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SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
I'm pretty sure that Dol Amroth is a city on par with Minas Tirith, if only because MT has seriously declined since its better days.

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SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
People used to call things "blue" when it's like dude that's not blue that's really dark grey or something.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Probs; if you can get your hands on Atlas of Middle Earth or whatever it's called it even talks about fault lines and poo poo and it's cool.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
He is saruman the White and the Wizards are the "Hand" of the Valar in middle earth. There is no explanation given in The Two Towers as far as I can find, so that's the closest Id imagine there is.

SHISHKABOB fucked around with this message at 19:49 on Mar 12, 2015

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
I hope not! Also I don't think so. They went bye bye in the east.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
I'm sure if one monstrous entity was formed from nothing then another one could. Like the watcher in the water, where did that come from WHO KNOWS!

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Sounds like they had a good time.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

euphronius posted:

No. Evil's main essential characteristic is the desire to control and create.

Yes but also what heiermosntomsyalloy said is true.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

Thunder Moose posted:

I would say that both dark lords lacked in wisdom what they had in raw intellect, yes. I always wondered what they thought their end game with Eru was - they both knew the true measure of their innate power to that of Eru surely?

Side note - rereading the Moria chapters today and several thoughts came into my mind.

1) When Gandalf confronts the Balrog and reveals that he is a "...servant of the secret fire, wielder of the flame of Anor." are these both references to Eru's light from which all creation comes, or is the second a reference to his hidden ring of fire? If the ring, why on earth would he tell the Balrog he has it?

2) Anyone care to settle the size dispute of the Balrog? I have heard it said that he was not much larger than a man but it is described as "man shaped, but greater" so I have always imagined it similar to what Jackson envisioned.

Balrogs are a man and a half. If you look carefully at the scene in fellowship it's actually pretty much a man and a half tall. I mean, it's hunched over but that's how they always are so its ok.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Who cares if someone else writes about it, it won't matter what they write cause they ain't Tolkien.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Terry brooks poo poo wasn't TOO similar, it was just his first book really.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Haha, fairly similar series?

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

i81icu812 posted:

Both authors had one major genera-defining literary success, an epic spanning multiple books, received to great acclaim in the 60's. Both die with a few years of each other and their estates falls to sons. One son curates the The Silmarillion, The Children of Húrin, Unfinished Tales, etc. The other cedes creative control to Kevin J Anderson to churn out a book a year and leaves his father's notes moldering in an university archive.

Oh ok yeah, in those ways they are similar.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
He also talks about things that burrow deep underground. The worms were awesome, though it was a little weird that they disappeared completely without another mention...

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

The Belgian posted:

I've been reading LotR again, and it seems like the breaching fire that Saruman uses at Helm's Deep is a cannon? Especially as it is fired at aragorn the second time it's used. So not a big bomb carried to the wall.

Am i correct* in this?

*As in, it's a commonly accepted interpretation.

I just read it and I think that's reasonable. In that part, it says that the archway above where Aragorn had been standing crumbled with the thunder and fire.

As an aside, I really like the part where Aragorn is standing on the wall talking to the orcs mostly because of the way the uruk-hai talk as one. It's one of the scenes that I remember most vividly from my first reading of the story when I was like ten. And now I see how it fits perfectly with the ideas and stories that influenced Tolkien.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

Hogge Wild posted:

What makes that funny was the fact that he was a signals officer.

And why he made a career out of that oh wait

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
He doesn't say they're worse he just says that there are nameless things in the depths of the earth that not even Sauron knows of. That means some algae or fish for all we know. Though he did say that they bored tunnels down there.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
More like Gandalf doesn't want to make them feel bad by telling them all about the deep dark tunnels that he had to run through.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

Ravenfood posted:

"In that despair my enemy was my only hope" doesn't really make it seem like its a nice place. And I didn't think the Balrog lived in those caves either, since the Balrog flees twice in that passage: once from Gandalf into the dark deep places, and once from there back to Khazad-dum.

There's a million times in lotr where darkness loneliness etc are bad. There don't need to be wacky scary monsters for Gandalf to not want to talk about a place that was the utter opposite of his longtime home and everything he wants to save.

And the balrog was running from Gandalf, duh

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Sun and the moon I guess.

Speaking of the moon, it's one of my favorite stories in the Silmarillion.

"Daddy why is the sun a perfect circle but the moon is so blemished?"

"Because ten thousand years ago an evil powerful dark lord tried to gently caress with it and got trounced, so it's covered in scars."

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
He writes it like a fantasy elf guy would describe tanks and artillery if I recall correctly. More emphasis on the fire and steel armor/hides of the dragons.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
It's a hella good book, my dad isn't even into reading very much and he's adored it ever since he was a little kid.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Off the top of my head I can't think of any Maia children.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Luthien is also not a Maia and is never referenced as half-Maia as other people are with mixed ancestry. So I think it's more of her mom's un-maianess that allowed it. Like how Arwen gives up her elfness.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
His scars were from fighting dragons from the north. He says something like "you're not the only one who knows the threat of dragons" as he flashes the scars.

And the dragons came from who know where. Big wormy things. Then he put wings on them.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

Octy posted:

I understand there's a theory that dragons are similar to Balrogs in being Maiar. I just assumed they were a corrupted form of eagles when I was younger, though, but I don't know if Tolkien ever said anything about that.

Some sort of powerful spirit, definitely.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

Smoking Crow posted:

Prancing Pony

Dang son, just skip around and read the bits you like.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

HIJK posted:

Feanor is not a particularly great or heroic figure and his big character flaw is hubris. Well earned hubris and it lead him to do many great (terrible) things but man, what a price huh?

That being said I never liked how the Valar handled that situation. I don't like how they handled any part of the elves. The Valar are shitheads.

They really are. They always seemed to me to be a bunch of pretty dimwitted, slow guys who got assigned a really important job and they know they need to do a good job, and they know it's super important so they hold themselves with dignity, etc. But they're complete idiots and whenever a hard decision comes along they're all "hmmm" rubbing their chins trying to look like they're weighing the options like Solomon but really they're like "gently caress gently caress gently caress what the gently caress do I do with my gameboy- wait what did feanor want again". Or at least the male valar. Lorien and Yavanna were cool.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Aule's the kid playing with legos, or the train set. Dad walks over and says "this is bad, why did you do this" and Aule is :((((((

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

Ynglaur posted:

Ahem: Galadriel. :colbert:

Galadriel doesn't really... do... much. :/

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
That gives me a new perspective on the theme of decay that's throughout lotr.


Also: men led to the destruction of numenor, and dwarves led to the desolation of Smaug. But clearly not as devastating as what happened cause of the silmarils.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
I don't remember how important Aragorn's sword was in regards to his kingship or whatever. I remember that they reforge it in Rivendell before "the ring goes south" and he stops calling himself strider and takes on Aragorn fully. But it wasn't a super big deal like how getting Excalibur made Arthur the king. It was important, but not defining. So I guess that answers my question.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

euphronius posted:

When was this. After the fall of Gondolin right?

Oh spoilers. Gondolin gets wrecked.

It was at like the way end I thought, after Morgoth got boned.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Doesn't bother me, cause I'm not a loving nerd :smug:

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
Umbrellas didn't exist in Britain until I don't know when, and lotr is a mythology of Britain.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

Levitate posted:

we could also probably enjoy some dope rear end books and not jerk off about the few anachronisms the author left in them (though I'm sure this thread is down with that)

What is with this attitude?

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe

Ynglaur posted:

Wait, wasn't the writing on the inside of the Ring? This picture may be tricksy...

Sauron couldn't show it off it it was on the inside!

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
A lot of them I straight recognized like finarfin, celeborn, etc. but yeah fuckin Imin that one got me.

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
There would be so much made up stuff in a silmarillion movie and that would be perfect.

HIJK posted:

The Silmarillion mostly deals with abstract concepts like the Valar creating the earth along with Eru. Even if that could get put down there's a lot of religious packaging to go along with it. I'm not sure that any studio today could portray that well.

It's all western Christian stuff so I think it'd work out fine.

SHISHKABOB fucked around with this message at 15:16 on Aug 22, 2016

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SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
There's only one God in lotr.

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