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Baboon Fiesta posted:What exactly is a mixologist? Google doesn't really go into much more depth than 'they are basically bartenders but sometimes engage in cocktail-alchemy'. I like to use this distinction. A "mixologist" comes up with drink recipes and sends them to magazines and things, and might even make drinks every now and then at events. A bartender is someone who actually works in a bar and does all the work entailed in it, which may or may not include making high-end cocktails. Obviously, you can tell which term I prefer.
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Aug 9, 2012 06:19
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navyjack posted:That might be a regional thing? Around here (Colorado, and Indiana before that), barbacking is still very much a skill position and the pre-bartender job for men. My guess is that's also tied into the size of the specific market too. In other words, in most of the large cities I've visted have bars with exclusively Hispanic or immigrant support staff, whereas smaller-medium cities, like college towns, will hire non-immigrant barbacks with the intent of promotion. I always jump into this conversation, because I remember spending months trying to get my first industry job as a barback, since that's what the common advice was, and repeatedly striking out. Then one day, I applied to a club, and the lady managing it explained to me how things worked on the barback side (at least in my neck of the woods) and told me to stop wasting my time looking for barback gigs and get a job waiting tables at a chain restaurant. I sucked it up, did that right away, and ~7 years later I'm on my way to being an industry lifer. Just quit a long-time gig a little while ago, deciding the next step, but for all intents and purposes: Tom Rakewell - Craft cocktail bar
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Aug 11, 2012 16:34
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My experience with cocktail contests is that they're more marketing shows for "mixologists" than drink contests for "bartenders." The people who focus on those and do well (a lot of the results really come down to whose bar moves the most of X product, whose bar has been cozy with the distributor, or which "well-known" bartender's turn it is to win something) are more the types who are chasing a brand ambassador/corporate mixologist route rather than people who are focused on the industry or the craft. Nothing wrong with that, but I rarely bothered with contests because I was too busy managing the bar I worked at. The old joke we have is that the bartenders who would probably serve up the best drinks never make it to contests because they're too busy actually bartending to keep taking time off for events.
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Aug 16, 2012 20:00
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Daric posted:What would y'all recommend for making whiskey sours at home? Whiskey, fresh lemon juice, and some sort of sugar or simple syrup. An egg white if you like the texture or feel like doing the historical thing. It's really easy to overthink this one, and that's where people mess up.
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Aug 22, 2012 02:53
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Heh what's kind of funny is at the last bar I worked at our default whiskey sour was made with egg white shaken in it, pre-Prohibition style. Egg drinks require several minutes of continuous shaking to reach the proper consistency, and had to be made individually, with no batching for larger orders. So it was always amusing/painful to watch people come in on volume nights and order rounds of 4-5+ whiskey sours, perhaps thinking they were ordering quick, easy drinks and not realizing what they were getting into, or perhaps just being well-aware of the trouble. Those rounds would leave your joints throbbing in pain if you couldn't get anyone to help you, and the poor sap would be waiting 15-20 minutes for his whiskey sours while the people behind him would be visibly pissed off watching the bartender tied up with that order for so long. That's my experience, but yeah, everywhere non-fancy (and even a lot of fancy places) a whiskey sour is just an easy booze and mixer drink that takes seconds to make.
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Aug 24, 2012 08:17
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Vegetable Melange posted:Also I only recently hit the point where people are trying to poach me away from my job, and it was a doozie; a client, heavy into PR/Event Production, asking me what it would take to open my own place. "Cash, Real Estate, PR, what?" Aww, it's cute watching idiots try to throw money at would be cocktail bar owners. Of course, only if "owner" entails giving up all but 15%-20% of your say to whatever frat boy(s) with money wants to try to back you in exchange for party house rights.
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Sep 5, 2012 09:37
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Vegetable Melange posted:Oh, believe me, I've seen disasters happen. I know people who had a couple investors pull out at the 5yr mark. Even when it's going well, it's hell. I do have a role model in the guys I used to work for, who are aggressively turning out the restaurants (but then, food is a lot less fashionable than booze, so you have to think). Never hurts to have a conversation or six. Of course, I'm just jaded at hearing pitches and being fed the same lines, and it's always good to go into those things with a giant dose of skepticism. Hands-off investors can be tricky to deal with, because restaurants and bars are notoriously dangerous/risky investments, and the most cash-minded investors are going to stay away from them as a rule of thumb. So people seeking to open restaurants without being actively involved in them are the type of people who really just want to play owner and have a personal clubhouse, i.e. not the type of person to do business with in a restaurant/bar setting.
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Sep 5, 2012 20:21
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I'm waiting for the graduate level seminar, "How to Market Yourself as a Professional Bartender Without Ever Actually Working Behind a Bar or Making Drinks." Seems to be a much sought-after skill these days.
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Sep 19, 2012 01:34
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If you've worked in the service industry more than a year and still have an accent fetish, you are a total glutton for punishment.
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Oct 22, 2012 09:38
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INTJ Mastermind posted:Why are top shelf single malt scotches so expensive at bars? I'm looking at $15 per drink. A 750cc bottle costs like $80 and you can get 16 45cc servings. What's up with the 300% markup? Depends on the bar, but standard percentage target for liquor cost (i.e. cost of product / price you sell it for) is around 15%-20%. That bottle of scotch will sell at the bar for a combined $240, so at $80 cost, it's 33% liquor cost. That's on the high end, and means a shot of that scotch is actually cheap in bar terms, but the bar tolerates a higher liquor cost because it is a more expensive product that moves more slowly. You notice the scotch more because of the sticker price, but compare it to your basic cheap well liquor. A bottle of Taaka/McCormick/whatever generic well vodka will cost $4-5/wholesale, and the bar will sell a shot of it for $4-5 too. That's a much higher markup, but people don't notice it because the $4-5 price tag is considered cheap in absolute terms. Markups are so high because bars and restaurants have a lot of overhead to cover without much room for profit. When you pay an inflated price for a shot of liquor, you're also helping the bar cover rent, utilities, insurance, taxes, labor, payroll, merchant services, and all the other nickel and dime costs that make bars difficult to run. After all, when you go to a bar and drink, you're not just paying for the liquor, you're paying for the crowd, ambience, and staff, and those things cost money to maintain.
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Dec 23, 2012 18:50
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I'd be very happy making high quality cocktails at a small, low key bar setting with people who were really into the drinks. But none of the speakeasy affectations, that stuff drives me nuts. From an ownership side, I wouldn't so much prefer, but absolutely need to have a crazy high volume bar just to stay afloat given the current market. Definitely an interesting and frustrating contrast.
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Apr 27, 2013 23:05
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Sheep-Goats posted:Some cocktail oriented bars in NYC do. No other bars do reliably though. Not really. Pretty much every decent sized city has at least a handful of dedicated cocktail bars that will either make their own ginger beer or carry something more flavorful like Goya or Fever Tree. Just got back from doing cocktail tours in Omaha and Providence, for example. Some divey old guard restaurants/pubs, the type that did Manhattans properly before cocktails were cool again, will also have a decent ginger beer offering.
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Jul 6, 2013 04:36
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Mr. Tibbs posted:I live in Providence during the school year and most of the summer. I'd love to hear where and what your favorite cocktails were. I spent just a quick night there, but my friends and I enjoyed drinks at the Eddy, then I went solo to the Avery, which wasn't as polished as far as the drink menu, but had a capable barstaff and a solid spirits selection. Wanted to hit Justine's, but didn't make it there. Cook & Brown Public House was a James Beard semi-finalist for best Bar Program this year, but the drink menu online looked pretty straightforward. I guess I'd have gone if I had more time. Also worth checking out restaurant-wise are Birch, which is brand new and does a thoughtful local ingredient-driven menu that actually isn't full of overpriced bullshit, with a solid cocktail program to match; and North, which is right across from the Avery, and plays around with spicy Chinese and South Asian cuisine, and builds its short cocktail menu around pairings with that. My understanding is that having Johnson & Wales in town provides a good feeder for talented chefs who go to Providence to study and decide to stick around and open craft restaurants in the area.
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Jul 7, 2013 09:54
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Sheep-Goats posted:Oh I didn't mean only NYC, I meant only in those sorts of places. You know, I finally managed to do an NYC cocktail bar hopping tour, and it was a combination of my having a blast touring all these much-touted spots and seeing what they were all about, and also realizing that myself and a lot of my industry colleagues outside the markets are just as capable of competing on the exact same level and offering the same quality of product and service no matter what the market. Favorite bar I saw was Pouring Ribbons, though Amor Y Amargo definitely gets a thumbs up too.
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Jul 7, 2013 09:59
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The Hebug posted:I remember finding Beaker and Flask pretty good in terms of cocktail bars, though afterwards I was sad I didn't go next door to Rum Club. My top recommendation for drinks in Portland is actually non-alcoholic, Pok Pok's Som drinking vinegars are amazing. One of those and a plate of their wings is 7 minutes in heaven right there. Beaker and Flask just closed. Anyway, Cocktails: Teardrop Lounge, Rum Club, Kask/Gruner, the Tannery, Hale Pele for tiki drinks. Beer: Apex, Bailey's Taproom, Belmont Station, Horse Brass Pub. Restaurant bars of note, generally more cocktail oriented: Clyde Common, Imperial, Oven and Shaker, Raven & Rose, Whey Bar (in Ox), Woodsman Tavern. There was also a really cool champagne and sparkling wine bar I visited last time; it may or may not be Ambonnay. Restaurants in general: Apizza Scholls (pizza), Le Pigeon (fancy French), Lucky Strike (fusion style Sichuan Chinese), Luc Lac (Vietnamese), Riffle (seafood), Tanuki (Japanese). Pok Pok is good, but get there early to avoid the lines; I liked my meal, but wouldn't have waited an hour for it. I also tried the other Andy Ricker concept, Ping, which was fairly underwhelming. Things to remember: places close early in Portland, a lot of places close on Sunday and Monday, a lot of places are small and notorious for long lines, so get there either really early or late if you don't want to deal with that. Also, Portland is a busy little town, and restaurants, bars, and high quality chefs/bartenders go through a revolving door. I last visited in December, and I hear the hot spots about town have rotated heavily. Find a bartender you like and ask for the details on how the current scene looks, as I imagine my selections may be slightly out of date.
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Jul 10, 2013 00:42
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May or may not be doing Tales, just started a new gig and have to get approval from the owner within the next day or two, but if I do, it's a straight shot down I-10 to New Orleans.
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Jul 11, 2013 07:52
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Gambrinus posted:I fancy a few beer in Portland, Maine tomorrow night, maybe a cocktail if I'm feeling dangerous. Where are some good places to go? Novare Res is an excellent beer bar that specializes in Belgian beers; the same owners also have a brewpub called Infiniti that also offers the best cocktails in the city, IMHO. Gingko Blue is Portland's go-to cocktail lounge, but I think Infiniti has better drinks. Still worth a visit. Other options are Sangillo's if you want a small blue collar dive bar with really stiff pours, and Brian Boru Public House and Ri Ra if you want a straightforward Irish Pub setting. All those places are in the Old Port. Local 188 is another good spot (mostly hipster/industry crowd, decent enough cocktails), but they're further up on Congress and keep restaurant hours. Hope that helps; Portland is a fun little city.
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Jul 26, 2013 14:59
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Soda water, cranberry juice, Coke/Sprite/etc, non-alcoholic beer, etc. If you're at a bar known for its cocktails, feel free to ask the bartenders to mix you up something, though chances are it'll be a lemonade variant or some sort of mixed juice drink. Obviously nothing's wrong with going to a bar and not drinking, though if you're interested in the bartender perspective on that, I'll throw out three quick rules of thumb: -When I'm only ordering a non-alcholic beverage (generally soda water, because I don't drink much soda), I always make sure to tip a dollar or two each time I get one. Nobody will give you poo poo if you don't, but it's a nice gesture. If the bar is crowded and I'm sitting there or if I plan on hanging out for a while, I make a point to buy something like bottled water instead of getting tap water so I'm not totally killing the bar's revenue for the seat I'm taking up. -If it's busy, you may have to wait longer for refills, just because the bartender will prioritize higher spending (and tipping) customers. Don't take it as a personal slight or a criticism of your not drinking. -If you're at a nice restaurant or a bar that does fresh juices, please don't go crazy pounding glass after glass of orange juice or lemonades and run the bar out of mixer while the bartender has to disrupt service to make more juice. Usually restaurants will charge pretty high prices per glass of juice to keep this scenario from happening, or at least make the cost worth it.
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Sep 3, 2013 00:31
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Sheep-Goats posted:Bitters is usually about 60% alcohol or more in the bottle and you can't drink a bottle of it anyway. You could try a few drops of bitters in your soda water but honestly bitters is awesome when used to play off of the musky man flavors in other drinks (mostly the brown ones but gin works too), it's not for drinking on its own. Sure it is, my other industry friends and I shoot straight Angostura (~45%) all the time, and I've drank Angostura on the rocks with dessert every now and then. Granted, it's turned into a gimmicky sort of cocktail inside joke thing, but some bitters are perfectly drinkable on their own if you're so inclined. But he's probably thinking of bitters and soda water, like you mentioned.
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Sep 3, 2013 06:23
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Adoreible posted:One cocktail that became very popular in the restaurant where I work was 1.5 oz Hendricks Gin, 1.5 oz St. Germaine, squeeze of fresh lemon, topped with maybe an oz of house "champagne" (whatever cheap sparkling you choose, we have Wycliff California Brut) into a shaker over ice. Stir and serve in a martini glass with a lemon twist. One of my favorites, beyond refreshing. It's been off the menu for almost 9 months now and we still have people ask for it. Gotta say I'm curious about that drink. I've never been willing to put more than .5 oz or so of St Germain in a drink, as it can quickly turn things into a syrupy mess, so a full shot in a drink sounds a little dicey. Also, what market are you in and how much do you charge for it? Hendrick's and St. Germain are both really expensive spirits (from a cocktail cost standpoint), and with 1.5 oz each and some sparkling and lemon, I'd have to sell that drink at about $20 just to hit to my liquor cost target, so the bean counter in me cringes too. Of course, that would definitely fly in some of the NYC and Vegas places I've visited, so who knows?
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Oct 12, 2013 18:57
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Adoreible posted:In the Midwest, in what could probably be classified as casual fine dining in the rest of the world. Here we are one of the top 4 restaurants out of hundreds in my fairly mid-sized market. Population no more than 400,000. In a fairly affluent area, the martini is $10. Perhaps that accounts for the liquor cost, I'm not anywhere near management and haven't seen our cost in a while. That said we also haven't been able to get St. Germaine in a while due to distribution issues (as far as we've been told anyway). Thanks for humoring me. I like to nerd out about these things. FWIW, in my market (Houston), I pay about $1.49/1.5 oz shot of Hendrick's and $1.74/1.5 oz shot of St. Germain. Figure about $.20/oz for whatever cheap champagne (at about $5/bottle) and maybe $.10-.15 for the lemon used, so the drink coasts about $3.53 wholesale to make. A good range for liquor cost is between 15% for a cheaper-mid range place and 20% for a more high end place (25% is reasonable for a loss leader type drink that looks awesome on a menu, but probably won't sell a bunch). So you'd have to price that drink around $18-23 to hit your numbers, and only super fancy hotel and venue bars in Vegas/Miami/NYC type markets can move drinks at that price. So that's why I say $10 seems crazy if the drink sells well. Just sharing the thought process in case you were curious.
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Oct 15, 2013 03:43
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Vegetable Melange posted:Willet ages and bottles the best Rye. Bulliet, Willet, hell everything but Rittenhouse (Heaven Hill) is distilled using the same mash bill at Lawrenceburg Distillers Incorporated (LDI) in Indiana. It's then aged and blended to spec to make Redemption Rye, Templeton, High West, Whistlepig, etc. Just some nitpicks: Whistlepig buys stock from Alberta Distillers and ages it in Vermont; there's also a recent high end release called Lock, Stock, and Barrel that does the same thing. Jefferson's and Masterson's too; though I don't remember if Jefferson's switched suppliers recently. Beam Global makes their own rye that they release under Jim Beam, Old Overholt, Knob Creek, and (ri)1 (ew) if they still make it. Buffalo Trace does the Sazerac, Van Winkle, and Thomas Handy expressions. I do wish the bottlers were more forthcoming about using MGP/LDI whiskey, though I've liked the High West blends and Bulleit Rye well enough.
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Dec 21, 2013 20:56
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