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Based on discussion from the Badass Thread, this is a place for us to discuss the worst creative runs on certain comics. That one year or so (if you were lucky) where everything in your once-favorite comic became utterly unreadable. I'll start it off. Luke Cage: Power Man #28-35 by Don McGregor Funny thing about this run. #29 isn't by McGregor, but Bill Mantlo. It's the infamous Mr. Fish fill-in issue and while it's silly as hell, it's still a gigantic breath of fresh air compared to the rancid bread that's sandwiching it in. Luke Cage's 70's series started out as a fun ride about a blaxploitation superhero fighting the most over-the-top villain designs writers could come up with. It was energetic and goofy and all get out, but that screeched to a halt once McGregor took over. For six issues that felt like twelve due to the never-ending narration, McGregor decided that Cage should be worthless and everything about his world should be super depressing. To start, Cage fights a guy named Cockroach Hamilton who has zero powers. He's just a guy with a six-barreled shotgun. He's able to take a punch from Cage because of lazy writing. This sets the theme for the six issues as Cage's super strength appears to be all but shoved into the backseat.  Every other panel from this run features narration about how much New York City sucks. There's a story in there about Cage fighting a racist pyromaniac villain who ends up killing a black kid and for all the issues that follow, we see Cage and the family grieve with no actual point to it. At one point they're written out by simply moving away, I believe during one of Cage's fights. Like he's fighting a dude, looks over, sees them getting on a bus and feels bad. Just as bad, McGregor introduces a character Quentin Chase, a bland FBI agent who is on Cage's case because all of his villains end up dying in some way or another. Chase is blatantly McGregor's attempt to get a spinoff series (he's admitted as much), except he's in no way interesting and does zero of note except nag Cage relentlessly. McGregor left Power Man during an arc that was finished by Marv Wolfman. After that, there was no mention ever again of Quentin Chase, that dead kid or anything else from this lovely run. The series got enjoyable again for its remaining year before merging with Iron Fist's book, which also ruled.
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Jul 30, 2013 19:58
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I don't want to step on Waterhaul's toes, but try to explain your point of view more than just mentioning runs. Lot of good stuff so far, though.E the Shaggy posted:Howard Mackie's Spiderman run in the 90's-2000's. Part of me wants to read the entirety of Mackie's Spider-Man run just to see how many times he loses his place. The guy always tends to come up with some truly interesting comic book concepts, but can't write his way past it. You know that scene in the Room when the mother says she has cancer and it's never mentioned ever again? That's Howard Mackie as a writer. The most memorable to me was this awesome storyline concept he had in 2000 of Spider-Man vs. Venom vs. the Sinister Six. Venom just came back after two years of zero comic book appearances (shocking in its own right) and insisted on joining the Sinister Six. They didn't take kindly to this and betrayed him. Venom decided that he was going to pick them off and kill them one by one. Spider-Man would try to fight them both off and stop anyone from dying. Any capable writer could turn that into a really cool story. Not only did Mackie fumble around on it, such as the issue where Venom "killed" Sandman, but he didn't have a single ending in mind. Venom just kind of stopped with no explanation.
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Jul 31, 2013 02:27
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delfin posted:Can't believe I haven't been beaten to the end of Thunderbolts Vol. 1. The weird thing about this is that it wasn't even BAD. It was actually a really solid story arc that could have worked as its own miniseries, but it had literally nothing to do with Thunderbolts outside of the main theme of villains turning themselves around and the use of Thunderbolts supporting character Man-Killer. I've always thought of "Fightbolts" as the Halloween 3 of comics, only if Halloween 3 came out four movies later. If anything, the big question was who was supposed to buy this? Thunderbolts fans were turned off and new readers didn't know enough about Thunderbolts to pick it up anyway. A year ago, the worst run for Thunderbolts would have probably been Andy Diggle's. It wasn't a terrible run so much as it was just a bunch of setup and no payoff. It took Warren Ellis' take on the series and removed all the more interesting characters, cutting the whole thing at the knees. Putting in Mr. X turned out to be a strike against it as although having someone other than Frank Tieri write the guy was nice, he only works in an antagonist role. Making him as a member of the team means having to figure out a new way to counter his powers every single issue. On the upside, Diggle did give us the modern version of Ghost, who I already miss. As of now, the worst run for Thunderbolts would be the beginning of the new volume, written by Daniel Way (who I will be mentioning a couple more times in this thread). First off, putting Frank Castle on the team, even before Rucka's Punisher run was over, caused Rucka to leave Marvel in a huff. Then there's the fact that I can't tell you a single solid thing about his run. Just vague half-ideas. Red Hulk is trying to make amends for something he was involved in and... Crimson Dynamo's son is involved and Elektra's brother is behind it all. And the Leader is red now. As a guy who loves Thunderbolts, Venom and Deadpool, it hurts to see how below average this run was. The one redeeming thing about it was Deadpool's threat to Castle: "You may kill me first, but I loving guarantee that I'll kill you last."
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Jul 31, 2013 04:26
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The funniest thing about JMS Spider-Man is the Spidey Sense bit. There's a scene during one of the Civil War tie-in issues where Iron Man asks if Spider-Man senses any danger. Spider-Man gets frazzled because how does he know about Spidey Sense?! Probably because Peter flat out told him about it earlier on in JMS' run, but his answer is "mustache-twirling Tony Stark" anyway.
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Jul 31, 2013 04:40
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Madkal posted:One title I was going to comment on that I have read was Way's Venom, but I think Gavok is probably saving up for a really (hopefully) big entry about that steaming pile of crap so I might as well leave it to him. But it was a steaming pile of crap. Man, what a steaming pile of crap was Way's Venom run. When people say "what is that steaming pile of crap of yonder?" the answer will always be "that's Way's Venom run". Because it was a steaming pile of crap. Might as well. So as everyone can probably figure out by now, I've read nearly every Venom comic appearance there is. Of all those comics, without a doubt the worst comes from this. Venom (2003) #1-18 by Daniel Way  Venom went two years without a single comic appearance until Howard Mackie brought him back for Spider-Man. After a year's worth of stories where Venom did a big pile of nothing while acting like he was totally going to do something, Venom vanished into the ether yet again. It was another two years of absence before Marvel announced a new Venom series as part of the Tsunami line. I'll list the main points of what was wrong with it, but first a quick look at what goes down. The first five issues are a knockoff of John Carpenter's the Thing. The second five issues are about Venom in either Alaska or Canada where he fights and briefly assimilates Wolverine. The next three issues are a flashback to explain stuff while bringing up even more questions. Then the last five issues take place in NYC where Venom fights Spider-Man, Nick Fury... and Venom. Which brings us to the first problem. 1) The comic isn't even about Venom. At least, it isn't about THE Venom. We find out far down the line that this is a clone of the Venom symbiote. The real Venom (and Eddie Brock) don't appear until the flashback story in #11. This isn't a damning point on its own because it could have worked in the right hands. Then again, clones are the last thing the Spider-Man corner of the Marvel universe needed. 2) It's incredibly mean-spirited. Loads of innocent people killed. An entire town wiped out. The hero is constantly tortured, abused and shown to be worthless while at no point having anything resembling a victory. At no point is evil punished in any way. 3) It's disjointed and confusing. Here's my best attempt at explaining the plot. The tale of Noah's Ark is based on a situation from thousands of years ago when a bunch of nanites came to Earth to wipe out humanity. At the last second, they decided not to and left. A batch of nanites didn't get the memo and were stranded, trying to figure out a way to kill all humans. They took the form of a guy named Bob with a bushy mustache. With a series of cloned twins (who don't know that they're cloned), he waits it out for years until a guy sells Venom's dismembered tongue on eBay. Bob steals the tongue, gets scientists to clone it and lets it loose. The idea is that this Venom symbiote clone will somehow cause the apocalypse. Meanwhile, the original nanites come back from space to stop the offshoot Bob. Rather than actually tell him to stand down, the good nanites take the form of an Agent Smith knockoff named the Suit, who is intent on killing the clone creature. At times, the Suit is really Bob in disguise, giving our hero and Venom clone host Patricia bad advice. 4) The good guys suck. Every hero in the series is incompetent and/or an rear end in a top hat who ends up on their back. The only characters who know what they're doing are the Venom clone (who is practically a slasher villain) and Bob. Bob even proceeds to humble Nick Fury and pressures him into calling him "sir". 5) Wolverine survives a nuke. Forget that Nitro thing from Civil War. Wolverine has a nuke dropped on him and all it proceeds to do is knock his shirt off and knock him out. This is right after a cliffhanger where the Suit's weapon (a weaponized smartphone, years before smartphones were a thing, which itself is kind of cool) zapped him into being a skeleton. Wolverine naturally came back from that in-between the last page of that issue and the first page of the next. 6) Venom Frenches the Thing.  7) It has a complete non-ending. It ends at #18 and it's written as if it was a huge surprise to Way. The storytelling is so rushed that you can't even tell what's going on at all. The quick version is that the two Venoms meet, merge together and the singular Venom jumps through a wall, bigger than ever. Whether Patricia is dead, assimilated into this or left naked in the aftermath is never explained. Bob is out there, happy that everything is going according to plan and nobody cares. It's never been brought up again, not even by Way. The only reference to this series is that Mighty Avengers arc with the Venom Bomb. When Iron Man's looking at a list of symbiote host alumni, it namedrops Patricia. I've written more detailed looks at the series here and here.
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Jul 31, 2013 23:58
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Or is it Sputnik posted:Notable for the issues after after Clone Saga up to JMS' run were many concepts that were never again touched upon. Apart from the Nobody Goblin and Venom "killing" the Sinister Six that Gavok went into, here are some things off the top of my head: There's also the annoying Venom-eats-Carnage story. Venom breaks into the Vault, kills some guards and beats up Carnage. He eats the symbiote to make himself more powerful. On Venom's side, all he does is beat up Spider-Man and not kill him because "Wait, Carnage is trying to fight its way out! I'll be back later!" After that, his supposed power boost is never mentioned again. Cletus Kasady is still alive and when Mackie feels the need to bring him back as Carnage, he has him simply find a new, red symbiote in the Negative Zone. IT'S LIKE LANDFILL NEVER LEFT! Everyone ignores that whole mess because Toxin makes more sense if you do. The issue also had a cliffhanger where Spider-Man's unconscious on a rooftop with Jameson, who's reaching for the mask. Mackie proceeds to forget about this plot thread and towards the end of the run sweeps it under the table by having Jameson shrug and say he didn't look under the mask because of reasons.
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Aug 2, 2013 02:37
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Metal Loaf posted:The story right after the Sinister Six one was a Carnage story, except it wasn't really, it was just Cletis Kasady running about New York in his underpants covered in red paint brandishing a knife. Which I pray is the plot for Amazing Spider-Man 3.
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Aug 2, 2013 02:53
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SiKboy posted:If I remember right Whedons run also had a lot of delays even though it was a short run, which really didnt help my enjoyment of it. Yeah. Whedon's run's problem was that it was 12 issues worth of ideas shoved into 6 issues and took at least a year for it to come out.
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Aug 14, 2013 18:28
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TwoPair posted:I'd say the beginning of the end was the Fear Itself tie-in books where he did that godawful cut-in interview poo poo like I was watching a loving reality show, but apparently some people actually liked that, so whatever. It was a stupid thing because it was a gigantic waste of Bacchalo's art, but it was played to perfection in the issue where Daredevil joined the team, which I think is safe to say the last good Bendis Avengers issue. Lurdiak posted:Well you know, he was made provisionary director of the Thunderbolts under heavy surveillance because of that time Tony decided to... mind control him into shooting an atlantean guy... for no reason. And in that position, he shot someone in an all-out war with people dying all over the place. People still make the "He shot the Skrull Queen so he gets the promotion" argument? I know Thunderbolts isn't the most popular book out there, but it is the book that Norman starred in, so it's pretty important. A major part of why Norman was pushed up the ladder was because he had the most success against the Skrull threat. He didn't use Stark-based technology, so he and his forces were able to save Washington DC. That's kind of a big deal. Being broadcast as killing the Skrull Queen was just the icing on the cake. As for Dark Reign, I enjoyed it, mainly for Dark Avengers. Dark Avengers is a pretty amazing book if you look at it as being about what happens when anti-heroes fail to follow-up on the anti-hero path. Ares is warned not to join the team, but does anyway because he doesn't see anything wrong with it. He's the only one with any success in that even though he dies a horrible death, he still dies a good guy. Norman Osborn tries to save the Sentry, which would in turn save himself, but fails on both accounts and ruins everything. Noh-Varr realizes he's on the wrong team and proceeds to merely run away from his problems. Bullseye is the most interesting in that playing the hero really gives him some meaning and makes him genuinely likeable, but then in one moment we see him throw it all away.
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Aug 16, 2013 07:21
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Jerusalem posted:Something I've been quite curious about, is Noh-Varr the same guy from Grant Morrison's Marvel Boy mini? Because I sort of had the impression he was but whenever I read him he seems NOTHING like the character from that mini. Are you reading Young Avengers? Because if not, you should be reading Young Avengers.
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Aug 17, 2013 05:04
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Just something to add to the Children's Crusade hate: So Allan Heinberg wrote the big 13 issues that introduced the Young Avengers and then went off to do TV and stuff. Marvel was so happy with his work and couldn't wait for him to do the third chapter in his Young Avengers trilogy of stories that they made them HANDS OFF to other Marvel writers. Sure, the writers could use the Young Avengers, but they weren't allowed to do anything with them. This is the same line of thinking that turned helped turn Prometheus into the shittiest of characters because DC Comics didn't want anyone touching Kevin Smith's precious Onomatopoeia. They did a handful of Young Avengers minis during that very lengthy window. They had two Runaways crossovers and one that was a series of spotlight one-shots (including the important-in-retrospect issue by Fraction where Hawkeye and Hawkeye first meet up). But the most memorable moment of HANDS OFF was when they did a Dark Reign miniseries that introduced a darker team of Young Avengers. A big pile of nothing happened, as the core concepts of the team couldn't be messed with, so none of the Dark Young Avengers could join the main team. In fact, it ended on the biggest anti-climax where one of the main characters, Coat-of-Arms has a dream about her and a chibi Green Goblin dance together in some kind of reference that went over my head. The Dark Young Avengers then went on to appear in Avengers Academy and that's pretty much it.
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Aug 18, 2013 05:07
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Small Frozen Thing posted:Byrne hates 4chan because they organized a raid on his creepy hugbox forum. The objective was to express polite and reasoned positions that ran counter to his, and watch how long it took him to flip his poo poo and start banning like a madman. It was drat fun, one of the few 4chan memories I still look back on fondly. Well? How long did it take?
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Oct 16, 2013 02:18
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bobkatt013 posted:Runaways had three writers. Their was Vaughan which was great, Whendon which was okay, and Moore which I heard was terrible. Moore wasn't even terrible. He was just... average. He was average and that just isn't good enough for something with the momentum that Runaways had. I realize I never got around to this, but I guess I should talk about the worst Deadpool run. After his first ongoing series, it seemed like the worst Deadpool run went to Frank Tieri, who was around for two story arcs. To be fair, they weren't all that terrible overall and had some strong moments (Deadpool's funeral issue for one), but there were two parts that really chafed me. One was in the first story, where Deadpool is brought back into Weapon X, realizes they're a bunch of assholes and rebels against them. This story turned out to be bullshit due to Sabretooth killing Deadpool's then-and-original love interest Copycat with zero repercussions because he's not going to be killed off and even if he was, it wouldn't be by someone like Deadpool. Deadpool then dies and even when he's brought back, he doesn't even care about all the bullshit Weapon X has put him through. Weapon X is built up to antagonize Wolverine and Deadpool is meant to move on, like it's a bad wrestling angle. Then he did the story Funeral for a Freak, which was a cute idea. Deadpool's dead and there are four guys claiming to be Deadpool running through the streets. There's a superhero, a murderous vigilante, a violent psycho and a charismatic pop culture MC. It all led to the reveal that T-Ray was behind it all and upon being defeated, Deadpool said that this proved that he was the true Wade Wilson after all. Not only did his logic make no sense whatsoever in terms of storytelling, but Tieri decided to completely negate Joe Kelly's awesome ending (where we found out that T-Ray is the original Wade Wilson and Deadpool stole his identity) out of spite. But the REAL worst run of Deadpool, as far as I'm concerned, goes to Daniel Way. After his run on Venom, I never wanted to read another Way book. Then he did the Deadpool arc in Wolverine: Origins and I read it out of curiosity. It was fantastic. It was several issues of wacky/violent Deadpool antics followed by an emotional issue where we get to see why Deadpool resents Wolverine so much. It blew me away. If this was Way's audition to write the new Deadpool series, then by all means! He started out strong, too. The first year was really good, outside of an unfortunate crossover with Thunderbolts. The Bullseye-as-Hawkeye arc was easily the highlight of the whole run. Then the problems started. First, Way decided to redo the same exact story that the last two Deadpool ongoings have tried, which is, "I'm tired of being seen as just a murderer. I want to be a hero now!" Then he started screwing up his own storytelling. For instance, there's a good storyline where he tries to join the X-Men and ultimately makes the X-Men look awesome in the public eye by antagonizing them on TV. Since he's seen as a bad guy, they come off as great heroes by thwarting him. He did a heroic act by sacrificing his need to be seen as a hero. Great! Then in the next storyline with Spider-Man and Hit-Monkey, Deadpool outright admits that he doesn't see the difference between being a hero and being seen as a hero. It's like he simply regressed in character development between stories. Way also brought up a subplot where Deadpool was seen as a traitor to the human race by siding with the Skrulls. This was national news. It was brought up an entire one time before being completely forgotten about. From there, the comic really dropped off. Way would drag you along by promising interesting story concepts and then having nothing happen. Instead, everything would hit an anti-climax and roll to the next storyline with the continued promise that something was going to happen. Also, while Way's humor quality dropped, his emotional quality became nonexistent. Kelly's run had a storyline where it was revealed that Deadpool would shove Blind Al and later Weasel into this dark room filled with sharp objects called the Box, which was treated as being on the same level as if he raped them. It was a traumatic, horrible thing that Deadpool would do and he came to terms with his past actions and was eventually forgiven. So of course Way has Deadpool ruin Weasel's life for hilarious, selfish reasons and shoves him into the Box as if it's a cute thing he does from time to time. I stopped reading around the time he was locked up in an English psychiatric ward and from what I've heard, it didn't get any better. I remember flipping through the final issue, which treated T-Ray as a throwaway villain. I think Deadpool was attacked by a SHIELD agent whose life was ruined by Deadpool's actions and he responded by bitching her out and making her cry. Then Evil Deadpool shows up to reveal he's not dead after all, just as a last minute way for Way to undo his status quo of Deadpool having lost his healing factor. The fact that Way was writing Deadpool's series during the character's most popular era was salt in the wound. Also, considering there were so many Deadpool comics being written at the time, Way's stuff really felt far from spectacular in comparison.
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Oct 30, 2013 22:18
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Suben posted:Part of the reason Way's Deadpool run is so bad, too, is that it basically completely got rid of his supporting cast. Weasel showed up a bit but as you said Way did his best to ruin that relationship for cheap comedy. I can't remember if Blind Al showed up at all and I don't think Sandi and Outlaw appeared either. Yeah. I forgot to talk about the mental tics that Way introduced. One was "Pool-O-Vision", which luckily trailed off after a while. The idea being that we see what kind of cartoony madness Deadpool's psyche sees. This started out as a great gag in the Wolverine: Origins story, mainly for seeing Steve Dillon draw Wolverine in a Tex Avery style. Then there was the time he kissed Thunderbolts Black Widow (who was really regular Black Widow in disguise) and told her he loved her while in his eyes she looked like Death. Otherwise, the gimmick never brought anything to the story and felt like a stand-in for humor. The worst thing was creating the Deadpool inner dialogue. Deadpool's supporting cast became the yellow thought bubble and the white thought bubble. Two non-characters to have dialogue with him while never actually leading to anything. That's why the Posehn/Duggan run is so brilliant. They understand the need for a real supporting cast, but know that people are used to the inner dialogue. That's why they created Agent Preston and had her shoved into Deadpool's mind. There's an actual story in there and a feeling of the voice coming from a sympathetic character.
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Oct 31, 2013 03:47
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eightpole posted:Didnt the supreme power books introduce like two new sets of super heroes that were totally not Spider-Man and captain america and so on and just disappeared the superman clone? That series was rather interesting. It was written by Howard Chaykin (not illustrated, thank God) and the first six issues had barely anything to do with the established Supreme Power characters with a couple minor exceptions. It introduced not-quite-Marvel characters in a Marvel comic, with their powers coming from the same source as the not-quite-DC characters. I think this was when Ultimate Nick Fury was still in the Supreme universe. Hyperion and the rest reappeared in the second arc, which was actually quite readable, but nobody cared anymore. Any chance the series had at an audience was driven away by the first few issues being all Halloween 3. muscles like this? posted:I believe that was when they tried to keep the series going after JMS ditched out (because it was supposed to be temporary) but they didn't want to use his Hyperion. I don't think they were trying to appease JMS, since that shitfest Ultimate Power took place after the big Supreme Power cliffhanger.
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Nov 2, 2013 02:19
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Lurdiak posted:I had completely blocked that garbage out. It might count as a Worst Run of the Squadron Supreme concept in general. Yeah, like I obviously have problems with Daniel Way's work, since I've mentioned him thrice in this thread, but while his Nighthawk mini wasn't setting the world on fire, it was okay for what it was. If anything, I was impressed with his character Whiteface. Supreme Power was about taking DC characters and making them hosed up. How do you write a hosed up version of the Joker? Way actually pulled it off and had a handful of scenes that were genuinely chilling. Other than that, it was a forgettable footnote in all things Squadron Supreme. Ultimate Power, though? A collaborative effort between Bendis, JMS, Loeb and GREG LAND? The comic that gave us the most blatant "this is totally from porn" trace job Land's ever done? Yeah, that was pure poo poo.
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Nov 2, 2013 03:07
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Codependent Poster posted:So the people who died in Avengers Arena are dead for real. Which includes Juston, Mettle, Red Raven and Reptil. Chris Powell lived and got his amulet back. Bendis immediately whisked away X-23 who Hopeless didn't even use in the last issue, probably thanks to Bendis stealing her out of that loving stupid book. And it ends with Arcade being drawn as an attractive guy with wine and unopened condoms laying around a hotel room implicating that he's totally awesome and is going to get laid so much and he won, and he did it just to get views on youtube. It sounds to me like the series was a more coherent version of Daniel Way's Venom, only it had an effect on the mainstream.
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Nov 29, 2013 00:58
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Suben posted:The way I've always heard it is that they were not only working from a vague outline of Morrison's ideas but from an outdated outline at that because Morrison basically kept his actual plans very close to the vest (which is, imo, kind of a lovely thing to do if you're working on the tentpole event comic of a shared universe but whatever). To go with that, from what I understand, the Mary Marvel thing was something created for Countdown with full intent to bring her back to normal by the end. Morrison kind of liked the Evil Mary Marvel idea and decided to include it into Final Crisis. Then they rewrote the ending of Countdown where she went evil again as a way to match up with it.
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Jan 3, 2014 07:05
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Suben posted:The problem is that Cyborg has like three decades across multiple reboots and various outside appearances (i.e. cartoons) of being a really loving boring character. It says a lot when the least boring he's ever been was a cartoon where he really didn't have much of a personality beyond a one-dimensional Slightly Goofy Black Guy Who Shouts "Aw yeah" deal. I'd argue that he was more interesting on Superfriends. Granted, I don't remember too much about his role in that season, but I do remember him sulking over the fact that with all the heroes who have been on that show, he's the one who is physically unable to have a secret identity and has to live his life as a half-metal freak. He was basically the closest thing the show had to Ben Grimm.
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Jan 6, 2014 02:55
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Suben posted:I know it was a big part of Kelly's run on Deadpool with two characters from it (Zoe Culloden and Montgomery) being fairly important supporting characters. I don't think either of them has shown up in a comic since Kelly's run though. They were at Deadpool's funeral during Tieri's run.
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Jan 13, 2014 00:12
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bobkatt013 posted:Has their ever been a mutant who had a hideous deformity and never had the poor mes? He just accepted how he or she looked and did not give a gently caress how anyone else thought of them? His name is Rockslide and he is the best.
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Jan 13, 2014 06:12
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mind the walrus posted:and yet he got a prominent role in a movie before Emma Frost. There is no justice in this world. Hey, man. The Generation X movie came out in 1996.
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Feb 9, 2014 23:23
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With the new RoboCop movie, I figure I should talk about the comic Terminator/RoboCop: Kill Human by Rob Williams and PJ Holden. There have been a lot of RoboCop comics from all sorts of publishers. Marvel did a 23-issue series that was really fun. Frank Miller's RoboCop vs. Terminator is the one comic that challenges Dark Knight Returns as my favorite Miller work. Then there's the RoboCop series based on Miller's original ideas for RoboCop 2, which was dull as hell. But nothing compares to the terribleness of Kill Human. It reads like Williams had an outline filled with 3-4 halfway all right ideas and never came up with anything past that. It starts in the future where there's only one human left. She stumbles upon a Skynet museum and accidentally wakes up RoboCop. He protects her from the T-800s, but has no idea what the hell's happened. As he connects into a computer with his spike, Skynet forces him to shoot the last human in the head against his will. RoboCop is horrified and pissed off, also mad that according to Skynet, there are now zero humans in the world when he's standing right there. He downloads information on how this came to be, downloads the directions on how to travel through time and does so. Skynet allows this because he's a robot and is therefore on their side. RoboCop then goes back to the time of Terminator 2, tells the Connors, "Come with me if you'd like to live. You have ten seconds to comply," and he tries to prevent the horrible future. That right there is a good start. A good, new direction to take the crossover concept. Then everything completely falls apart. It turns out that RoboCop went back further in time. He met up with college graduate Dick Jones and gave him the specs for the ED209, making them allies. That in itself puts the timeline into question because if Jones is that young and the robot apocalypse happens after RoboCop is shut down for good, then how old is John Connor supposed to be when the war is going on? Hell, we already know that he's going to lose the war anyway, so why is he even important? The whole Dick Jones alliance was created so RoboCop had a way of countering the T-1000. It's all for naught, as it escapes containment anyway. Then everyone is put on a series of aircraft carriers to keep them protected and that doesn't work out either. RoboCop's end game is to ultimately allow T-1000 to kill John Connor just so he can wipe him out with Dick Jones' special metal-killing acid. Everyone ends up dying except for maybe Sarah Connor. So there you go. A crossover where the climax is that RoboCop would murder a child for the greater good. And you know what? We don't even know what the greater good is supposed to be here. He tells the Connors earlier that the events of Terminator 2 don't do anything to prevent Skynet's takeover. He never says why, nor does the comic ever let us know. RoboCop's master plan is to do all the poo poo they did in the normal timeline (destroy both Terminators, the mangled up arm and the computer chip), but also create an army of ED209s and get a ton of people killed, including John Connor and Dick Jones. There's no logic whatsoever. Gavok fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Feb 19, 2014 |
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Feb 19, 2014 20:47
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| # ¿ May 10, 2024 01:09 |
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Valiant did comics for Mario, Zelda, Captain N and Game Boy. The Mario and Zelda ones were based on the cartoon versions. The Game Boy one was based on smoking a lot of crack. They also did at least one big one-shot that featured stories for Punch Out and the like. Meanwhile, Nintendo Power had their own comics for Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Star Fox and then some random one-shots like Blast Corps. Some of them were released in trade.
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Feb 20, 2014 05:36
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