Final Fantasy Megathread - People here, it sounds like sickness

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Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Barudak posted:

Dump his worthless rear end from the party and imagine that whenever you see him in town the party is chilling pack at the inn while he runs around and does their errands for them.

The best cutscene in the game is the one where Balthier and Fran have a conversation about returning to her village and you can hear Vaan in the background interrupting but not being responded too as they walk away having their talk.

Yeah funny thing about that, they literally wouldn't have gotten past Eryut village if it wasn't for Vaan. Since he was the one who interjected into the Viera guilt tripping Fran and refusing to help with "Fine, then gently caress off if you aren't going to help." Balthier literally congratulates him for it and admits they probably wouldn't have gotten anything out of the Viera if it wasn't for Vaan.

Look I know it's cool to pretend he had nothing to do with the plot and disappears from the game after the initial stretch, but that's silly and wrong. The fact of the matter is that unless you rewrite the game, you can't actually get anywhere without him, and even then the game would end in a different matter.

Lets be clear here, you don't have to like him. But there's a difference between "character I don't like" and "Character who is literally pointless."

Of course it's pointless to say this because everyones already made up their minds, but what the hell, I enjoy a challenge.

# ¿ Aug 22, 2013 16:14

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# ¿ May 10, 2024 14:46

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Oxxidation posted:

Mm yes, that is quite a major contribution and not at all one that could have been solved by, say, giving Vaan's lines to someone else.

Of course given SE's usual development process I can definitely imagine the task of Ctrl-X + Ctrl-V taking three to six months to complete.

Actually you can't. Since the lines are character sensitive, he's the driving force of the early game. the only reason they ever go to Bhujerba is because Vaan browbeats Balthier into taking them, since he has no desire to go for Penelo or Basch, only for the Nethicite. Which he wouldn't need to get if Vaan wasn't there, and which Basch wouldn't have access to without rewriting the game.

Let's clarify something chums, for a character to be 'useless' they have to be completely replaceable as in "I can drop you from the game, and nothing will change, your function is served by an item." Several of these characters will pop up in any game, where there jobs could be fulfilled by a key. I use KOTOR 1 as an example as lot since outside of 3 party members, the entire games cast is completely pointless and could utterly be replaced by an assortment of keys.

You can't do that with Vaan. He needs to be in that role for the entire game to function, if you remove him, you have to rewrite the plot. And that by definition means he's not useless.

And if you start throwing in "Oh we rewrite this, we rewrite that" well then we can rewrite loving anything we please. Turns out, oddly enough, you can't just drop the character who pushes the early game forward and is responsible for the late game not ending on the Pharos, from the game, without having SOMEONE play his role. Which you just admitted to, since you said they would give someone else his lines. Wouldn't fit of course but hey.

Again. You do not have to like Vaan, when it comes to writing and storytelling and all that wonderful nonsense, whether you like something or not tends to mean jack poo poo. You can claim he was an utterly unlikable protagonist, and I wont fight you on that, but fact of the matter is He, Balthier and Ashe are basically the three most rounded of the games characters. Basch hardly says a word all game, and does less. But you like him, cause of who he is. But don't for a second delude yourself into thinking he does anything for most of the game but stand there.

# ¿ Aug 22, 2013 16:54

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

DACK FAYDEN posted:

Reddas was the second of those

Reddas was the one who made sure they didn't all blow up. Except for himself. Vaan was the one who made sure Ashe didn't go Dynast-Queen.

# ¿ Aug 22, 2013 16:56

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Barudak posted:

Poor people don't get cool accents, QED.

Seriously, Maquis Ondere should have had an even more expanded role so that I could hear the voice. They should also have maybe recorded everyone's voices using something better than tin cans and string but hey.

I think the main reason for the quality drop is how compressed the audio is for the game. But I could be wrong, for some reason the japanese version doesn't sound like that but eh.

# ¿ Aug 22, 2013 17:01

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Barudak posted:

Really? Because its definitely present in the IZJS version as well but I wouldn't put it past SE to not have saved an uncompressed copy of the English sound files.

I recall that SE pretty much had the worst management in that era. And yeah the IZJS just uses the same voice files from the english version of the game, No idea why they wouldn't beyond "Why the hell would we need to keep those laying around."

Wouldn't be the first time, Capcoms lost the original annotated source for Megaman 1-6 I believe.

# ¿ Aug 22, 2013 17:05

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Azure_Horizon posted:

I'd probably be saying the same thing if we got more than one sequel for FFXII.

That's because you have horrible taste. Not that the one sequel to XII was good...

# ¿ Aug 27, 2013 21:14

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

BioMe posted:

So what is the gameplay in LR going to be then, exactly? If they are doing what they are doing with FFXV (realize they can't design RPGs for poo poo anymore and should instead keep making Kingdom Hearts games) I might actually buy it, god help me.

That showed him.

The reason XV is a Kingdom Hearts game is because it's the Kingdom Hearts team. This is Nomura, these are the games Nomura makes. Seriously go take a look at them, I don't think he's ever directed a title that wasn't just this. I'm more shocked by how people were surprised by this turn of events, or thought it was a change for all of Square Enix.

# ¿ Aug 27, 2013 21:59

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

The White Dragon posted:

Yeah but Quasar is such a pain in the rear end to get, doesn't only one boss actually cast it and isn't it stupid easy to destroy it before it can even get it off?

Oh Quasar isn't that bad, you just have to build a deck dedicated to get him out with some speed. Otherwise the summoning requirements are way to strict for just casually throwing him in. :suicide:

# ¿ Aug 28, 2013 06:55

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

I knew someone who considered all JRPGs to be poorly designed terrible games because he somehow got stuck in what I assume is FF10s opening Tutorial (he was very vague) and couldn't figure out how to proceed.

It was then I realized that some people are just REALLY DUMB

# ¿ Sep 17, 2013 07:11

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

For the record, I don't think those 5 characters are ALL of FFXVs playable cast, just the ones they can reveal without going full on plot spoilers. I mean that would essentially mean getting your entire party off the bat at the start of the game, which... okay it's Nomura and he made Kingdom Hearts, but even he wanted the PC to actually recruit the characters from the disney worlds, not just have them guest star.

I remember for the longest time people thought the initial group we had seen were it, and we had to be specifically told "No, we just haven't shown the rest." Now could I be wrong? Absolutely.

ANYWAY. Putting that to bed. FF2? I like it? I think? I certainly played it enough. I think it was ballsy to handle "We need new party members" by "Let's loving MURDER the other ones." It was probably FFs most blatant "Fantasy Star Wars" story ever.

But this was Square when it experimented. When it wanted to explore what would work and what didn't. And the gameplay didn't work in many senses. At the same time, at least they tried something new, which would become a standard for FF in the future. Which gave us things like the Job system and ATB.

And it's nowhere near as bad as FF8 or XIII. Even if the game will murder you for going south instead of north. Feels like an RPG I would make back as a child with RPGmaker 2000

# ¿ Dec 12, 2013 16:25

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

CeallaSo posted:

Let's not forget that II also gave us the SaGa series, the gameplay of which is very clearly descended from its best elements. The first game in the series is... strange, but even now it's still pretty fun once you figure it out (and if you can get around the Gameboy graphics). It's the only game I've ever played that allows you to cut God in half with a chainsaw.

And the SaGa games gave up The Last Remnant, which I love to death.

Seriously, if you haven't go buy TLR.

# ¿ Dec 13, 2013 01:43

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

TLR is a game that when you know all the little things that make it work. How to trigger what AI commands, how to level and chain etc. Is a really good game. And when you don't know any of these things, it's a really bad game.

I second the desire for a mod that lets me simply choose what everyone in a union can do, which subtracts from the AP bar of that union and leaving me able to do everything. Also an in game explanation for... oh... the Class system the weapon levels the stats and everything else would be helpful.

Course I love the game more than I hate it. But nothing is as annoying as starting on Hard Mode and wiping to a boss when you have Rush, and then AI unions.

There isn't anything I could do about that game. Why did you gently caress me?

But yes. Could have been much better. Was still good personally. Let me change everyones equipment without modding the game and let me select everyone's actions. And I would even settle on that as Golden.

# ¿ Dec 13, 2013 10:40

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

So. This is a thing. Apologies if it was discussed previously but this the most :psyduck:

thing to ever exist.

A short plot outline is detailed here:

Yuna and Tidus get stranded on an island.
Tidus is unable to concentrate on battle because of Yuna's swimsuit.
They argue.
The beach is covered in blitzballs.
Tidus kicks one of them in anger.
It's actually a bomb.
His head gets blown off his body.
It lands next to Yuna and explodes.
Yuna passes out.
The island is either created by an ancient summoner or a refuge for summoners to hide during the Machina War.
There is a mysterious old man on the island.
Yuna resurrects Tidus through the Farplane by whistling.
They have sex to create a new fayth.
She realizes this Tidus is different than the Tidus she knew.
They break up.
The new fayth has revived all dead life on Spira.
Sin is reborn anew.

Link to it's amazon page here.

http://www.amazon.co.jp/FINAL-FANTA...ice+of+eternity

This has to be a troll, I can't fathom this existence, I truly can't. Yet everything points to it being a real product

# ¿ Jan 3, 2014 04:41

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Amazon Reviews time!

quote:

I'm done reading it, but I never thought in my wildest dreams that reading a novel could make me feel this terrible.
This sequel has rendered meaningless the pair's story and bonds that were established in FF10 and FF10-2.
It seems that Squeenix has taken a liking to gloomier things of late.
Not only is Tidus ignored, despite moving towards meeting Tidus once again by means of her own ego, which was Yuna's only wish in 10-2... when they finally meet, the meeting is oddly cool.
She doesn't think of the recently returned Tidus' feelings at all, she just comes across as a selfish girl with a bad personality.
Her portrayal was very sexual, but was it really necessary to have a presentation like that which rarely occurs in FF?
The shocking guro scene along the way left me with a disgusted feeling, why would the efforts of the pure summoner from FF 10-2 have all of her efforts come to this?
The image of the characters has also crumbled, and the Yuna who was once kind, pure, and earnest is now like a totally different person.
After reading the novel, I was in a state of shock that FFX-HD was connected to the events of the novel, and having no desire to play, I sold it.
I didn't want to give it any stars, but I have to give it one star becuase I don't have a choice.
Surely, the entired FF10 series has been cheapened in this one moment; it's all truly meaningless.

quote:

I agree with those who are of the opinion that they don't even want to give this one star.
There may be people who will be come interested in something because of the fact that it has terrible reviews and a terrible reputation, but I want to speak in a loud voice to all those who love the FF10 story.

Do not, DO NOT read this book!!!

I once loved this game, and an official release this blasphemous cannot be forgiven. The characters have degenerated to totally different people, the neatly concluded story has now been shoved into the depths of unhappiness. And maybe by throwing it out half-completed with a "To be continued..." ending,
they thought the fans would eat it up and beg for an ending, so they could make more money off of the series.

Did they hope to get the public's attention for 10-3 by way of a shocking continuation full of guro, erotic scenes and loss? Isn't that nothing but filthy profiteering? Spira was a gasping world of unending nightmare, caught in the spiral of death but I don't want ot see the oft-repeated case of characters and worlds broken because of the studio's ego, self-intoxication and lust for money.
For companies to try to make up for their sluggish sales of new titles by making sequels to their old hits, that's the real unending nightmare.
"If you think my story is stupid, then I'll just end it for you here and now!"
With that, Tidus asserted his spirit; does Squeenix have that spirit?

The pure story and characters of previous releases have been tainted.
It's said that FF10, by way of the parting in the last mission had the theme of 'graduation',
but for me, this novel seems like it will mark my own decision to 'graduate' and say farewell to FF.
I had thought this was going to be a single episode like FF10-2, which concluded the story of Tidus and Yuna.
To think I was handed a discordant half finished product...
Rather than a final fantasy, this was a lost fantasy.

# ¿ Jan 3, 2014 05:15

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Mazed posted:

I can't read Japanese, but I'm going to assume that Taro Yoko (the Drakengard guy) is credited for this, because that's the only way it'd make sense.

Nope, Kazushige Nojima. He is best known for writing several installments of Square Enix's Final Fantasy video game series�namely Final Fantasy VII, Final Fantasy VIII, Final Fantasy X, Final Fantasy X-2, Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children, Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy XV�and the Kingdom Hearts series. Nojima also wrote the original lyrics of Liberi Fatali for Final Fantasy VIII and both Suteki da Ne and the Hymn of the Fayth for Final Fantasy X.

# ¿ Jan 3, 2014 05:33

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

There is also an audio drama with the HD Remake that picks off after the novel. It talks about Aurons supposed daughter, Yuna and Tidus not being together. Tidus being very weak. It also talks about Sins return.

It ends with the same speech Yuna gave in FFX about Sins defeat. The exact same one.

It's basically setting up for FFX-3 saying Yuna will defeat Sin again.

# ¿ Jan 3, 2014 05:38

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

ImpAtom posted:

The thing about a light novel is that it has a lot less oversight than a video game. Very few video games are the creation of a single person. A light novel is just the person writing whatever they want and with relatively little editing. (Due to what I mentioned before: Japan treats that kind of stuff as disposable and not as True Hard Canon.) So this kind of writing is basically "the writer shits something out and there's nobody else involved to temper it.'

Again, it's pretty Star Warsian where Lucas' ideas were tempered, refined, adjusted or bounced off of the other people involved in the original films while he had immensely more control and less oversight on the second set of films. Add to that that anyone left at S-E from the FF7 days is probably a higher up in the company now and they probably don't have many people actually giving them oversight.

Actually Nojima has been a freelancer since 2003. So while he still works for square he's not officially apart of the company, and I don't know if that would mean there's less to watch over him or not.

Mazed posted:

Did...something happen to him? Like there's a clear line of shittiness that was crossed here. Did he experience an emotional breakdown? Did he just run out of decent ideas? Was he always this bad but the bloated size of design teams needed as the PS2 era progressed caused there to be fewer opportunities for awful ideas to get caught and turned around?

I have no idea, He's written a lot though. In the end I'll bring it down to this.

A director exists to make sure that everything is being handled correctly, they okay/nope the creative team and the writers. There is no director on a Novel, or an Audio Drama. That's right, there's an Audio Drama released with X/X-2 HD that's following up on the crappy Novel! In it they talk about looking for Aurons Daughter, the fact that Tidus is super weak now (since he's an entirely new fayth I guess) and how Yuna pledges to kill Sin again, in the same speech she gave in FFX.

Also unconfirmed not sure how much is someone taking the piss but Rikku and Paine are apparently lesbians, Paine dressess more colorfully and Rikku dresses so skimpily that Lulu asks her to leave. I don't know if that's true, or someone just seeing how much bullshit we'll accept given... everything else.

But this has got to be the worst justification for a X-3 ever. Essentially there isn't a game because there's something to explore or a new foe or anything else.

It's cause Tidus got horny and kicked a blitzbomb cause his girlfriend dressed skimpily in battle and gave him a boner. Sin came back because Tidus got a stiffy.

# ¿ Jan 3, 2014 11:18

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

so straight translated from the novel itself! The death of Tidus!

quote:

"You were snickering."

"It's a secret."

"Yunaaa!"

His dejected groan was all the more amusing to her as it was incredibly endearing.

"Ow!"

"Huh?"

When she turned to look at him, she found him holding the back of his head. Tidus turned around, startled. His vision focused on a ball rolling gently on the ground. It was the same color as the ocean(?), but its size was about the same as the ones used in Blitzball tournaments.

"It's a blitzball!!!"

Glancing around for the ball's owner, Tidus began to walk towards it. Yuna watched as he took one step forward.

And then felt surprise, for tears were suddenly spilling from her eyes. Her emotions jolted abruptly and she couldn't stand. Crouched on the ground with both arms wrapped around her, she realized that the emotion she was feeling was unbearable sadness. In one moment a loud noise had flooded her ears and a strong force had flung her into the air. The source of her shock was Tidus's head, which had been blown off his body and was now lying in front of her.

Yuna lost consciousness.

Drama.

# ¿ Jan 4, 2014 04:47

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Butt Ghost posted:

"It's a blitzball!"

- Famous last words.

So is it ever explained why there's a loving blitzball bomb randomly lying about on the beach? Did someone use Tidus' undying love for Blitzball and incredible incompetence to stage the most hilarious assassination to ever be written?

Okay so Yuna and Tidus decided to forgoe their usual travel of one of two airships and decided to instead take a boat, shipwreck on an unknown island that was created by Summoners in Zanarkand 1000 years ago as a haven from the war, and there's whole bunch of those balls and they're all mines. Painted to look like Blitzballs.

So yes this also all requires that Tidus and Yuna didn't just take an airship.

ALSO! Apparently Tidus will fade away if he ever realizes what exactly he is, so Yuna's acting cold towards him. And she breaks up with him at the end of the novel when she realizes "Hey this isn't my Tidus I summoned back from the dead by whistling for the second time after I had sex with him already.

# ¿ Jan 4, 2014 05:49

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

NikkolasKing posted:

It's actually Shuyin with amnesia.

Considering Tidus is literally Shuyin except the Fayth forgot some of the details (hence the fact that his clothes in general seem in complete and his backstory is so similar to Shuyins) it wouldn't be that shocking that she just revived the ACTUAL Tidus.

Obviously Tidus isn't Shuyin with the Fayth forgetting some details over time because that would make sense as to why they look alike

# ¿ Jan 4, 2014 06:15

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

nine-gear crow posted:

Sounds like someone in Square's writers room finally grew a conscience, and this is contrition for being goaded by fans into making FFX-2.

Now as for X-3, god I hope Square's usual production bullshit smothers this idea in its crib. The only idea I'd personally want to see explored in depth is the Jecht/Braska/Auron story, and even then it was done so perfectly in FFX that it doesn't even need to be explored in full. Hell, the implied story of what went on prior to X was a billion times better than X itself... And I actually liked the story of X to a fair extent.

I don't know how serious it is but I hear people saying that this was literally written because Nojima didn't like that X-2 was so happy. Then again he WROTE X-2 so I can't see why he would be upset. Also that's the most inappropriate reaction to "this was too happy".

The thing I can't get past is that this literally reads like Fanfiction like... the audio drama follow up introduces a girl claiming to be Aurons daughter and a boy with a super crush on Yuna. It literally reads like someones fanfiction of FFX, I know Kitase once said

quote:

�In the real world things are very different. You just need to look around you. Nobody wants to die that way. People die of disease and accident. Death comes suddenly and there is no notion of good or bad. It leaves, not a dramatic feeling but great emptiness. When you lose someone you loved very much you feel this big empty space and think, 'If I had known this was coming I would have done things differently." These are the feelings I wanted to arouse in the players with Aerith's death relatively early in the game. Feelings of reality and not Hollywood.�

And this seems like the exact opposite. Something so comical and ridiculous that I can't help but laugh, and everyone I tell it to believes that I am lying or posting someones fanfiction.

I don't get Square, Lightning Returns did horribly, the brand name has been damaged beyond recognition, the COMPANY NAME has been damaged beyond recognition. I thought they were supposed to have a board to determine the quality on this stuff, but apparently that doesn't cover non games? X-3 is not going to sell on nostalgia, the brand has been so damaged. You can't just say "Hey we can make a sequel and lots of money" anymore!

I still can't stop laughing.

# ¿ Jan 4, 2014 13:18

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

nine-gear crow posted:

When they finally break the emergency glass on that FFVII remake people have been hounding them for for nearly a decade, then you know they're well and truly hosed. Mostly because they'll go bankrupt before they finish remodelling Cloud's face so he looks more like Lightning as per Toriyama's orders.

But that's the thing, an FFVII remake would do well if their was any faith to go with nostalgia, but Square has destroyed all faith and good will. I doubt people would even be excited for an FFVII remake after X-3s invevitable iOS Release.

I'm just happy they apparently dislike my favourite FFs of IX and XII and they are unlikely to ever be continued and ruined.

# ¿ Jan 4, 2014 13:40

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

RagnarokAngel posted:

To be fair we don't know how much is the original writing and how much is the translator's doing. The overall story content can probably be criticized but the writing style is a different story.

Would it surprise you even if it was stilted to be honest? Writing script for video games and writing it for a novel are two separate skill sets. I mean most translations from Japanese->English wind up very stiff, especially with novels because the languages are just so different. But also consider that Nojima's not a novelist, he's a scenario writer.

# ¿ Jan 5, 2014 17:13

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

That's probably because despite just being "There" Vaan has a stronger character than Basch did. When you got down to it Basch was just his duty, he was pretty muc the same guy you met and always knew with no change or growth. And while I'm not calling him a bad character the fact is Basch barely does anything in the game anyway. He takes a backseat to Balthier, Ashe and Vaan.

Vaan lucks out because he gets to serve as Ashe's shadow, with many similarities between their situations and their personal treatment of each other, their treatment of grief and how they lived their lives. Vaan pretended he wanted to be a sky pirate because otherwise meant confronting the fact he was all alone in a cold world and he would, eventually, be swallowed by despair. Ashe drove herself with uncompromising duty, she would stop Archades, she wouldn't accept a treaty or surrender or political result she was going to break them.

The difference between them was Vaan eventually realized his hatred was pointless and sought about finding a new goal, he didn't know what it was so he chose to follow Ashe. He gave her a reason to not just focus on herself, every time the nethicite came up he suggested they destroy it, he firmly believed that she wouldn't even consider using Nethicite on Archades, and when the scene on the pharos is happening she looks to him, because Gabranath has caused him the same pain he caused her, he stole Vaan's brother and her father. And he looks back, then calms himself down. And she rejects the occuria and Gabranth at the same time.

Balthiers arc is entirely focused upon him attempting to escape the reach of his fathers obsession while simultaneously fighting back, at multiple points Balthier is references as someone who runs away. He's like Shinji Ikari but way more mentally stable and more mature, even right down to the fact that his dad's insane and has an obsession over something that drives him away from his son. The end of his arc is him with the ultimate chance to run away on the Bahamut, and choosing "Nope, I'm going to stay and see this through."

So yes, Vaan was the last of the playable characters to be created, no, there was no part of the game that was done at the time this happened, yes, Daisuke Watanabe the writer intended for him to be a blank slate, thankfully he failed, yes he actually does have a character, no he's not just "there". and that's why he's gotten two extra games to help expand who he is as he grows up and why he was the rep in Dissidia 2.

EDIT: Also yes, the game did wind up going through 3 directors, development on FFXII was a god drat mess

Onmi fucked around with this message at 10:51 on Jan 24, 2014

# ¿ Jan 24, 2014 10:47

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Oh god... Dragon Song. I had never played a Lunar game I went "Hey I got a DS, Pokemon still isn't out, I like RPGs, I've heard good things about the Lunar series. I'll give it a shot."

I will never. EVER. Get that part of my life back... I finished it and it's just sitting there looking at me... forever...

EDIT: That's actually why I was so kind to FF3DS, which is a horribly remade game as I've played and ENJOYED FF3NES. Because before that I had played Dragon Song and the idea of an RPG I had enjoyed, that wasn't pokemon on my DS? hell yes.

# ¿ Feb 6, 2014 13:12

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

ApplesandOranges posted:

My first thought was actually the Archades rumour sidequest, that was just padding.

Indeed, I'm not shocked at FFXIIs horrid pacing, nothing that goes through 3 directors is going to come out without some hiccups, and for FFXII the biggest hiccup was pacing.

# ¿ Feb 14, 2014 11:41

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

ApplesandOranges posted:

It goes:

FFXII
Revenant Wings
FFTA2
FFT

FFTA is out of continuity.

No it isn't. St. Ivalice is Ivalice now that all the magic is dead and Ivalice itself has died down into nothing but a small town. The fantasy world the Grimoire takes them to isn't real, just a record of some time in history, but the real world is the end result of history.

It would have been nice if they had made it clear that severing the Occurias grasp on the world is what wound up causing the decline of magic etc. because FFXII is the Golden Age and by Tactics, all the other races are dead, magic has severely dropped off, we've lost Airships and guns.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2014 04:38

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Volt Catfish posted:

I'm pretty sure most of it is people playing the gently caress out of Chrono Trigger back in 1995 and then hearing about a sequel and hyping themselves up for five years and then you got...Chrono Cross.

Chrono Cross is a good game, but indeed a horrible Trigger sequel. Which it was never really trying to BE, but you know.

It kind of is (in as much as taking place in the same world) but when it is trying it's hamstringing itself. Which is really the games faults, it's trying to do way to much and a lot of what it's trying to do isn't very good... Still a good game, but it could have been an amazing game.

# ¿ Aug 31, 2014 23:42

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

I take Nomura's dropping to co-director as more "Focus on KH3 so we can actually get that game out." seeing as development for XV started in 2011 and 4 years isn't THAT long of a dev cycle for a game like this. Now that being said, I'm also a giant optimist so that's just me.

# ¿ Sep 18, 2014 04:22

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Mischitary posted:

This is true, but I like to tell myself that the miracle that is FFXIV's resurrection was a portent that S-E had become more serious about getting good games out there in a timely fashion and it's internal development is becoming more streamlined and efficient.

Nah. KH3 was gonna come out with or without this renewed focus or whatever on KH3 that Nomura is doing now. I mean since Nomura's been working on Versus/XV we've seen the release of two KH games for DS, one being a spin off and one being a remake, and two full-fledged KH games, one a prequel that's just as important as any other and one a straight up sequel to KH2. I actually trust whatever guys were making KH3 till now more than I trust Nomura, to be honest. Before Versus he was heavily involved in KH2 and that game was so long in development that they straight up had to cut features out of it to release it on time, and they didn't get added back in until the Final Mix version, which made the original KH2 release super bare-bones.

I believe that Nomura is still- yup went and checked it. He was still the director for Birth by Sleep, 358/2 Days, Dream Drop Distance and Re:Coded.

So to amend what you said, while he was working on Versus/XV, he also made two KH games for DS, one being a spin off and one being a remake, and two full-fledged KH games, one a prequel just as important as any other and one a straight up sequel to KH2.

# ¿ Sep 18, 2014 04:44

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

SyntheticPolygon posted:

Huh, for some reason I thought Nomura was only recently made director of FFXV so that it wouldn't interfere with the other games he was making. But him working on an entirely different series while working on XV just sounds like a recipe for disaster.

Nomura has always been the director of Versus/XV and always been the Director of the Kingdom Hearts games, in fact the latter is pretty much ALL his directing work with Square, his work with the Final Fantasy was mostly art and a few other pieces here and there. So Versus was really his first time working on a Final Fantasy game as a director. And during the majority of that time, he made 4 Kingdom Hearts games, apparently couldn't get what he wanted out of the PS3, and had most of his team jumped to help XIII and XIV at different points.

And then, they announce Kingdom Hearts 3 at the same time. The funny thing about KH3 is it wasn't announced until just last year, but everyone has been acting like it was announced for YEARS because it was obviously going to happen. And as bad as it is to try to manage ONE AAA game like Versus/XV if you also get thrown in to develop a second one, you can't keep that that up for long. So moving Hajime to the main director of XV when he isn't working on anything, and letting Nomura focus exclusively on KH3 is probably for the best.

# ¿ Sep 18, 2014 05:21

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

So here's a bit more of the engine showcase from TGS https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-GQMaGZYaQs

# ¿ Sep 20, 2014 07:09

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Evil Fluffy posted:

They're fighting FF2 imps/goblins in that video. FF15 secretly being FF2-2 confirmed. Noctis is emo as hell because he's Leon's descendent.

Or FF5, since Garula is in as well

And FF5 is the first game Nomura worked on, as a monster artist.

# ¿ Sep 20, 2014 08:58

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Mega64 posted:

I hope the first minute's footage means Toad is still a status effect and you can drive the car with a group of toads.

Don't you mean Toad returning as a status effect?

# ¿ Sep 20, 2014 12:35

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Yeah I'm uh... losing a lot of steam since the director swap...

# ¿ Sep 23, 2014 11:07

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Varance posted:

FF4 could easily be summarized as "Life shits on Cecil, Cecil figures out a way to deal with it and moves on."

Cecil is apart from all other FF lead protagonists in that the guy is already a mature leader with plenty of responsibility and a large number of people who would trust him with their lives before the game even begins.

Basch would have been the second, but he didn't focus test well so Vaaaaaaan.

At least the cast of FFXII actually achieved poo poo, either their own personal issues, or indeed actually making a difference in the world... and this is the game that's all ABOUT the guys that history never focuses on and follows because that's the theme of Ivalice games in general. Actually gonna bring up a different game series, you can indulge me for a moment since it happens all the time in this thread.

In Tales of Phantasia, the game starts off with you not succeeding until you get shot to the past, and then from there, you start succeeding, you set out to do things and it works, and it's not a secret "HAHA THE VILLAIN HAS BEATEN YOU" win, it's just a win. It's good.

Never, in video games, have "Protect the X" where the X is Crystals, Pillars, maidens, seals. Because in that case, you MUST lose so they can be destroyed to lead to the end game. Making the PC incompetent. I don't need a PC that always succeeds, but if I just spent 20 hours trying to save a seal, and then after I'm done it gets blown up... I feel like my 20 hours just got wasted, why should I care? In fact, if my mentality should be "It's got to happen so the end-game can happen" why should I care about anything outside of the end-game, my success has no value except to move the story and the story is pointless because I will always fail, unless the game is going to actually observe the failure affecting the protagonists, I shouldn't both paying any attention.

# ¿ Sep 30, 2014 04:30

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Evil Fluffy posted:

If the latter half of the game was the FF8 writers showing restraint...

Squall Is Dead seems semi-viable largely because the writers for FF8 were so terrible that it's embarrassing and people want to believe there's more to the game's story because it's so bad otherwise.

See also: Indoctrination Theory. When you have fans of something, especially fans like the Final Fantasy Fans who've been riding high on the smell of sweet FFVII and have been jiggling in jubilation for the next game in the series, which has prettier graphics and oh my did you see that really flashy intro sequence?! And then the game comes out and it's... Well their minds are reaching? Bad? Surely not! And so they will latch on to whatever theory they can that lets them comfortably play out the game and say "It was not bad, it was just so deep and beyond the average person!"

Of course, years of poo poo FF games followed by long delays between them and of course the overall changes of theme and setting between games have no bred a culture of "Every game is the worst game in the series." And that Square can do no right, clearly incompetent.

Essentially the observation on public perception of Square should be recorded and noted for future revolts against companies. Like Bioware. Or Capcom.

Although in Capcoms case they've just come out to say "We hate you the customer."

# ¿ Oct 25, 2014 12:10

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

morallyobjected posted:

when we say every game is the worst in the series, that means VII too. it is also a poo poo game

Well of course, EVERY game is the worst in the series

Looper posted:

I would like to know more!

That's all there is, there isn't anymore.

# ¿ Oct 25, 2014 23:16

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

ImpAtom and people like ImpAtom are the reason the entire Don Cornero segment of FFVII could never happen in todays society. So thank you brave soldiers from saving us from ever getting an FFVII remake, for it is the worst in the series.

# ¿ Oct 29, 2014 23:03

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# ¿ May 10, 2024 14:46

Onmi: Jul 12, 2013; If someone says it one more time I'm having Florina show up as a corpse. I'm not even kidding, I was pissed off with people doing that shit back in 2010, and I'm not dealing with it now in 2016.

Cake Attack posted:

Agarest is an srpg where you romance anime girls over five generation, like fire emblem with three more gens, which sounds like my poo poo

it's a shame really

Agarest is a game that seems really cool. And it's really really really bad. It's not like it didn't have the potential to NOT suck, it's just that it does suck. Best forget it and try to pretend it doesn't exist.

# ¿ Nov 14, 2014 05:05

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Final Fantasy Megathread - People here, it sounds like sickness

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