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Engineer Lenk posted:Well, there's always the AMT... If you have to worry about AMT, you're making enough that you don't have to worry about getting put out onto the street.
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Jul 13, 2013 17:17
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Yond Cassius posted:There are a few edge cases where you can, in fact, be screwed by making more money, and if you're working in a university I wouldn't be surprised if someone (or someone's parents) has/have been. Usually they involve the cutoffs for large tax deductions or credits, and a lot of those have to do with tuition. Right around $52,000 and $80,000 there are a couple booby-traps where making an extra $1 can cost you, depending on your exact tax situation, and there's one at $80,000 where that buck that can cost you $1000 or more. In those situations you can pretty much always just sock another few $$$s into your 401k to avoid it though, right?
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Jul 13, 2013 17:17
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Yond Cassius posted:There are a few edge cases where you can, in fact, be screwed by making more money, and if you're working in a university I wouldn't be surprised if someone (or someone's parents) has/have been. Usually they involve the cutoffs for large tax deductions or credits, and a lot of those have to do with tuition. Right around $52,000 and $80,000 there are a couple booby-traps where making an extra $1 can cost you, depending on your exact tax situation, and there's one at $80,000 where that buck that can cost you $1000 or more. Tuition credits don't work like that. They phase out over the course of thousands of dollars of income. Virtually every income tax benefit works like this. I can't think of any situations where a person will end up with more net cash through income tax savings by forgoing a raise. Maybe at the state level (just because of how hosed up certain states' codes are) but not at the federal. Situations where raises can hurt you generally revolve around assistance programs, which are by and large hosed up. Engineer Lenk posted:Well, there's always the AMT... AMT doesn't work like that either. Admiral101 fucked around with this message at 20:19 on Jul 13, 2013 |
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Jul 13, 2013 20:16
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Admiral101 posted:Tuition credits don't work like that. They phase out over the course of thousands of dollars of income. Virtually every income tax benefit works like this. The credits are phased out in small increments, yes, but the tuition deduction, a really heavy hitter in the "crap, made too much money" tax sweepstakes, has a hard cutoff. It's weird that way, and like I said, it's a fairly unusual edge case. You'd have to be in the position of not qualifying for the credits but (otherwise) qualifying for the deduction. The credit phase-outs are much more minor, but you can find some situations where the intersection between IRA tax deductions and tuition credits means paying (slightly) more money in taxes than your raise/bonus is technically worth. It'd be less than $100 difference, and I think usually less than $20. State taxes do compound the problem, yes. OctaviusBeaver posted:In those situations you can pretty much always just sock another few $$$s into your 401k to avoid it though, right? Yes, provided that you can see it coming. Cassius Belli fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Jul 13, 2013 |
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Jul 13, 2013 21:14
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Admiral101 posted:Tuition credits don't work like that. They phase out over the course of thousands of dollars of income. Virtually every income tax benefit works like this. The affordable care act subsidies will function like that and have an extreme effect if you make $1 too much (could be $10k in extra cost if you go a dollar over).
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Jul 13, 2013 21:26
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Yond Cassius posted:The credits are phased out in small increments, yes, but the tuition deduction, a really heavy hitter in the "crap, made too much money" tax sweepstakes, has a hard cutoff. It's weird that way, and like I said, it's a fairly unusual edge case. You'd have to be in the position of not qualifying for the credits but (otherwise) qualifying for the deduction. The credit phase-outs are much more minor, but you can find some situations where the intersection between IRA tax deductions and tuition credits means paying (slightly) more money in taxes than your raise/bonus is technically worth. It'd be less than $100 difference, and I think usually less than $20. It does have a phase out, just not as gentle of one. The the phaseout goes from 4,000 deduction->$2,000 deduction-> -0- deduction. It definitely doesn't cost the taxpayer "$1,000 or more". At its worst, it'd be roughly $500. Situations where the tax cost is material virtually don't exist. Droo posted:The affordable care act subsidies will function like that and have an extreme effect if you make $1 too much (could be $10k in extra cost if you go a dollar over). I'd be interested in reading more about this if you can provide some kind of source. Are you referring to the penalty? Because the only time a penalty doesn't come into play is if you make so little money that you don't even have to file a federal tax return (and you'd have to have enormous amounts of income to hit a 10k penalty). Admiral101 fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Jul 13, 2013 |
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Jul 13, 2013 22:14
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Admiral101 posted:It does have a phase out, just not as gentle of one. The the phaseout goes from 4,000 deduction->$2,000 deduction-> -0- deduction. It definitely doesn't cost the taxpayer "$1,000 or more". At its worst, it'd be roughly $500. Situations where the tax cost is material virtually don't exist. e: You're right, I misread the page. Still, tripping into that $500 fall can be pretty nasty if you're not expecting it, and state income tax could be another $100+ depending on your state taxes and how they account for it (looks like the high end would be $186 in California). Cassius Belli fucked around with this message at 22:54 on Jul 13, 2013 |
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Jul 13, 2013 22:44
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Admiral101 posted:I'd be interested in reading more about this if you can provide some kind of source. Are you referring to the penalty? Because the only time a penalty doesn't come into play is if you make so little money that you don't even have to file a federal tax return (and you'd have to have enormous amounts of income to hit a 10k penalty). The issue isn't penalties, it's the subsidy phase-out. This is a good guide to the basic subsidy structure. The PPACA uses refundable, advanceable tax credits to cap premium costs for a decent health care plan at a percentage of your income, but only up to 400% of the federal poverty line. If you get a raise that pushes you up to 401%, all of a sudden you lose that 9.5% cap, and you're
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Jul 13, 2013 22:47
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Weddings always turn into a pissing contest over money, although in the area I'm in I've noticed it's the opposite-- who spent the least on their wedding. I've been berated by random coworkers for "wasting money" because I wanted to buy an actual new wedding dress instead of finding some white prom dress at JC Penney instead, and I'm spending a decent amount for a nice venue instead of just renting out the local VFW hall. But we can afford it without plunging ourselves into years of debt, so everyone can go gently caress off. There is no reason to go into debt to pay for your super extravagant wedding just to impress people. In my experience the people who throw weddings out of their means just to impress people end up divorced in less than five years. And they're not fooling anyone, people at their wedding will know them personally and know they're not loaded so what's the point? Also I think that destination weddings* are the most selfish thing people can do. "Come to my wedding! Use up your vacation days from work and buy plane ticket plus hotel accommodations at some overpriced resort just for us! I'm going to guilt trip you forever if you don't spend 4 figures to attend my wedding!" *i.e. weddings held at resorts in Hawaii/the cariibbean/overseas just for the hell of it and not due to proximity to family. Obviously people are going to have to travel to weddings regardless of location unless you're from some podunk little town and neither of you or your family members have ever moved away.
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Jul 14, 2013 16:50
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Aquatic Giraffe posted:Weddings always turn into a pissing contest over money, although in the area I'm in I've noticed it's the opposite-- who spent the least on their wedding. I get to see this side, too, because the majority of my friends have been getting married in the last year. They're 18-21 and in college (yes we are from the South and a strict Christian sect why do you ask). Needless to say, they don't have a lot of money. It's like a contest to see who can get it done the cheapest (but no courthouse weddings, that's just tacky, and Jesus doesn't approve). So far my favorite are the three sisters, 19, 20 and 22 who all got hitched in a 14 month time frame and wore the same dress  . I mean, that's pretty loving practical but it was hilarious because the exact same guests were at every wedding and I started getting a Groundhog Day vibe. Most of them are a formula of church + some paper streamers + a cake someone's mom made at the awkward alcohol-free reception. Yeah, I think there's a happy medium. I mean, ideally this is something you only do once in your life, spending a little money on it is okay.
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Jul 14, 2013 19:29
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Silly Hippie posted:True story: someone I know spent hundreds of dollars on personalized M&Ms for her wedding. In an event that was already hilariously over the top (a $2000 groom's cake; not even the drat wedding cake!), that struck me as some particularly poor decision making. I remember at the end of the night they were pushing bags of the things on everyone while they left. Just looked it up and 10 lbs of the little bastards cost $250. Or for the low low price of $405.99 you can get 144 M&M filled business cards drat, maybe I need to raise my prices. I have so many friends and family members that are horrible with money that it's almost absurd. My aunt makes about 120k a year and has 2 teenage kids. She's a super cool lady, but she's always stressing about money. She lives in a 300k house full of expensive poo poo, has 3 car payments on brand new bmws (two SUVs and a coupe), takes lavish vacations constantly, and never ever cooks at home. It's sit down meals 7 days a week. Both kids go to very expensive private schools. I was recently chatting with her and she was talking about how much she hates her job and how much she wants to quit and do something more inspiring for much less money with a nonprofit in her field. She actually came out and said "I wish I hadn't bought all of this crap because now I'm a slave to it." I felt bad for her, but I don't think she's going to change her lifestyle. Speaking of wedding chat. My wife and I had a pretty nice wedding for $1200 total. She even made her own dress. That said, I kind of wish I had splurged a little more on the honeymoon.
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Jul 14, 2013 22:22
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Leroy Diplowski posted:"I wish I hadn't bought all of this crap because now I'm a slave to it." Well that's a pretty powerful thing for someone to say and changes must be pretty close if they're willing to admit that to other people and themselves.  Edit: I think our wedding is costing about $3300 in total. Including 1300 in flights from Edmonton to Halifax. We refused to skimp on the photographer so that was 1350 right there as well (I'm a snob). Other than that I think we're doing ok!
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Jul 15, 2013 01:34
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I knew a guy who came from a family who was obsessed with thrift, frugality, and being utter misers about everything. The parents were some flavor of high-dollar engineers, and they were probably clearing close to $200k in an area with a low cost of living and where $200k can buy you a 4 bedroom house in a gated neighborhood. And they were utterly cheap, to the point where I cannot see them being ever satisfied with their finances. I have no idea what they do with their money. This guy was getting married, and in addition to being cheap, he's an insufferable douche. His bride was shopping for a wedding dress. Bride's father told her to literally pick any dress she wanted from this one store she liked out of town (which probably tops out at $3k or so). She chose one for $800, which those of you who have shopped for wedding dresses know that's about 'middle of the road'. On her drive back, this dude berated her to the point of tears over the phone and demanded she tell him how much the dress was. Once she told him, he freaked out and demanded she go return the dress, and that she was being selfish and vain for wanting a wedding dress. Well, dude, first off, you're not paying for it, it's a gift from her father and he didn't say "I'll give you $3k for a dress, buy what you want and keep the rest". So it's not like if she spent less, there would be more money available for other things. Second, it's none of your drat business. And what kind of weirdo looks at a bride and clucks their tongue at a $800 wedding dress? He also didn't want to buy her a ring. At all. Told her she was selfish for wanting expensive jewelry (like a wedding band?). They got married a couple years ago, despite protests from literally every one of the bride's family members and people who care about her. It's going to be the worst few years of her life. I think that's an example of someone who is bad with money on the opposite side of the spectrum. People like that set such ridiculous expectations that they cannot enjoy the fruits of their labors. It's possible to be a slave to an extreme, miserly attitude just like being a slave to debt. Bonus dickhead story: The wife had a miscarriage. He smugly said at a family dinner at her parents' house shortly afterwards, "Well, it's not MY fault. I did MY job  " 
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Jul 15, 2013 15:55
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canyoneer posted:Bonus dickhead story: The wife had a miscarriage. He smugly said at a family dinner at her parents' house shortly afterwards, "Well, it's not MY fault. I did MY job No jury would convict her, goddamn. I think it's an example of someone being good with money, but terrible at living.
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Jul 15, 2013 16:35
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FrozenVent posted:No jury would convict her, goddamn. That story is possibly the saddest thing I've heard. He's putting the money above everything, including his wife's happiness. Getting berated over a wedding dress, drat.  Is it bad that I immediately thought after reading that 'at least when she divorces him she'll get half, which considering his attitude will be quite a significant sum'? As an aside, that really reads like financial abuse. Would anyone like me to do a post about the subject in this thread sometime? It might be useful for anyone worried about their friends or family I used to read "frugal lifestyle" blogs. For the most part they were normal people who were doing it for reasons such as they never knew any other way or they were worried about the environment, but there were some who obviously had some serious issues surrounding money and just kept stocking up their emergency funds out of paranoia. I stopped reading after I read a post by somebody who said they couldn't attend a wedding or a family holiday because she 'couldn't afford it' despite the fact she was completely debt free, stocking up her retirement funds to the max and had plenty left over. She admitted she told people she was poor and couldn't go because she didn't want anyone knowing she had money. I found it so sad that somebody was so willing to deprive themselves constantly for 'someday', yet never stopped to smell the roses. Family and friends don't live forever, enjoy the time you have with them.
froglet fucked around with this message at 02:34 on Jul 22, 2013 |
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Jul 15, 2013 17:17
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froglet posted:I found it so sad that somebody was so willing to deprive themselves constantly for 'someday', I know a guy who's a multimillionaire who still digs through dumpsters for cans. He is so frugal it hurts, but never really enjoys his money. It's really a sad way to go through life, hoarding money and digging through trash but never enjoying the fruits of your labors.
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Jul 15, 2013 18:25
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froglet posted:I used to read "frugal lifestyle" blogs. For the most part they were normal people who were doing it for reasons such as they never knew any other way or they were worried about the environment, but there were some who obviously had some serious issues surrounding money and just kept stocking up their emergency funds out of paranoia. I stopped reading after I reading a post by somebody who said they couldn't attend a wedding or a family holiday because she 'couldn't afford it' despite the fact she was completely debt free, stocking up her retirement funds to the max and had plenty left over. She admitted she told people she was poor and couldn't go because she didn't want anyone knowing she had money. I found it so sad that somebody was so willing to deprive themselves constantly for 'someday', yet never stopped to smell the roses. Family and friends don't live forever, enjoy the time you have with them. I read two such blogs - Mr. Money Mustache and Early Retirement Extreme - and both of them advocate a frugal lifestyle in order to be able to retire early. Which I think is a fantastic goal. Mine is different though, as I won't be able to retire early unless I get a significant raise in income soon. Rather, I save as much as I can so that I can leave my future kids and grandkids as big of an inheritance as possible. I want them to have a good life, and not have to worry about taking out giant-rear end loans for college or ever find themselves in a situation where they are living paycheck to paycheck. If that means I don't enjoy the fruits of my own labor, so be it. I'm a minimalist anyway, and it doesn't take much to make me happy. (That said I would never do retarded poo poo like berating my significant other for buying a $800 wedding dress. Special events like weddings/honeymoons are worth spending some money on. Especially honeymoons.) Slow News Day fucked around with this message at 18:59 on Jul 15, 2013 |
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Jul 15, 2013 18:57
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froglet posted:I found it so sad that somebody was so willing to deprive themselves constantly for 'someday', yet never stopped to smell the roses. Family and friends don't live forever, enjoy the time you have with them. To me, that's just as sad as people racking up piles of debt in their early 20's on clothes, booze, furniture, and autos that will hobble them for the next 20 years. There really needs to be a balance between spending money like there's no tomorrow and saving money like there are only tomorrows. Why can't people just happily live within their means? For content: I know an individual who bought a car without telling his wife. He is a cop now, and his employment history was 3 years of no job (with 2 kids), and then 4 months of police academy and literally 2 weeks at a police department, then quit the PD and began another year of unemployment. During his years of unemployment, he would take 6 credits a semester at the community college, working towards a degree. He's just over 30. They were on public assistance and food stamps the entire time, with his pregnant wife finding babysitters for the kids when she'd go to work at a retail job whenever they had hours for her. He couldn't watch his own children, you see, because he had so much schoolwork to do for 6 credit hours of community college "intro to writing" and "vampires in literature and pop culture" courses (I am not making that up).  After his first paycheck with the PD and with a new baby days away, he goes to a dealership in town and buys a 4 year old Expedition with 80,000 miles on it for almost $20k to replace their aging sedan. It's got all the upgrades, and a lot is broken in it. Power windows are not working, the back left door doesn't open, etc. That's about 7 months' net salary, folks. Fortunately, they were able to give it back to the dealership and instead got a sedan that 3 car seats barely fit inside. Good job?
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Jul 15, 2013 19:29
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canyoneer posted:To me, that's just as sad as people racking up piles of debt in their early 20's on clothes, booze, furniture, and autos that will hobble them for the next 20 years. It may be just as sad, but it's definitely not just as bad. Extreme frugality is much easier to abandon - you just start spending some money. Whereas with extreme spending comes extreme debt, and that can cripple you for years, sometimes decades.
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Jul 15, 2013 20:25
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enraged_camel posted:I read two such blogs - Mr. Money Mustache and Early Retirement Extreme - and both of them advocate a frugal lifestyle in order to be able to retire early. Which I think is a fantastic goal.  One of us should totally make a general Frugality/Early Retirement thread. (and by "one of us" I mean you) 
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Jul 15, 2013 21:20
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froglet posted:
I'd love to see a financial abuse post. Maybe a new thread about raising kids to be smart with money or money and psychology or something.
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Jul 15, 2013 21:40
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I'd also be interested in a financial abuse thread, even if I expect it's going to be as all poo poo.Leroy Diplowski posted:Maybe a new thread about raising kids to be smart with money or money and psychology or something. The psychology of money would definitely be an interesting subject, it's obviously a source of anxiety and a mean of escape for a lot of people - "Retail therapy" and all that - but for it to be worthwhile it'd have to be well researched and founded in fact.
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Jul 15, 2013 22:17
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Extreme frugality: my uncle is a wealthy man, no kids, he and his wife are successful, live on the Puget Sound, drives a Porsche, etc. But he has moments of extreme frugality that are either insane or brilliant. For the latest example, he decided he hated paying the fee to park at the airport, and he didn't want to pay for a taxi. So he got in his beater Corolla, drove a mile away from the airport, parked on the shoulder, and put a FOR SALE sign on his car. Then he walked the mile to the airport entrance. He left his real number because he was curious about the response, and he wound up getting calls all week. I guess he saved $150 but he risked getting his car towed. The car was fine when he came back.
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Jul 15, 2013 22:19
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_areaman posted:For the latest example, he decided he hated paying the fee to park at the airport, and he didn't want to pay for a taxi. So he got in his beater Corolla, drove a mile away from the airport, parked on the shoulder, and put a FOR SALE sign on his car. Then he walked the mile to the airport entrance. He left his real number because he was curious about the response, and he wound up getting calls all week. I guess he saved $150 but he risked getting his car towed. The car was fine when he came back. I was hoping this story would end with your uncle selling the car to someone at the airport before his flight. Still a pretty cool thing to do, if you get away with it.
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Jul 15, 2013 22:22
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Gotta weight it against the attorney fees you'll have to pay for when you get brought up on terrorism charges.
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Jul 15, 2013 22:24
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At the Sydney Olympics in 2000 there were some guys that brought a caravan and parked in on the road, getting a ticket every single day. But when they were asked about it, they said the ticket was cheaper than getting a hotel room and this way they had a way better spot, so it was worth it.
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Jul 15, 2013 22:47
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Cicero posted:Sup Mr. Money Mustache buddy Yeah a Financial Independence thread would be great. "Early Retirement" is such a loaded term.
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Jul 15, 2013 23:11
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HookShot posted:At the Sydney Olympics in 2000 there were some guys that brought a caravan and parked in on the road, getting a ticket every single day. But when they were asked about it, they said the ticket was cheaper than getting a hotel room and this way they had a way better spot, so it was worth it.
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Jul 15, 2013 23:14
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tuyop posted:Yeah a Financial Independence thread would be great. "Early Retirement" is such a loaded term. I like 'financial independence'. I don't think I would quit my job or anything, but not having to worry about getting fired/not being able to find another job/etc is invaluable. I like working, it's just nice knowing I'm not chained to someone else's desk.
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Jul 15, 2013 23:30
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froglet posted:As an aside, that really reads like financial abuse. Would anyone like me to do a post about the subject in this thread sometime? It might be useful for anyone worried about their friends or family I would enjoy this as well.
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Jul 16, 2013 00:02
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 Warning: I'm going to be talking about financial abuse here, so if you dislike reading about that stuff, go look at pictures of hedgehogs or somethingWhat is financial abuse? Financial abuse is not always, but often associated with other kinds of domestic abuse, such as verbal or physical abuse. Financial abuse can include the following:
Who is most likely to be a victim of financial abuse? Sadly some of the biggest victims of financial abuse are the most vulnerable, such as the elderly or disabled. However, it can happen to anyone and in any kind of relationship, including between parents and children. Many cases of domestic violence involve some aspect of financial abuse, including holding assets such as cars or houses exclusively in the abusers name. Holy cow, that sounds like what's happening to me! Please get out. Go online and have a chat with a local counselor or social worker or talk to a friend or family member who would be willing to help you. Consider opening up a new bank account and having mail delivered to a friend or relatives house or to a P.O. box. Holy cow, that sounds like what's happening to my friend/relative! If your friend or relative is incapable of managing their finances themselves, you may need to speak to a social worker specialising in working with the elderly or disabled. They've most likely dealt with similar situations dozens of times before. If they're in a bad relationship, there is really not much you can do unless they want to leave. There's all sorts of resources online for people who wish to help friends or relatives, so I won't go into much depth here. Ensure your friend or relative knows that you're there to listen to them and hopefully they will turn to you or somebody they trust when they're ready to leave. How do I avoid this happening to me if I become unable to care for myself or my financial interests? Thankfully, there are lots of things you can do, such as set up a trust or a power of attorney to look after your best interests (I believe you can set it up so nobody can just unilaterally decide to siphon all your money away to the Canary Islands, but ymmv, check with a Real Lawyer, etc etc). Here in Australia we have the Public Trustees, who are often asked by the courts step in when a person is unable to look after their own affairs. However, plan for this so if you're hit by a bus and your family needs to take money from your account to pay the for the mortgage they're not left in the lurch. Comedy option: spend all your money so you don't have anything worth taking. froglet fucked around with this message at 08:18 on Jul 16, 2013 |
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Jul 16, 2013 03:05
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Thanks for that post, Froglet.  In the instances I've been involved in, financial abuse is often framed as "for the good" of the abusee and the abuser is seen as the "helper" - for instance, a mother ruining a child's credit with false accounts because "the lights need to stay on, food needs to be bought, it's for their own good." It's milder than the more controlling forms of financial abuse, but it takes advantage of an unequal relationship and exploits a child's love and ignorance of potential harm. It took me until I was about 20 to fix my credit, until this last year to fix my relationship with my mother, and occasionally a lost collections account still shows up.On a lighter note, let's talk about my dad, King of Commerce. Bought a wreck of a house house in Shitsville, CA in 2001 for $130,000. Allow me to copy the description I wrote for the PYF Awful Roommates thread: Trilineatus posted:Just to paint a more solid picture of this fiasco, this house is in a lovely central California city, was built in 1902, renovated in 1971 to add the wet bar, and not touched since. Delicate single pane original windows that shattered one by one, you had to alternate plugging in the dryer or the stove into the same outlet because nobody wanted to change the fuse box. The shower stall broke (too many lead paint chips down the drain) so we set up a ghetto shower in the clawfoot tub - the intermediary zone between that clunker project was the tub and a pot from the kitchen you used to pour water over you. The PG&E guy refused to let us touch our own octopus furnance, and gave me his personal number to call him to come out and relight it if it ever went out. I don't think we ever lit it again over the winter, we just drank to keep warm. During the height of the housing boom, the house was worth around $390k just due to sheer size. At the moment, it's worth approximately $90-110k. He's never QUITE been upside down on it. He refuses to sell it for less than he bought it for (he has always been lucky flipping real estate before this) and keeps trying to convince my brother and I that we should move back to the Foreclosure and Unemployment Capital of California to live in it. Did I mention it's in a trust for his offspring as a shelter from his bankruptcy and my mother's drug addiction? He pours around $1200 into this house every month because he pays hazard insurance on it after the absestos covered garage fell into the Walgreens parking lot. Why does that $1200 matter so much to someone who makes around $75k? Got remarried at age 42 and had two more kids plus a step kid, but never managed to live in the same city/county as his wife Why is this bad financial planning? Well, he lives in the Central Valley, and she lives in Coastal LA - this is about a 4.5 hour drive. They estimate they spend between $600 and $800 on his commute on the weekends alone. Additionally, he pays the $1200 mortgage on the shack, his $600 rental in the city he actually works in (did I mention the shack stands empty most of the time? He lives three hours away from it), as well as the $1600 rent for the house his wife and three youngest children live in. The two youngest are 2 and 4 and daycare costs are currently $400 a month to my teenage stepsister for essentially being a stay at home mom for the 2 year old and $650 a month for the 4 year old to be at a daycare center. My stepmom pays through the nose to keep us all in health insurance, which ain't cheap for a family of seven. It essentially breaks down that his first check of the month is entirely rent, her first check of the month is entirely healthcare/retirement/childcare, her second check is household maintenance like groceries/clothes/transportation, and their "emergency fund" is my dad's second check (which always gets used somehow since they have two crappy cars, two young kids, and an idiot teenager who just broke an ankle playing roller derby).  Who knew it was possible to live paycheck to paycheck while making around $140,000 a year combined?I've had them call me and ask me to borrow money until their next paychecks. I make around $25k a year in graduate school. To their credit, now that my stepmom handles repayments, she is always good for it. Before, my dad would borrow money and go "eh, I fed 'em to adulthood, I figure they probably owe me." Yeah, jackass, thanks for making me use a bucket to shower in a drafty shack during my teenage years t  Edit: The friend I'm staying with (an old friend from high school) tells me I should add commentary about the bees too. You see, the shack has a hive of bees of it's very own, going strong since 2001 when we bought the place. It was a small hive at first, around the old iron drain pipe at the back of the house. Now it is a thriving fifteen foot long hive inside the back wall of the house between the siding and the redwood lathe. I lived in the back bedroom for a year, and you can actually hear them humming through the walls sometimes. It was almost soothing, just don't open the window. (That room also almost gave me heat stroke once while I was working nights, because the temps in there reached 130 while I was sleeping, cause you know, you can't open the windows). My dad spoke to a bee removalist recently, and was quoted $2k for the murder of the bees and the removal of their bodies and honeycomb. The conversation went something like this:  : How much to get rid of the bees? : That'll be $2k to kill the bees and remove their bodies and the honey and honey comb so it doesn't stink up or damage your walls, sir.: No, I mean, how much to just kill the bees?: Oh, $1000 is allocated for that, but you can't just kill the bees. If you leave them there they will stink and rot and damage your drywall.: Good thing we have plaster and lathe then.It seems he is learning to be frugal at last 
Mocking Bird fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Jul 16, 2013 |
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Jul 16, 2013 14:28
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froglet posted:How do I avoid this happening to me if I become unable to care for myself or my financial interests? In the US, I believe every state has a public licensing program for fiduciaries. These individuals work under strict laws and guidelines and exist to ensure that the elderly and the disabled are not being ripped off. Here's a licensing page for Arizona, which explains part of the process. http://www.azcourts.gov/cld/FiduciaryLicensingProgram.aspx
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Jul 16, 2013 18:53
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The financial abuse talk hits a little close to home. I could fill this thread with stories of my parents. At six years old my mom would dump on me, complaining about all of my family's financial woes (when I had only recently grasped the concept of capitalism). My father once said to me, "budget for entertainment first, and everything else will fall into place". When I got my first job as a paperboy at 10 years old they began borrowing money from me, and it continued through when I had credit cards (it took me a long time to realize how much they were loving my future, and even if they did pay me back I was being raped by interest that they weren't going to pay). But the worst stories come from my parents' plan for retirement, which was their grand agenda for their children's life. My father, who had a brief career as a Christian recording artist, was training his sons to be the next Osmonds or Jackson 5. As soon as my brother and I showed musical talent he wouldn't stop talking about how he couldn't wait until all of us were older and we all could play instruments, so we could start a band. Education was ignored (I technically finished high school, but being home schooled I never actually received a diploma, or started college until last year - it was worse for my brothers, for whom any kind of attempt at education wasn't even executed), big plans were made for when we'd be "the next Beatles", and my parents could finally retire, since they had never put any money away - my mother would be looking at houses on the Sotheby's website that we would buy as soon as we became overnight successes. So, we all got together as a group of "clean cut, all-American young men" who were going to "change the music industry". I was stuck (there was a lot of emotional abuse and conditioning and e/n stuff that doesn't belong here), and my parents were convinced this was God's plan for our family, who all spent every single day together, seeing as how we were all homeschooled and my father worked from home. The best story is also the final one, when I'd finally had enough and told my parents the idea they'd pursued for the past few years was complete and total bullshit. They had taken a $20,000 from a "private investor" (I still don't know how it happened or why anyone would go along with that), and used it to drive across the country to Los Angeles, live in a hotel room for two months, and shop the band around to record labels and industry people, because "they'd put us in front of people, and of course everyone will love you guys when they see you!" I refused to go, and yet they still bought me a plane ticket in hopes that it would change my mind. When they came back empty handed (who didn't see that coming?), they blamed me, saying that because I wasn't there nobody wanted to sign us, and to pay back the loan my father would have to work for the rest of his life, and that I ruined his chance at retirement. So much money has been wasted on this awful pursuit, and yet they're still throwing away any sense of retirement and their children's future to chase after something that's been a money pit for ten years now.
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Jul 17, 2013 01:50
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Cicero posted:Sup Mr. Money Mustache buddy I would love to, but I'm on vacation until end of July. So guess who will have to create the thread!
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Jul 17, 2013 07:52
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froglet posted:go look at pictures of hedgehogs  lookit those little hedgehogs. Good post on financial abuse, but the hedgehogs are a real winner.
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Jul 17, 2013 08:53
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enraged_camel posted:I would love to, but I'm on vacation until end of July. So guess who will have to create the thread! http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3560269
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Jul 17, 2013 11:09
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canyoneer posted:In the US, I believe every state has a public licensing program for fiduciaries. These individuals work under strict laws and guidelines and exist to ensure that the elderly and the disabled are not being ripped off. When somebody is obviously incapable of looking after themselves usually the family or social services will step in to ensure that nobody takes advantage, while I think the real danger lies for people who are functioning on a day to day basis but might not have the ability to make informed, complex decisions about their finances. Victimisers pick out people they know may be feeling a bit lonely or isolated, such as the recently bereaved or people with few friends or hobbies, proceed to earn their trust, then exploit it. Abuse can fly under the radar for months or years because it may very well look like normal activity - twenty or forty dollars might not seem like much, but it can really stack up over time. Trilineatus posted:Thanks for that post, Froglet. Oh yeah. I doubt financial abuse is any different from any other kind of abuse - there will always be people justifying their actions or blaming the victim for 'letting it happen'. I find the whole subject unsettling due to the very real possibility of somebody misplacing their trust and losing it all. froglet fucked around with this message at 11:47 on Jul 17, 2013 |
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Jul 17, 2013 11:44
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froglet posted:When somebody is obviously incapable of looking after themselves usually the family or social services will step in to ensure that nobody takes advantage, while I think the real danger lies for people who are functioning on a day to day basis but might not have the ability to make informed, complex decisions about their finances. Victimisers pick out people they know may be feeling a bit lonely or isolated, such as the recently bereaved or people with few friends or hobbies, proceed to earn their trust, then exploit it. Abuse can fly under the radar for months or years because it may very well look like normal activity - twenty or forty dollars might not seem like much, but it can really stack up over time. Yeah, I understand. My intention is to say that if you encounter individuals who you suspect are victims, there are public resources out there to help that you can direct the victim or people who care about the victim to. Many people don't know that these resources exist.
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Jul 17, 2013 13:26
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The Banana Pee posted:The financial abuse talk hits a little close to home. I could fill this thread with stories of my parents. At six years old my mom would dump on me, complaining about all of my family's financial woes (when I had only recently grasped the concept of capitalism). My father once said to me, "budget for entertainment first, and everything else will fall into place". When I got my first job as a paperboy at 10 years old they began borrowing money from me, and it continued through when I had credit cards (it took me a long time to realize how much they were loving my future, and even if they did pay me back I was being raped by interest that they weren't going to pay). Well that's loving cooky/depressing. Sorry you had to go through that.
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Jul 17, 2013 14:17
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