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As a budding copywriter and fiction writer, I feel somewhat like a fish out of water as a former International Studies major/careerist in college when it seems like everyone else is an English major and talk to each other as such. I'm sure there a lot more people out there who don't fit the typical mold like me, but it does feel strange. That being said, is there any advice for self-studying for a pseudo-English BA education as a well-educated writer? Any syllabi or books I should look at for this kind of hobbyist self-study? Anything like MIT OpenCourseWare that might help me?
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Nov 8, 2013 22:32
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| # ¿ May 20, 2024 06:30 |
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I appreciate the advice, thank you. In terms of a pseudo-English BA versus a pseudo-MFA in Creative Writing, I mainly want to understand why certain usages of tone, grammar, etc work the way they do as well as having a better intellectual tool-set to analyze and dissect (classic) authors like Tolstoy, Dostoyevsky, Shakespeare, Hunter S. Thompson, and other great writers and why their writing "works". Does that make sense?
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Nov 9, 2013 21:29
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Alright, so for my upcoming Thunderdome entry, I want to have the narrator recount the story in past-tense as if he were talking to the audience (imagine an invisible therapist) as an adult looking back on a traumatic experience he had as a kid or a teenager. That being said, my question is: How should a first-person narrator "talk" to the reader while also describing past events? Should I forgo quotation marks when the narrator is commenting directly to the reader and save it for actual spoken dialogue that takes place in the past? I'm a little worried I might confuse the reader trying to both talk to the audience in the present-tense but also recall experiences in the past as he narrates. I keep tossing around the idea of a quick lead-in intro that takes place in the present between the narrator and a therapist and then going into the "past narrative" (think movie-version of Great Gatsby or the Tell-Tale Heart by Poe) but, given the word count and for sake of brevity, I feel more and more that I just want to axe this intro part and jump straight into the "meat" of the action to keep the story from dragging in the beginning. Any thoughts? [e]: I also really want the first line to be the narrator commenting on his regret or asking the reader about regret as a way to hook the reader in. E.G., "You wouldn't blame me for making a mistake, would you?" (Narrative starts here) In other words, the Narrator is mainly talking to You (the reader) as well as reflecting on his past trauma as a kid. It's kind of like a confessional to get the burden off his chest since he felt partly responsible for what happened by not doing enough to stop said incident. Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 17:33 on Nov 12, 2013 |
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Nov 12, 2013 17:21
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Thank you for the advice. I was worried because I was thinking over the other narrative-style I was imagining (ie present-tense narrator is talking to a therapist as an actual character) Here's an example [not actually going to be in the story]: --- I craned my neck and looked askance at Bob, my therapist. "Really, you want me to tell everything?" "Yes, of course, Shane. Why don't you start from the beginning?" I sighed. "Well, if you insist..." [Past narrative starts here] It all started one day at the zoo. Bill was... (etc. etc.) "Hey Shane, you dummy!" Bill said to me. I looked over at him (etc. etc.) "And then what?" my therapist asked. (etc. etc.) --- I think "double-layering" the narrative like that, actually writing it out now, would make the story needlessly convoluted and distract the reader instead of immersing them. I think it's better just to jump straight into the narrative and act as if the reader is the invisible therapist. [e]: Also, this is my first Thunderdome challenge ever; it's a little intimidating at first competing with other writers but now it's surprisingly a ton of fun actually having a reason and prompt to write something creative for once!  I haven't written fiction for a good while now![e2]: While I'm thinking about it, how should I break up blocks of extended dialogue or monologue? Example: ------------------ "Jerry," Cindy started, "I... Don't think this is going to work out." Jerry's eyes bugged out. "What!? Why?" "You've never taken the dog out, the dishes are always a mess, and you reek constantly. How on earth do you expect to take care of our unborn child? "Honestly, Jerry, it's a miracle I haven't left you already by now." (etc. etc.) ------------------------- I want to know, essentially, how to break up larger blocks of spoken text. Isn't there something about sentence chunks only having one quotation mark at the beginning of the sentence or something? Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 18:04 on Nov 12, 2013 |
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Nov 12, 2013 17:48
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Any advice for beating the cliche reflex out of me when it comes to writing dialogue and characters? That's a problem I keep running into, before in a creative writing workshop and now with Thunderdome. I know I can write better than this, so I'm open to learning and improving. It helps to deflate the ego.
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Nov 18, 2013 14:18
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Thank you for the advice. I meant more specifically about recognizing cliches to begin with, like I think I'm writing good dialogue but it actually reads as cliched to someone else.
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Nov 18, 2013 14:53
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Okay, so I've made a few book requests at my local public library and now I have this reading list to tackle: - The Shining by Stephen King - Ender's Game by Orson Scott Card - A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess - Slaughterhouse-Five by Kurt Vonnegut - I Am Legend by Richard Matheson I am primarily interested in exploring Horror and Sci-Fi. I am also really, really interested in studying writing that really digs deep into the reader and creeps them out with psychologically/ethically/philosophically disturbing questions and prose. Also, good writing that realistically and engagingly depicts mental states and thoughts when confronted with brutality, violence, (meaningless) death, war, torture, madness, trauma, loss of innocence or idealism, loss, hopelessness and despair, etc is a huge plus. Any recommendations for which book I should start with? I think I'm most partial to reading A Clockwork Orange or Slaughterhouse-Five first. I've never read anything by the above writers, by the way. [e]: Also, yes, this is basically Babby's First Reading List.  I read fiction very rarely, definitely changing that now.
Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 17:43 on Nov 29, 2013 |
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Nov 29, 2013 17:32
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The Saddest Rhino posted:I Am Legend is arguably the easiest and the shortest, so start with that. Slaughterhouse is good reading, Clockwork Orange can be incredibly difficult if this is your first reading list, especially as it uses its very own vocabulary and you may have to refer to the glossary several times. King has many deriders, but he has an easy to read style. I would suggest you also take a look at King's On Writing. That's a good point on A Clockwork Orange. I really want my first few fiction readings to be relatively easy to read (not a deal-breaker, of course) and accessible without sacrificing quality so as to make fiction reading more of a regular enjoyable habit I just do normally like playing video games rather than something to "prepare" for. Other posters have explained the meaning of genre fiction already but I'm still not clear on what makes something not genre. So... I suppose I am looking primarily for genre fiction, specifically Horror and Sci-fi. Short stories and novellas I think would be a good strategy for me for habit building and for dipping my toes into what I would want to focus on as a writer in my own stories, as you've suggested. Basically consider me a pseudo-Freshman Creative Writing major. Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 19:03 on Nov 29, 2013 |
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Nov 29, 2013 18:28
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Erogenous Beef posted:Hemingway's ... For Whom The Bell Tolls are both interesting depictions of men confronted with the realities of war Maybe it was because I was a junior in high school, but I actually read For Whom the Bell Tolls for my junior English term paper and remember finding it incredibly dry and boring. To high school-me, basically nothing happens for the majority of the book while the anti-fascist resistance hides out in the foothills of Spain (apart from some implicit "earth-moving" sex) until the very end when they blow up a bridge and people die with a cliffhanger ending. I could give it a re-read and probably appreciate it better now, though. [e]: And yeah, definitely wanting to read broadly to dip my toes in different waters, so to speak. Really going for exposure to different ways of conveying narrative at the moment, like you mentioned, to figure out what makes good writing good and to find my own voice as a writer. [e2]: For further reference, I loved the hell out of 1984 and Brave New World in high school which I think had a pretty big (albeit indirect) impact on what I wanted to study later in college (International Relations). I have a soft-spot for poli-sci heavy dystopian science fiction.  The Jungle, too, even though the last dozen or so pages is basically Upton Sinclair getting up on his soapbox to preach about socialism (not that I mind the political message, I'm somewhat of a nascent socialist myself, just speaking from a "good writing" standpoint). On a tangent, am I the only one who gets unreasonably irritated that people seem to only remember The Jungle for depicting unsanity meat factories but never talk about how lovely raw capitalism is in the book and its call for socialism, which is what the book is actually about? It's almost as if nobody actually read the book, including Teddy Roosevelt. Were people just that blinded to the realities of capitalism versus belief in the system or what? (Yes, I had these same questions when I first read it in high school too) Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 19:23 on Nov 29, 2013 |
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Nov 29, 2013 18:52
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General Battuta posted:If you're looking at genre short stories, I'd actually suggest turning an eye to more modern writers. There's been a remarkable eruption of good short fiction in the field in the past ten/twenty years. I'm not immediately coming up with any authors that fit the themes you're after (this aimed at RamblingSoul) but I'm confident they exist. I definitely understand the need to read more female authors. My girlfriend is recommending Oryx and Crake by Margaret Atwood for creepy/disturbing good writing. Isn't Atwood a good reference for good female-written sci-fi in general?
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Nov 29, 2013 20:21
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I'm reading through Slaugterhouse-Five and enjoying it so far, but it does bring something to mind: Do you have to be gregarious to be a good storyteller? I can easily imagine Vonnegut sitting next to me telling the story, it feels very clear and organic. It's like I can imagine hearing the good storyteller in person through the text. As for me, I love making stories but have difficulty telling them. In other words, I'm pretty shy and find it awkward and unpleasant to tell mundane stories about my life that other people seem to do naturally in conversation. Could this have an impact on my ability to tell stories on the written page or is it like comparing apples to oranges? Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Dec 5, 2013 |
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Dec 5, 2013 22:11
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Are there other ways to be a storyteller apart from writing novels/novellas? I keep turning it around in my head, but I think I really want to be a visual story teller (eg movies, video games, etc.) most of all. Even then, doesn't that still involve writing to some degree (ie screenwriting)? Don't get me wrong, I still love writing out fiction and non-fiction, but I think my ideal outlet would be a visual medium. What other outlets does a visually-oriented storyteller have? I really, really, really want to submit an entry for the Saxxys using Source Film Maker, for example.
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Dec 18, 2013 22:34
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Anyone have any reviews of Elements of Fiction Writing - Conflict and Suspense? I think I'm definitely partial towards writing thriller stories, especially ones rooted in human conflict in a tightly-knit group (think the Zero Escape series or The Walking Dead). Is there anything else I should read to help with thriller/suspense writing?
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Dec 20, 2013 15:36
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Any links, advice, or other resources for writing thriller (or suspense) fiction? Especially psychological thriller, I'd appreciate any pointers.
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Jan 16, 2014 23:32
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I've been reading more on fiction advice and there seems to be a general consensus of "to be a better writer, just keep writing." I get it, but what is the process like for you when you sit down uninspired and need to just write about something? Does it have to be from where you left off on a story or do you just have a separate file for random writing practice? Where do you store these random musings (I use Scrivener for reference)? These probably sound like simple questions, but I want to be serious about getting better at writing fiction. This includes basic issues like eliminating cliched writing/characterization/etc, writing exercises when you're not inspired, confidence in writing concise details/scenes, etc. Are there any 101-style fiction writing books/blogs/resources for these kinds of issues? [e]: Plus I'll set aside time to read this thread and the Creative Resources (for writing) thread back to end. Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 14:18 on Sep 3, 2014 |
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Sep 3, 2014 14:14
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When is it appropriate to focus on describing nature or weather in a story? I've read advice saying that you should by-and-large avoid describing or writing about nature or weather since it is really cliche, but what about like with Grapes of Wrath where Steinbeck spends several pages (the first chapter?) describing the clouds passing over Oklahoma before getting to the Joad family?
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Sep 8, 2014 23:27
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blue squares posted:Describing weather briefly is fine, but you shouldn't begin that way unless you're an established author. What's wrong exactly with beginning a story with weather besides screaming cliched and turning off readers immediately? Is it just about bad first impressions and not trusting the author's storytelling ability or something more? Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 01:29 on Sep 9, 2014 |
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Sep 9, 2014 01:26
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| # ¿ May 20, 2024 06:30 |
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sebmojo posted:do you need anything more? Eh, I guess not. Point taken.
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Sep 9, 2014 01:32
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