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James Woods posted:I've still got it, its a bit of a long term restoration project that was serving as my daily driver for the last year until it threw an axle. I've been too busy preparing goon McMadCow's Ratrod BMW 2002 that we just finished a Frankenstein engine swap on for a vintage on-road rally to get the Vette' back together. If you have the time, you should start a project thread in AI. It really does help motivation at times and everyone there would appreciate it I'm sure. I know I would, I love old Vettes, and if you have any more projects the more the merrier.
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Aug 10, 2012 07:45
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James, can we try to get a list together of all the bartenders that post in these threads and what types of venues they're working in? Like: Daric - Medium-High Volume Restaurant
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Aug 10, 2012 08:02
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isomerc posted:As far as watering down liquor goes, is this and industry accepted practice, or is it just reserved for lovely bars? Is this something that's more common than we believe? As Dirnok said, this is incredibly uncommon. And just to nip this in the bud from the start, a bartender had noting to gain from short pouring, watering down, or otherwise trying to bilk you out of your booze. A heavy hand will get you a lot more tips that being a jigger Nazi and a smart owner/manager knows that drunk people are more likely to order more consecutive rounds and buy drinks for others. This kind of thing isn't just unscrupulous, it's bad business. leica posted:If you have the time, you should start a project thread in AI. It really does help motivation at times and everyone there would appreciate it I'm sure. I know I would, I love old Vettes, and if you have any more projects the more the merrier. You can definitely expect a James Woods AI thread in the near future.
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Aug 10, 2012 08:09
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So according to the news broadcast I just watched, one of our cooks got shot in the chest and is in the hospital in critical condition. He got home at 3am, which is normal for a restaurant job, and had a couple hundred dollars cash on him, also normal for our jobs, and some guys jumped him, took the cash and shot him in the chest but he managed to get the gun away and yell for his wife to call 911. There may be people reading these threads and thinking "Man, that sounds like so much fun, I want to do that" but, if I were you, I'd keep my 9-5.
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Aug 10, 2012 08:12
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Daric posted:So according to the news broadcast I just watched, one of our cooks got shot in the chest and is in the hospital in critical condition. First off let me say that my heart goes out to your friend and his family and I hope that he makes a full recovery. That said, if you're the type of person who's scared to be out at 3am for fear of some boggeymen robbing you, you have no business bartending and should continue to hide from the world in your cubicle at the adult day care program that is office work.
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Aug 10, 2012 08:39
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Holy poo poo, that's loving terrible. I hope he pulls through. Send him the best from uhh, the bartenders thread on the internet.
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Aug 10, 2012 08:42
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Frozen Horse posted:Welcome back, thread and inhabitants. What would it take for you to actually permanently cut off a regular for their own good? Have any of you done so? If you mean cut off for the night, extremely disorderly behavior, having serious trouble speaking/walking/parsing sentences, or, and this is if I have been especially off on noticing such behavior, puking all over themselves/the bar. If you mean barring them for good, well... as far as I know we've only banned one guy in the last two years from my current job, for going on a blistering racially motivated rant at one of our serving staff. But from a past job, drug use on the premesis, showing up with and consuming outside alcohol, serious or repeated fighting, theft, vandalism, and one very interesting night that got several people banned for putting our pool table through one of the bar's windows.
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Aug 10, 2012 09:18
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Frozen Horse posted:Welcome back, thread and inhabitants. What would it take for you to actually permanently cut off a regular for their own good? Have any of you done so? I wasn't going to reply to this since a couple of the other bartenders got to it before I saw it. But after reading their criteria for barring someone for good, it seems to me that my bar is far, far less forgiving than other bars and way, way more inclined to throw the permanent 86 flag. Examples: - Guy in his early 20's, maybe 120 lbs. soaking wet. Only came in on the weekends. Tried his damnedest to drink just as much as his friends did but just couldn't handle his booze. Four weekends in a row we had to cut this guy off and then, not long after that, kick him out. Always a big production of arguing and yelling. Never anything physical but it would always take a couple of staff members several minutes to finally get him outside. After the fourth time we were just like "That's enough. Guy can't drink, we don't have the time to deal with that anymore, don't ever let him in again." - Local tranny started coming in, never bought a drink, just wandered around the bar. But not just wandering around trying to find someone or getting a judge of the crowd, she was just making laps around the bar waiting for someone to say something that would start a confrontation. Nothing ever really came of it, never escalated past an exchange of words, but after the third time we were done with her being in the bar. (This was five years ago, she tried to come back in the bar a couple weeks ago, had to hustle to the front and inform the new door guys that she was barred for life.) - Guy came in a few years back. His movements were jerky as gently caress, just all over the place, swaying and stumbling. Door guys refused him initially but the more they talked to him the more they realized that he wasn't drunk, something else was wrong with this guy. So I get buzzed up to the door and have a conversation with him. Turns out he'd been in an ATV accident recently and it had left him with some nerve/spinal/brain damage and while he looked drunk as piss he was actually stone sober. I felt for the guy, that's a lovely hand life dealt him, so I let him in and served him. This went on for over a year, I'd see him at the door about to be refused and I'd run up and explain the situation to the staff and wave him in. All good and well. But after awhile he realized that he could get as drunk as he wanted and bank on his disability to keep getting served. It became a huge pain in the rear end trying to judge just how drunk he actually was and after a couple weekends of us having to cut him off I decided it just wasn't worth letting him in anymore. - Older guy, probably late 40's to early 50's, started coming in only on the slow nights. Always somewhat of a dick, but he tipped decently, didn't bother the customers, and left before he got too drunk. However, every time he started to get liquored up he'd go on these long rants about how all of his friends took advantage of him and hosed him over, same with girlfriends and employers. We'd all nod, try to relate, end the conversation with "Yeah man, that sucks.." and do everything in our power to get to the other end of the bar. Then one night he makes a very flagrant pass at the wife of an off duty cop. A cop that works our district, a cop that we all know and somewhat fear. She tries to politely wave him off, he persists rather relentlessly, cop notices and gets his Irish up. We intervene, toss the guy (hard, and rather showy about it) and bar him for life. Guy hosed up one time, but we're not about to have that cop walk in and see him sitting at our bar. I guess the moral of the story is you have to gently caress up pretty bad at most bars to earn yourself a life ban. But at some bars all you have to do is gently caress up in the same way repeatedly or in what we deem to be a big way just once. In the bar industry, we only suffer so much bullshit. But it depends entirely on the bar how much bullshit we'll suffer. Dirnok fucked around with this message at 14:04 on Aug 10, 2012 |
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Aug 10, 2012 11:32
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Has anyone banned cigar smoking in their bars? We've been thinking about it because there are a few regulars that smoke them non stop and the other patrons bitch and complain about it. One of the bars across the street from us has started kicking out people for smoking cigars, I was wondering if this was a trend to keep the majority happy.Daric posted:James, can we try to get a list together of all the bartenders that post in these threads and what types of venues they're working in? Sounds like a good idea. Would be cool to see the different types of bars we all work in. leica - Tiki beach bar
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Aug 10, 2012 18:21
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leica posted:Has anyone banned cigar smoking in their bars? We've been thinking about it because there are a few regulars that smoke them non stop and the other patrons bitch and complain about it. One of the bars across the street from us has started kicking out people for smoking cigars, I was wondering if this was a trend to keep the majority happy. We are like 10 feet outside the city limits so you can smoke at our bar but my manager recently banned cigars because it stinks up the entire restaurant. I'm ok with that, I wish we'd just get rid of smoking too.
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Aug 10, 2012 18:25
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leica posted:Has anyone banned cigar smoking in their bars? We've been thinking about it because there are a few regulars that smoke them non stop and the other patrons bitch and complain about it. One of the bars across the street from us has started kicking out people for smoking cigars, I was wondering if this was a trend to keep the majority happy. Smoking in or near 'public' indoor areas has been banned in the Greater Vancouver Area I think 2 years ago, but maybe more. It was banned in bars just before I got my first job around 5 years ago, which is shortly after they mandated that all bars/clubs had to have special smoking rooms + ventilation if they wanted to allow smoking. A LOT of people, regulars and staff were pissed off about this.
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Aug 10, 2012 19:31
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I worked in a place before that had a cigar area with vents and all that stuff but they got rid of it because they couldn't use the space fully when it was designated for cigars as they had to keep it available for cigars. On most busy nights it was just a needlessly empty room. Ban all smoking in your bar IMO. Girls don't like it. The staff doesn't like it. Smokers are used to their addiction getting beat on so they won't even  that much.
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Aug 10, 2012 19:41
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So how does one get into bartending? I've applied a few places, but it seems like every place wants prior experience, and I can't get any experience without getting hired somewhere. It's a real catch-22.
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Aug 10, 2012 20:30
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TwoPair posted:So how does one get into bartending? I've applied a few places, but it seems like every place wants prior experience, and I can't get any experience without getting hired somewhere. It's a real catch-22. Don't go to a bartending school, try and get a job lower down the chain (as a barback or busser), work hard and try not to piss the people above you off. Disclaimer: I went to a bartending school, it is a waste of time and money and will not get you a job, and is not a substitute for experience. I DID go right to bar at my first job though.
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Aug 10, 2012 20:37
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My best friend has been a bartender since he was legally able to. As long as I've known him I've always ended up hanging out at his different bar jobs shooting the poo poo and drinking once or twice a week. It is a hell of an interesting industry - I come from a casino background myself (out now) and I found a lot of similarities. He's worked all over South Florida and especially Miami in all different types of places but the most memorable to me is a little poo poo hole bar in a nearly bare strip mall next to a highway that somehow had a liquor license that let them stay open and serve until 8 am. Apparently the only bar from a bird's view that could do this. That's also the only bar I didn't drop into more than once. Besides the usual haggard cougar types offering to split (your) blow with you in the bathroom, this bar had the highest percentage of convicts per capita I have ever encountered and was located directly next to a dilapidated trailer park. The owner would outright spy on the bartenders with a webcam system that they would actively monitor and call in to bitch about things or accuse them of stealing (which obviously can happen). My pal also had to double as the bouncer and he's got a great story of him and one other bartender having to eject the ENTIRE bar that was having one huge brawl. They ended up barricading the door with their bodies and whatever they could find to stop them from breaking back in to fight and drink some more. It is hard sometimes to match up the dude who writes heartfelt poetry in spanish and will call me up to invite me to discuss the latest issue of Lapham's Quarterly with the man who keeps a baseball bat (or worse) in the backseat at all times - just in case. I didn't grow up in the best parts of Miramar myself as a kid but that's a far cry from growing up on the wrong block over from 8th st. The people you meet that live for the night are always more interesting than 9-5 types. They seem to sense more than others the illusory nature of the pacts we make with society. Thanks for the thread and the stories! Incredulous Dylan fucked around with this message at 21:28 on Aug 10, 2012 |
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Aug 10, 2012 21:25
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TwoPair posted:So how does one get into bartending? I've applied a few places, but it seems like every place wants prior experience, and I can't get any experience without getting hired somewhere. It's a real catch-22. Barbacking if you're a dude, serving if you're a female. Barbacking is probably the best experience next to becoming a bartender (although I'm biased as all hell as that's where I got my start) as you get a look at how the bar works. Plus, you can either get the opportunity to pour at bigger establishments (place I work at has 3 bars that has 2 wells for a single station and 1 bartender working them some nights...BAs are expected to hop on and assist when it gets busy) or learn things from bartenders. Also: lie. I got my first industry job by saying I had barbacked at another place (out of province) for 3 months.
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Aug 10, 2012 21:31
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TwoPair posted:So how does one get into bartending? I've applied a few places, but it seems like every place wants prior experience, and I can't get any experience without getting hired somewhere. It's a real catch-22. There are a couple of other things. Watch for new places that are opening, as they will be hiring all fresh staff. Lie about your experience, but don't make it ridiculous (I bartended at Chili's for 3 months is fine, I was the Head Bartender and Snooty's Cocktail Club for 3 years is not). Other than that, what others have said is true. Start off as security/barback and work your rear end off, that's what I did. Daric posted:James, can we try to get a list together of all the bartenders that post in these threads and what types of venues they're working in?
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Aug 11, 2012 00:23
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Sheep-Goats: used to be a club bartender in Manhattan, in EMS now
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Aug 11, 2012 00:29
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TwoPair posted:So how does one get into bartending? I've applied a few places, but it seems like every place wants prior experience, and I can't get any experience without getting hired somewhere. It's a real catch-22. Like everyone else said, barbacking is your best bet. Another thing worth mentioning, becoming a regular at the bar you'd like to work at can also help. Coming from someone who has done the hiring at a bar for the last couple years, I've hired far more regulars than random applicants that I've never seen before. I read a really good guide to how to go about doing this correctly but I can't remember if it was in the old thread or a blog somewhere. Either way, I'll try to dig it up after work. Daric posted:James, can we try to get a list together of all the bartenders that post in these threads and what types of venues they're working in? Dirnok: High-volume college bar
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Aug 11, 2012 01:18
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Sheep-Goats posted:Ban all smoking in your bar IMO. Girls don't like it. The staff doesn't like it. Smokers are used to their addiction getting beat on so they won't even Our bar is an outside bar that's the problem. Cigs are bad enough, but even outside, cigars are annoying. I can't imagine working an indoor bar where smoking is allowed. A good friend of my wife's who was a bartender passed away from emphysema and never smoked a day in his life. His doctor told him it was from all the second hand smoke he was exposed to over the years  JawKnee posted:Don't go to a bartending school, try and get a job lower down the chain (as a barback or busser), work hard and try not to piss the people above you off. I went to a local cheap bartending school YEARS ago just for my own peace of mind before going out and looking for a job, and I ended up getting a job behind a bar before I even finished the school. YMMV.
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Aug 11, 2012 01:31
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IMO it's often easier for males to get into bartending via serving these days than via barbacking simply because in so many cities now there are no non hispanic barbacks and the hispanic barbacks aren't candidates for promotion. Your first bar job is going to have something wrong with it. Chain restaurant. lovely Indian casino. Boss tries to pozz your neg hole everytime you bend over. Whatever. Maybe you're lucky and you get let into a place through family, friends, or connections. If all else fails though, the bar at Applebees is still a bar. So start somewhere that sucks, and in six months move on. Oh and by the way, servers usually make more than bartenders do and work fewer hours, especially the more high end you go. Most bartenders do that job instead of serving out of pride IMO -- no offense to servers but if I had a shop full of only bartenders everything would go fine, but if I had only servers things would fall apart. leica posted:Our bar is an outside bar that's the problem. Cigs are bad enough, but even outside, cigars are annoying. I can't imagine working an indoor bar where smoking is allowed. A good friend of my wife's who was a bartender passed away from emphysema and never smoked a day in his life. His doctor told him it was from all the second hand smoke he was exposed to over the years Yeah ban the cigars outside. They're bad for business. I smoke a cigar once in a while but I'd never do it in a crowded public place. raton fucked around with this message at 02:39 on Aug 11, 2012 |
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Aug 11, 2012 02:34
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Sheep-Goats posted:no offense to servers but if I had a shop full of only bartenders everything would go fine, but if I had only servers things would fall apart.
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Aug 11, 2012 02:55
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Nth Doctor posted:Am I a loving weirdo for drinking the Old Fashioned? Well over half the time, the bartender looks at me like I grew a second head. Around a third of they time, they lack either bitters or sugar. Clearly, you are not in Wisconsin. It's the regional drink it seems. I had been scouring the city for someone who had even heard of one and then I moved here and ordered one and got asked back "whiskey, brandy? Do you want it sweet or sour?" Daric posted:James, can we try to get a list together of all the bartenders that post in these threads and what types of venues they're working in? Frozen Horse - Research chemist & distiller of bathtub gin My fallback plan is to start making molecular-gastronomy apertifs although the paperwork is awful and it will involve being hosed by the spare dick that distributors aren't using on their customers.
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Aug 11, 2012 03:28
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Sheep-Goats posted:Hispanic barbacks. That might be a regional thing? Around here (Colorado, and Indiana before that), barbacking is still very much a skill position and the pre-bartender job for men.
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Aug 11, 2012 03:32
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navyjack posted:That might be a regional thing? Around here (Colorado, and Indiana before that), barbacking is still very much a skill position and the pre-bartender job for men. Oh, I'm sure it's quite regional.
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Aug 11, 2012 03:41
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Hoops posted:Yes, yes, oh my god, yes. I say some variation of this every single shift. I trust my bar staff, I don't trust my wait staff (with certain exceptions) to tie their loving show laces. For some reason when someone is hired and turns out to be useless, they tend to be thrown onto the floor if a girl, and barback if a man. Unfortunately though floor is a step up from barback, so it's more obvious how useless they are. In my place there's a real feeling that the floor staff should all have turns doing the "easier" and "harder" jobs, handling a section or just floating or food running. While on the bar, the stars are always kept on the bar while the worst people barback, with the middle being on the bar but sent off to do errands if the barbacks are otherwise engaged, or doing dispense tickets, or whatever. This makes sense, and makes sure your best barmen are always customer facing. Yet on the floor I managed an extremely rare 100% report from a mystery diner, only to be food running on my next shift while someone who shouldn't really have been hired struggled to look after a section. So I guess what I'm saying is that bar staff had a gentle gradation into the role, with a clear hierarchy making sure no-one is out of their depth. My place (and I guess some others too) don't take the same approach with the floor, instead trying to be "fair". This means you end up with serving staff out of their depths while others are wasted on an easy job. Admittedly, when a good manager is doing the rota, I know I'm having a section unless I'm in a really bad mood for some reason and ask for an easy ride. It's when the bad managers choose who's where that it's a dice roll. But on the bar they can all just shift into their natural hierarchy whatever they are initially told, as they are all simply "bar" or "barback" with the gradated levels of barman being more naturally occurring systems, while on the floor if I'm told "Food runner" and someone else is told "Section 2" there's no way to make sure I'm handling the hard parts of the job while they have the easy parts. Because waste of talent or not, that food still needs to be run. For my place in the list, I guess I'm: Masonity - Waiter and occasional / former barman, Gastropub.
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Aug 11, 2012 03:50
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Posting to remind myself to check into this thread and respond to poo poo... Also, Dave, bring me your resume already, fucker. GEEZ.
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Aug 11, 2012 04:11
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Frozen Horse posted:Clearly, you are not in Wisconsin. It's the regional drink it seems. I had been scouring the city for someone who had even heard of one and then I moved here and ordered one and got asked back "whiskey, brandy? Do you want it sweet or sour?" Also, they were a buck apiece. All the bartenders went home to file OSHA claims afterward.
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Aug 11, 2012 04:28
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for the bartender roll call: Shooting Blanks: Former high volume night club bar manager
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Aug 11, 2012 05:01
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gently caress errbody tonight, just a bunch of assholes all night long
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Aug 11, 2012 08:14
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Bartender dartboard entry: nrr. ex high volume night clubs, now back to high volume fine dining restaurant/cocktail lounge Tonight was cruisy as hell and yet somehow I'm completely exhausted. My Chef did get tipsy at my bar though at the end of the night and told me she hired a new meat station guy who's gonna be living with me apparently. But it's cool cos he's never going to be home except to sleep for half an hour a day because she's gonna work him to death and instead of giving him days off or breaks, she's going to schedule him to cook for me at home. 
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Aug 11, 2012 09:07
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Speaking of being management...there goes the last of the Jim Beam Devil's Cut that an overly optimistic distributor dropped by awhile back. Time to hit up the "what the gently caress is this poo poo" section of the liquor room again. On the other hand, as the only guy on our management staff who is a "beer guy," I should have multiple six-packs coming my way as everyone starts to show off their fall seasonals. ps. being a manager sucks don't do it ever.
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Aug 11, 2012 12:12
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Masonity posted:lovely Barbacks All my barbacks come from my security staff, and if they make me unhappy, they go back to that area.I don't hire barbacks, I hire security men, if they make me happy, they barback, if they suck, they don't. My secmen (I am a post-apoc dictator) make 25% what the bartenders bring in (plus their 6 bux an hour) the barbacks make 50%+6/hour so I have a big money stick to beat people over the head with. If you suck as a barback, I'll see if a few shifts as the "dress code guy" doesn't shake loose some extra effort.
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Aug 11, 2012 12:32
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Ok, and before Crawl for Cancer hits me in....7 hours. What should customers NOT do? 1) Don't do poo poo in my bar sober you wouldn't do in a McDonalds poo poo-faced?
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Aug 11, 2012 12:39
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navyjack posted:Ok, and before Crawl for Cancer hits me in....7 hours. What should customers NOT do? 2) Order a bottle of wine at "Last orders!" unless there are enough of them that they will finish it within 15 minutes.
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Aug 11, 2012 13:03
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Found that post I mentioned earlier about becoming a regular in order to get a job, it was on Jeffery Morgenthaler's blog. While I wouldn't necessarily follow it step by step, word for word, it's pretty decent advice. This is not going to work in every bar, but I do hire a lot of regulars at mine. Of the 9 people I have on staff right now, 6 of them hung out at the bar to some degree prior to working there. (The other 3, one is my cousin, one was a friend of another venue's bartenders and they put in a good word for him with me, and the last is just some random applicant.)Jeffery Morgenthaler posted:If you’re not a complete idiot, you can get a job in a bar with no experience, and for half the cost of a bartending “school”. And I’m going to show you how. navyjack posted:Speaking of being management...there goes the last of the Jim Beam Devil's Cut that an overly optimistic distributor dropped by awhile back. Time to hit up the "what the gently caress is this poo poo" section of the liquor room again. Every time I see the bottle of Bacardi Oakheart cluttering up my shelf I mentally revisit my very detailed plans on how to murder all overly optimistic sales reps. But with you on the beer. Had a freebie bottle of Newcastle's fall seasonal tonight when I got home. Not bad, like it just a little bit more than regular Newcastle, but not terribly impressed. But free beer is free beer, and the more free beer the better. My GM though, I'm convinced he is loving with me when it comes to having me taste new products. He'll give me several things, I'll drink them and tell him which ones I thought were good AND WOULD SELL. He will then order cases of the ones I thought sucked and wouldn't move. And then they don't move. After years of this the only plausible explanation for these actions is that he is simply loving with me and playing some long game where the end goal is driving me absolutely bat poo poo loving insane. navyjack posted:ps. being a manager sucks don't do it ever. This. A million times this. While my ego absolutely loves being in charge, gently caress if I didn't have a lot more fun just being a bartender. My drinking was a lot more in check back then too, come to think of it.
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Aug 11, 2012 13:05
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navyjack posted:That might be a regional thing? Around here (Colorado, and Indiana before that), barbacking is still very much a skill position and the pre-bartender job for men. My guess is that's also tied into the size of the specific market too. In other words, in most of the large cities I've visted have bars with exclusively Hispanic or immigrant support staff, whereas smaller-medium cities, like college towns, will hire non-immigrant barbacks with the intent of promotion. I always jump into this conversation, because I remember spending months trying to get my first industry job as a barback, since that's what the common advice was, and repeatedly striking out. Then one day, I applied to a club, and the lady managing it explained to me how things worked on the barback side (at least in my neck of the woods) and told me to stop wasting my time looking for barback gigs and get a job waiting tables at a chain restaurant. I sucked it up, did that right away, and ~7 years later I'm on my way to being an industry lifer. Just quit a long-time gig a little while ago, deciding the next step, but for all intents and purposes: Tom Rakewell - Craft cocktail bar
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Aug 11, 2012 16:34
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Tom Rakewell posted:My guess is that's also tied into the size of the specific market too. In other words, in most of the large cities I've visted have bars with exclusively Hispanic or immigrant support staff, whereas smaller-medium cities, like college towns, will hire non-immigrant barbacks with the intent of promotion. Then again, I work in the same market you do, and I started as a barback.
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Aug 11, 2012 16:54
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Sheep-Goats posted:Yeah ban the cigars outside. They're bad for business. I think you should either ban all smoking, or allow all smoking. Banning cigars and allowing cigarettes is ridiculous, considering cigarettes tend to smell much worse (if not quite so strong).
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Aug 11, 2012 17:58
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I just spent the day sailing, I injured my back last night and now I'm gonna go work a huge private party and go close the bar. Pirate life, yo. VegMel, neighborhood cocktail bar, freelance booze smith.
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Aug 11, 2012 20:45
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