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Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Well he is almost certainly demon-related at the very least. Considering Old Rose was a diabolist after all.

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Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
That's the best thing about Wildbow: nobody is safe!

There is definitely another point in that Blake picked up Sympathy (and other magic) so fast.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Grundulum posted:

Would someone remind me where we previously heard about the Seal of Solomon, and what it does to/for Others?

Before the Seal, humanity was basically a primite prey species to Others. Solomon was the biggest, baddest wizard that challenged the most powerful Others, and eventually settled on a compromise; 'innocent' humans are kept safe, while Awakened humans can be targeted by Others. While the Seal works for humanity in perpetuity, it only works for Others that were either present when the Seal was made or as this chapter teaches us those that agree to be bound to it afterwards. Also apparently it is a power source, which makes some sense, as no Other would agree to it otherwise.

Presumable the can't-tell-lies was put in there as a form of antiquity chivalry.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

TOOT BOOT posted:

Now that some time has passed I feel like I'm not really in any huge hurry to return to the Wormiverse. When is Wildbow supposed to start on that again?

Was there ever a return planned? I know wildbow runs a forum role playing campaign set in the Worm world, but I think that's it.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Ah okay. I knew he was planning to edit it and eventually make it a real book. Didn't know he had a sequel planned.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Remora posted:

On a scale of 1 to Wildbow, how bad is the grenade going to gently caress up everything after they survive the night?

It probably fell into Johannes domain, forcing his hand to attack the Thorburns as well this night. :v:

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Also, i can't be the only one that noticed that Blake seems to become increasingly adept at spending time in and influencing the real world. Even as his personal power does not seem to be increasing in proportion. Even more telling might be that he doesn't seem to even notice, much like his irrational devotion to the Thorburns.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Wolpertinger posted:

Someone in the comments just pointed out something that seems pretty likely - that all the lights going out at once, and the great horrible thing they saw walk by was Ornias, especially with all the lightbulbs being a little bit dimmer and more unreliable after his passing, and all the references to "a starless night" "an empty void".

Man, Wildbow does awesomely chilling demons.

I interpreted it as the giant massive creature Blake saw when he was relatively new to the Abyss.

e. That said, I kind of agree with their analysis that Ornias is pretty likely. Alternatively they could be the same.

Namarrgon fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Oct 22, 2014

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
That goddamn lunatic is going to murder them all isn't he?

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
What the hell just happened? I'm not sure if I understand.

e. So what I gather from the comments, Blake got temporarily possessed by Molly. Molly is rather hesitant to go for deals with the Behaims so she stabs Alister, breaking the possibility for a truce and fueling her desire for revenge (Alister knows it was Molly and he doesn't even necessarily blame Molly or Blake but he can't look weak in front of his family). The goblins tearing Blake apart where a vision from Molly's last moments and Maggie Holt isn't actually there; it is Molly's mind imagining it.

Namarrgon fucked around with this message at 10:39 on Nov 4, 2014

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
I hope we learn more about how getting Foresworn works. From what I gather, any statement with "I will" or similar is essentially treated as an oath. Breaking an oath allows others to declare you Foresworn. But someone still needs to actually do it and presumably the spirits need to arbitrate if it counts. Also assuming there is a downside to just going around declaring every practicioner you meet Foresworn; probably the spirits getting really pissed with you.

So at some point Rose 'swore' that she would not induct her children in the practicioner business and this is the reason she picks an heir from the grandchildren. But why bother? Could she not just pick one of her direct children on her deathbed? I would wager it doesn't really matter if you break an oath literal minutes before your death? On the other hand there have been hints of the actual existence of an afterlife, so maybe practicioner either know or don't really want to risk reprisal in there.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Hmm yeah karma seems like a good reason to even be careful with oaths you feel you can get away with breaking, for example by declaring them where you are positive that nobody able to call you out on it could hear it.

Although I suppose there is no real point to those oaths either.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Grundulum posted:

I wonder if it's possible to split good and bad karma. Instead of going into one big pool that cancels out good and bad, store good karma separately so that it can be passed on to a different person from the bad karma. Certainly could explain why the Thorburn heirs have had such monumentally lovely luck while Blake lately seems to be catching a lot of breaks for a Wildbow protagonist.

Karma manipulation is definitely possible; see The Benevolent, but I think it was stated that Blake's karma got reset after falling into the Abyss.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
It would be pretty awesome if The Benevolent just assumed a Bogeyman can not possibly have enough positive karma to harm him.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Blasphemeral posted:

That's very likely. Knowledge of that fact, however, does not further our understanding of his or her boner (or anti-boner, depending on the usage of "gently caress") for Saint.

It kinda does. Saint does that thing shutting down Dragon when mankind is literally fighting for survival.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Really? He doesn't really do anything before then I believe.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

thespaceinvader posted:

So a bunch of the kids blake though were kids were Faeries the whole time?

Looks like it. At least one anyway. Kind of paints Blake's encounter with Letita in a whole new light. Did Letita lose on purpose to give more ammo to the chaotic element?

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Even when everything goes right for Blake it still goes wrong. A true Wildbow story.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
I wonder if the Awakening ritual is actually a human binding themself to the Seal of Solomon. Seems to make sense from a thematic standpoint; there is the personal (/defining) item, the giving up the ability to lie and becoming more susceptibel to rituals.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Not a big fan of the last chapter. Between the anatomy discussion and the hard-to-follow fight I didn't feel anything of substance really happened, although Wildbow may have spoiled us with too many gamechanging details in the past.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
I read Worm in one glorious two week binge and my brain was fried to the point I didn't even know what was going on in the last few arcs.

So what I'm saying is that moderation is the key.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Is that mirror the one with Conquest in it?

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
So they burn through Mara's friendship with the local spirits that she cultivated for twenty six thousand years with only a handful of lies? This universe is loving brutal.

Anyway, regarding the ending; Faysal was originally send out to stop Johannes from claiming such a gigantic domain right? Could be that was his intention all along, and now sinking Johannes domain into the Abyss would probably qualify as 'taken care of'.

e. Also, I don't recall Mara swearing anything, let alone forswearing herself. Are we supposed to assume this happened between chapters while they were working on her house etc?

Namarrgon fucked around with this message at 14:36 on Dec 27, 2014

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
So we finally have the long-awaited Johannes Histories. He seems like a pretty cool guy. If I read the ending correctly; Faysal knows that Johannes would have failed in the end, so he possesses Johannes to ensure he can complete the demesnes ritual and be able to fulfill his long-term plan for Barbatorem in the long run? I'm beginning to doubt whether I'm just being a dumb-dumb about this series or whether it is not always clearly written what is going on.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Tollymain posted:

odds that there's some twist yet to be found in this scene?

Faysal never specifically says on whose side he is; his statements can be interpreted either way.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Well, that was put to rest easily (no spoilers because they are the very first lines of the next chapter);

quote:

“When you say pests, or ‘help’, you wouldn’t mean, say, those imp things being pests and you helping us?” Peter asked.

“No,” Faysal said.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
I found out Wildbow has insight in low screentime characters and his writing process scattered around the internet. Mostly for Worm. Apparently there was a realistic chance Taylor would have died during Leviathan, as he rolled dice to determine survival for his mass extinction scenarios. His original choice was to have continued on as Aegis, but we see how that worked out.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
So under ideal circumstances, fighting a mortal practitioner in their own demesne should be near-impossible right?

Good luck Blake and co.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
"Ah, you see, but the fact that you cannot be killed is actually a weakness!"

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Well I didn't make it up out of nowhere; it was hinted at with the Sphinx. Others that are very long-lived tend to think on a longer timescale and may be more affected by demons. Presumable being human or something in a similar timespan makes you a bit more reckless and ready to do things long-lived Others might not see coming. I have no idea how that would apply to something like the Barber though.

BTW, Lola is still Padriac right?

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Completely true on all accounts. So, did the Barber just cut off the 'weak/dying' part of the dragon and essentially fabricate a new one? That is actually somewhat funny.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Same thing really; net result is that Blake murders the 'weak' dragon and the Barber spawns a 'strong' dragon.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Squinty posted:

The first chapter is dated December 24, 2014, so I guess he's worked on it at least a little bit.

I ended up skipping Pact since people seemed a bit disappointed by it, is it worth starting now? Seems like a good chance to build up a bit of a backlog for Twig.

It's not that Pact is bad, it's just that Worm was that good.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Best Worm line near the ending for maximum irony in the context;

This was it. Finally, everyone was working together.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Neurosis posted:

Also, cut out Contessa altogether or rework her power majorly.

I think a minor detail can easily make her power more workable. She can't see Endbringers in her path right? Make anyone that has been affected by the Simurgh a semi-blind spot. This allows for Cauldron to be immensely powerful in the early part of the setting, allowing them to gather the vast resources they have but ensures that by the time of Taylor Contessa can't just steamroll nearly everyone.

Also makes more sense that Cauldron would be more OK with an early end-of-the-world; besides losing capes to Endbringers after a while it just gets too complicated and impossible to keep properly Contessa-manipulating everyone.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Doctor w-rw-rw- posted:

She was dangerous enough to eliminate Scion, and she is no longer in her right mind.

That's a good point. You could argue that she only did what needed to be done against an unstoppable enemy; ends justifying the means but then you could say the exact same thing about Contessa taking her out.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
Cauldron doesn't work with governments directly because that results in following laws and poo poo or having public outcry and what not. They are a really small organization actually and either don't want to or could not deal with that. There most valuable resource is probably Contessa's time; better to operate from behind the scenes and manipulate key individuals than try to maintain public support (remember that these are the people that created the Siberian and Gray Boy).

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!
To be fair, I think part of the (meta) point of the PRT rating system was that it is based on potential threat level when facing capes out of the street. Dragon uses tech, ergo is a tinker. I am like 90% sure statements like that from Wildbow are responses to the semi-autistic Worm reddit community that doesn't quite seem to grasp that concept. So try to see his statements in that context as well.

For Masamune; I'd argue there is a big difference between reverse engineering and mass production. Dragon can copy other's tinkertech and modify it and play with it, but she is still limited by having to do superpower-maintenance on them (it's just that she can vastly outperform regular humans in the maintenance department, so net effect is she can field more stuff). I was under the impression when Masamune mass produces things they can actually be maintained by humans.

Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Milky Moor posted:

Eidolon sends Scion running through all kinds of worlds and pursues him. That's the most basic summation of what happens when he taps into the full extent of his power. Scion has no choice but to use PTV, giving him a moment where he can stun and then kill Eidolon. This implies that Scion has no other power that Eidolon was vulnerable to, even if one blast that hits Eidolon, and breaks him apart to such an extent that Uaine has to put him back together, is certainly several orders of magnatude less than what Scion presumbly blasts Behemoth and Leviathan with given their ludicrous amount of matter thing.

'Doesn't' is not equal to 'can't'.

It is extremely heavily emphasized that the entities, and especially Scion, has massive powers and almost 0 creativity. Repowered Eidolon was the first thing in a loooong time that gave Scion a run for his money. He probably could have used something else, but he panicked, burned of energy for PtV and did it that way.

Besides, Scion wasn't fighting just Eidolon. He had to PtV against Eidoon + GU.

I mean, I think Worm definitely has some flaws, and there are aspects of the story I ignore as well but Dragon and Scion are not points I think were logically inconcistent.

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Namarrgon
Dec 23, 2008

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Pavlov posted:

This is largely why I think Twig is his better story.

Speaking of which, I have this problem where I want to talk about Twig, but can't think of anything to say besides, "it's good I like it". Does anyone have any real opinions on it?

I think it's pretty dope.

It is very hard to say so far, as we are really quite near the beginning (or at least not even halfway). If this is going to get to Worm lengths we haven't even reached an Endbringer yet.

Anyway I like that, for now, we see a civil war from the perspective of the establishment and not the plucky young rebels. This on it's own is breaking the trope enough to be noticeable. I also noticed that some people commented that the 'Enemy' interludes are somewhat ambiguous in meaning. It could mean a) we see from the perspective of the Lambs' enemies, b) we see from the perspective of the Crown's enemies, c) we see the enemy Academy from the real good guys' perspecives or d) all of the above. I like it.

Now what I really liked from the recent chapters was the Duke. I don't know about anyone else, but for some reason it never really crossed my mind that the Royals would be heavily augmented. I just assumed they would be 'above' those things. So maybe just me, but that was quite of a surprise immediately followed by 'well duhh'.

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