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I just finished worm. Is there somewhere with a list of all the clever things I missed?
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Sep 3, 2013 02:29
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Can someone explain why folks think there's a connection between eidolon and the endbringers? I don't get it. 
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Sep 4, 2013 00:12
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SerSpook posted:I don't think anyone on SA does, but the idea is that Eidolon's power, up until very recently, is one of those ones that is kind of difficult to control. In terms of power it's on par with Scion and greater than the Endbringers when it isn't shackled by his own blindness, if how far he pushed Scion is any indication. huh. If he created the endbringers to fight and challenge himself then why didn't they maintain his power when he was fighting them? He certainly didn't fight them off by himself. He always needed Alexandria and legend to do it.
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Sep 4, 2013 01:31
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NinjaDebugger posted:Because he didn't understand what he needed to do to progress. In this theory, his subconscious and/or shard was acting on his conscious belief that he just needed to push himself harder, rather than knowing what he actually needed to do to progress. That is certainly an explanation. Is there also an explanation for why they're made out of scion/worm-stuff? Also, is eidolon actually dead? And what's the deal with contessa's god mode shard that scion didn't recognize? I have a lot of questions.
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Sep 4, 2013 04:26
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Dietrich posted:I don't know about you guys but I'm torn up over the death of Clockblocker. The best hero.
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Sep 4, 2013 13:53
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:So if I start reading this Worm thing how "in the loving middle" is it right now? I don't want to get started on half a story. Is there some point at which it's going to be "finished" ? How close are we to that point? Supposedly going to end around arc/chapter 30. It's on arc 28.
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Sep 4, 2013 14:02
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Grundulum posted:By the way, is Doctor Mother's name really (28.1, IIRC) Mengele? Or was that just Tattletale trying to get a rise out of the woman? I think the latter.
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Sep 4, 2013 21:53
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Lprsti99 posted:I don't know about any of that, I just finished the first fight against Leviathan. Am I the only one who thought that due to Tattletale's description of it as a creature with a simple biology, basically sounding like an oversized crab, Taylor's powers were going to have some interaction with it? I thought this too at that point, but keep reading as you'll soon discover there's a reason she can't. Aside from it ruining the story.
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Sep 5, 2013 15:54
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Lprsti99 posted:This has probably already been thoroughly discussed, but I enjoy hashing stuff out like this, so bear with me. 1. Why wouldn't he just get weld's power? 2. Isn't his power like metal manipulation? He's manipulating physical stuff with his body. It's a similar vein, just not limited to metal and with the restriction that he has to use his body to literally shape the stuff vs just his mind. 3. SerSpook - what about eidolon's power up potions?. What are those? 4. Necromonster - doesn't she have the admin shard? Is that a kiddie shard?
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Sep 18, 2013 02:56
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Fellwenner posted:Agreed wholeheartedly. True, there are six installments left and anything could happen, but this was billed as being 'The End' and should be totally unambiguous. It is. That folks are sad about it, or that an author can do things like say "gotcha! the dead body wasn't actually dead, it was just foolin'!" does not make this any more ambiguous. Because it's not.
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Oct 30, 2013 12:45
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Fellwenner posted:I guess we disagree for now. What I'm referring to in this regard is the newest name that Contessa gave her and its meaning, plus the wording of the small two bullets paragraph. I don't think either are clear cut, although I wouldn't be surprised in the least if it turns out to be nothing at all. Fair enough. In my mind the reference in the name is 1. Kind of like how the smurf gets a couple names in different languages and 2. Referring to the rest of everyone, not to her. I don't think the bullets are ambiguous at all but am fine agreeing to disagree on that. The other sort of meta issue I have is that this is a story where everything is just getting worse forever and then all of a sudden voila, she's ok and lives happily ever after with her pals just doesn't jive with where the story arc's been going. This is far more heroic tragedy, I think, than everyone walks into the sunset happily ever after.
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Oct 30, 2013 15:17
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Skippy McPants posted:This. I'm fine with Taylor dying, but giving us an entire extra section where her failed predecessor taunts her and has the temerity to sit in judgement when Taylor is in a state of physical and emotional disintegration is just pointlessly cruel. I think we have been reading different things. I'm reading worm: it gets worse  . How about you?
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Oct 30, 2013 19:03
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Skippy McPants posted:Again, this. Taylor was in no state to be defending herself from the kind of accusations Contessa was making. She needed help, and she got a bullet in the brain. It undermines Taylor's entire arc if at the end of it all there's not even an ounce of compassion for someone as broken as her. Contessa having the power to "see" things doesn't really men jack poo poo. We've already seen just how wrong she's capable of being, whatever power she has. She did save literally every earth in all the worlds from permanent destruction and (single-handedly) defeated an aeons-old eldritch horror from beyond space and time, so she's got that going for her.
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Oct 30, 2013 23:49
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Blasphemeral posted:It didn't. Holy poo poo, you're right!!! (up to where I cut off your quote, that is. Everything after is nonsense and would be a boring story.) I still think it's silly to think Taylor's alive. All the interludes have been interesting back story that don't really drive the main plot at all (with a very few notable exceptions). This one shows you that teacher was trying to figure out countessa, and gives you a look at how he operates and what his goals are. In terms of pointlessness, I don't think it's any more or less pointless than any of the other interludes in this chapter. The story is already over, these are just short looks into the life of minor characters. Skippy McPants posted:I mean her friends are going to remember her, yeah. That doesn't mean I'm okay with having her get monologued at and murdered by the most sanctimonious character in the story. There are just so, so many problems with how that scene plays out if it is where Taylor comes to an end. Look, a thing on which we disagree. Of course, I'm still curious to hear (tomorrow) your issues in detail.
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Nov 19, 2013 00:07
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Tollymain posted:Get a turtle, they live for loving ever. Honey badger! 
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Jan 2, 2014 22:17
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Pact questions: 1. What's up with the tattoo? 2. Why does rose get weaker when she promises not to be terrible? 3. What's up with rose commanding the ghost to do something and the ghost is all yes ma'am, right away ma'am? Speculation: rose is part grandma. Because, you know, vestige. Worm: didn't we find out the other entity/eidolon created them? In the other entity flashback and the thing scion says to eidolon.
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Feb 16, 2014 15:46
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SerSpook posted:I like the idea that this will backfire due to the glamour. Unfortunately Blake isn't the target. just mess with time in the house - make it suuuuuuuuuper fast so you effectively age to death immediately when you walk in. Also, hah, mustache.
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Feb 20, 2014 12:34
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1. A bad binding is good because he wants the hyena and Pauz to get loose and gently caress up conquest. 2. How angry will rose be if he chooses a familiar without talking to her about it because she's in a coma because he's sucking her life away? On a scale of there's no scale it's just a lot. 3. Is the kid a ghost or the soul of a little kid or what? Aren't ghosts just like replays of the badness whereas the little kid's guardian angel or whatever bugged out when the hyena came? Because a ghost is a lovely familiar but the soul of a little kid is like the opposite of demons and what you'd expect from a diabolist.
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Apr 3, 2014 14:10
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Happy Yeti posted:About Evan, he didn't die from getting mauled, he froze to death after escaping the Hyena for a while. It seems like he's a soul stuck in the park who acts more like a ghost the farther he goes from his body. I don't really get what advantages he'd give Blake as a familiar as he probably takes more than he gives. On the other hand, he still has his soul so maybe he could cross over into another kind of Other. He is a ninja. 
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Apr 3, 2014 19:36
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Worm its a different story if it's a tragedy but that doesn't make it any less hopeful for folks generally. The idea that a person could choose to do good in the face of the world being such a jerk to her is, I think, a nice, warm fuzzy idea even if it's also a sad one. That would, I think, fit with the story. That said, it wasn't the story and instead it's a story about doing good even though the world is a jerk and hey maybe it's not a fairy tale ending but it's still a happy ending. Pact from 2.6 with the lawyer: 1. "Do you know where you want to be for the rest of your life? The kind of place you would make your home? The kind of place that is as comfortable with you as you are with it? Find a Demesnes. Fight for it, and if you’ve picked the right place, that fight won’t be so hard. 2. Do you know the company you’re willing to keep? You need to know who you are to know who or what you might spend the rest of your life with. Do you have interests? A passion? Find an Other in keeping with those ideas, and make them your Familiar. 3. “Then it’s a question of direction, of focus, figuring out how you’ll address the situation you’re in, how you address any situation. A cup, a container, to store power?” “A weapon, to fight back?” “A defensive object? A symbolic one? A personal one?” Kid ninja seems to be where he's going with familiar. I have no idea on demesnes because it seems to be all about his friends and not a space. It's tough for the story to center on the house if that's not where his demesnes is but I could see it ending up in Toronto and Podunk being just the first step on the way to [big bad thing we're not even aware is bad - it's god isn't it? Blake is going to kill god.]. For implement, he seems most comfortable with tools so maybe a hammer? Also, if you've re-read the grandma diaries interlude, anyone else think that the bad other her boarding school pals unleashed is the thing (75 years later) that Blake has to go after in the warehouse? Edit: it's convenient if this is a lie. “I can’t lie, Blake Thorburn,” Ms. Lewis told me. The words were uncomfortable, heavy, and they took the wind out of me. Is there anywhere else that indicates that others can't lie? I thought that was only practitioners? builds character fucked around with this message at 14:07 on Apr 10, 2014 |
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Apr 10, 2014 14:03
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TheRagamuffin posted:These are all spoilered Pact speculation. Didn't know whether to keep them spoiled, so I'm erring on the safe side. Hah! That was metaphorical. i like a hammer more than a mirror for him because it's supposed to be something he's comfortable with but I'm not sure the hammer is best just because he always talks about being handy and it'd be a useful thing symbolically because it's made for patching things up/building and can be used for smashing poo poo in a pinch but we've seen him use a lot of non-hammer tools. Just never a hammer. Cryophage posted:So is Pact starting to pick up then? I stopped reading when he left for Toronto. I'm re-reading and on another look it's all quite consistent and there are neat throwbacks and internal references and the rules actually seem pretty clear. I do agree that karma sucks but if you re-read the section before leaving Toronto he's actually doing pretty well considering what he has and what he's up against. Karma only really screws with him a couple of times and it's pretty minor. SystemLogoff posted:The problem for me is that it's doing that thing where the hero is constantly getting poo poo on, and when he/her gain an advantage it's small or lost right away. Boy, does that get tiring after the 56th time it happens. this looks a lot different to me the second time around. I don't know why that is other than I was wrong before and you are wrong now. Obviously.  Grandma starts out with the compliment that he reminds her of her pops. Then Molly dies and he makes it to the house instead of freezing to death even though he gets attacked by weird forhghbeoldd when he's just a regular dude. Then laird tricks him and rose fast talks him home. He awakens, threatens everyone, hits back at laird once, beats a duelist faerie in a duel, gets access to a demon that put the stars in the sky, makes sort of friends with goblin queen and nature girl, infiltrates and disrupts the behavior-Duchamp ritual and gets strike 2 vs laird while destroying a bunch of super valuable stuff in his escape. He's also a natural at glamour. He's getting kicked a lot but based on where he started he's actually doing really well even without going up against terrible karma. And the little ghost ninja is still awesome.
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Apr 12, 2014 02:35
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Nettle Soup posted:Re-reading Worm, I just laughed as I realised that their first view of Coil's base is the archetypal "Villain's Warehouse" It's not quite an underground volcano-lair, but it was all that was on the market at the time.
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Apr 15, 2014 00:11
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Fake edit: ^^^ that makes sense to me. still the duchamps and Dionysius to deal with though, to say nothing of conquest who must have plans for the three beings more than just "lol demons OP amirite?", right?NinjaDebugger posted:I actually wonder if he's lost the first two rounds, here. The resets may not count as losses for HIM.. One of the big takeaways I think is that symbolism matters and what folks think matters so if Blake and Duncan both think one of them lost/won then that's what happened. SerSpook posted:So if this counts as the third time he's going against Laird/the Benhaim family, and this is the third skirmish in the third battle, I wonder if winning the third round of this will multiply the significance of it all yet again? From arc 3 “I think it’s safe to say it’s two points. Another point in this department, and he’s earned three. A great deal more profound.” never says what it does though. Grundulum posted:Based on the chapter released last night, I'd really like to get inside Rose's head for a POV eventually. Because in this chapter she came off as quite selfish and unlikeable -- "I'm worried about using to much of Be fair to her though, she just got knocked the gently caress out for two days, she's not a real person and Blake just sort of does what he wants whether or not she thinks it's a good idea. Dietrich posted:Leave it to a Canadian to invent a magic system where part of your power is determined by how polite you are, even to your enemies.  my speculation is that Blake gets a ninja familiar, and the third demon is dealt with almost entirely by Rose who shows us why Thorburns are such badass diabolists that everyone goes crazy trying to stop/kill/control them. And then that sets up tension between Blake who wants to do good and rose who is like a vestige version of grandma, morality-wise.
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Apr 16, 2014 16:27
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" But we've only been getting Blake's perspective on this, so I'm hoping there's more to her character that we just haven't been privy to.
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Hugoon Chavez posted:I know, plot wise, that Blake will come out alive and triumphant over the abstract demon, but I can't see how. The guy is so weak he can't even carry a box, and I wouldn't like his odds even if he was in top fighting shape. my money is still on rose being badass and going "full Thorburn" in this one. Relative to everyone else they apparently have a tremendous amount of knowledge about demons and how they work and they've (her, anyway) got demon street cred. Anyway, not like the abstract demon is going to punch him in the face. Re: runes, they get talked about when he meets up with laird at the coffee shop and then after. You have to build up credit with the local spirits for them to be really useful and even then they're not that powerful (unless fueled by something else I presume). Seems like folks really seem to focus, too, and runes are a lovely thing to focus on compared to TIME or STAR-CHUCKING DEMONS.
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Apr 21, 2014 18:38
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Pavlov posted:I'm not just talking about Ornias in particular. It's just that if that kind of power can be thrown about with that short of notice, and with what we've seen of practitioners being just a little unhinged at times, you'd think every once in a while one would just go WELP gently caress THE WORLD and plop something nasty down in time square. How are they going to get the name of somebody that big and bad? Blake got it because the lawyers gave it to him and he knows the lawyers because he comes from a long, distinguished line of diabolists. Other folks won't have that kind of access and also yeah, this is definitely an issue that I don't have the answer to. new demon is pretty awesome/terrifying. Also, look how wrong I was about rose and it being easy. 
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Apr 22, 2014 18:13
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Wolpertinger posted:Nah the wreath was mentioned briefly midway with Blake contemplating how useless it was as it got completely ignored as the demon rolled over and crushed it in the scuffle seems like the plants need to be alive. So some sort of ring of potted plants you carry around yourself like a ridiculous one man band might work. Edit: e-z mode: plant kudzu all around the building Or just burn the motherfucker down with something that doesn't make dark smoke like magnesium
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Apr 23, 2014 13:50
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Fetucine posted:A Histories update, concerning Conquest and Fell's family. fell's grandma is a Duchamp? And conquest didn't tell fell to not let Blake know that rose is spilling the beans so maybe he'll be forewarned.
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Apr 26, 2014 15:52
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Happy Yeti posted:His mother, I think. Though Duchamps are only supposed to have daughters. Maybe she magically distanced herself from her family, she apparently doesn't like them that much. good point, I think I misread at first and thought that it was his brother's wife which would make the niece thing make sense (although how that'd work with the duchamps wanting to raise her vs conquest owning the whole bloodline...). Anyway, clearly there's more than one family of enchanters out there and I was wrong. What's the trick to get out of conquest's grasp? Just work him down by dying over and over and taking his power with you until eventually someone gets free?
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Apr 26, 2014 18:26
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Lyon posted:I didn't see anything in the story that implied she had an abortion? When she calls the unnamed man I think the connection that broke is between her and the unnamed man. Jeremy definitely tries to have Blake destroyed at the next council meeting so he is definitely helping out his wife's cause (well the Duchamp and Behaim cause). She said her family wouldn't let her keep the kid and she and the drunk are broken up and he doesn't have a kid and the duchamps are still having girls (little girls younger than twelveish at the meeting).
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Apr 28, 2014 13:59
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packsmack posted:Don't forget Duchamps, they're not there right now. But, they'll definitely be back. You're forgetting one very important point. Motorcycle.
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May 21, 2014 02:49
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Velius posted:I'm getting pretty burned out on the serialization of Pact. The need to have every single chapter end in a cliffhanger combined with the duration of this Conquest arc makes the experience really uneven and weirdly paced. It's like if someone novelized the movie Aliens and just went on and on with Ripley running away from one Xenomorph only to open a door and find another, twenty times in succession. Worm had downtime and dialogue, and even the S9 arc, which was probably the longest aside from the end, had changes of venue and pace. From the comments I think Wildbow knows he needs to wrap this up, so hopefully it happens in the next couple chapters. I started only reading it after I've finished a book, so I get at least a couple chapters built up. It's better that way but worse for discussion.
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Jun 10, 2014 13:07
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Virigoth posted:And rose getting the house and small town. Dual storyline action would be neat. My theory on rose is that grandma put her in place to take over but not before all the other heirs (Blake and Molly anyway) soak up as much bad karma as possible while she gets time to setup. How it actually works out though... Agreed that the Toronto arc has started to drag a bit.
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Jun 11, 2014 02:59
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Pavlov posted:Now the question is whether Blake will be forsworn, or if his promise was vague enough to weasel out of it. Blake can't be forsworn in the same way your main character in a superhero story can't lose their superpowers.
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Jun 14, 2014 14:54
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thespaceinvader posted:What was the deal with the shard of wood, btw? I don't remember that from the ErasUrr eps. Pretty sure that's the shard fell/conquest gives him to find eraser to begin with.
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Jun 19, 2014 00:05
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Wolpertinger posted:The best parts of pact, IMHO, were trying to figure how poo poo works in the mansion and trying to figure out how to scratch out a bit of power from an extreme disadvantage. Hopefully the nonstop life-or-death battles will stop and let the story take a breather. His friends are barely even characters, most of their development was pretty much skipped. I liked Fell as a character, but now he's dead. Which leaves like.. 3 actually developed characters other than Blake. Rose, Maggie, and Evan. He needs to flesh out his friends and make them feel like actually part of the cast if he plans to keep them around, I think. Evan is the best part of pact. I really liked the hyena scene. Blake gets a little help, we get info on how some things work (runes on shotguns!), he goes out and you get a bunch of world flavor and how stuff works with the ghosts and fae, you get Evan who is awesome and then you get Blake scrambling but with a clear plan that works. It's a neat little package where he's struggling but you get to see a lot more of his personality. Re: conquest going after rose, I thought that he did that because Blake said he couldn't just surrender himself. Rose has to surrender too because blake has the body (and legal [vested with a possibility of reverter] title to the house, I might add) and she has the Thorburn hero secret sauce. So if conquest wants to beat the Thorburn heir he has to beat both of them. Conquest doesn't buy it 100% but rose is weak and he does want the Thorburn heir and he is, you know, the physical embodiment of conquest so if he can conquer someone weak he does have some interest in doing that. Then he gets tricked. one of the things that I don't love about pact is the karma. Wildbow is pretty good at writing gritty don't gently caress with me (unreasonably) badass characters but Blake has the whole universe against him so rather than just getting hosed by circumstance and overcoming it he's got an even higher bar to overcome. And everything is still always terrible for him. It's one of the things I liked about fell. Dude is badass and hosed but all his choices are just his own and a reflection of that. It's not like when he tries to shoot someone the gun jams all the time. But with Blake you end up with this weird thing where he can't be killed off because he's the main character but things have to be terrible because he also has the universe against him so he's just always slogging through miles and miles of sewers. I liked the way karma worked for the behaims more, where haha you lost Blake gets to leave the station no matter what you do. And then that was it.
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Jun 20, 2014 13:19
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Rose Spirit posted:So did they manage to burn down the factory or not? Sucks for Blake if it goes. Pact posted:“You remember what we agreed to, right?” he asked. Seems like they burned it down, but there's enough ambiguity that Blake could be alive in the basement. Poor Evan. 
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Jul 2, 2014 03:32
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Lyon posted:I am convinced this is fully planned. It kind of makes sense... it frees Blake from the responsibilities of being the heir, completes his promise to Rose that he would try to help her become permanent, will allow him to travel the world trying to stop demons/bad others (part of #1) as Blake promised Evan, semi resolves the death of Laird though not the overall Jacob's Bell situation (if they think he's dead), allows him to continue to help Rose if he chooses but perhaps unties their fates, completes Isadora's prophecy, etc etc. I don't know. Doesn't seem like it's going according to Blake's plan. I saw what was happening, and felt only stark horror at the realization of just what it meant. The back window. Through the spiderweb. With the flare gun, I could break the web. I ran for it, giving it my all. I didn’t make it. Edit: I agree it's a clever way to wrap a bunch of things up, but that's a lot different than according to plan.
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Jul 2, 2014 13:09
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Grundulum posted:None of the characters recognize Evan at the end of the chapter, which is interesting. I don't think we have enough information on how magic works in-universe to do more than speculate on how connections and familiars work. At least it's clear that Evan isn't Rose's familiar. Edit: so who is? JC? builds character fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Jul 2, 2014 |
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Jul 2, 2014 20:34
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Einander posted:In light of her taking Blake's place in life (friends included), having Corvidae would be quite funny... If incredibly, incredibly worrying. You'd have to be pretty hosed in the head to look at what Corvidae does and say "yeah he's my magical BFF now." I'm hearing a yes from you. That's a "yes" right?
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Jul 3, 2014 03:29
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Pavlov posted:"We will never forgive you for the person our parents told you to kill. By the way don't help her cousin he needs to die our parents said so." Maybe laird gets bad karma but for the kids this is good karma, no? Maybe bad if they know Molly was just going to hang out at home shivering. But otherwise, killing a famous diabolist (ok so probably good for laird too) before they could become a threat? Seems like a net good in terms of karma. Not really fair that binding demons seems to auto give you bad karma though just for associating with them. That seems like the big bullshit card to me.
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Jul 9, 2014 23:57
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