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That's a great way to frame it. I think I came off as antagonistic above and I didn't mean to. I am genuinely curious why it seems some people who have run the game are hesitant to let players narrate their advantages. Even though I think that contradicts the rules, I don't think it's necessarily wrong.
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Jan 3, 2013 18:47
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fosborb posted:That's a great way to frame it. Some people are playing online, where it can be harder to have the kind of conversational back-and-forth necessary to collaboratively describe a scene. I can't speak for them, of course. In my group (around a physical table), I pretty much let the players go hog wild with that sort of thing if they have ideas they want to present. It's kind of organic; if they come up with a cool way to narrate the result, they go ahead and do it, but if they're not really feeling inspired, I'll go ahead and describe it myself or take suggestions from anyone who offers.
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Jan 3, 2013 19:40
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fosborb posted:That's a great way to frame it. It's all about the gaming group you have. Many groups consist of friends that have the same ideas of what makes these games fun and therefore cooperative storytelling isn't a huge deal. Other groups have players who only show up to "win" every encounter and do things like lie about their die rolls and such. If you're lucky enough to have a group like the former, this type of system is a lot of fun (I play WFRPG 3rd edition w/ my group) but if you are for whatever reason stuck with the latter, it can be a hassle to constantly have to fight against your players.
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Jan 3, 2013 19:50
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fosborb posted:storm troopers, who are incredible loving shots What kind of loving Star Wars game is this? 
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Jan 3, 2013 20:08
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Huh, I went through the rules and it didn't specify who gets to choose what Advantages/Threats/Triumphs/Despairs are spent on. In WFRP 3E, the equivalents of those are spent by the owner of the character who rolled them if they are beneficial. If the symbols are negative, the GM spends them if they're rolled by a player character, and by a player if the GM rolls them. But WFRP 3E has the advantage (heh) of having the effects heavily codified in the rules text of the action cards (all actions you can take, and there are a fuckton of them, are printed on reminder cards) which means that there's absolutely no argument about what they do in a given situation as long as it involves an action. The harcover Player's Guide has rules for "freestyling" the positive and negative symbols similar to the suggestions that Edge of the Empire offers, but only for situations where you're doing a roll without an associated action card. So anyways, as written it looks like the intent of Edge of the Empire's rules is for the GM to use the Advantages/Triumphs/Threats/Despairs as a narrative tool. i.e. "you miss but the shot hits a piece of equipment and causes to it explode, startling the enemies" or "you succeed in epically jumpkicking the stormtrooper but you fail to stick the landing and fall on your face" or somesuch. I don't see any harm in doing it WFRP 3E style though.
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Jan 3, 2013 21:43
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The Beta rules explicitly state that the player chooses how to spend advantages and the GM does threat. (If you're just looking at the Beginner's Game, it may not specify, so you're not blind or crazy.) So, the player will choose if they want to get a critical hit, an extra maneuver or recover strain, etc. That covers the mechanical side of things, but in terms of describing just what happened in the world to impart that extra effect, there's wiggle room. That's where I'd personally be happy for the player to narrate it if they have a good mental image, but as the GM, I could take over that part.
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Jan 3, 2013 23:31
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The only thing I had a problem with advantage/threat-wise was the 3 advantage to disarm an enemy. I lean towards asking my players to tell me where they're aiming on the target so that we can tailor narrative and mechanistic effects of rolls a little more. Otherwise, I worry that most combat encounters will have characters spend significant periods of time running to and picking up their blasters. Crit injuries are nice, but disarming is pretty powerful.
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Jan 3, 2013 23:47
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rolling 3 advantages after any threat is accounted for is not very common. There are only 4 of 8 faces that have advantages on the ability die, where there are 5 of 8 faces that contain threat. remember they cancel each other out. at medium range the difficulty is 2, and the average for dice on a newer character will only be 2 Ability (d8) 1 Proficiency (d12) 
LumberingTroll fucked around with this message at 23:57 on Jan 3, 2013 |
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Jan 3, 2013 23:54
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Wikipedia Brown posted:The Beta rules explicitly state that the player chooses how to spend advantages and the GM does threat. (If you're just looking at the Beginner's Game, it may not specify, so you're not blind or crazy.) Okay, so the Beginner's Game must omit some of the explanation. I guess they've thought of everything but kept it trimmed down a little for space.
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Jan 3, 2013 23:56
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The beginner box glosses over a lot. I admit, I may have missed this, but player character sheets are explicit that net successes add +1 damage to their damage - the NPC boxes and overview rules doesn't mention this for the GM side of things. That's only covered in the beta rules. Same goes for space combat - the Krayt Fang versus TIE Fighters fight was pretty hard for my players, and the "hit once, damage twice" rule TIE's get meant each shot was good for 6, while the Engineer station could only heal for one point a turn - except that net successes also add +1 damage here. Had I known that ahead of time, my players would have been dust. It's intended to be an introduction to the core dice concepts like Difficulty dice and boosting, though, and not get you initimate with the ins and outs of every single rule.
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Jan 4, 2013 00:10
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It's on the top of page 13 of the beginner's adventure booklet. Not sure about the beginner's rules book.
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Jan 4, 2013 00:19
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LumberingTroll posted:rolling 3 advantages after any threat is accounted for is not very common. There are only 4 of 8 faces that have advantages on the ability die, where there are 5 of 8 faces that contain threat. remember they cancel each other out. fosborb posted:It's on the top of page 13 of the beginner's adventure booklet. Not sure about the beginner's rules book. It has that at the bottom of page 12 in my beginner's adventure booklet, and pages 14-15 of the beginner's rulebook doesn't distinguish between NPC and PC characters as far as all combat rules. That includes successes contributing to additional damage.
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Jan 4, 2013 00:40
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Honestly being that it is an RPG, and you are the GM, just say that disarming requires 4 successes, not three. I don't think any player is going to argue with you about it! But at the same time, disarming isn't a HUGE deal, the NPC just spends their maneuver picking up their weapon, and then shoots the player. Its good for slowing them down, but I think there are much more effective uses for Advantages. LumberingTroll fucked around with this message at 02:07 on Jan 4, 2013 |
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Jan 4, 2013 02:03
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You cannot run forever... I am having a hard time finding top down images of star wars ships...
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Jan 4, 2013 04:52
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LumberingTroll posted:You cannot run forever... That is awesome. I can't wait to eventually be able to run an Imperial campaign to blast some Rebel scum. Also, seconding the request to share your google docs sheet.
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Jan 4, 2013 05:02
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Looselybased posted:That is awesome. I can't wait to eventually be able to run an Imperial campaign to blast some Rebel scum. The character sheet was posted last page, here is the link https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmC3HKYxUU_fdDdmU25YMjNac0dYX0JzU2ZjY1RiREE if the OP wants it could go in the first post as well.
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Jan 4, 2013 05:23
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It doesn't look like the Android dice app is for sale anymore. The link on Fantasy Flight's website is broken. It's not listed under Fantasy Flight Games' product list and a search for it doesn't reveal it either. I hope this is only temporary. I'd like to have it because I'm kind of a germophobe and don't like touching things (like dice) that other people have touched. I wouldn't mind having the roller on my tablet (along with sound effects and the Star Wars sound track as aids) while my non-germophobe players share the physical dice.
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Jan 5, 2013 12:34
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Ever since I saw the PA comic about this, I've been itching to give it a try. The d20 System never seemed like a good match for Star Wars and even though I heard good things about Saga Edition, I never got into it. I'm really excited that the new Star Wars game is more explicitly a genre emulation engine and less a rules-as-physics game. Going to check this out and maybe give it a spin with my university RPG club.
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Jan 5, 2013 16:17
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Ran the beginner game last night with my group. I'm really loving the dice, I know they're a bit of a gimmick but they forced me to be creative. There were so many times where, after rolling advantage or threat, I had to come up with some way to put a positive or negative spin on things for my players. Some (spoilerish) Highlights include: One PC uses a hapless cantina patron as an alien shield. Gamorrean thug rolls crazy and slices through the unfortunate space-alcohol enthusiast and crits the PC. The PC's not only bought the HMRI from Vorn but also bought R5-K3, they're new lovable coward of a droid. Typically astromechs cost waaay more (beta book says around 8000 credits) than the PC's had at the time but I gave them a discount because they pointed a gun at Vorn's head and rolled well on a "negotiate" check. In the cantina, Pash the pilot proceeds to kill every one of the Gamorrean thugs with crazy rolls while drinking space-booze and lounging in one of the booths. Stormtroopers who were coming to the rescue of Trex, the hissing Trandoshan slaver, were easily taken care of by some "light laser" fire from the Krayt Fang's laser cannons. 41-VEX tried to trick Trex into believing that he and R5-K3 were there to install the HMRI. They fail miserably. 41-VEX than surrenders but manages to secretly pull out a stun grenade while binded. Hilarity ensued. Overall a very fun system and my group is anxious to play some more. The encounters are definitely too easy in the beginner adventure though, by the time they got to the Trex encounter I added the aforementioned Stormtroopers and Three Gamorrean thugs to the mix and the group still cleaned them up pretty easily.
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Jan 6, 2013 19:37
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Looselybased posted:The encounters are definitely too easy in the beginner adventure though This sounds like the opposite of every FFG rpg ever. What's with this "Beginner box" deal though. Does it have the core rulebook? Will the book be available by itself? I'm interested in running a game, but a little concerned about finding players. It seems like a book is a much easier sell to players than a boxed game.
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Jan 6, 2013 20:03
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Manifest posted:This sounds like the opposite of every FFG rpg ever. So many drat RPGs make their starter adventure brick-hard, and it feels so lovely to run your players through character generation where they make happy-go-lucky choices based on what's most fun to play, then you dump 50,000 goblins on their head and they get creamed in the first encounter.
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Jan 6, 2013 20:22
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The beginner box has a shorter rule book, four character folios, a map of the ship your players get at the end of the adventure and the dice. Honestly, I feel like I got my money's worth out of it considering I picked it up for like 25 bucks but I can see why people would hesitate to pick it up. The beginner box rules don't have character creation rules and a lot of the rules it does have aren't as in depth as they will be during release. If you look around online though you can find the beta rules and the revision updates.
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Jan 6, 2013 20:25
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Looselybased posted:The beginner box has a shorter rule book, four character folios, a map of the ship your players get at the end of the adventure and the dice. Honestly, I feel like I got my money's worth out of it considering I picked it up for like 25 bucks but I can see why people would hesitate to pick it up. The beginner box rules don't have character creation rules and a lot of the rules it does have aren't as in depth as they will be during release. If you look around online though you can find the beta rules and the revision updates. It's currently $20 on Amazon. I figure even when the main thing comes out the stubby rulebook should be helpful, plus more dice are always good.
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Jan 6, 2013 21:52
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Also, in case anyone didn't know, there are two additional pre-generated characters and another 5+ sessions worth of adventures continuing the beginner game storyline on FFG's site. My group chose Mathus and Sasha over Pash and 41-VEX, and I'll be starting Long Arm of the Hutt Act 1 on Wednesday.
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Jan 7, 2013 03:03
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there are also two more character folios on the FFG site. I wish there were pdfs of all the character folios though - I'd love to print these out for more beginners so they could write on them. Or maybe at-least b&w versions of the character and talent tree sheets
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Jan 7, 2013 18:53
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:It's currently $20 on Amazon. I figure even when the main thing comes out the stubby rulebook should be helpful, plus more dice are always good. I'm tempted to buy another just for the dice. I won't, but I'm still tempted and more dice is always good. Does anyone know of any pre made campaigns for any of the older Star Wars RPGs that dealt with outer rim stuff? Mostly what I find deals with Jedi. Really I just want ideas for my own campaign.
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Jan 7, 2013 21:27
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Looselybased posted:Does anyone know of any pre made campaigns for any of the older Star Wars RPGs that dealt with outer rim stuff? Mostly what I find deals with Jedi. Really I just want ideas for my own campaign. I can't vouch for the quality of these individual books, but there was some stuff for the West End version that dealt with non-Jedi stuff, and other subjects not directly pertaining to the rebellion. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/The_Politics_of_Contraband http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Secrets_of_the_Sisar_Run http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Pirates_%26_Privateers http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Platt%27s_Smugglers_Guide There could be some ideas worth plundering in these. I have no idea how scarce they are now. Some are more general sourcebooks than adventures per se, but still could be handy.
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Jan 7, 2013 21:48
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The Darkstryder campaign was really neat for its time. Dawn of Defiance was really neat in Saga edition, but suffered from the problems that Saga suffered from regarding leveling up and difficulty curves.
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Jan 7, 2013 21:58
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LordLobo posted:there are also two more character folios on the FFG site. I made pdfs of all of them, more to fix the errors in Lowhhrick's and Pash's folios than for future playthroughs. I don't know if it would be acceptable for me to post them here, though, since FFG hasn't made them available outside the set yet. If it's fine, I'm happy to post them.
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Jan 7, 2013 22:33
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alg posted:The Darkstryder campaign was really neat for its time. Dawn of Defiance really suffers from a ton of railroading and dumb dungeon crawls and confusing space battles that don't go anywhere. I wasn't a fan personally, but then again maybe the GM running it was doing it poorly.
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Jan 7, 2013 22:41
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Oh poo poo yeah! The challenge die in my set came with no paint on one face, so I sent one of those "missing or damaged components" things in to FFG. I just received a whole new set of dice from them. Well done, FFG.
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Jan 8, 2013 01:00
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Bionic posted:Oh poo poo yeah! The challenge die in my set came with no paint on one face, so I sent one of those "missing or damaged components" things in to FFG. I just received a whole new set of dice from them. Well done, FFG. Wow you do realize that one of the faces are supposed to be blank right?
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Jan 8, 2013 01:11
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LumberingTroll posted:Wow you do realize that one of the faces are supposed to be blank right? Yes. One of the clues to that was that every single die in the box (except the force die) has a blank face. One of my challenge die's two-threat faces has no paint in the icons, and one of its one-threat-one-failure faces has no paint in the threat icon. No paint != blank.
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Jan 8, 2013 01:37
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Bionic posted:Yes. One of the clues to that was that every single die in the box (except the force die) has a blank face. One of my challenge die's two-threat faces has no paint in the icons, and one of its one-threat-one-failure faces has no paint in the threat icon. No paint != blank. Thats cool then, FFG is a pretty good company, their rules writers are a little daft a times though.
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Jan 8, 2013 01:40
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I didn't have enough players show up to continue my regular BattleTech campaign so we pulled out the Beginner Game. I GMed and I had 2 PCs - not as many as I would like but it was still a lot of fun. I had read through the included adventure and I did my best to make it less railroady. I don't think they beat the adventure the way in which it was intended. My players chose Pash and 41-VEX. In the Cantina, they chose to duck into a booth together. Pash succeeded with his stealth roll, 41-VEX did not. Since they were in the same booth, I ruled that the Gamorreans managed to make out 41-VEX's glowing bits in the darkness and of course saw Pash next to him upon closer examination. In the fight the players rolled an incredible nubmer of threats, which resulted in a few overpenetrating shots destroying booze behind the bar or blowing holes in tables. They won but I played the bartender as being incredibly pissed... until Pash handed him a wad of Credits at which point he decided to be a lot more helpful. Being all business, the PCs went straight to the junk shop. They successfully convinced the owner that they were sent by Trex to pick up the Hypermatter-whatsit. I couldn't find the price that Trex had promised to pay, so I set it to 500 based on the increased price that you can negotiate with him to buy it instead. At this point the players chose to split up - 41-VEX went to the landing bay with the part and Pash went to the control tower. Pash successfully managed to lie about being Trex's hired pilot to both the droid guards AND Overseer Brynn. Both of them were very sceptical about the lack of a "Pash" on the list, but he succeeded in his Deceit rolls. Meanwhile, 41-VEX managed to convince Trex that he was sent to install the part. He succeeded in the deceit roll and was let on board by a Trex who was pleased to finally have a way off this craphole. Pash left to join up with 41-VEX and succeeded in a stealth roll to get past the stormtrooper patrols without being spotted. I let him do this since there was no way a fight with them would have ended well. Upon arrival at the docking bay, Pash told the guards that he was one of Teemo's minions come to speak with Trex. Trex came out to meet him and succeeded in a Perception roll to realize that he remembered what the random minion in question looked like and that Pash definitely did not look like him. Pash drew on him and shot which forced Trex to retreat into his ship. Pash managed to make it up the ramp and close just short of the security droids reaching it, all while Trex was wailing on 41-VEX with his claws. One of 41-VEX's shots missed with a big number of threats so I ruled that a panel got hit behind Trex and filled the immediate area with obscuring smoke which further made Pash helping out 41-VEX difficult. In the end they defeated Trex without anyone getting knocked out - though they weren't in amazing shape. Now the fight with the TIE fighters got a little weird. I decided to run with whatever the players wanted to do but with an appropriate level of difficulty and a bunch of Setback dice. 41-VEX installed the hypermatter-whatsit with enough successes to ensure an escape in 4 rounds. Pash did some very, very ill advised moves... and managed to succeed. He wanted to try to rip the side panel off of one of the TIE Fighters with the hooked part on the front of the YT-1300. He succeeded with enough Threats to deal a bunch of accidental damage to his own ship. His next move was to trap the "ball" of the second fighter in the same area and sit there with it trapped until the hyperdrive came online. Not only did he succeed in that roll, but the TIE Fighter pilot failed his own rolls to try to break free. THe Krayt's Fang was almost destroyed in the end but it managed to escape. We also ran the first portion of the first act of Long Arm of the Hutt. They used the wampa skin carpet to wipe up after Trex's messy eating and took a while after that to discover the real source of the bad smell 
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Jan 8, 2013 01:49
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For some reason I haven't enjoyed this as much as Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay just yet. I think I just need more time with it, but it feels like I have to relearn some things with it. I thought it was going to be a 1-to-1 translation of the rules, but this just seems to be a mix of WFRP 3rd Edition and WFRP 2nd/40k RPGs. The d10 requirement threw me off and kind of bugs me that they didn't have some sort of system like WFRP did to resolve crits or whatever.
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Jan 8, 2013 12:48
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Grandpa Goodtimes posted:For some reason I haven't enjoyed this as much as Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay just yet. I think I just need more time with it, but it feels like I have to relearn some things with it. I thought it was going to be a 1-to-1 translation of the rules, but this just seems to be a mix of WFRP 3rd Edition and WFRP 2nd/40k RPGs. The d10 requirement threw me off and kind of bugs me that they didn't have some sort of system like WFRP did to resolve crits or whatever. I had a chance to look at a friend's copy of the Beta rules and the D100 tables surprised me, considering how simply critical hits were resolved in the Beginner Game. But it isn't so far off from WFRP 3E - the Player's Guide let you use a D100 roll for various things instead of drawing cards. I do like WFRP 3E but fewer doodads to have to carry around is nice.
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Jan 8, 2013 22:01
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BattleMaster posted:I didn't have enough players show up to continue my regular BattleTech campaign so we pulled out the Beginner Game. I GMed and I had 2 PCs - not as many as I would like but it was still a lot of fun. I had read through the included adventure and I did my best to make it less railroady. Haha you're a really easy going GM! Putting up with a split party, crazy ideas and then crazier ideas... Sounds like a fun game. I would have blown up their ship though. Seriously, ramming BOTH tie fighters?
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Jan 9, 2013 02:03
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Looselybased posted:Haha you're a really easy going GM! Putting up with a split party, crazy ideas and then crazier ideas... Sounds like a fun game. I would have blown up their ship though. Seriously, ramming BOTH tie fighters? To be honest I was going to punish them harshly if they failed any single one of their rolls - they just managed to succeed even with what I felt were suitable difficulties and Setback dice. They took like 10 points of hull damage JUST from impacts with the TIEs, though, and that was with successes. Just based on that session, it felt to me like overall success but with a large number of Threats were the most common outcomes.
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Jan 9, 2013 02:17
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I own the Beginners Game, but not the full Beta rulebook so I have a few questions about the full game. 1. I have played quite a bit of Saga Edition and I love the ability to multi-class, since I think it is in keeping in line with the films. Does the full game provide rules for multi-classing? 2. I could not see any discernible difference between the different species in the folios. Is there much difference between the different species mechanically, or is it just fluff? 3. The trees in the folios seem rather uninspired, for the most part. Many of the choices just give the character a plus one to some random stat or something equally uninteresting (which is fine in a tutorial, but would get rather old in a full length campaign). Does the full rulebook have some more interesting talent choices?
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Jan 9, 2013 03:34
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