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So, are the WW writers discussing/playtesting whatever changes they'd like to make to the core combat system anywhere? I could only find that thread about the physical disciplines.
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Sep 3, 2012 19:03
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Whoa I guess I'm STing for our Hunter game tonight! I finally get to send my players up against THE MISSOURI RIVER FISHMEN OF SOBEK!!!
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Sep 3, 2012 20:08
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Oh hey, new thread, that's why I couldn't find the old one! So yea, in the last thread someone talked about podcasts and all that help you get into a WoD kinda mindset and inspire you to make terrible adventures and all, and the Nosleep podcast was one of them. Were there any other kinda horror story podcasts that got thrown out? Also crime fighting hog posted:Whoa I guess I'm STing for our Hunter game tonight! You have to expand on this.
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Sep 3, 2012 22:14
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Loomer posted:You motherfucker. I just got Kanye out of my drat head and now you put him right back in there. 21st Dynasty Schizoid Man
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Sep 4, 2012 01:21
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Error 404 posted:Malcolm's a cool dude, I don't want us to be a total dick to him, so I just grabbed one I thought was really funny. There's no better anime for nursing a headache post-Canada Day karaoke party than Grappler Baki. The pacing and complexity of subject matter are about as much as a man or can handle in that state. Anyway, I'm involved with a different stream of things than the soft revisions being discussed for WoD and Vampire, but one of them does bring up an aspect of the system that was kind of screwed up in presentation, which was the idea that circumstantial/equipment bonuses are supposed to be applied pretty aggressively. Over in the WW forums Russell Bailey reported some rumblings about making weapons add their bonus to damage after the roll. Now this doesn't necessarily violate the principles of the core system, but it does demonstrate the kind of ambiguity that came about through the revision process. Back during playtest the task resolution system was different in ways I can't really talk about, and as it evolved to the current system informal notes pinned down the general concept that virtually all dice pools would actually be *three* factor pools, with two Traits plus an equipment/circumstantial bonus dictated by the ST. The book weakly suggests this, but it was never firmly implemented except in the combat system where the last bonus became the hard-coded weapon bonus. So it was tentatively thought that every dice roll was supposed to work like combat, but this didn't really come out of the oven fully baked into the system since it was in the late 2nd generation/3rd generation of the core system. So now that folks are taking another look at that core system, they need to really examine the "boots on the ground" version that people are using, which probably did not aggressively implement three factor dice pools -- especially since different games are inconsistent about this. Vampire is pretty much in tune with this, but Mage is funny in that the third factor is a bennie for rotes, which means that is you apply a circumstantial bonus to improvised spells, you're punishing rote users. So three factor pools have evolved into something fairly exceptional (for combat, powers or special bennies) even though in playtest we eventually applied them very aggressively. Moving weapon effects to a straight bonus isn't a bad system (I've used it myself) but it works along with the rules as implemented, not the never-fully-realized back end discussed in playtest. This kind of process, where principles can get overshadowed by presentation and subsequent history, is a typical thing. I personally think three factor pools would be kind of cool and add a Wushu-like feel as players scrabble to justify dice, and it would put the Storyteller at the heart of actions in a distinctive way, but it might be too radical for people expecting a gradual shift.
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Sep 4, 2012 03:32
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Er, it's not a problem of presentation. Everyone gets that dice pools are meant to have equipment or circumstantial bonuses (or penalties, as appropriate). That's not why it doesn't play out like that, and I'm really surprised the reason isn't more obvious to you. The equipment bonuses for weapons are codified, in such a way that players can say to themselves "Well, my character has a Light Revolver, and according to the book that's worth another two dice on top of my pool." This means that when they approach the Storyteller to talk about their dice pool, they don't approach with a question, they approach with "He's using the Light Revolver, so that's another two dice on top." By way of contrast, equipment and circumstantial bonuses are all arbitrated by the Storyteller, and thus any player wanting to put bonuses on top has to play Mother-May-I with the Storyteller to get their bonus dice. Given the inherently uneven relationship that exists between players and Storytellers (it's been described somewhat accurately as pedagogic, with Storytellers having almost all the power), most players are psychologically predisposed to be reluctant to argue for bonuses to their actions since they're in all other ways encouraged not to argue with authority (especially at the gaming table). Most players don't like arguing with the person running the game, because the power dynamic at play tells them they stand to lose. You could say that this isn't a problem for more confident players, or for games where it's been established that the players and Storyteller are meant to have a sort of argumentative, constructive relationship, but this still doesn't change the fact that most people are predisposed not to do so. Moreover, even players who are happy enough to argue will frequently choose not to do so because they don't want to feel like they're being disruptive, and slowing the game with "Can I have this bonus? How about this one?" for dice rolls is a problem for them. This isn't telegraphing and presentation, this is the difference between "We have a mutually agreed set of numbers to use for this situation (written in the game book)" and "We must discuss and come to a consensus on the numbers we will use, while working within an inherently unbalanced relationship". That's it. I can't count the number of times I've had assertive players really not go for equipment bonuses because of these sorts of factors, just as I can (from the flip side) count the number of times I've had to reflexively stop myself and ask "Are there bonuses these guys should be applying that they're not mentioning?" This isn't just a problem for new players, it's a consequence of the way the game is set up.
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Sep 4, 2012 03:46
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Yeah, I think equipment/circumstance bonuses on non-combat rolls are criminally underused. I usually haggle with the ST for one when I can find it, and my group's usually fairly liberal when it comes to assigning bonuses or penalties representing the ease or difficulty of some task, but I've always gotten the idea that it wasn't a very common practice. One thing is that real power in the current WoD actually flows out of four trait pools: Attribute + Skill + Supernatural Trait (usually the Vigor Discipline, Life Arcanum, or other thing that you can turn into a direct stat boost) + Equipment Bonus. The classic example here is of a high-Strength, high-Vigor, high-Weaponry vampire swinging a greataxe at you - if they're also spending blood or willpower, they're throwing dice in the mid-twenties, potentially with some __-again rule tacked on. If you're getting really silly and have found some way to amplify your Attribute and your Skill, you go even higher. In the stripped down/condensed WoD rules I've been writing, I went and named the circumstance/equipment component in every dicepool "Edge" (thanks, Nobilis) and went on for a bit about how Edges can have varying sources and usually don't stack and so forth.
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Sep 4, 2012 03:50
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As for how you fix that problem, you formally codify equipment bonuses and circumstantial bonuses with descriptive phrases that telegraph to players what sort of dice to expect. You get away from the idea that "A bigger gun automatically has a higher equipment bonus" and abstract bonuses as being qualitative, and introduce something like:pre:Bonus Descriptor +1 Crude +2 Average +3 Good +4 Excellent +5 Exceptional A similar solution can work for circumstance bonuses and penalties, introduced descriptively like "As he races through the rain away from you, you're blinded by the floodlights, making it Strained to see where he went" or something similar. A bit of work can polish that up, but it's the formal codification of how bonuses and penalties are applied that hopefully circumvents negotiation. Codify it, make it explicit, and it'll work. Leave it to Mother-May-I, and people will avoid it.
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Sep 4, 2012 03:54
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crime fighting hog posted:Whoa I guess I'm STing for our Hunter game tonight! The Fishman Says: Splish Splash Motherfucker! I love fishmen as an antagonist.
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Sep 4, 2012 04:16
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Etherwind posted:Er, it's not a problem of presentation. Everyone gets that dice pools are meant to have equipment or circumstantial bonuses (or penalties, as appropriate). That's not why it doesn't play out like that, and I'm really surprised the reason isn't more obvious to you. Yes. Codification is a form of . . . presentation. You are not really finding the clever thing I have not thought of, in no small part because the system doesn't actually apply the third factor in a "Mother May I" fashion and provides specific bonus examples. Where the *presentation* was a problem is that this isn't really brought together into a general principle as you describe, which is a pretty good idea but if anything is, chock full of Mother May I because terms like Excellent, Exceptional and Dude Totally Awesome are really loving subjective things. The fact that the ST applies it to items as a template is handwaving: "Look, I had to fill out an entry on a sheet. It's legit!" Otherwise your table is almost good, but then, well, not. It has the following problems: 1) It starts at 1 instead of 0, and "Add a die because who gives a gently caress if you suck, here's a die" is a poor signal to players. 2) Because dice bonuses usually top out at 5 allowing it to be applied as a template to a single item is problematic, especially if these are stacked with circumstances. You could hard-limit the sum of all bonuses to 5, but this leads to an absurd scenario where you may as well just hand out 5s whenever anyone is vaguely tactical and has good tools, which makes Excellence meaningless. What would be preferable is a 0-3 scale where 3 is truly exceptional (see Exalted's 3 die stunts) that can be acquired for multiple factors (maybe a maximum of 3: Equipment, Environment and Miscellaneous) by making Wushu-like description proposals. If the combined factors exceed 5 there might be some additional options available, like dropping your bonus to bank a Willpower point, or maybe additional successes if you succeed (though this might often do nothing -- a standard exceptional success reward would be helpful). And unlike Stethoscope Extreme, it actually encourages creative collaboration between player and Storyteller. MalcolmSheppard fucked around with this message at 01:54 on Sep 6, 2012 |
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Sep 4, 2012 04:26
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Etherwind posted:As for how you fix that problem, you formally codify equipment bonuses and circumstantial bonuses with descriptive phrases that telegraph to players what sort of dice to expect. You get away from the idea that "A bigger gun automatically has a higher equipment bonus" and abstract bonuses as being qualitative, and introduce something like: y'know, this is almost exactly another houserule I've always used as a way to avoid the +5 greataxe/sniper rifle. I've just been hesitant to ever bring it up for fear that it'd sound too D20. pre:Bonus Descriptor -5 Broken or barely usable -4 Bent -3 Strained -2 Weak -1 Flimsy/Rusty +1 Basic/Crude +2 Average +3 Good +4 Excellent +5 Exceptional fakeedit:and I always thought the basic "numerology"(lol) of the ST system was fairly clear (3's and 5's), but I can see how it's not explicit at times.
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Sep 4, 2012 04:27
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Ferrinus posted:Yeah, I think equipment/circumstance bonuses on non-combat rolls are criminally underused. I usually haggle with the ST for one when I can find it, and my group's usually fairly liberal when it comes to assigning bonuses or penalties representing the ease or difficulty of some task, but I've always gotten the idea that it wasn't a very common practice. There are good game procedures that can make this easier, one of which is to model it by making it an object that you grab, as Etherwind kind of suggested. But by "object," we mean "A construction that has definitely game-affecting results." Now if you take this in a certain direction you end up with FATE, which doesn't really gove the game its own identity. Take it in another, and you have templated objects that define and constrain bonus-stacking, as per D20. The sdanger here is that if you overdo it you end up losing touch with what's going on with the story while you stack Divine Flaming Radiant. I personally like Wushu because it encourages you to grab and stack descriptors willy-nilly because they produce your dice, but for WoD it would have to be a little more constrained. All of these methods encourage a certain kind of conversation that helps the group decide, and I think it's possible to tailor it for the WoD. But again, this isn't the way the game really turned out.
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Sep 4, 2012 04:34
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I like the "multiple sources of potential +3s which can stack up to a certain limit" idea, not the least because the mage stuff I've been writing uses a three step scale to measure the power of a given spell. Like you say, though, it's a bit moot given how different it is from the way the game works right now. Generally, I think a lot of WoD stuff benefits from condensing 1-5 lists into 1-3 lists; it's a lot easier to rank things best, decent, worst without trying to figure out smaller margins. For instance, translating extant weapon bonuses into autodamage is kind of nuts, but if you halve and round down the bonuses of every listed piece of equipment, weapons that range from "Lethal damage, +0 autodamage on hit" to "Lethal damage, +2 autodamage on hit" are really quite manageable. (I credit LOOK from the White Wolf forums for this) Ferrinus fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Sep 4, 2012 |
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Sep 4, 2012 04:40
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Ferrinus posted:For instance, translating extant weapon bonuses into autodamage is kind of nuts, but if you halve and round down the bonuses of every listed piece of equipment, weapons that range from "Lethal damage, +0 autodamage on hit" to "Lethal damage, +2 autodamage on hit" are really quite manageable. (I credit LOOK from the White Wolf forums for this) We used this house rule in oWoD; we just applied half the damage dice pool as autodamage instead of rolling it and counting hits, keeping in mind damage target numbers were (almost) always 6. Instead of always rounding down, for odd numbers we rolled 1-5 = round down, 6-10 = round up. If you're talking about reconfiguring the combat system to that degree, breaking up accuracy and damage into two rolls would be worthwhile. You know, attack+dodge or attack+damage roll or something.
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Sep 4, 2012 05:09
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My white whale is still making combat in the WoD involve one attack roll vs. one defense roll rather than one attack roll mediated by a passively applied penalty. I don't think a separate damage roll has any purpose, though - at least a Defense roll allows a defending player to feel like they're participating/"watch" their character do something. A separate damage roll on an attacker's behalf doesn't really do much that a flat damage bonus couldn't.
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Sep 4, 2012 05:14
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Glitterbomber posted:You have to expand on this. I shall when I have some downtime tomorrow! Everyone survived though one player contracted Typhoid because of doo-doo water.
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Sep 4, 2012 05:38
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Ferrinus posted:My white whale is still making combat in the WoD involve one attack roll vs. one defense roll rather than one attack roll mediated by a passively applied penalty. I don't think a separate damage roll has any purpose, though - at least a Defense roll allows a defending player to feel like they're participating/"watch" their character do something. A separate damage roll on an attacker's behalf doesn't really do much that a flat damage bonus couldn't. My house rules for OWoD generally used Aeonverse static soak, and damage was = attack successes + base damage number, minimum 1 point of damage left over for all lethal/agg weapons. This makes the only rolls attack and defense. It worked pretty well. You could soften autodamage by bringing back soak, but that would be annoying -- better to up HLs instead, maybe, if you feel it's required.
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Sep 4, 2012 06:32
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The house rules my group is trying now (but haven't actually used because we haven't had a fight for like ten freakin' games)(we, the players, are cowards)(it worked okay in white room playtests, though) are basically: "The attacker rolls their usual Stat + Skill + Equipment dicepool, the defender reflexively rolls Defense (Wits plus the lower of Str and Dex), every net success by the attacker is a point of damage." Armor lowers your Defense dicepool in exchange for giving you a couple guaranteed minimum successes on all Defense rolls (there's no such thing as equipment which just passively and persistently boosts your Defense, also, Defense is applicable against any kind of attack unless things have been specifically set up so that it can't), and Defense is also what you roll in case the Storyteller says something like "The ceiling caves in, everyone takes 5 lethal minus any successes they get to dodge." If the WoD's gonna have a system where you roll your dicepool minus someone's defense trait but then add your weapon bonus on as autodamage, my hope is that armor, resilience, and other "I'm way too tough to care that you just hit me with an axe" type stuff works by subtracting directly from weapon-derived autodamage only, without ever (unless something special is being brought to bear) subtracting from someone's actual rolled successes. And that stuff like Vigor and Resilience works explicitly to eventually render weapons and armor redundant, rather than stacking with weapons and armor like they do now.
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Sep 4, 2012 06:42
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Ferrinus posted:And that stuff like Vigor and Resilience works explicitly to eventually render weapons and armor redundant, rather than stacking with weapons and armor like they do now. How would you justify that in-character? I can't think of any logical explanation for a supernaturally strong character refusing to use weapons or worse, preferentially not using them other than "I'm so strong I just break weapons".
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Sep 4, 2012 07:11
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Gobbeldygook posted:How would you justify that in-character? I can't think of any logical explanation for a supernaturally strong character refusing to use weapons or worse, preferentially not using them other than "I'm so strong I just break weapons". They wouldn't refuse to use weapons, and in fact if they happened to have higher Weaponry than Brawl or if they didn't feel like paying to activate their power they'd continue using weapons. It's just that the difference one weapon makes over another, or the difference having a weapon makes over not having a weapon, rapidly becomes irrelevant when you're dealing with truly prodigious amounts of vampiric super strength.
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Sep 4, 2012 07:18
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Gobbeldygook posted:How would you justify that in-character? I can't think of any logical explanation for a supernaturally strong character refusing to use weapons or worse, preferentially not using them other than "I'm so strong I just break weapons". Justify not wearing armor in character: vampires don't get hurt from guns. Bulletproof vests are bulky and lame and they don't work for vampires. They also fail to protect against knives, which are a much bigger deal for your average undead. Also they make you look like a pansy (every vampire can tell you got a vest on) and no one wants you to kiss them while you are wearing one, making feeding difficult. Justify not using weapons: Carrying around a broadaxe or an AK is gonna get police trouble and violate the masquerade. I can make wolverine claws complete with *snikt* sound or have bone claws protruding from my hands like motherfucking Doomsday, and no one is gonna notice until I feel like letting the beast out. At this point, a switchblade is an embarassing joke. The only time I'm gonna use one is if my wolverine claws are gonna attract even more attention and I wanna blend in while I kill people.
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Sep 4, 2012 10:49
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crime fighting hog posted:I shall when I have some downtime tomorrow! Everyone survived though one player contracted Typhoid because of doo-doo water. Spoiler alert: The idea sounds like it's been pulled from the Urban Legends splat from the normal New World of Darkness line, in case you want a sneak peak. 
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Sep 4, 2012 13:02
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Circutron posted:Spoiler alert: The idea sounds like it's been pulled from the Urban Legends splat from the normal New World of Darkness line, in case you want a sneak peak. I did just. I typed up my notes, looked through the book, found that and literally scribbled out fish men and replaced it with alligator men and it was pretty much the same.
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Sep 4, 2012 14:02
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Goddamn it that's not how you fishman. EDIT: I can't decide if I should assign serial numbers based on in-universe chronology or out of universe. I'm leaning towards out of universe order of appearance, with the exception of founders (e.g. Cappadocius is always the serial for Cappadocian-0001) of lines and traditions, etc. Loomer fucked around with this message at 15:51 on Sep 4, 2012 |
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Sep 4, 2012 15:13
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Last night we played Hunter for the first time since... January? It's been awhile. Everything was super rushed because my players are both really casual and not familiar with the system or its background. I was throwing poo poo together pretty haphazardly by the time people started showing up, deciding to do a creature feature kind of night. Regardless, we had loads of fun. As before, our game was set in Omaha. About seven months ago, a rash of disappearances had people questioning what was going on down at the banks of the Missouri River that separates Nebraska and Iowa, Omaha and Council Bluffs. Since each of the seven missing were homeless, vagrants or addicts, the Omaha Police Department, FBI, Douglas County Sheriff and state patrol thought nothing of it. The homeless population is always in flux, especially with seasonal changes. Then, on a calm, cool night, the Ameristar Casino Boat departed from its dock, making its usual tour upstream beneath the Bob Kerrey Pedestrian Bridge for some sight seeing. The boat and all 103 passengers and crew ceased communications at 9:07 p.m., March 16. A massive search was undertaken, and the river dredged sixty miles both north and south. Ironically, dozens of bodies were found that were unconnected to the case, many of them gang killings solving several cold case files. Not a single scrap of evidence or piece of the ship was found. The incident was dubbed "The Missouri Triangle" despite calls of callousness by grieving families on the local media. Ameristar Casino went bankrupt after six dozen lawsuits. A memorial is being built near the banks in Old Market of Omaha. Since that night, no disappearances have been suffered that seem out of the ordinary. Until last night, when six church workers disappeared into the night. The city is on edge, to say the least. The characters names escape me since everyone changed things up again. Our group consisted of a medical student, a private investigator, a convenience store worker, a lab tech grad at the medical center and a gearhead thug. The PI comes into her office late, nursing another hangover when a client is waiting outside. The woman is distraught and tells the PI her husband is one of the missing six. The PI takes her information, plus an advance, and begins making calls. The lab tech is passing the day with menial chores at the university when a friend asks for him to look over something. They both enter a room with a dissection of an appendage already opened with calipers. It resembles a human hand, but the size and shape is all ...wrong. The skin is tough and greenish, the fingernails are hardened into black claws and there is a thin webbing between appendages. The tech fails his science and medicine rolls despite lab bonuses, and can't figure out what the hell it is, but he knows it's not right. The convenience store worker jerks from his afternoon sleep to the sound of his phone beeping. An email, titled "From a friend" tells him to be at the Sake Bombers Lounge in Old Market at exactly 9:07 tonight. He thinks nothing of it, and prepares for his swing shift that night. The gearhead is putting a glass pack muffler onto his 1967 Camaro. His garage is located near the river, and he begins having day dreams during his work about basking in the sunlight, and craves a very raw steak. He shakes off the notions and continues to work. The day passes with everyone mentioning to each other the weird poo poo going on. The PI tracks down her client's husband's car at the impound lot. She and the two med students drive over and persuade (quite well) the clerk to let them search the car. Within the maroon Acura, they find discarded butcher trays with bloodstains, scraps of raw meat, something resembling alligator scales and half of a cat. They also find a flyer, stained in blood, of a smeared handprint. Scrawled letters below read WE FOLLOW SEBAK SEBAK FOLLOWS HIM WE STAND AT THE DOOR The PI gets a call at her office while the lab tech and med student are there. Her client with the missing husband is on the phone. "There's someone here. He's standing across the street and I can't see his face but I think it's Robert. But somethings not right..." Everyone meets at the house, not very logical but I was tired of everyone being separated the town over. They spot the creeper, who is bulging from his overcoat, bandages and hat. Think Darkman, but about 8 feet tall. They botch their stealth rolls to circle around him and cut him off, and he rabbits. They give chase, with the PI and others heading him off in the Jeep Mangler while the greaser and Kwik shop worker tail him. "Robert" is loping across the ground on all fours, and when he isn't leaping over fences, he bursts right through them. Greaser, with amazing speed, catches up and shoulder clips his knee. Kwik shop drops his duffel bag filled with goodies and draws his Louisville Slugger. "Robert" turns and bares his teeth and claws. He knocks Greaser out of the way then tears a chunk out of Kwik Shop's chest (6 lethal in one bite will do that). Greaser puts on his brass knucks and starts working Bob's ribs, which is like punching rock. The PI runs forward out of the car and pumps four shots into Bob's back. He grunts and tries to get away before she pops two more in his knees (loving 9 again pistols man). The med student sedates him on the spot, and they carry the five hundred pounder to the car. They drive to a storage unit they rent for such an occasion in Carter Lake. Within are med kits, chairs and a table with straps. They strap Bob down and sedate him just enough to keep him lucid for questioning. Under a good light, he looks more like Killer Croc than Joe Schmoe now. "What happened to you?" the PI asks. Robert drifts in and out of logic, asking where his wife is and that he only wanted her to share in his dreams. Dreams of the river. Dreams of pyramids and basking in the sun. Of raw meat and blood gushing between your teeth. The greaser shudders and crosses the room. They notice the bullets are barely lodged into his thick hide and he blinks without closing his eyes. While discussing their plans and bandaging Kwik Shop, Robert rages out, busts through is straps and takes out the wall of the storage unit. They lose him due to some really bad luck, and he disappears into the river. It's 8:45 p.m. Kwik Shop mentions the email he received earlier. With no other options, they go downtown. While walking by the pond in Old Market, they overhear a city worker complaining about someone stealing the fish from the pound each time they replace them. They go into the bar, the PI stays outside in her car. At exactly 9:07, several other Bob looking guys show up. Bandages, hats worn over faces, trenchcoats. They burst through the front windows of the sushi restaurant and begin tearing the place apart, loading their arms with raw fish. The group stands up and opens fire, tagging several while ordering all the terrified people to get out. Kwik Shop revs his chainsaw, dons his catcher's mask and in murderous Casey Jones style begins chopping killer crocs. One gatorman falls, two more escape into a nearby manhole. The party gives chase, trying to open the cover but they attract the attention of a beat cop on the scene. The PI persuades him despite the heavy penalty that they need to get down there to stop the guys who destroyed the restaurant. Beat cop has heard about this group, and thankfully is a fan. They descend into the smelly depths and waist high doo doo water. Slips, falls, nastiness bumping into legs, rats, darkness, increasing water flow- all harass them as they try to find their way. The occasional hieroglyph adorns the tiles, and the Greaser fails trying to resist the dreams again. His hand snatches out and grabs a rat, but Kwik shop stops him before he can sink his teeth into the live rodent. Greaser tries to compose himself and sheathes his bastard sword. A gator man springs out of the water, slicing up Greaser bad with his claws, and spits acid on one of the med students. They put him down, with Kwik Shop severing his head and remarking he could use a pair of alligator skin boots. Four more gatormen pop up behind them. They eye their chances and decide fighting in cramped doo doo water tunnels doesn't suit them. They run ahead, into a large chamber with a vaulted ceiling, moss and cat tails and mushrooms every where. It's a literal swamp in the sewer, and a fifteen foot croco-man stand before them facing a glowing red stone, chomping away at some poor bastard. Beneath him, the Ameristar Casino Boat is sunk into the poo poo and mud. Skeletons are every where, some more recent than others. Egg sacs clump together in the water, with writhing figures beneath the shells. The big croc turns as the other crocs ...cheer, would be the closest word, at their coming demise. "gently caress this!" Kwik shop says, pulls out his home made flamethrower, risks willpower and lights up big croc. The others pull out their guns, succeed on composure checks to keep their sanity, and pour rounds into the glowing gem. Everything blacks out, and they wake up on a rock floating in space, drenched in blood and bones and sinew. Something unimaginable stares at them from the sky, and they again succeeded keeping their sanity, and pour more rounds into the shapeless horror between the stars. I had them test for killing it with their minds, and everyone blew willpower to do so. Something roared in anger that shook them to their souls. They awoke back in the sewer. The rock is shattered and the gator men have their skin melting from their bones, howling in pain. The big croc lies dead, seared to the bone as Kwik Shop is panting in pain. They climb out of the sewer just in time for the sunrise, and go to Dairy Queen.
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Sep 4, 2012 18:46
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Ferrinus posted:The house rules my group is trying now (but haven't actually used because we haven't had a fight for like ten freakin' games)(we, the players, are cowards)(it worked okay in white room playtests, though) are basically: "The attacker rolls their usual Stat + Skill + Equipment dicepool, the defender reflexively rolls Defense (Wits plus the lower of Str and Dex), every net success by the attacker is a point of damage." Armor lowers your Defense dicepool in exchange for giving you a couple guaranteed minimum successes on all Defense rolls (there's no such thing as equipment which just passively and persistently boosts your Defense, also, Defense is applicable against any kind of attack unless things have been specifically set up so that it can't), and Defense is also what you roll in case the Storyteller says something like "The ceiling caves in, everyone takes 5 lethal minus any successes they get to dodge." This makes Mage Armor kind of ridiculous though, if you still use it as a dot-for-dot thing. I mean, it is anyway, but how are you reworking that if at all?
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Sep 4, 2012 19:29
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Um... drat it I need to find a Hunter game. Right now I'm trying to bodge something that resembles the Mage magic system into D&D 4e. It ticks my "try something futile and ill advised" checkbox. Does anyone have any suggestions or any attempts they've tried so I can see where the succeeded or failed? My usual group isn't going to play WoD due to the usual perception of White Wolf players. Despite this, I want to sneak the Mage: the Awakening casting system into 4e so they can experience it without the preconceptions that M:tA would bring with it. Maybe I can bootstrap them into playing it.
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Sep 4, 2012 19:53
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Xir posted:My usual group isn't going to play WoD due to the usual perception of White Wolf players.
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Sep 4, 2012 20:15
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Xir posted:Um... If I were trying this, but wanted to not break 4E in half, there's a few things I'd do: 1. Make the arcana based off the knowledge:arcana skill (all classes who don't start with it can pick it up) basically this is Gnosis. You can't have arcana higher than that. 2. Divide up the keywords between arcana, some will be in multiple arcana, and you'll probably want to make up a few. 3. Divide up rotes/effects to fit into 4E's scheme. Eg- 1-2 dots would be at-will, 3-4 are Encounters, and 5+ would be daily. Edit: 4. Make each arcana into basically a skill, make each "rank" in that skill cost maybe a little more than other skill ranks. I would stress the free-form and creative nature of spells, within the loose(er than DnD, stricter than WoD) framework. I'd have them choose either potency or duration, and have those factor into the DC. But this is just,like...my opinion man. Error 404 fucked around with this message at 20:34 on Sep 4, 2012 |
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Sep 4, 2012 20:31
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quote:They climb out of the sewer just in time for the sunrise, and go to Dairy Queen. That is the perfect ending for a Hunter story.
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Sep 4, 2012 20:32
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Reene posted:This makes Mage Armor kind of ridiculous though, if you still use it as a dot-for-dot thing. Basically, spells which boost your defensive capabilities act like armor, giving you one, two, or three guaranteed minimum successes on Defense rolls. (Totally normal armor can also do this, but usually penalizes your Defense pool in the process) (Shaving off at minimum 3 damage from every incoming attack might, admittedly, still be too strong, but I'll have to finish writing the bloody thing and playtest it in order to see)
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Sep 4, 2012 20:40
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Loomer posted:I can't decide if I should assign serial numbers based on in-universe chronology or out of universe. I'm leaning towards out of universe order of appearance, with the exception of founders (e.g. Cappadocius is always the serial for Cappadocian-0001) of lines and traditions, etc. The in-universe one would be impossible to keep straight given that a) most elders' personal histories are vague or self-contradictory and b) a lot of poo poo gets retconned from book to book. Also, Tremere and his Council of Seven were all simultaneously Embraced by the same ritual and/or same sire, so they'd technically share the same number even though Tremere himself is the others' honorary sire. Also also , 
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Sep 4, 2012 21:40
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crime fighting hog posted:Last night we played Hunter ...  Yup, wanna play me some Hunter. Maybe i'll have to run it to get my hit of it.
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Sep 5, 2012 02:13
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Mummies are the perfect splat to fight The Prince. They're also the splat that does everything I wanted from Mage and nothing else. Dibs on Lenin's real body.
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Sep 5, 2012 03:37
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ErichZahn posted:Mummies are the perfect splat to fight The Prince. They're also the splat that does everything I wanted from Mage and nothing else. First thing I'm doing when Mummy comes out, I'm gonna give it to my Hunter ST and say "don't care how, but we need to hunt one of these."
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Sep 5, 2012 03:40
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gtrmp posted:The in-universe one would be impossible to keep straight given that a) most elders' personal histories are vague or self-contradictory and b) a lot of poo poo gets retconned from book to book. Also, Tremere and his Council of Seven were all simultaneously Embraced by the same ritual and/or same sire, so they'd technically share the same number even though Tremere himself is the others' honorary sire. Also also , Yeah, that's why I'm leaning towards just doing the sensible thing. Mind you, I think literally every post I make about this project should automatically have a goonsay attached.
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Sep 5, 2012 03:40
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Yawgmoth posted:First thing I'm doing when Mummy comes out, I'm gonna give it to my Hunter ST and say "don't care how, but we need to hunt one of these." Make sure to have Big Hubris fucked around with this message at 04:12 on Sep 5, 2012 |
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Sep 5, 2012 03:46
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ErichZahn posted:Make sure to have him mention Lenin getting out of his box on 12/12/12.
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Sep 5, 2012 03:49
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Today, Charles Manson released an album with a man named Manuel Vasquez. This is a great excuse to introduce Seers or Slashers into your game. EDIT:Actually, gently caress it. I've been wanting to write/gather material a Mage Noir game set in San Fran for quite a while... Big Hubris fucked around with this message at 05:06 on Sep 5, 2012 |
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Sep 5, 2012 04:44
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crime fighting hog posted:
While the rest of it was awesome, this line right here made me love it. God that was an awesome thread, and now I want to go look those videos up again.
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Sep 5, 2012 05:03
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