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Does anybody have any recommendations for the thickest, densest, heaviest, blackest Germano-Scandinavian black bread of a gajillion calories? I saw this one and thought it was getting there: https://www.daringgourmet.com/easy-danish-rye-bread-rugbrod/ I want to spring one on my mother-in-law around Thanksgiving and I also like the novel idea of kind of living off of one of these for two days. Second thing: I'm trying to diversify on breads to make in my wood-fired oven as the temperature declines. From 900F-600F it's all about pizza, but I'm thinking: 500F-400F: focaccia 450F-400F: ciabatta 425F-375F: kolaches and klobasneks 400F-300F: ...something? 375F-275F: 2.5 hours of dense-rear end loaves of death over hours (oh look how that came up again) Consider that the oven will cool down gradually. So I have maybe 30 minutes of focaccia, but upwards of an hour of ciabatta and kolaches.
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Oct 22, 2019 06:30
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His Divine Shadow posted:Jälkiuunileipä or after oven bread. A type of finnish 100% rye bread that was baked in the oven after all the main cooking was done and the oven was cooling off. So you bake it after you Finnish cooking?  I just tripped across the Wikipedia entry on Finnish bread. I guess categorically they are leaner than other rye breads--even if you particularly mention a sweet one--so maybe my wife would be on board with them.
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Oct 22, 2019 08:28
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Electric Hobo posted:That recipe is very close to something you'd find here in Denmark. I'd use dark syrup instead of sugar, and always use buttermilk. I'd personally drop the almonds, since it changes the taste and feel of the bread too much for my liking. Generally speaking, is it something so dense that you end up having to grunt a little to lift it up off the table? I'm trying to achieve a comic level of heft with this. I'm guessing that having wheat/rye berries and some nuts does a lot to really give it heft. Generally I agree with the idea of using some kind of dark syrup. Would blackstrap molasses be appropriate? It would contribute a kind of flavor and I don't know if that would be consistent.
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Oct 24, 2019 08:19
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Electric Hobo posted:Yeah, it usually feels more like a brick than bread, and it can be really hard to cut, especially the homemade stuff. Regarding blackstrap molasses: Boiled sugarcane juice makes sugar in its first run. It's second run makes molasses. It's third run makes blackstrap molasses. It's sludge at that point and has to be coaxed out of the jar by warming it up and sacrificing a goat. Rich, dark, and hilariously thick.
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Oct 24, 2019 18:01
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Paging Electric Hobo: I was showing some possibilities for dark, dense breads to my mom and Rugbrød looked a lot like a bread she used to see the nuns making where she grew up in upstate New York so she's on board for messing with that in particular. I saw a few possibilities for this that gave a real spectrum for moisture. What was more common was something like a wet muck that you slop into a baking pan, but some were dry and kneaded. I'm wondering which way to lean in general and what to expect. I think the recipe you posted is going for the wet muck.
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Nov 8, 2019 21:09
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My first attempt at that rugbrød will probably be a failure for being too wet. The I soaked the seeds/rye berries beforehand for a recipe that didn't call for that, but then the recipe called for a 24-hour rest after mixing. So I'm pretty sure that was supposed to help saturate them. I added a little more flour but it was a complete guess. It's currently oozing over onto a catch pan under it in the oven. So I'll be mostly going for taste and such this time and disregarding moisture content and everything else.
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Nov 11, 2019 02:29
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Electric Hobo posted:How much did you fill the pan? It should only be about 2/3 full, or it'll go everywhere. I went all the way. The recipe I had posted wanted me to dump it all in: https://www.daringgourmet.com/easy-danish-rye-bread-rugbrod/ ...but I could have made two loaves with that even without the extra moisture. My wife considers it to be far too bitter but her mother-in-law would like it. I'm not sure how much of a fan I am either. Do you have a tried-and-true recipe?
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Nov 12, 2019 00:40
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My kitten obliterated my first response without undo working somehow so this is going to be a tad lazier. 1. Do you have a notion for the amount of seeds to use? 2. Having played with this some, it's starting to look something like a fruitcake--a seedcake, if you will. My wife thought it was too bitter so now I'm starting to wonder if I could just throw in the classic dried fruits and make her happy. She things she would have taken the slivered almonds too instead of the flax seeds.
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Nov 12, 2019 17:39
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biggfoo posted:Rye bread talk early got me going. Went with rye/spelt version from the perfect loaf. Only had dark rye and tried sifting it but might not have a fine enough mesh as it didn't remove much. It's good and dense though. Just out of curiosity--how bitter did it come off to you?
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Dec 2, 2019 04:35
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I am looking for shopping advice for proofing cloth, kloches, or whatever you want to call cloth for keeping shape of high-hydration doughs. I had some rough dish towels that were ruined. I tried old pillowcases with a high thread count. Not ruined at all, but the dough still stuck. It sounds like I need something that is porous that I clog up with flour and consign forever to bread. That is fine.
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Mar 17, 2020 06:10
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I had gotten the impression those things cost a bunch of money but clearly they don't. I think that's cheaper than the pillowcases I was using...
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Mar 17, 2020 11:42
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toplitzin posted:I'm finally getting biscuits down. I make similar biscuits and have been personally dissatisfied with them. My wife and mom both love them, and they have some standards for them. My take is that I feel like I'm making something like a really think, crumbly pastry, and that's not exactly what I want. I think they should be taller and have just a little bit of a tear to them when you break them apart. I don't know what you're looking for. Those biscuits would pass some people's tests and it's probably just a matter of personal preference now. Something I picked up from Southern Living just this morning was to pack all the biscuits together so that they're forced to rice upwards instead of outwards. Also, they prep their fat by freezing it and then grating it.
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Mar 22, 2020 05:33
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Yuns posted:I am very new to baking but wanted to ask if you guys found that using a low gluten flour like White Lily makes a noticeable difference in biscuits as asserted in this old article:
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Mar 22, 2020 17:48
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beerinator posted:I base my recipe on Southern Living's. Another tip is to melt a couple of tablespoons of butter and paint it on the biscuits right when they come out of the oven. This is more my flavor and I can't really get it. My wife mocks this style as being like the Pillsbury tins but I regret nothing. Do you know how thick your dough is when cutting? I'm not getting anywhere near that kind of height. I know places like Popeyes does a thinner, crumbly biscuit too and people are into that. I'm starting to treat biscuits like they have at least two distinct styles. People don't really distinguish when they're talking about them, but I'm pretty sure they require distinct methods to create. It's very frustrating to research. Edit: My current theory on this based on upbringing between me and my wife is that I want a Yankee biscuit and my wife wants a southern biscuit. That's usually how this stuff goes. I might be wrong though.
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Mar 22, 2020 18:35
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SymmetryrtemmyS posted:Your current theory is correct; there are drop biscuits (like what you've been making) and rolled biscuits. Drop biscuits are made with more liquid and result in more of a crumbly texture like you've been getting, and rolled biscuits are like the picture you're quoting. Haha I've been making rolled biscuits! But yeah, they're coming out like very homogenous drop biscuits.
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Mar 23, 2020 00:43
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Hopes Fall posted:Is the King Arthur dough suppised to be very wet? It's certainly wetter than other doughs I've tried. If you're not so used to fancier [flour] then you're probably seeing the effect of a lower ash content. It takes less to hydrate it. I've been toying with some heirloom flour recently and between experiments and talking with the mill's owner, I've had to go the other way and hydrate more. The owner said they've heard people hydrating their stuff over 100% and it behaving pretty normally even like that. That's from strange, hipster wheat. Rocko Bonaparte fucked around with this message at 06:48 on Mar 26, 2020 |
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Mar 25, 2020 22:24
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snailshell posted:I know exactly the distinction in biscuit texture you're referring to, and I prefer the layered/vertical style too. How else can I get the even split crucial for a stable foundation for the fried egg sandwich jfc I had read something the other day that maybe the super-delicate methods for making biscuits is actually wrong and you should be fine working in warm weather, beating it up, stirring it a bunch, and generally doing everything the Internet says is wrong. I'm thinking of trying that once just for giggles. I kind of jibes with my sense that a bunch of Southern mothers weren't methodically chilling all their stuff in the middle of the summer and delicately handling everything. (...then I'll start pinching the butter when that doesn't work, hydrating the dough with my desperate tears. Plus, I won't need salt!)
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Mar 25, 2020 22:37
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Hopes Fall posted:I've only made bread successfully once before. The top cane out very flat, but that taste was good, and the crumb a little dense. There's some pretty typical commentary on that: https://thebreadguide.com/why-does-my-bread-collapse-or-flatten/ I always assume overproofing, but I forget other people are afraid of wearing themselves or their equipment out so I am not good at guessing at underkneading. I also couldn't tell from a picture. However, dense crumb is definitely a thing from overproofed dough. That site also talks about mishandling high-hydration dough, which is only a problem if you're a freak making ciabatta and baguettes.
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Mar 26, 2020 06:53
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Stringent posted:Unfortunately mine end up looking like this: I don't think I'm allowed to talk about other people's biscuits, but I still want to speculate that it looks... wet? Was it raw? Also, was that done at a really high temperature? That's a big contrast between white/brown.
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Mar 26, 2020 06:55
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Piss Meridian posted:I'm starting to regret not buying that 30kg bag of flour, it's the only flour I've seen in weeks and now it's sold out Search for local, hipster flour mills near you and you might be surprised. If you're posting in this thread then you're definitely the type to enjoy playing around with that. An example: https://bartonspringsmill.com/collections/all-grains/products/rouge-de-bordeax-wheat?variant=16611412607066 These operations might be waiving shipping near where they are too.
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Mar 26, 2020 17:27
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Hopes Fall posted:Every single time I've tried a cold ferment it has failed. 0 lift and rock hard consistency, even on poo poo like pizza dough and overnight waffles. For whatever reason, the oven proof is the thing I've been halfway successful with, aside from the occasions that counter-proofing has worked because it was A. Uncomfortably warm in the house, or B. I was cooking/boiling water/creating lots of ambient heat at the same time anyway. Since Flash Gordon Ramsay brought this up, I thought about that a little too. Have you proofed the yeast to see how it's doing? How much salt are you adding as a percentage of the weight of the flour? How is the yeast introduced to the salt? Are you using tap or filtered water? I don't think you should have to resort to such heat to kick your yeast in the rear end. I've had my pizza dough rebel in the fridge when I was trying to slow it down. It gave no shits about that fridge. A normal thing for me would be: 160g type 00 flour per pizza I want to make 55% hydration so 88g (or ml) tap water. 65% hydration if I'm using TAM-105 type 00. 1% salt so, like, 1.6g salt. I think the pizza thread was talking about something like 3% salt and I just can't do it. It's just too much. 1% dried baking yeast (1.6g) Yeast is briefly hydrated in water but I don't have proofing concerns. salt is tossed into flour in mixing bowl and stirred. Water is all dumped to one side and then party time.
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Mar 26, 2020 21:01
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In the spirit of loving up, the coches showed up the other day ... and my wife gad them tossed into the washer. So now we're trying to stretch them back out and iron them in hopes of restoring them. Fortunately, I didn't start flouring them.
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Mar 26, 2020 21:03
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Today, I try to make baguettes according to the somebody who sounds like Winnie the Pooh: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m08i8oXpFB0 His ciabatta method has been highly successful so I have high hopes. Still, it's hard to take the videos seriously when I expect him to screw up at any time and exclaim, "Oh, bother!"
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Mar 27, 2020 17:59
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That Rouge de Bordeaux flour really does smell like cinnamon! I figured it was some faint note kind of thing but the inside of the bag smelled like cinnamon rolls.
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Mar 27, 2020 22:16
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I did make good bread, but I can't say I made baguettes. My wife really picked up the cinnamon in the final result so we're confused on what to really do with it. I thought the crumb was a little too regular. Like it was more like whole wheat with smaller, more regular bubbles. Oddly enough, I got nearly-perfect timings for the procedure and temperature with my wood-fired oven. The dough looked okay according to procedure but didn't have that nice, smooth, shiny taffy affect I was expecting. I actually don't think it was completely kneaded. The crust wasn't particularly tough so I see a future battle with steam. I was trying to use a dutch oven full of water. It definitely was steaming; I was getting a lot out of the smokestack. I just don't think that steam was reaching down to the oven floor and hitting the bread. I also got surprisingly low oven spring. The loaves are flat and wide. They didn't really bounce in the oven. I also had a failure with scoring. I had tried to use a double-edged safety razor blade and it didn't appear to cut deep enough. The bread basically cooked around the cuts and they disappeared. I felt the bread could have also been tougher. I intend to try again with a more conventional flour and a different cutting method. The steam situation is something I'll have to play with. It'll probably like smoking meat where I got insanely better results if I put the food in a pan suspended right under the chimney. Then it hits the convection stream and everything in it. This particular flour, however, will be serving a very important purpose in making cinnamon rolls and sweeter stuff. I wish I had used it for the kolaches. The coches helped a lot. No issues with sticking.
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Mar 28, 2020 07:17
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Thumposaurus posted:You need a way to keep the steam in. Commercial bread ovens have levers to pull to open the vent and let rhe steam out or you just open the door up when the lever inevitable breaks. What surprised me was I had less chew on the crust that I do when I make ciabatta, and I'm not doing anything in particular towards its crust. The dough is even less hydrated than the baguette (85% vs 65%).
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Mar 28, 2020 23:24
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mediaphage posted:You definitely need to keep the door shut, if you can without smoking out your fire (obvs I don’t know how your oven is built). If you could set them on a rack or cooling rack that’s sitting above a small pre-heated pan to pour your water into, I think you’d have better luck. Extra bit: I realized just now that I had also built the reveal between the front and the dome so that I could install a plug door for this kind of thing. I was going to make a plug with an atomizer so I could just run a garden hose in and have it mist like a motherfucker. My current door is at the very front so it's ahead of the flue.
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Mar 29, 2020 01:51
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I guess it's like using a baking cloche. I can see it.
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Mar 30, 2020 20:31
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Piss Meridian posted:I managed to source flour, I am now working on a sourdough starter*... I may have also blended some lentils into flour to stretch it out
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Mar 31, 2020 04:56
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This is kind of a far shot but I figure I'd still try: Do any of you have a suggestion for a misting nozzle that can take high temperatures? I want to use one in a plug door for my wood-fired oven. I want something that can help me inject some steam into the main chamber. I'm thinking it I need to be able to adjust it from outside and that it should generally use a slower flow rate. On the other hand, if there's a standard for this, I'm probably better of using that, but I'm ignorant of what is used in the normal baking trade. A dutch oven of boiling water might suffice with the plug installed but I'm totally cool with overkill here. It definitely wasn't enough without a plug. I will probably experiment with a cedar one soaked in water, but I know I'll eventually probably set it on fire.
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Apr 1, 2020 20:54
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I'm trying to improve my baguette technique (and flavor) from the John Kirkwood directions: https://profoodhomemade.com/beautiful-french-bagettes/ Basically: 75% hydration knead using a few "slap and folds" 4 times every 45 minutes. At the beginning he touts this whole method helps it develop its "distinct flavor" but I can't really see how that goes. I'm thinking I'd be better off hydrating a fraction of the dough a day before--possibly with a faint touch of yeast--and let it party a bit. Insert method of choice here. No, really. Is there a preference? The other thing is the result comes out with the gluten surprisingly being developed for how little kneading I have to do, but it hasn't hit that taffy-like texture I like to see when I'm doing other types of dough. Is this a thing with baguettes? Would I do better beating it up some more? I can just let the big mixer beat the piss out of it for awhile no-problem. I was thinking of just doing one knead cycle but I wonder if the texture is actually going to suffer. A final technicality: I was surprised that I couldn't slice my baguettes again with a safety razor blade. It's the second time I tried. The first time was with a different wheat and I had sprayed the form loaves first. I tried it with a more normal bread flour without spraying. I was surprised instead to find one of my knives doing the job.
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Apr 11, 2020 04:56
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Taima posted:Hey I just appreciate the advice of skilled artisans. In my mind, it's almost meaningless if I personally like the bread. I'm not in this to make ok bread that I like, I'm trying to make really, really good bread. That will take time and the advice of experts, as with any new hobby. I was trying to figure out how to retort constructively but you managed to say it better. Some things then: 1. Yes, that browning looks like something somebody would pay for. 2. Anything anybody says about the outside has to be compared to how it looked and tasted when you busted it open. I've had some great crusts that covered a Superfund site. 3. It looks like you could have scored it a little bit better since I'm seeing a scraggly bit on the right side that makes it look like it kind of burst apart. Some people love those little crusty love handles but I'm guessing you didn't mean to cause it. 4. If you're trying to make it more brown, consider switching to a dough that is more basic/alkaline. I thought you wrote that you were doing something acidic and that's going to make it tougher to make it more brown. That'll remove one thing from the problem you're worried about right now. 5. If you want specific feedback then you'll want to target a specific style of bread and talk among its enthusiasts. I'm saying this as somebody that doesn't tend to make artisan loaves much so I'm not God's gift to them or anything but I don't think I said anything out of my wheelhouse.
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Apr 11, 2020 07:10
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bartlebee posted:I used my kitchenaid mixer to make two separate single batches of dough. It kept resisting and the motor smelled like it was burning up a little. I checked it out afterwards and couldn’t figure out what was wrong since I’d done double batches of dough before for the full seven minutes and never had a problem and figured out I used the flat beater instead of the dough hook. Anybody think I’ve done permanent damage to the mixer? Kitchenaid mixers of the past few decades have been built by Whirlpool and aren't as robust as they used to be. My mother's Kitchenaid comes from around 1980 or so and is just now needing some new grease. It can knead just fine. Mine is an an entry-level, tilt-head model (Artisan?) from early 2000. I've had to replace the motor and it's been taken off of bread duty. I think people have some more luck with the more-expensive models, but I see a lot more complaints than anything. The entry-level models don't have anything like a transmission and pretty much just jack up the motor more and more as you increase the speed. I figured they were all like this, but I saw a few part diagrams that show at least some kind of gearing change in the better ones. I know my 20-quart Hobart from ancient times has a 3-speed mechanical transmission and it would crush my hand on speed 1 if the worm gear wasn't meant to grind itself out first as a safety. What I picked up from elsewhere is that there's a recommended cycle time when using the newer mixers. It's something like a 15-minute cycle of 5-on and 10-off. It might even by 5-on and 15-off; I didn't write it down while I was seeing it because I wasn't interested in that model. You can take a counterpoint to this from America's Test Kitchen who recommended the ~$650 model recently, but you'd be amused to see the YouTube discussion afterwards about that.
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Apr 14, 2020 22:14
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Having it smell a little isn't necessarily bad in a one-off thing but that'll probably kick its rear end if you keep doing it. I found out a little bit more. KitchenAid recommends only kneading at exactly speed 2. Here's their formal bit: https://producthelp.kitchenaid.com/Countertop_Appliances/Stand_Mixers/Mixer_Performance/Kneading_Times_and_Speeds_-_Stand_Mixer quote:
I saw somewhere else the normal duty cycle is 10 minutes on, 20 minutes off. I guess that's where the 5 minutes on, 10 minutes off comes from.
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Apr 15, 2020 06:13
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I'm not really in the sourdough game but I have an anecdote from the past few days. I made a poolish for some ciabatta Wednesday night and baked it Friday. I did not add yeast to the poolish. Come Friday morning, It looked like something had moved in and started a Fight Club after a rock band trashed the place. Lots of little bubbles, streaks, puddles, even some different colors. I was using some TAM-105 flour produced locally. I suspect trying to make a starter from a big-brand mix is going to be harder because I imagine those places are actively taking measures that would prevent crazy poo poo from happening because that risks big $$$ for them. Meanwhile, some local mill pulls some wheat in from some guy 45 miles away next to a pile of cow poo poo and you can see the individual flour granules moving on their own in your hand.
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Apr 18, 2020 17:38
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Has anybody experimented with the the tangzhong technique? It's where you cook some of the flour with liquid like you're making a roux paste before mixing it with the rest of the ingredients. I only did it recently with some cinnamon rolls, and we were reheating them anyways. I may have gotten a little more time out of them regardless. I'm curious how well it has extended the life on your bread.
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Apr 24, 2020 17:23
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SymmetryrtemmyS posted:dough conditioner Edit: I don't need anything to help me work the dough and get the gluten going. I got... equipment for that.
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Apr 26, 2020 19:39
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Chard posted:does anyone have a good quote:Table salt (sodium chloride) used in dough must contain small quantities of calcium and magnesium salts and its solution should be clear with no insoluable deposits (figure 16). The whole book is pretty much like that, by the way. Also, this isn't the pizza thread, but I have to still go off that I'm stuck around 1% salt to flour weight, not dough weight. I did 3% once like all the hipsters and oh my loving God why. So I take that salt recommendation... with a grain of salt. Nonetheless, the stuff about gluten is interesting and we all learned something today!
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Apr 30, 2020 06:50
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explanation of what salt does to the dough's structure? as i was working it i noticed it blew up enormously during the first rise, like triple to quadruple in size, and then felt way too soft as i was trying to move it to my "banneton" (colander)/the oven.
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Is anybody else in here playing with soy lecithin now? I used about 1% in separate pizza, baguette, and kolache doughs. The problem is each of those doughs had different flours so I can't completely tell what did what quite yet. The pizza dough came out especially well, but I also had added some oil this time. I'm shifting from a Neapolitan dough to a New York pizza dough despite still use Italian type 00 flour. My wife thought it was the best pizza I ever made, and I've made hundreds over the decade between two different ovens. She definitely prefer New York pizza to Neapolitan. The kolache dough was spectacular. It was very puffy and soft. I don't know how authentic that is but it made for a fantastic dessert. I don't know if the soy lecithin did anything for that because it's a completely new flour to me. I was using the Sonora flour from Barton Springs Mill. It has very little gluten. I think I once got this flour on accident from a local supermarket and made some comical pizzas from it. For kolaches, it's spectacular. It was another home run. Given the softness of everything so far, I was surprised my baguette still had that teeth-pulling chew. So I'm guessing lecithin by itself won't turn everything puffy-soft like generic supermarket bakery bread. I consider this a good thing; I was afraid that bread would lose it's spunk. I suppose I'll know in a few days if the lecithin does anything to stave off staleness. Edit: It's Sonora flour, not Sonoma flour. Rocko Bonaparte fucked around with this message at 07:50 on May 12, 2020 |
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May 9, 2020 05:43
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| # ¿ Apr 29, 2024 13:34 |
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[Pops into bread thread to ask about making a DIY lame. Scrolls thread. Closes browser. Sits in dark room.]
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May 11, 2020 18:22
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