The Palladium Megaverse Gigathread

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Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

The Tale of Palladium Books

Palladium Books is one of the oldest companies in the RPG industry still under the control of its founder, Kevin Siembieda, giving it very few peers*. When it was founded, games like Dungeons & Dragons and Champions ruled the roost. Chaosium had just put out Basic Role-Playing, the first generic system, and Games Workshop had just founded Citadel Miniatures. But before we even get to that part...

Back in 1969 or 1970, middle school nerds Kevin Siembieda and Alex Marciniszyn printed a "mimeographed monstrosity" fanzine named Megaton. Later, in 1973, they would revive the Megaton name under Megaton Publications** to publish their sci-fi and comic fanzines like Nightspawn and A+ Plus. In 1979, Siembieda was introduced to Dungeons & Dragons by fellow nerd Julius Rosenstein, and began working on his own settings and rules some time hereafter. Already used to self-publishing, the idea of making his own game seemed natural. Siembieda also submitted art to a number of companies, and was published in a wide variety of RPG publications.

Armed with $3,000, half of which was borrowed from a friend's mother, Siembieda founded Palladium Books with its first publication, Mechanoid Invasion, which dealt with a space colony being invaded by robotic aliens, inspired by recent science fiction like Star Wars. It and its two supplements (Journey and Homeworld) are pretty profound in having one of the first metaplots in an RPG, beginning with the initial invasion and ending with the defeat of the mechanoids in Homeworld. At this point, however, Palladium was really a small-time publisher, and Siembieda continued to build capital by producing sourcebooks on weapons, armor, and castles, which were intentionally system-agnostic (but functionally designed for Dungeons & Dragons and its derivatives). These generic supplements were small-press hits, selling around 100,000 copies apiece, and pushing Palladium Books towards becoming a much larger publisher.

Siembieda's hard work modifying the Dungeons & Dragons game for his "Defilers" campaign would be published in 1983 as the The Palladium Role-Playing Game, and it was the first full game that really established Palladium as an RPG company. Compared to Mechanoid Invasion, it was a more conventional Dungeons & Dragons "heartbreaker", though with some more unusual races (like the self-explanatory wolfen and changelings), magic classes that used different magic systems, and having one of the first detailed fantasy game settings. Though the Palladium system is now generally derided for its mechanics, it's important to bear in mind when it was released, The Palladium RPG had yet to develop much of the cruft that would later plague Palladium's house system, and so stands up better than one might expect.

Their first big hit wouldn't be until 1985, however, with the publication of Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Other Strangeness. A licensed game about anthropomorphic animal vigilantes (it was a thing), it was based on the original Turtles comics. It preceded the Turtles cartoon by two years, and is notable for launching the career of long-time Palladium contributor Erick Wujcik, as well as featuring original art by Turtle creators Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird. It's also memorable for being one of the first games to truly cement the "copy-paste" nature of the Palladium house system, borrowing rules heavily from the earlier Heroes Unlimited, their superhero game.

Palladium's luck with licensed properties would continue in 1986 with the Robotech RPG, written by Siembieda, based off various Japanese robot cartoons adapted to American TV in 1985. Kevin Long would provide striking art of the Robotech giant robot suits, though would also run into plagiarism accusations that would follow him until the end of his work with Palladium Books. It would also produce some of Palladium's more infamous game systems, like "Mega-Damage", a means of simulating the higher damage scales of giant robots, and overly complex missile rules inspired by the missile swarms of the original cartoon.

Rifts, released in 1990, would change Palladium's fortunes forever. Rifts was a culmination and combination of every game Palladium had released at that point. It had magic rules from The Palladium RPG, psionic and horror rules from Beyond the Supernatural, giant robot and occupation rules from the Robotech RPG, post-humans from Heroes Unlimited, and even mutant dogs from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Other Strangeness. Siembieda wrote it, and artist Kevin Long's toyetic robot and armor designs stood out as distinct for their time. It also provided power levels rarely found in RPGs, where characters carried pistols that could atomize buildings or cast tank-melting fireballs.

While it was not the first broad multi-genre RPG***, it is perhaps the most successful one. It has continued to be supported for the past 20 years, and has gotten an "Ultimate Edition" as well as scores of supplements. Though Palladium has produced new games since Rifts, none have gotten anywhere close to its success. For better or worse, Palladium Books lives in the shadow of its most successful creation, and the majority of their output as of 2013 still largely consists of Rifts and its tie-ins.

_{* As far as founder-run companies Steve Jackson Games predates it by a year. Flying Buffalo is the real dino, predating both by half a decade, but is a far smaller developer.

** No apparent relation to the later Megaton Publications that launched the career of comic artists like Erik Larsen, Rob Liefeld, Gary Carlson, etc.

*** Worlds of Wonder (1982) and Lords of Creation (1983) predated Rifts by nearly a decade. Torg (1990) was released earlier the same year, though it didn't enjoy the same long-term success as Rifts.}

Palladium's Famous Bouts

As is inevitable with any company of its age, Palladium Books has various notable legal and personal conflicts. However, Palladium Books has a reputation for being particularly fractious, and its most famous bouts are chronicled here.

Palladium vs. Time: Though publishing late books is far from unusual in the same industry, Palladium is particularly famous for announcing books that are published late, hardly resemble the promised product, or never materialize at all. It's as if Siembieda is inclined to mention any passing whim for a book as an upcoming product, and only more recently has begun filtering himself. A lot more detail on late books and publishing woes involving Palladium Books is available at Kevin Siembieda: J'ACCUSE...! maintained by rpg.net's Geshbourn.

Winner: Time
Loser: Palladium Books

Palladium vs. White Wolf Magazine: In 1990, Kevin Siembieda sent a letter to White Wolf Magazine, accusing it of not covering "small-press" publishers like Palladium. They published two such letters from Kevin, and explained that their coverage was dependent on submissions received, and that they had never received submissions for Palladium material. A Rifts adventure was sent by a writer, however, and White Wolf Magazine agreed to publish it. However, Palladium immediately sent a C&D letter, threatening to sue White Wolf Magazine if the article was published. Confused, White Wolf Magazine pulled the article from their next issue, and avoided attempting to publish any Palladium-based articles thereafter.

Loser: White Wolf Magazine
Loser: Palladium Books

Palladium vs. Wizards of the Coast: In 1992, Wizards of the Coast would start working a book entitled The Primal Order, a book on deities in RPGs that would contain rule conversions. Though they were certainly aware of the potential legal issues, Wizards of the Coast went ahead and published without seeking permission for any of their conversions. Palladium Books, in turn, sued Wizards of the Coast. Though they went to settle, Siembieda sought an admission of guilt, something Wizards of the Coast could not agree to (since that would make them potentially liable for every conversion in The Primal Order). Though Wizards of the Coast was able to settle for a large sum of money instead, they were nearly put out of business by the lawsuit, and only a little product called Magic: the Gathering would later pull them out of their dire financial straits.

There's history more on the lawsuit by Shannon Appelcline here or by Rick Marshall here. Oh, and Palladium FAQ maintainer Stan Bundy said: "The seriousness of these events exists only in the minds of a few crazed WotC fanatics", so maybe it's not such a big deal after all.

Winner: Palladium Books
Loser: Wizards of the Coast (but cardboard gold healed those wounds)

Palladium vs. Todd McFarlane: After publishing Nightspawn in 1995 (a thinly-disguised adaptation of Clive Barker's Nightbreed), Todd McFarlane threatened a lawsuit due to a superficial similarity with his comic and media franchise (well, it was back then) Spawn. Though Palladium Books believed they could win a lawsuit (given the publication of "Nightspawn" in 1973), the estimated legal costs were too high to consider. Palladium Books complied, and future printings would instead use the title "Nightbane" instead.

Winner: Todd McFarlane
Loser: Palladium Books

Palladium vs. Players: Palladium is also well-known for sending cease & desist letters to fanzines and websites that use any element of Palladium Books' output, particularly for conversions (no doubt encouraged by the above lawsuit), adaptations, or original work. I've never seen one of these purported letters, but here's a few testimonials. Got others? Share!

Winner: Palladium Books
Loser: Players

Palladium vs. Freelancers: In 2002, Bill Coffin, a freelancer for Palladium Books, wrote a long diatribe at rpg.net detailing his "creative differences" with Kevin Siembieda. Steve Conan Trustrum and CJ Carella, other former freelancers, had already joined in the chorus, concurring that the situation at Palladium Books was fairly dysfunctional and having found writing for Palladium quite frustrating. The result was quite a bit of bad publicity for Palladium Books, even though Bill Coffin would later apologize for his words.

Winner: Freelancers (sorta)
Loser: Palladium Books

Palladium vs. Palladium: In 2006, Palladium revealed that it was the victim of embezzlement by long-time employee Steve Sheiring, Palladium Books employee and contributor from 2002 to 2004 to the tune of around a million dollars, and as a result the company was in dire financial straits. By holding his hat out to fans in a variety of ways, Siembieda was able to recoup enough money to keep the business afloat, and would refer to it as the "Crisis of Treachery" to put the onus of blame strictly on on Sheiring. The idea that long-term mismanagement may have contributed to the issue is, of course, ridiculous and need not be considered any further. Kevin's official comments on the matter can be found here. More on this at Wikipedia.

Winner: Palladium Books
Loser: Palladium Books

Palladium vs. Trion Worlds: In 2010, Palladium Books got legal again when they went after Trion Worlds and their MMO Rift: Planes of Telara, which, to be fair, does include rifts. https://www.livingdice.com got the legal docs, listed below:

The lawsuit was ended later that year to go to a settlement. The details of that settlement aren't public, but there are some clues. First, Rift: Planes of Telara shifted its name to plain ol' Rift and Palladium Books suddenly managed to shift a good number of reprints at the printer. It seems Trion Worlds most likely provided restitution for legal considerations on the part of Palladium Books.

Winner (seemingly): Palladium Books
Loser (seemingly): Trion Worlds

Kevin Siembieda wrote a lengthy post in 2004 rebutting or acknowledging a number of issues above (lateness, Coffin, etc.). And here's a more more recent interview explaining some things from 2009.

Other Fine Palladium Games

Not all Palladium games have been huge megaversal hits; here are some of the games that aren't Rifts.

Valley of the Pharaohs (1983): Perhaps the most obscure Palladium game, this is a boxed historical game set in Egypt written by Matthew Balent. Its ruleset differs from later Palladium material.
Heroes Unlimited (1984): A broad, if inflexible, clunky, and deeply flawed superhero game. The best thing that can be said for it is it has the most fun random superhero tables in the biz.
After the Bomb (1986): An alternate setting for Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Other Strangeness where post-apocalypse animals mutate into anthropomorphics* and fight fascist human holdouts. It became its own line of supplements and eventually a standalone game; it was a thing.
Revised Recon (1986): Originally published by RPG, Inc. in 1981, this is a game largely centered around a thinly-veiled version of the Vietnam War (though it has nods towards mercenary campaigns as well). Notable for being the only Palladium game with a completely divergent system that largely relies on percentile dice. Originally written by Joe F. Martin, and later revised by Erick Wujcik.
Beyond the Supernatural (1987): Investigative horror with occultism, psychic powers, and monsters that are often more bizarre or goofy than scary. Can be seen as a setting precursor to Rifts.
Ninjas & Superspies (1988): Martial arts and James Bonds with cyber-fingers that are actually bullets. Hint: the ninjas loving win the poo poo out of this game, as illustrated on the cover. Usually just mined to give the other games martial arts rules. Written by Erick Wujcik.
Macross II (1993): Once out of Robotech material, Palladium produced a new game for Japanese sequel Macross II. It was true to its source material in that it felt entirely unessential.
Nightbane (1995): Ever see Nightbreed? Of course you did. This is like that, only it has a different name. Better than it sounds, but still hobbled by the Palladium ruleset. Created by CJ Carella.
The Rifter (1998): Not a game per se, but a house magazine that continues to be published regularly to this day, as well as being a "clearing house" for new writers and artists, and really has helped the company in that it's provided a means to vet and hire new freelance talent. A Palladium anomaly in that it's published like clockwork four times a year. One of the very few single-system magazines still being published in 2013.
Systems Failure (1999): A post-apocalypse game where giant bugs that can travel through power lines wreak havoc on Earth. This Y2K-inspired setting will, of course, be eternally dated at this point.
Rifts Chaos Earth (2003): An alternate take on Rifts where humanity survives in a more intact fashion to fight back just after the apocalypse in enclaves. Takes place right after the cataclysm. Mostly like Rifts, except your character remembers what fast food was like.
Splicers (2004): Another post-apocalypse game (yeesh) by Carmen Bellaire where sinister AIs and nanotech have destroyed or subverted all conventional technology, and it's time to fight back with gross biotech. Eat stomach bile, robots!
Dead Reign (2008): Post-apocalypse zombie horror; think the mutant zombies from Left 4 Dead taken to absurd levels. Like having two zombies mashed into each other to run a three-legged race against you. Scary!
Robotech: Shadow Chronicles (2008): Based on the movie of the same name, this was essentially a reboot of the Robotech RPG line, featuring notably updated rules and material, and came in a controversial (amongst fans) "manga-sized" digest format.
Robotech RPG Tactics (2013): Perhaps the first Palladium production to not be an RPG (despite the puzzling "RPG" in the name), this is a Robotech miniatures wargame developed by Ninja Division. Or, at least, I'm assuming so; none of the design or production resembles Palladium Books in the slightest, aside from the use of some Robotech RPG art.

_{* That's an old-timey term for "furries".}

The Faces of Palladium

Here's a listing of the most notable employees and writers for Palladium Books. You'll notice many of them boil down to his old gaming group from the late 70s and early 80s; it is a "family business" in that sense.

Kevin Henry Siembieda: The sole owner of Palladium Books, Kevin is considered synonymous with his company as far as most of the gaming industry is concerned. However, it's often forgotten that he got his start as an illustrator, having graduated from the College for Creative Studies. He did art for various products from Dungeons & Dragons, Runequest, and Traveller until 1982, which is heavily detailed on his wikipedia page. He is often credited for "Keylining", which refers to his old responsibility of physically doing layout on each Palladium book.
Erick Wujcik: Though he passed on in 2008 due to cancer, Wujcik was one of Palladium's most prominent and writers due to his work on the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles & Other Strangeness and Ninjas & Superspies lines, both of which were almost written single-handedly by him. Though we worked on a number of other Palladium products, he's also well-known for his work on the Amber Diceless RPG, published under his personal company, Phage Press.
Alex Marciniszyn: A founding staff member, Alex is a close friend of Kevin (having been in the gaming campaign that resulted in the Palladium RPG), and has served as an editor (the distinction is, frankly, quite dubious) on the grand majority of Palladium's titles. He has also moderated the official Palladium forums.
Julius Rosenstein: The man that introduced Siembieda to roleplaying games, he also played in the original Palladium RPG campaign as well. Has written short pieces in various books. Practices aikido and can probably flip you to the ground if you let your concentration lapse even for a moment.
Wayne Smith: Originally brought into the company after trading Star Wars figures with Kevin, he volunteered for the company before being hired on. Editor of The Rifter for over a decade, most recent books in the past decade or so have seen Wayne's involvement as an editor, and occasionally as a writer.
Thomas Bartold: Often credited as an editor, Bartold wrote Island at the Edge of the World for the Palladium RPG. Was also involved in the original Palladium RPG game.
Carmen Bellaire: A fan who was brought on via submissions, Carmen has written a number of books for Palladium, chiefly on the Powers Unlimited line for Heroes Unlimited, and also wrote the Splicers game. He has a reputation as a "Killer GM".
Carl Gleba: Carl is mainly known for doing the "Minion War" series, where demons and deevils (yes, it is spelled that way, because) have a big brouhaha battle across different Palladium settings. He likes to play wizards.

The Heels of Palladium

These are former employees and freelancers that have spoken up against or otherwise had disagreements with Palladium Books.

CJ Carella: A GURPS fan who had previously done work for Steve Jackson Games, CJ Carella was an intensely prolific writer for a time at Palladium Books, particularly on the Nightbane and Rifts game lines. Though his parting from the company to be more involved with Eden Studios and his own games seemed amiable, he later professed to having creative differences with Kevin; Kevin later criticized CJ's work for being unbalanced. So it goes.
Bill Coffin: Another prolific freelancer who worked on a number of high-profile projects (Systems Failure, Coalition Wars, and Land of the Damned), Bill Coffin's pointed words regarding his time in the company are listed above. Siembieda refuted a number of this allegations, in turn. Coffin also writes science fiction novels.
Kevin Long: A key artist for the early success of game lines like Robotech and Rifts, it is unclear whether how much acrimony remains between him and Palladium Books in the 1990s. Rumors circulate that he was fired under strenuous circumstances, though employees at Palladium Books insist the parting was voluntary. It is believed by some that he remains unpaid for a number of illustrations used by Palladium Books. Long is also sometimes accused of plagarizing robot designs from other sources. He has an online gallery as well.
Steve Trustrum: A freelancer with a wide array of minor credits, he was a minor contributor to Heroes Unlimited and The Rifter. Trustrum alleges that Palladium Books plagarized some of his fanwork for Heroes Unlimited Second Edition.
Steven R. Sheiring: Aka "The Perpetrator of the Crisis of Treachery". Another graduate of the original Palladium RPG group, Steve contributed writing to Palladium Books for over two decades before his embezzlement was discovered. (It's a bit hard to find information on him now, since Palladium Books has essentially stricken him from their public face.)

The Left Behind Series: Other Former Talent

Palladium has accepted work from a wide array of writers, but it's a rare figure outside of Kevin's personal circle that remains. The following is just a sample of freelancers and staffers that are no longer associated with Palladium.

Randi Cartier: A Palladium RPG playtester who became a freelance writer for the Palladium RPG, as well as an editor on a number of earlier titles (like TMNT and other Strangeness). One of the few female contributors at Palladium Books.
Maryann Donald (formerly Siembieda): Kevin's wife for nearly two decades, Maryann is credited with "Typography" in many Palladium Books. For a time, she oversaw much of Palladium's online presence. Her time spent monitoring the web for offending websites and moderating the official boards put in her in the unenviable role as Palladium Books' primary censor, but she also oversaw organizing fan support as well. She left the company during a trial seperation between her and Kevin which led to a later divorce.
Steve Edwards: Though only a minor contributor to the Palladium RPG line, Steve Edwards designed the logo seen across the wide line of Rifts products.
David Haendler: Wrote the "War Against Tolkeen" fiction that ran through early issues of The Rifter. Has gone on to write his first novel, Shattergrave Knights.
Jason Marker: A staff writer for the new Robotech 2nd edition books launched in 2008, Marker oversaw the "manga-sized" books until being laid off in 2009. Jason Marker now does freelance work for Fantasy Flight Games on Rogue Trader and other Warhammer RPGs. His blog can be found at www.amalgamatedfiction.com.
Shawn Merrow: A fan turned freelancer who contributed to The Rifter, Merrow maintained Palladium's online FAQ along with Rodney Scott, but left for personal reason. He still assisted with the Q&A column in The Rifter for a time.
William R. Muench: An writer for early issues of The Rifter, Muench also maintained the Palladium mailing list for a time as well.
Jason Richards: A freelancer who worked on the Rifts and Chaos Earth lines, his blog can be found at www.jasonrichards.net.
Mark Sumimoto: A freelancer that worked on a variety of Rifts books for a time before being let go, he now blogs about mobile technology.
Todd Yoho: A freelancer that wrote about a bunch of magic dinosaurs for the Rifts line.

Good, Bad, and the Ugly: Palladium's Artists

Here's a listing of some of Palladium's most notable artists - their names are linked to their online galleries when available. There have been a lot of artists over Palladium's three decades of existence, and I'll probably add to this later on.

Kevin Siembieda: In addition to writing, Siembieda has often supplied his own art for ideas and concepts in various books.
John Zeleznik: A freelance artist with a massive amount of professional credits, John Zeleznik did a lot of seminal covers for the Rifts line, and had an artbook ("Rifts & the Megaverse: the Art of John Zeleznik") published by Palladium Games.
Keith Parkinson: Though he passed away from cancer in 2005, Keith Parkinson's art defined some Palladium books - literally speaking. Which is to say, Palladium Books purchased the rights to use a piece of art and then created game concepts around it, rather than vice versa.
Michael Gustovich: An artist brought over from his independent comic work on the Justice Machine, Gustovich produced a prolific amount of art for Palladium Books during the eighties and nineties, and was probably their chief "workhorse" artist for a time.
Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird: The creators of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles did practically all the art for the first few books in the line, giving them an authentic hard-boiled furry look.
Jim Lawson: After Eastman and Laird stopped doing art for Palladium Books, Jim Lawson, a later Turtles artist, did much of the art on the line, and then later did art for Rifts.
Newton Ewell: A freelance artist during the nineties, Newton Ewell did a wide variety of work for Rifts and Robotech, as well as a wide variety of other games. Though he no longer does art for Palladium, he can be found at his Deviantart page.
Wayne Breaux, Jr.: After Kevin Long's departure from the company (detailed above), Wayne Breaux filled in for many of his art duties on a wide variety of books, as well as writing a number of supplements. Though no longer producing art regularly for Palladium Books, he seems to maintain a friendly relationship with them. Breaux still can be found experimenting with art as his Deviantart page, and also doing "less mainstream" art at Hentai-Foundry.
Vince Martin: Notable for his hirsute heroes and thick inking, Martin can be identified by his distinct, rhomboidic signature.
Thomas Miller: With a loose style, Miller's portraits in Palladium books has a very sketchy look to it.
Roger Petersen: Petersen has a talent for expressive character art that would carry him on after his Palladium work to do comic series for DC and Dark Horse, and most notably worked on Swamp Thing and The Escapist.
Kent Burles: Often miscredited in Palladium Books as "Kent Buries", Kent has an organic style that looks like it would be more likely gracing the side of a 70s rock group tour bus, and really, really sticks out in the middle of a Rifts book.
Timothy Truman: A comic artist, Truman had only a brief stint on early Rifts books, but got to concept his own original world that appeared in Rifts Dimension Book 1: Wormwood, which is largely based on his world and ideas.
Ramon Perez: A freelance artist, Perez was one of Palladium's most profilic and talented contributors for a time, particularly on the Rifts and Heroes Unlimited lines. He did an ongoing Rifts comic in The Rifter which was collected as Rifts: Machinations of Doom.
Scott Johnson: Known mainly for his work on Rifts Ultimate Edition and Rifts Chaos Earth, Scott Johnson went on to become a house artist for Marvel Comics, though has since returned to doing freelance work as well.
Nick Bradshaw: "You have to be at least a little brain damaged to work at Palladium. It�s a prerequisite. That�s why Nick was an instant fit at the company.� - Kevin Siembieda
Mark Dudley: Credited with some associated artists under Drunken Style Studios on some earlier work, Dudley has been an artist on newer Rifts and Heroes Unlimited books.
Chuck Walton: A newer artist who has chiefly worked on the Splicers and Rifts lines, Walton is a freelance concept artist. He has a Deviantart gallery with much of his Palladium work.
Adam Kass: If you've seen any CG, Poser-looking art on a recent Palladium product, it's probably this guy. You can find his Youtube account here.

Palladium Books vs. Something Awful

For some reason, Palladium Games have been a frequent subject of mockery on Something Awful for reasons which are unclear and mysterious. Maybe if you read some of these articles, things will become more clear? Only you can solve this mystery!

WTF, D&D!?

Zack Parsons and Steve "Malak" Sumner review Palladium's artistic monkeyshines on the frontpage.

FATAL & Friends

Need some summaries of Palladium's finest words? Well, some assholes wrote a bunch of crap. You can find a lot of the older reviews mirrored at Inklesspen's site if you don't have archives.

Palladium-Playing Awful Goons and Other Strangeness

CroatianAlzheimers talked about working as a TG industry, including his time with Palladium here (requires archives).
clockworkjoe mashed up Rifts and The Eliminators in Rifts: Eliminators. He also has some live plays of Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Other Strangeness: part 1 is here and part 2 is here.
EclecticTastes tried to run Heroes Unlimited and was killed in the attempt. The recruitment thread is here and the play thread is here.
System Mastery, a podcast by goons theironjef and Grnegsnspm, includes reviews of Heroes Unlimited, After the Bomb, and Rifts.

Palladium Books vs. You

Some many wonder if it's okay to post adaptations, conversions, and rehabilitations of Palladium material to this thread. I have asked and the answer is yes, you can. Personally, I'd just make sure you're aware of Palladium's past behavior in that regard (see Palladium vs. Players, above), but it has been 20 years of threats or so and no fans have actually been sued. If you're more interested in complying with the PALLADIUM BOOKS� INTERNET POLICY, just follow the link (the caps lock is theirs).

Palladium Books: a 20 Second Summary

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TtGQnyPZ6g

Polite Suggestions

Kevin's done some stuff that has earned some powerful dislike, and his personal life and Palladium Books have become unavoidably intertwined. It's natural that some will dislike what the guy's done, but let's stop short of helldumping.
Similarly, though Palladium Books has a rep for dodgy material, nobody has to freak out if somebody actually enjoyed Mutants in Orbit or whatever. A lot of folks have a love-hate relationship and hypocrisy is thread approved.
The rules suck. We all know the rules suck. If you want to talk about how the rules suck, try and at least make it amusing or constructive talk on how the Megaversal system sucks. (Because, geez, it really sucks!)

Alien Rope Burn fucked around with this message at 22:12 on Jun 16, 2016

# ¿ May 4, 2013 04:57

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# ¿ Apr 29, 2024 19:24

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

InfiniteJesters posted:

The more I read about Rifts, the more I'm convinced it's what you'd get if you took all the drawings I did in middle school of mechs and space marine dudes blowing each other up, gave it more budget/proper artists, gave it a more complicated plot with about the same amount of sense, and gave it game mechanics with ludicrous power levels.

As I understand it, part of the "Palladium Method" is this:

1. Kevin finds a piece of art he likes by one of their artists.
2. Kevin attaches a concept and numbers to that piece of art.
3. BAM! New monster or robot or race.
4. Slot it in the next book he needs to fill page count on.

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

I worked for Palladium as a staff writer for two years. It's weirder than you could ever imagine.

I can imagine quite a bit, as a wise man once said. What's the weirdest thing you can talk about?

# ¿ May 4, 2013 19:47

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Winson_Paine posted:

Also I loved TMNT in high school, it was big fun rolling around as my ninja porcupine or my ex-Navy SEAL mutant housecat.

Yeah, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Other Strangeness wasn't my first exposure to RPGs, but it was certainly the first one I purchased. I still have that copy, complete with the er- questionable- coloring I added to the Turtles.

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

Eh, I'll talk about stuff in general, but I'm not real into airing dirty laundry like Bill Coffin. Somewhere I had an A/T thread about working for Palladium and as a game writer/designer in general, but I can't find it. Uh, what do you want to know?

Yeah, I didn't have any luck finding it either.

Any idea what the editing process is like? Palladium Books seems to have a number of editors noted on most books, but that doesn't seem to do much for the rough quality of some material. I'm curious as to what sort of things get redlined.

krebbed flam posted:

I don't have anything to add but I wanted to say, Alien Rope Burn, you did an amazing job with the OP, and it was very well written and absolutely fascinating.

You're welcome! I found a lot more interesting elements than I thought I would when I started. There's still a lot more I know I missed out on, and folks that unfortunately didn't get their due. I might add to it later on if folks have other things to add, or if there's call for it in general.

# ¿ May 5, 2013 02:05

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

How did you get hired, if you don't mind me asking? Palladium Books seems pretty insular, though The Rifter seems to have given them a gateway for new authors to get a toe in the door.

# ¿ May 5, 2013 04:39

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

Lately I've been digging myself out of a hole I made when I totally overcommitted last year, ended up with something like 250,000 words to write in three months, and then missed some deadlines. Combined with a new baby, work, my band, and other poo poo I don't get a lot of sleep these days.

Yikes. Hopefully it'll all start coming together sooner or later. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

But to get more specific, how did the layout on Robotech: Shadow Chronicles end up as... eccentric as it was? (For those less familiar, it starts out with stats and backstory for the antagonists, and then does PC creation without bothering to explain what a character's stats represent, amongst other oddities.)

# ¿ May 5, 2013 20:19

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

As for R:tSC's layout, I couldn't tell you. My job started and stopped at . Layout was all Kevin on that one. Speaking of that book, the manga size version was the very last book PB did that was laid out by hand without use of computers. The first book PB digitally laid out was the special edition hardback of Shadow Chronicles.

That would explain a lot, expecially if he laid some of it out already and then your writing had to get stuffed in and... well. Well.

Thanks a lot for speaking frankly on this, it's been really cool. It definitely sounds like Robotech would have remained in limbo for awhile if it wasn't for you. It'll be interesting to see where the Robotech minis game goes, though it seems deeply Palladium in that it's effectively a license of a license of a license. Weird stuff.

What was working with Harmony Gold like? What sort of questions and issues did you have to take to them?

# ¿ May 5, 2013 22:29

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

To the point where I got hate mail from nerds claiming all kinds of poo poo like I raped their childhood for doing poo poo like making Max Sterling's glasses non-perscription. Nerd tears are delicious, and they keep me hale and virile.

Yeah, it makes me think of some of the interviews I've read from folks that have worked on recent Transformers projects where they get all sorts of threats and hate mail. Honestly, it's very weird because Robotech is a similar property in that it's so far removed from the original creators that everything being produced is being done by professional fans of the original work. You'd think there'd be less of a bucket o' crabs attitude.

Shadow Chronicles had a different approach to character creation than most Palladium games, where players got to potentially adjust their opening stat rolls and had a little more of a directed approach. Do you know anything of how that came about?

# ¿ May 6, 2013 00:34

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

If you don't mind, I'd like to take issue with this. The Rifter is the only thing that Palladium has successfully and regularly produced on time and as promised. It comes out quarterly. I don't believe it's ever missed a publication date, thanks to Wayne Smith's tireless work on it. Honestly, if Wayne disappeared tomorrow Palladium Books would be out of business by Wednesday.

No, no, you're right and I wrote dumb stuff. For some reason I had the current issue # wayyy off in my head, never double-checked it, and assumed that it had minor delays here and there at some point. But its totally been on time, as I look. I'll get it fixed soon.

Given how vital The Rifter and the writers it's brought in to Palladium's publishing are, you're absolutely right. Even with my mistaken perspective and just looking from the outside, it's pretty clear Wayne's been an amazing boon to the company, and I'd bet they owe their survival over the past decade-and-a-half entirely to his hard work.

# ¿ May 6, 2013 05:49

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

OP has been updated! Added summaries for a number of Palladium's former writers and staffers in a new section, corrected The Rifter summary, and added a new staffer. If there's anybody folks think need to be added or any mistakes, let me know, I know there are a lot of writers and artists I've overlooked for whatever reason (mostly my own sanity), and some people I can't find anything more than the most basic information on.

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

Because someone might either actually steal or be accused of stealing some else's idea and there would be lawsuits. Seriously.

The whole IP paranoia is weird. This is a company that was built initially on the Weapons, Armor, and Castles series of books, which were basically reproductions of existing historical material converted to Dungeons & Dragons. Granted, yes, they're supposedly for "any system" but it's not really written for anything but D&D and its close relatives; they were basically the d20 supplements of their day. The Palladium RPG doesn't fall far from the D&D tree, either.

Maybe he was terrified of getting Arduin'd and it just never went away.

occamsnailfile posted:

Though the Robotech book probably has better writing and fewer druids. Please, lord, fewer druids.

It is also thankfully free of Pygmy R.C.C.s and Gypsy O.C.C.s.

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

Much better writing and no Druids. I promise. As for rule conversions, since I got let go I've converted all of my old convention games over to Savage Worlds. So, if you're coming to Gen-Con, you can play some Savage Robotech with me .

The plan is for me to come to GenCon, so I might do just that!

On a totally different note...

Does anybody have a copy of the "Original Combat d20" ad Palladium put in Dragon Magazine? I've been wanting to see it again, but it's not in my issues, and I don't know what Dragon issue # has it to look it up otherwise through Paizo's archives.

# ¿ May 8, 2013 17:50

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

Would you mind putting a link to my blog in my listing?

Not at all, done in one!

# ¿ May 8, 2013 18:30

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

By the way, ClockworkJoe suggested I mention this in here. Two of my colleagues and I are running some freelancing/game design seminars at GenCon this year. The other two dudes are John Dunn and Ross Watson, both FFG alumni and all around pros. Here's the details:

You may want to highlight this in the Gencon Thread, too.

# ¿ May 10, 2013 14:54

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Zereth posted:

Wait what

The N-Gage had "advanced classes" you could level up into (unlike normal Rifts, which just has races, classes, and classes that are also races - it's confusing). One of these was the Elemental Fusionist class, which is a wizard that melds two different magical elements together for unique effects. When they did Rifts Ultimate Edition, they did a tabletop version as well. I'm not sure why it gets so much mockery, I mean, if you're going to have a videogame that puts in a new element, why not put it back in the tabletop game? But I guess anything related to the N-Gage just gets mockery even if it's not bad or anything (or, at least, no worse than any other Rifts class).

Asimo posted:

Admittedly I'm not sure how much of this is anecdote or not, but speaking from hazy memories of the early internet era it pretty strongly coincided with Palladium going after MUDs, fan conversions and supplements, and other things that used RIFTS rules/IP.

Actually, Palladium enforcing their IP with legal action predates Nightspawn by about three years with the Wizards of the Coast lawsuit, so any dodgy legal advice probably dates back to that. I imagine they feel they have to keep up the precedent they set with that. I actually looked up the firm that represented them for the Trion Worlds lawsuit, and that seems like a large, professional firm, so I imagine some of it has to do with Siembieda's attitude towards the whole matter as well. That's just my gut, though, I have no strong evidence to back that up.

Atlas Hugged posted:

The one thing I never really understood about Rifts is beyond the bonuses you get for having a stat over 16, what did your stats actually do?

Nothing, unless a rule calls for them (which is uncommon at best). An Mental Affinity of 3 generally has as much rules effect as a Mental Affinity of 15. They're just a roleplay aid at that point, really.

There are some secondary stat effects - Hit Points and Potential Psychic Energy are based on Physical Endurance, Inner Strength Points are based on Mental Endurance - but nothing too substantial compared to other games. The hand-to-hand damage rules for supernatural creatures being based on Physical Strength is the biggest effect I can think of.

Babylon Astronaut posted:

Has anyone played Palladium FRPG 2e? I've read the book countless times, and it's full of good art and inspiration but I don't see how it's functional RAW.

Palladium RPG is actually better in the 1st edition than 2nd edition. It's still vague as gently caress, but there are fewer elements, so it's easier to interpret into a workable game. 2nd edition added a lot of lovely or vague rules from other Palladium games to make it compatible with Rifts and its ilk, and suffers for it. (The art is much better, though.) Most Palladium games before Rifts Ultimate Edition are written in the form of early-eighties games, where rules were just something you generally threw into a game without too much handholding. Explanations of play, turn order, and other clarifying stuff that's standard to RPGs now just doesn't exist in a lot of Palladium games.

# ¿ May 12, 2013 19:12

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Zereth posted:

Yeah, that seems pretty ordinary. I thought it was inspired by the N-gage itself, not a class which appeared in the Rifts game for the N-gage.

Yeah, no, it's a fine class. Rifts has plenty of lovely classes, especially from the core (Vagabond, City Rat, Coalition Grunt, to just name three), you'd honestly have to work pretty hard to make a worse class than some of the ones the game already has anyway.

# ¿ May 13, 2013 03:55

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

clockworkjoe posted:

I ran a game of Rifts a while back for some friends as a joke. One of my friends had never played Palladium before. He did not care for the experience. http://actualplay.roleplayingpublicradio.com/2011/09/genre/horror/rifts-the-eliminators/

That's pretty goddamn inspired.

Parkreiner posted:

Yeah, I think somebody on rpg.net noticed a couple months ago that apparently none of the Palladium main books actually explain how skills work. The actual mechanical process of "roll percentile dice looking for a result under your skill total" is completely unmentioned and just left to inference.

Yeah, when I did my Rifts FATAL & Friends writeup, I noted it doesn't ever mention how skill rolls are done. It details skill penalties, but not how you check for success or failure.

Of course, given how low your chances are at most starting skills, maybe detailing skill bonuses would have been more important...

# ¿ May 13, 2013 16:41

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

SavageMessiah posted:

I always "liked" how saving throws are basically never explained and the base values for them are buried in the combat terms glossary that's copypasted into every palladium book.

What's worst are the saving throws that basically have no equivalents. For example, soul drinking weapons have a Save vs. Soul Drinking. The thing is, since this save is never mentioned again, nobody and nothing gets a bonus to it. Oh, and it's a Save or Die save, effectively...

And then you get saves like Electrocution, Pain, or Extreme Temperatures that nobody gets bonuses against aside from Physical Endurance (maybe) because they're not standardized.

Oh, wait, women get +2 on Saving Throws against Pain. So there's that.

SavageMessiah posted:

Also I've always been amused by Kevin's love of bizarrely specific percentages such as '23% of all people of race X hold Y viewpoint'.

Yeah, it's a bizarre crutch. It makes me wonder, of all the factions and people in their post-apocalyptic universes, exactly who is busying themselves with random demographics about cyborgs and juicers. I was recently reading a certain Palladium book that breaks down a given military faction into units of 128... and then gives percentages of the composition of those 128 soldiers. So means when you see there's like 5% of the troops are bloody-furred bichons, there's like, 6.4 bloody-furred bichons in every troop. Numbers are hard!

theironjef posted:

Did anyone else ever notice the "25 XP for completing a successful skill check" thing in the XP acquisition chart? My characters would always backflip everywhere.

Every time you read a sign, that's a Literacy check! Level up!

# ¿ May 13, 2013 19:50

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

DOCTOR ZIMBARDO posted:

Back in 1985 it was pretty forward-thinking to get the same amount of XP for talking someone down as for killing them.

Yeah, there's just no strong guidelines on how to use the system, but it's much, much better than AD&D. Mind, having run Rifts recently as a lark, keeping track of separate XP totals is for the dogs. And how they did the math on the XP tables (I suspect no math was done at all, really) is bizarre, where at certain points "strong" classes actually level faster than "weak" classes.

# ¿ May 14, 2013 16:16

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

theironjef posted:

I still run Heroes Unlimited when I can get a group together. No mega-heroes, you're allowed one free reroll during random character generation (mostly it's a Get Out of Mutant Animal Free Card). That game remains a blast as long as you more or less ignore about 40% of it.

I would at least let mutant animals in Heroes Unlimited the option to use the superpowered mutant animal rules from TMNT Adventures, which give bonus BIO-E and the ability to buy certain superpowers.

TMNT Adventures posted:

Of course, this can make for some truly unique and outrageous mutant animals. Can you picture a blazing, normal sized guinea pig with full speech, human hands, flinging fire balls and flying around like a blazing meteor?

# ¿ May 14, 2013 16:43

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

theironjef posted:

Heh, if someone is super desperate to use the jankity-rear end Bio-E rules I certainly won't stop them, but giving them 200 Bio-E still isn't going to make them not suck compared to everything else in the book. The rules are just too outdated. All those animal psionics are the worst.

There are a lot of lovely, lovely options in Heroes Unlimited, honestly. (Heya, Physical Training!) It's not really any much fun unless you get to roll on those crazy power charts with all the fixin's, even if you end up with Clock Manipulation + Static Electricity Manipulation.

But, you know, if you roll up a t-rex with laser eyes, that's still a t-rex with laser eyes.

# ¿ May 14, 2013 19:56

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

theironjef posted:

I'm sure I have the slim volume with T-Rex in it. For the life of me I can't remember which one it is, since I have like After the Bomb (slim and fat version), TMNT Road Trip, Mutants in Orbit, Mutants of the Yucatan... I was so deep in Palladium Kool-Aid in the 90s.

BlackIronHeart posted:

Is it Transdimensional TMNT? The time-travelling one?

I feel so loving dirty now.

That would be Transdimensional Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. No shame there, I think it's probably the best book Erick Wujcik did for Palladium Books. It pretty well blew my mind as a young, unformed sprout, with its bizarro mutant futures, mutant dinosaur rules, freakish psychic humans (see the toppost), random alternate world tables, etc. And hell, look at this cover by Kevin Long again.

If anybody can find a clean version of this cover, I would love you forever.
_{Also it had the Rat King in the back for no particular reason.}

# ¿ May 15, 2013 13:35

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

50 Foot Ant posted:

I've tried over and over during the years to make sense of four things that KS insists upon in Rifts, that drives me absolutely crazy.

Trying to hammer on the science and facts in Rifts, especially on the official forums, is never gonna work out, sadly. Just look at how the Glitter Boy or SAMAS are designed. Not to say that stuff isn't as dumb as a plum, but you'd be harder-pressed to find things that make sense than don't, especially when it comes to Rifts technology.

Rifts makes a lot more sense when you think of it as plastic toy battles with clip-on missiles, I think.

theironjef posted:

Right? The US now (with an exponentially larger population, safer access to factories, a literate workforce, and no Xiticix attacking) has 637 operational F-18s. But no, let's say a million, of which 3% don't know anything about Anthropology and 7% have been to Rubio's on a Tuesday.

Also you have to note that the Coalition seemingly has no infrastructure, yet builds a farcically huge military. It's akin to Cobra or HYDRA and other forms of cartoon military villainy - how do they build massive bases and armies? They just do, shut up.

That being said, it's the kind of thing that's easily fixed with ten minutes of reflection on the setting. "Oh, yeah, they must have mines and salvage operations and farms and all the things that would actually make their country run."

clockworkjoe posted:

I'd like to hear more about how the Coalition War was hosed up. I never read into it. The last book I read about the CS war was the military campaign book that stated the CS had 1 million SAMAS units in storage. One. loving. Million. SAMAS power armor units.

Here's Bill Coffin's comments on writing for the Coalition War series.

Bill Coffin posted:

Our collaboration on the Siege on Tolkeen went very poorly despite Kevin's high hopes. it didn't sell as well as could be expected and it got a lot more flak from the fans than I think Kevin was prepared for. as for my collaboration with Kevin on this, I think there were a bunch of reasons for why it didn't work out very well, not the least of which were a) I didn't really want to get involved in this project but I agreed to it because of the moeny, which was a mistake; b) I didn't even play Rifts, much less have the kind of appreciation for the Tolkeen/Coalition conflict that the fans did; c) I didn't feel comfortable writing up the Coalition as heroes because I find the whole Nazi angle distasteful, d) it was hard writing a series that flew in the face of logic -- how come the Coalition just didn't bombard Tolkeen with LRMs all year, or why didn't Tolkeenite sorcers whack Prosek -- and e) Kevin never really wanted to collaborate on this; he would just tell me to do my thing, but then get bent out of shape when it didn't jive with what he wanted the series to showcase.

Really the core issue is that Siembieda wanted to have a ground slog like World War I, but with the technological and magical advancement in the setting, both sides are reduced to holding the idiot ball. What's more, it's all really railroaded, and there's no acknowledgement that the PCs could change the outcome of the war, and all of the adventures just being sideline battles and whatnot. I remember one particular part where there's an adventure where there's race between the two sides to control a killer satellite! Man, that'd be an exciting, thrilling turn in the course of the war that the PCs could influence, right? Well, no. It's a red herring. The adventure goes so far as to say:

Rifts Coalition Wars 3: Sorcerers' Revenge posted:

And remember, the potential for these things to critically unbalance a campaign is very high, so forget killer satellites even exist and do not include them in your game.

# ¿ May 15, 2013 22:56

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Zereth posted:

Wait. It tells you that killsats existing and being operational would distort the hell out of your campaign, so don't include them.

In an adventure about groups trying to get control over an operational killsat.

There's like a quiet paranoia that runs through a lot of the writing on the Rifts books where if the PCs will be given any sizeable power or allowed to defeat any of the major villains, the setting will be wrecked, so it tries to nip that in the bud whenever possible. The general assumption is that PCs will be wandering murderhobos and the idea that characters might shape the world significantly often isn't really taken into account, despite it being a big post-apocalyptic blank slate.

One thing that's been running through my head since mentioning this is how much more interesting a Tolkeen win (or even just a pyrrhic victory or mutual loss) would be. A Coalition victory really just reinforces the status quo of the setting - the Coalition is weakened to where they were originally before the "War Machine" geared up, and Tolkeen was never of major consequence in the first place. If Chi-Town had been destroyed or devastated, that would given cause for the Coalition to be more divided, and give them the grey moral qualities Siembieda was seeking for the faction in the first place. If the Proseks were dead or broken, the faction loses a lot of its direct Nazi parallels. The subtext would still be there, but the actual idolization of Hitler would be thankfully cut. And when Coalition troops showed up in an adventure, it would be less clear what their intentions or reactions might be, which could lead to more interesting interactions.

50 Foot Ant posted:

Did anyone notice the change to the "Disaster of the Week" theme the Great Cataclysm had? It went from world wide natural disasters and the Rifts tearing things up to the most outrageous claim.

I admit I haven't paid close attention to the revisionist material that's been cropping up in recent books, but what I did see in the Revised Sourcebook and the Revised Vampire Kingdoms just struck me as spitting in their own soup. Overexplaining the apocalypse is usually a bad idea in general, and the extra information just adds confusion and plot holes (like why the Earth isn't in an outright ice age from aforementioned super-eruption).

SquadronROE posted:

So, does anyone know of a good resource to get RIFTS books from that isn't ? I'd like to pick up some of the books, but have limited cash to do it.

When I was shoring up my Rifts collection for F&F writeups, I used hpbmarketplace.com. You can get a lot of the early books super-cheap (not caring about the condition helps), and if you can find multiple books from the same seller, the shipping costs are notably lower than amazon.com. One of the big issues, though, when searching, is that there's basically no standard for how those books are titled and filed, so you'll find the same book under like two to four different names sometimes.

If you're looking for PDFs, rpgnow as a selection of them, and they're about half off normal retail price.

# ¿ May 16, 2013 14:51

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

SquadronROE posted:

Perfect. I'm hoping for PDFs since I've got zero shelf space. I do want a good copy of the main book though, preferably in hardback. What's the latest version there, the Ultimate edition?

That would be it. It's got a lot of issues but it is genuinely more coherent than the original printing, which as my F&F details, is an amazing mess in retrospect.

The original is super-cheap, though, if you're just looking for a physical copy. You can often find it for like $1 + shipping.

Zereth posted:

... It's... it's a post-apocalyptic setting. It is already wrecked. That's the point of a post-apocalyptic setting. The only way the PCs could really "destroy" it is by rebuilding civilization.

To be fair, it's kind of "post-post-apocalypse", where you do have plenty of actual nations, like the Coalition, Atlantis, the New German Republic, the Empire of the Sun, the Phoenix Empire, etc. There are actually a ton of successful communities out there (the more evil, the more successful, generally).

# ¿ May 16, 2013 17:18

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

PlaneGuy posted:

oooooooooooo what do lasers actually sound like?

Most you'll see these days are silent, largely because they're effectively not much different than a lighter or a blowtorch. And, technically, a laser is going to be silent no matter what - it's the air it travels through that can make the noise! If you want to actually shoot somebody with a laser in the course of a combat action, you'll need something so powerful that it'll cause the air to superheat and "break down", forming momentary plasma. (That's a really, really gross oversimplification of the science involved.) You get a sound effect like a little series of cracks, like so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HHJhpStza0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XT5uQBpwvVk

Something powerful enough to demolish buildings in an instant would involve a lot more sound and much faster "bursts". Of course, the net effect IRL is that laser weapons that powerful would also lose their energy fast. In general you don't want lasers to make that "crack", because that means they're losing energy in the air, but it has some potential applications. Of course, most modern lasers make a loud hum just on account of the power source and machinery used to fire them, as well.

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

It's even simpler than "had a picture lying around". It's, "These are the tanks that were in the Sergeant Rock comics I read as a kid. I bet they still use them!"

Look, he bought Recon. That's not something you buy just to publish a few times and call it a day; you can use that art forever.

# ¿ May 16, 2013 21:25

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

It's not just my thread anymore, you're welcome to post as much as you like.

I ain't takin' the rap for this on my own, after all.

# ¿ May 17, 2013 00:52

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

SavageMessiah posted:

For what it's worth one of the books actually brings up a secret cabal of coalition magic users left over from before the CS and the Federation of Magic had their little falling-out.

Yeah, the Vanguard - which is honestly one of the better additions to the Coalition, since it gives a means through which the Coalition can counter basic magical sabotage.

Talen_Soti posted:

Is it just me or did anyone else need almost an hour to roll up a character?

My group averaged about 1.5 hours to build a character, from stats to skills to equipment.

It's a pain because it's not even all that complex - but because the skill organization is so terrible. Just the fact that it doesn't include the basic skill percentages with the character class or on a single table means you waste a lot of time flipping back and forth to obtain your starting skill values. It's probably the single worst aspect of character creation and it has never been fixed, even though there are trivial solutions to it. Making my latest Heroes Unlimited character took ages on account of starting with 30-40 skills, and waffling back and forth on which ones to take to begin with.

Talen_Soti posted:

Believe me I know about not letting players have access to some of the more "unusual" OCCs (cj carellas books come to mind).

Really, I think the issue is not having unusual or powerful PCs; after all, the corebook has wild variations. You can have a glitter boy and borg in the same group as a cyber-doc and Coalition grunt. Really, I think the thing is to define what kind of group and region you're dealing with, and just try and make sure people have enough of a focus to stave off choice paralysis. Dialing it back to the core and sourcebook still gives you the ridiculous robot R.C.C., after all.

The last game I ran took place in South America, and some people played some of CJ's "infamous" classes, but something like an anti-monster is actually weaker than a glitter boy (the big advantage it has is regeneration), and I let the weaker class being played have a riding monster and extra weapons and armor and that sort of thing. You can't sweat balance too much if you're playing anything close to RAW, you just have to make sure you and your players are on the same page about what sort of game you're running. If you're running a New German Republic military unit, you might not have a place for somebody to play the Killer Whale O.C.C. (which, for the uninitiated, is a literal killer whale as a character).

Ultimately, I think part of Rifts' appeal is being able to pick a character from a neverending list of weird poo poo no other game would ever contemplate, so I think it's more fun if you're more inclusive, and I'd rather get more use out of my shelf of books. Certainly, not every game needs to be as odd as having a cosmo knight, a nightbane, a zembahk wonder worm, and a flooper, of course, but for some folks, that's what Rifts is all about!
_{just kidding, nobody would play a flooper}

# ¿ May 17, 2013 13:46

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

I didn't post any conversions in the OP mainly just not to draw Palladium's attention to them (conversions posted second-hand to rpg.net have gotten people cease and desist letters, or letters to their webhosters), but I'm absolutely fine with people posting them voluntarily. If it's the d10 conversion I'm familiar with, I wouldn't see it as a big issue as far as SA policy goes, but you could double-check with Winson to be sure if you're concerned.

I don't know if Palladium is paying attention here, but I'd operate under the assumption they are if you're worried about that sort of thing.

# ¿ May 17, 2013 17:35

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

SquadronROE posted:

Does Rifts play well with a PBEM or PBP system? I know for a fact I can't get enough people around me interested in this, but I'd still love to play around with the universe.

Belatedly, Rifts just doesn't play well; the combat just plain involves a lot of rolling and action-tracking, which is sluggish enough in person, but ends up being positively glacial if run as written on a PbP.

I'd say whatever your favorite system that can do magic, psionics, and robots should suffice.

theironjef posted:

I doubt it is the one you are familiar with, as far as I'm aware there are six people that have read it, heh.

I'd love to see it! Sadly, it doesn't look like I can PM you for anything private.

SavageMessiah posted:

The coelocanth of elfgames.

I'd say the coelacanth would be something like Tunnels & Trolls; Palladium is like the cockroach - ugly and ancient, yet somehow capable of surviving disasters you would never expect something like it to survive. It'd be pretty admirable, but then you remember it's still a cockroach. It just keeps going on and on, much like this metaphor.

Speaking of which, Robotech RPG Tactics just finished with over $1.4 million in the bank. Of course, it's clear that it's mostly a Ninja Division design, with Palladium Books only really seeming to contribute IP and art. The game seemed pretty plain to me from the video demos, but the minis look nice, hopefully it works out for all the parties involved.

Oh, and it brought Kevin Long to mind, since we get to see them dredging up his art again. It turns out he has a dated gallery page (added to the OP), though it has blank pages for the "about" and "contact" sections, sadly. Hopefully he's still doing videogame work out there somewhere.

# ¿ May 21, 2013 06:14

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

50 Foot Ant posted:

When you've got a group that knows the rules, and has their little crib-card for their combat bonuses, you can actually resolve combat faster in Palladium than you can in 3.5E. One thing that a lot of people don't realize is that a lot of combats end in about 2-4 rounds. That's with power armor and everything else. It can get really really brutal.

Well, saying "2-4 rounds" in Palladium is deceptive compared to other systems, since 2-4 rounds in Palladium is usually about 3-6 exchanges per character due to the way multiple attacks work (effectively a form of what we'd call "phases" in really old games), so 2-4 Melee Rounds = 6-26 rounds in other systems.

A lot of it depends on the party you're fielding, of course. A party with two glitter boys, a ley line walker, a hydra hatchling, and a burster will be doing exponentially higher damage than a party with a Coalition grunt, a rogue scholar, a crazy, a cyber-doc, and a techno-wizard. One of the things to understand is that Siembieda was used to having a party of players over a dozen wide as I understand it, so a lot of the damage capability of robots and monsters is rated up to cope with that, but most gaming groups are much smaller - so you end up with creatures like gargoyles or vampires that A) attack in hordes and B) can take enormous beatings. And that's not even getting into the big villains of the game, who routinely have well over 5,000 M.D.C. and rapid regeneration...

Of course, if you're playing with the old burst rules, you can just have any old Coalition grunt dump their entire e-clip every round for ridiculous damage (just don't miss...). It's expensive as hell, but it works.

# ¿ May 22, 2013 13:26

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

MadScientistWorking posted:

Honestly, the techno wizard typically has been the most powerful member of our group and that is actually counting a glitter boy. Magic in Rifts apparently has the tendency to bypass the word save in save vs suck and in some regards actually has the ability to take down some really nasty creatures. It gets even worst when they technically have the ability to bypass the only limitation that magic has.

Yeah, there are some spells like carpet of adhesion or blind that are just farcical. What I meant is that in terms of dealing sheer Damage Per Round, a lot of TW gadgets ain't all that, from what I can recall. Maybe they fixed that in Coalition Wars or the like.

But they do have head-mounted sprinklers, so there's that.

CNN Sports Ticker posted:

I'm always so torn on Rifts.

I sometimes feel like this is a twelve-step group for people abused by percentile rolls.

Alien Rope Burn fucked around with this message at 17:58 on May 23, 2013

# ¿ May 23, 2013 17:55

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

occamsnailfile posted:

That isn't how it's written in my copy but their optional level mechanic is still super-bizarre; if they study longer they have to start at an eviler alignment and start rolling for random insanities and be either 3rd or 5th level along with more spells and bonii. If you're referring to the Raider--they're supposed to be NPCs though the text goes out of its way to be like 'well if you really want the decision is ultimately up to the GM but you shouldn't' sort of waffling. It makes me wonder what happened around an official Palladium table to get that in there.

Yeah, it's not really clear. I get the impression that it's supposed to be some sort of Faustian bargain for PCs, where if you agree to serve a Temporal Raider for X years, later on you get a boost in magic and levels? It's really really not clear, though. As for the waffling, that strikes me as pure Siembieda. (It's similar to the "not recommended as a PC" blurb you see on some races beforehand, rather than just flatly saying "not a PC" more clearly.)

Dr. Tough posted:

Well evidently Kevin Siembeda hasn't roleplayed since like at least 2003, so God only knows.

I don't think that's the case at all necessarily. Between Coffin and what Siembieda have said, I get the impression more that Kevin hasn't played in a regular campaign for quite some time, rather than not having played at all. CroatianAlzheimer's might know more, though.

# ¿ May 29, 2013 02:10

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Just in case you're not following the FATAL & Friends thread, occamnailfile's Rifts England writeup wrapped up, and my Rifts Africa writeup has started as of Friday. Links to the posts are archived here for England and here for Africa as quickly as Syrg Sapphire puts 'em on up.

Enjoy! Or don't, whatever, that's cool.

# ¿ Jun 9, 2013 06:12

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

50 Foot Ant posted:

So no comments or questions? I don't really want to monopolize the thread. I love the gently caress out of Rifts, and this thread inspired me to start a new campaign set back in 101 PA and only allowing the Core Book for the PC's and Conversion Book One and Sourcebook One for me.

It's quite useful to people wanting to poke at it, but most of my energy for that kind of thing admittedly is going into the writeups.

But after finishing Rifts Africa, I'll give you some tips on how to make it unsuck without just throwing out the whole deal:

As it is, the solution to the Horsemen dilemma mostly just involves having a line of Glitter Boys fire at them until the Horsemen are buried in fletchettes. Boring! Maybe they have some vampire-like weakness, and seeking out that knowledge makes up most of the adventure. Maybe with the help of a shifter, the PCs can hop to another dimension and race to find out how that dimension fought off the Horsemen! Or maybe a ritual needs to be performed - one that will take the magical might of many tribes, and require the PCs to be more diplomats than warriors to unite enough of Africa to weaken the Horsemen to the point you can give them the boom gun shakedown.
What if the gods of light were behind calling the Horsemen? Maybe they think Earth - between places like Atlantis and the Yucatan, Phoenix Empire - is just too far gone. Best to clean it out before its cancerous civilizations spread to the other worlds. Maybe the gods of darkness are actually the ones who are willing to aid the PCs, in order to protect the Phoenix Empire. Of course, if the PCs can convince the gods of light that Earth is still worth something, maybe Light and Darkness can join together to fight off the Horsemen.
Similarly, maybe the Horsemen are a sort of multidimensional self-defense. Earth has become too dangerous, and they're basically the multiversal white blood cells brought in to wipe Earth out.
Before he turns over to total pointless nihilism, Rama-Set has the interesting notion that conflict drives human development. What if the Horsemen and the Phoenix Empire are just means for him to try and push human growth? Maybe the Phoenix Empire is literally a means to gather supernatural evil in one place where humanity can struggle against it grandly, instead of having to uproot millions of monsters across the world. What's Rama-Set's endgame? Or is he committed to be the eternal thorn in humanity's side to drive it onward?
Maybe Rama-Set isn't a Chiang-Ku dragon, but instead is an immortal or god from Ancient Egypt? It would explain why he's set up there. Hell, maybe Rama-Set is just Set.
Certainly, Africa needs more communities. It needs cities; maybe some people have given up on technology, while others work on more jury-rigged technology (like found in Rifts Mercenaries). We haven't seen a large community based on techno-wizardry outside of Tolkeen - maybe Africa could be the cutting edge of techno-wizardry, low on production facilities but making the drat most of what they have. They could have badass techno-wizard warriors that combine ancient means of war with new, totally ridiculous weaponry.
Of course, there's the guerilla war between local communities on the border of the Phoenix Empire, with the locals being the guerillas and the Phoenix Empire being the stompy major power trying to kick them out. And of course, there's danger from both sides for any PCs caught in the area - magic wards and explosive traps don't particularly care what alignment you are, sometimes. Maybe the Phoenix Empire has just taken to releasing terrible monsters from other worlds into the area, which in turn has honed the surviving communities into the world's greatest hunters of the megaverse's most terrible beasts.

More attention than it deserves, but those are just a few thoughts while I was going through the review. Ironically, the thing that needs the most attention and reworking is really just the African people and culture. What it needs is a treatment like CJ Carella does with South America, where we get a bunch of distinct, strange, and interesting communities, but that's well beyond the scope of a post like this.

# ¿ Jun 17, 2013 20:37

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Now that I can flip through it that Gencon is over...

... I got nothin'. It's hard enough finding the Scott Johnson art in that book as it is! That book is a parade of Palladium art freelancers.

# ¿ Aug 19, 2013 19:49

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Indeed. Also, my ~~Mutants in Orbit~~ Rifts Space writeup has started in FATAL & Friends, as well.

# ¿ Aug 25, 2013 11:50

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

In flipping through Rifts Canada, I noticed it had a significant number of shoutouts to Palladium contributors in the text itself, as a number of NPCs are named after real people.

Bieeardo posted:

I was never on the boards, but the bit about 'not being sued' reminded me that a bit of fan-stuff posted on the even older mailing list actually made it into print. The one bit I recall was for Nightbane, a 'clans of the moon' werewolf add-on that I'm stunned KS okayed because it howled Werewolf: the Apocalypse look-and-feel right down to the not-tribes.

That runs on the dicey assumption that Kevin Siembieda is rather familiar with Werewolf, or any other RPG of the 1990s or 2000s, really.

# ¿ Aug 26, 2013 05:01

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Updated the OP, mainly just to do a few fixes, get the newer F&Fs in order, and added the "Palladium-Playing Awful Goons and Other Strangeness" section for goony Palladium material. Feel free to suggest additions, of course. I'd like to add more content if I find the time.

Oh! Funny story. I picked up a copy of Mutants Down Under to replace my lost book while I was at Gencon (there was a 1/2 off any After the Bomb or Heroes Unlimited book), and though it's great to see the Palladium folks keep a good percentage of their books on the wire racks, the pages are yellowed and I cringe slightly to think of how long Palladium has sat on that book, lugging it around conventions, hoping some schlep like me was like "Oh, I want this, because Eastman, Laird, and Lawson." And then I realized Mutants Down Under had so many brothers, just being lugged around, Palladium staffers and volunteers stuffing Mutants in Avalon into a wire rack con after con and hoping somebody actually wants it again...

... maybe it's not that funny after all. :geno:

# ¿ Aug 26, 2013 20:08

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

JohnnyCanuck posted:

You're missing my old buddy and new Marvel Comics Digital House Artist Scotty Johnson in the Art section, man!

What? No, he's always been there, you just missed him, and you can't prove otherwise now. :colbert:

(I honestly have a harder time with more recent contributors, so always feel free to suggest folks I've missed.)

# ¿ Aug 27, 2013 05:48

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

So! I'm looking towards my next F&F now that Mutants in Orbit is wrapped up. But there's a bit of trivia I could use some help with.

Kevin Long is known for his work on early parts of the Rifts line doing robot designs... and, to some extent, borrowing heavily from existing mecha designs. While he doesn't plagarize wholesale, there are recognizable design elements from existing robots and vehicles in a number of Rifts designs. Here's some notable examples, though keep in mind some only have distinctive elements (the Glitter Boy just has the same gun as the Gundam mecha, and the Hunter (and related designs) mainly just borrow Briareos' head design.

Glitter Boy = Full Armor ZZ Gundam (Mobile Suit Gundam ZZ)
Gargoyle G-10 or G-20 Avenger = Tekkaman Axe (Tekkaman Blade)
Triax X-535 Hunter / Jager = Briareos (Appleseed)
SAMAS = Madox-01 (Metal Skin Panic Madox-01)
Triax X-10A Predator = AD Police K-11 (Bubblegum Crisis)
KM-700 Uni-motorcycle = The Hound (Venus Wars)

Some link the Triax T-21 Terrain Hopper and Sylia Stingray's Hard Suit, though I personally feel that's a bit of a stretch. There's some possibility that the Triax X-5000 Devastator which may be related to Patlabor's AV-98 Ingram, and I remember there being a source for the X-1000 Ulti-Max, but I can't specifically recall what it was.

So, the question is - does anybody know of any other clear sources for Long's mecha work? There's also a poorly-sourced rumor that design-swiping got him into trouble during his days working on FASA's Battletech as well - any word on that? Bear in mind I'm not looking to totally just dump on the guy, I think he diverged enough in many cases that his designs often have their own merits, but it's relevant to a discussion of his work at Palladium and how anime-influenced it was.

Alien Rope Burn fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Aug 30, 2013

# ¿ Aug 30, 2013 17:49

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

CroatianAlzheimers posted:

The Battletech thing was a completely separate issue, and only tangentially involved Palladium. FASA got in huge trouble for stealing a bunch of Macross designs and calling them their own. Then they did a bunch of stupid poo poo like trying to copyright giant robots and the visual representation of the M-16 in comics and games. Needless to say they failed at all of this.

Yeah, I'm aware of that situation, but that's not what I was referring to. Long did some freelance work for Battletech, and the rumor goes that some of his work was too derivative and that FASA stopped serving up work as a result, but the more I consider and research the less likely it seems, it's probably just rpg.net hogswash stemming from his rep.

clockworkjoe posted:

I also have AP podcasts of TMNT here http://actualplay.roleplayingpublicradio.com/2011/02/genre/action/tmnt-and-other-strangeness-mutants-in-new-york-part-1/ and here http://actualplay.roleplayingpublicradio.com/2011/02/genre/action/tmnt-other-strangeness-mutants-in-new-york-2/

Added!

# ¿ Aug 30, 2013 20:02

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# ¿ Apr 29, 2024 19:24

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Long did a poo poo-ton of work - Rifts World Book 5: Triax & the NGR represented nearly a year of him concepting and drawing on just a single book, for example. He probably didn't get paid very much, and there's reliable scuttlebutt Palladium used some of his sketchwork and other art without paying him. Certainly, they've continued to use his art, sometimes literally just altering it enough to try and dodge crediting him, sometimes not. No idea if they pay him to reuse his art when they recycled it for the Robotech kickstarter, depends on what his contract was like.

In short, he could do better, and did.

Alien Rope Burn fucked around with this message at 22:32 on Aug 30, 2013

# ¿ Aug 30, 2013 22:01

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > The Palladium Megaverse Gigathread

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