put it in a money market savings account. They definitely aren't a bad thing, and you're right that they're extremely safe. Rates are currently just so low that they're basically not paying out any interest.
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Apr 5, 2012 03:19
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BiggerBoat posted:A lot of places I see have "NO GAMBLING" signs up by their tables. Is that just for show? Have you ever been playing a money game and been busted by the owner? Also, and I know you've touched on it some, but what do you do if someone stiffs you or tries to run out on you? Ever had anyone trying to play with fake bills? I see those no gambling signs everywhere and I have never been asked to leave and most of the time if we are gambling and people know it they don't say anything. I think the owners only put that up for show to keep the cops away or something but to be honest I am not sure why it's there because I have never seen it enforced. I almost never play someone without the money being put up on the rack or someone holding it so I don't usually have a problem especially strangers. There are some people that I will gamble with if they don't have the money on them but I know them personally then they go on my list of people who owe me money. If the money is a lot and I feel like I can't collect it myself I hire a guy to collect it for me and I pay him a nice hefty fee for that. I had a guy that I gambled with on a regular basis and he always paid. If I played him and he didn't have the money he would pay me the next time he saw me somewhere. He owed me a few grand and I just assumed next time I saw him he would pay. I saw him a couple of times and he kept telling me he is hard up right now and will eventually pay me. I offered him a payment plan with a small vig and he agreed to it. Then he disappeared for about 6 months and I found out he had the money he was just saving it for a road trip. He came back from the road trip broke and started shooting back in the pool halls. I put the word out to other people that he owed me some money and be careful gambling with him. It killed his action and it was tough for him to get a game. I had people letting me know where he was and I would go up there and kill his action anywhere he would go. Eventually he realized I wasn't going away and he saved up the money and paid almost a year later but I got the money plus some vig on top of it. I heard he ended up getting busted for coke and assault for beating the poo poo out of his girlfriend and I haven't seen him since then. Never had anyone pay me with fake money that I know of and I have never heard of that happeneing but I imagine it does happen. Chrispy posted:They definitely aren't a bad thing, and you're right that they're extremely safe. Rates are currently just so low that they're basically not paying out any interest. I know nothing about financial stuff and if I am derailing my own thread I can do this over pm but is there a better option where I can put my money long term that won't be touched but if I need immediate access I can get it without penalties? I have 2 of those money market accounts that I opened 15 years ago and anytime I have extra money I just dump it in there. I haven't touched any money in there in 15 years and when I decide to retire that will basically be my retirement fund. I don't want anything to do with the stock market and that was advice from my uncle when I first opened them was to stay away from investing and just have your money collect interest. I feel money management is one of the most important things in hustling. If I don't have money then I can't make money.
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Apr 5, 2012 15:36
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jase1 posted:I know nothing about financial stuff and if I am derailing my own thread I can do this over pm There's a whole subforum for financial stuff, so I'm sure you'd be much better served over there. http://forums.somethingawful.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=200
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Apr 5, 2012 22:15
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Awesome thread. As a great player, what are your most and least favorite difficult (but common) shots? Examples: long rail shots, bank across the entire table, really difficult cuts, etc.
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Apr 5, 2012 22:52
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jase1 posted:I know nothing about financial stuff and if I am derailing my own thread I can do this over pm but is there a better option where I can put my money long term that won't be touched but if I need immediate access I can get it without penalties? I have 2 of those money market accounts that I opened 15 years ago and anytime I have extra money I just dump it in there. I haven't touched any money in there in 15 years and when I decide to retire that will basically be my retirement fund. I don't want anything to do with the stock market and that was advice from my uncle when I first opened them was to stay away from investing and just have your money collect interest. I feel money management is one of the most important things in hustling. If I don't have money then I can't make money. To be honest, the stock market isn't bad if you stay away from short-term trading and speculation and focus mainly on stable income-producing stocks. (Did your uncle get burned by the market?) But you would have to put in the time to learn the basics of how to pick decent stocks. It's not that hard, but it's time that might be better spent shooting pool.
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Apr 5, 2012 22:55
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