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Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

A big flaming stink posted:

not to mention the "what the hell is up with Spender" plots

not to mention the "what the hell is up with Mayview" plots

not to mention the "what the hell is up Boss Leader et al" plots

not to mention the "what the hell is up with doorman/angel voice/forge" plots

not to mention the "what WHAT Max has a secret possession" that we're 1 1/2 months out of the 4 year anniversary of it's intro page.

jesus christ

If Zack wants to tell a jokeman crazyface comic he has to stop making his plots unfold like a reverse boredom matryoshka doll
If you want to see what happens to your comic if you just keep rolling out new characters and subplots with hardly any resolution for many many years, then take a look at Girl Genius.

Not to say that Paranatural is even close to that yet, but it is something you have to rein in.

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Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Falstaff posted:

Pretty sure Zack has said that there's never going to be any romance in the comic, so if she's got a crush on Max it's a one-sided thing that'll be played for laughs.
Are you sure he didn't mean between the kids? Because there's already something going on with Day and Zarei.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Tetracube posted:

It's baffling to me that people can be in webcomics, spend 10 hours slaving over each individual page for virtually no benefit, on a project they know will take many, many years, and then end up with "too little happening in too many pages" as a problem.
It probably doesn't seem that bad when you're in the thick of it, and I imagine there's an eagerness to show off a cool character or concept you came up with. You don't want to wait a year+ for this neat idea rolling in your head, so it gets kinda awkwardly crammed into the current chapter.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Kikas posted:

Huh. wait. If Mr Garcia does in fact work for the Cousinhood, then Isaac will have no second thoughts on joining in. I mean the Consortium banned him for life and they won't tell him why, and he'll definately see it as a way to get back and Spender and Max.
They don't seem like the type that would recruit literal children teenagers to join their ranks, although I could seem a future plot thread where Isaac is made to spy/sabotage the Consortium in exchange for the information he's not getting.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

So the shadow spirit that Spender is holding, I assume Lucifer just keeps weakening it so it can never fully regenerate and leave Spender (which is why it got loose when Spender did the fusion).

But my real question is how the spirit is affecting Spender's physical appearance, much like how Catnine alters Isaac's hair. Does Spender somehow look even more like a dork?

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Tenebrais posted:

It took me a moment to realise Dimitri has orange spectral energy and it's not just burning shonen spirit.

And I'm still not 100% sure it isn't.
Now I want his spirit to be some weird spirit version of Goku, complete with orange gi.

Naturally it'd be an overexcitable dork that clashes with Dimitri's cool guy persona.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

I am curious as to why Dimitri isn’t in the club, since we’ve had plenty of hints about a whole group of kids who are aware of spirit stuff but aren’t down with Spender.

Or maybe he IS in the club, and his role is to maintain their secrecy :tinfoil: Which is why he doesn’t like getting involved in their poo poo so he can’t be seen as weird and in on it.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Maybe for some reason he can't utilize energy anymore like spectrals can, but can still see spirits.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

I know this chapter is ridiculously long, but it still blows my mind when I realize it'll be four years this December.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Rand Brittain posted:

I guess when you get right down to it, "I left the student council because everybody else was a putz" isn't actually incompatible with being the head of the student council.
He never left. He's an active member, but finds it embarrassingly dramatic now.

The most likely breakdown is that Cody became President, a number of council members got weird about it, and now the Vice Principal takes advantage of it by faking orders from Cody. Again, this is all very stupid and Cody just wants to do bake sales and set up school dances.

Also, being half-vampire doesn't mean you're automatically a spectral (or at least can see spirits like a monster can). It'd explain his hitball skills and why he can't see Hijack.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

This is kinda where I hope it goes. It's an opportunity for Cody to be a spectral which, given that he's aware of spirits, may be something he wants/needs.

It also follows dad's command.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Roland Jones posted:

Yeah, I was going to say, Nin (the ninja rabbit spirit) is her own ninja army.
It just occurred to me the whole rabbit and multiplying power connection.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Half of cody will be possessed by hijack, giving him the power to make people seriously consider doing what he says.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Motherfucker posted:

I mean how are you people missing the clowns and sudden abundance of creepy childrens toys?



Peekaboo is clearly a dead kid.
I don’t think ghosts (actual dead humans as opposed to spirits) can possess stuff. Otherwise PJ could just possess a tool instead of looking to wield one.

But given Paranatural, it’ll probably be some secret/hard/immoral thing ghosts can do, and it will explain very old ghosts or Max’s Mom will possess a tool/him at a critical moment for MOTHER/SON TEAM UP FIGHT.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

I do think some of these younger artists would be better served doing smaller projects with a very clear scope of how it's going to play out.

These monolithic stories are great, but it consumes you utterly and seems to get unhealthy very quickly. Hussie was literally spending every waking hour on Homestuck (although to be fair he did start with Problem Sleuth), and Zack of course has the wrist issues. It gets even worse because fans get very invested in the story, adding another potentially toxic element to the whole thing. It's bad enough that some not-insignificant portion of Zack's livelihood depends upon Paranatural being updates, but there's likely a decent chunk of lovely people that give them grief every time an update is missed. poo poo, even if there isn't, you still likely feel bad whenever you miss an update, regardless of how nice people are about it.

I recall ggdg from Cucumber Quest saying she regrets her first independent project being CQ because it's consumes so much of her time. And, not surprisingly, CQ has been on a hiatus all summer long. It was started up the same month as Paranatural, and is maybe halfway through the story. I'd just hate to see extremely talented people get burned out on stuff like this.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Drunk Theory posted:

Likely. And as interesting as this all is I haft wonder if conspiracy kid needs an arc. We have so many existing plot threads, and a huge cast already. But oh well, this is not a new complaint.

And I am still not sure if the Prof here is an actual Bigfoot, or a guy in a costume, or just a represenation of his radio name
I think it’s showing the hosts as they really are, instead of the branding.

Mothman is unshaven, disheveled, and his “antenna” are broken. The reveal here is that Bigfoot is...actually a Bigfoot. He’s very likely a Medium with some kind of Sasquatch spirit (remember that Mediums slowly take on their spirit’s appearance). Bigfoot can’t be a spirit, since Stephen has been shown to NOT be a Spectral, and therefore would be incapable of hearing him. Also it means the radio show would have been one Mothman talking to himself for most of the airtime.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Davy can manipulate the environment which explains how he can squeeze into the mask, it’s perfect

Also he mentions to Hijack how he likes his town quiet and safe, which is a very cop thing to say. Further shown when he mentions to his son the peace he keeps for him. Make more sense when you’re a cop!

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

A bit worried about their wrist at this point. Switching to a weekly update schedule, multiple breaks for the holidays, and they already have to take a break a week after returning from holiday.

Obviously they have more obligations besides Paranatural, but they’ve changed the schedule twice now, and it doesn’t seem to be helping :ohdear:

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

I still love the absurdity of a guy who works in-costume for his radio show.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

If Wights almost instantly come from the brink when they’re killed, then how did Boss Leader become a medium for Sandman? The whole point is to feed off spectral energy to regain their strength, to the point where Eightfold had to off herself to go back into the tool.

Somehow this thing had to have been taken down in an area practically devoid of anything it could feed off of, and I imagine that includes spectrals.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Tired of hearing about her ghostly father-in-law, Amy chugged orange juice until she could finally see him.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

I totally thought it was backwards, and Amy had died and that’s why Grandpa was her daughter’s caretaker. Which is incredibly stupid since Spectrals can see ghosts :doh:

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

There is an update!

Also, Guerra being a ghost explains his disdain for tools to some degree, knowing what we know about their hypothetical effects on ghosts if one were to use such.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

I only just this month realized Scabs was taking advantage of Isabel’s fear of dogs instead of just using a really sick spectral form because it’s the most anime thing to do.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Honestly, if Davy is on the police force he may have a hand on suppressing things like that.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Tenebrais posted:

No Penny, huh?
Yeah, I was wondering if she is just that much younger since it’s still using a photo of Spender as a kid. Or if she was disowned even earlier. Bonus points if they’re BOTH gay.

Gonna guess mom’s name is Nichol.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

He does seem like the kind of guy to have another kid just for poll numbers

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Isn’t Ritz non-binary, or was it just implied but not yet confirmed?

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Xand_Man posted:

:negative: But Spender puns :negative:
I was trying to think of something with Penny Slugs, as in pre-transition Penny is fake. Slugworth Spender? Maybe Bill is a big Charlie & the Chocolate Factory fan.

But yeah, it’s likely going to be a lot of “Son” “Sport” and other nicknames. Zack doesn’t seem like the person to make that (completely unnecessary) reveal. It also will reinforce the Spenders very fake family relations.


I seriously put in [/spender] at first to end the spoilers :negative:

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Xand_Man posted:

She is committing crimes in her reintroduction

I guess that makes her a Bad Penny
It also explains how she was able to steal the lantern!

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

rannum posted:

Some people start working in High School so if they're about the same age that'd still work.


Probably both disowned but I do wonder how much money they still have access to considering giancarlo was probably not purchased on a teacher's salary. Maybe they still had their own stupid large bank accounts.
As someone disowned for being queer from a well-to-do family, bribes are very common. Sometimes “be ‘normal’ and we’ll get you more stuff” and other times “enjoying stuff? We’re so nice, aren’t we? Isn’t stuff proof of our love? All we want is for you to stop being queer. It’d be a shame if you stop getting stuff.”

Wealthy parents are...not good at understanding what it means to love someone.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

The parents that want to disown their son over being gay, the one concerned with presenting the image of a Perfect Nuclear Family...would definitely be okay with their daughter wearing boy clothes at a gala.

Also calling her the “future” Penny Spender, to really make a point of it.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

I wonder if even knows about Penny. If he was cut off early enough, he may have never known a out her transition.

Basically, I want another Awkward Spender Moment where he treats Penny like a stranger.

EDIT: Read a comment that, even as a child, Ritz wants to be a jerk to dogs.

Pants Donkey fucked around with this message at 18:55 on Mar 12, 2021

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Fecha posted:

I do love the headcanon that the Spenders are actually fine with Rick's monster boyfriend and disowned him purely because he's such a huge dork.
They are actually super leftist but can’t tolerate how much of a dang nerd Rich is, and they accepted Penny without problem because she’s super cool :unsmith:

(their dealings and Davy and Bill’s gaudy gala package imply this will not be the case, but we can dream)

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

RareAcumen posted:

This is the impression I got as well and I'm such a moron that I swear the text under the comic was just 'Thanks for Reading!' when I looked at it first.

Personally I can't wait till these girls taking selfies become the main focus of the plot for 3 months. They look cool.


https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-5-page-154
Aren’t those three girls a shoutout to an Aevee Bee game? I mean they look like the kind of disaster kids to be in one.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

This month is the ten year anniversary

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

I had a feeling this was inevitable when even a weekly comic was proving impossible to maintain. This happens a lot, where the artist is young and their first major project is an ambitious webcomic that is poorly plotted out in advance and thus takes years to get anywhere in the overarching plot. Cucumber Quest is probably one of the higher profile examples of this. The major difference being ggdg just didn’t want to spend the prime years of her career sucked entirely into another decade on this comic she came up with as a kid, whereas Zack’s spirit to finish seems to be strong, but the flesh human and thus weak. Which is definitely tragic for them, as I know they’d prefer the proper comic treatment they intended.

Just look at Gunnerkrigg Court, which seems like it does have some kind of plan to ultimately end, and yet Tom Sidell just passed the 15th year working on this thing. And a good chunk of those 15 years it was his full-time job, and he maintained a near-perfect three page a week schedule throughout. These webcomics either demand the kind of extremely short and self-contained story most young artists aren’t interested in, or turning into Andrew Hussie if you want to see it completed in a reasonable time frame. It sucks, but turns out writing and drawing a complete graphic novel entirely on your own is hard and time-consuming.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Some comics get there. Monster Pulse, O Human Star, Homestuck, etc. It’s rare, but it happens.

Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

Oxxidation posted:

the smartest thing to do would be to just pull the plug on paranatural and move on to gag-a-day or something, but zack's probably still too deep in sunk cost to consider that
Getting bi-monthly Lupin goof comics whenever their wrist is up to it would soothe our loss.

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Pants Donkey
Nov 13, 2011

A Sometimes Food posted:

Yeah between this and my patience with Gunnerkrigg finally being up Im down to uh

K6BD and Sleepless Domain. And K6BD is on approach for ending by the end of next year by all indications.
K6BD ending feels like a more recent decision. I definitely get the reason for it, because having the story play out the way you’d imagine would be, well, like Paranatural or Cucumber Quest where it’s entering year 15 with no end in sight. But it doesn’t feel paced that way, which is why I’m assuming they only relatively recently decided, “Yeah, let’s cut the cord early and move on.”

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