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Sup thread. I'm a Russian citizen living in Germany and I can probably answer culture-related questions with some accuracy. I'm not very up on very recent stuff, but pre-2001 I can at least give a rough idea. For what it's worth, my German partner seems completely untroubled by the rise of fascist groups in Europe, but Germany is probably the safest place to be in Europe, if you want to avoid fascist gangs.  As for the British fascists, they are and will always remain a joke, thankfully. Britain will elect Thatcher but it would never elect Oswald Mosley and thank god for that. I don't think fascism is going to make the sort of wide-spread comeback that would have me fleeing for Canada, but it never really went away, it just bided its time. I'm very upset about the situation in Russia, since it means I cannot go back there without literally putting my life in danger. I'm not sure what I'm going to do about my citizenship, now, I have to formally renounce it in Russia if I want to give it up. weavernaut fucked around with this message at 00:47 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 00:45
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| # ¿ May 10, 2024 18:50 |
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I'll admit that it's been two years since I was last anywhere near the British Isles (I'm an Irish citizen) but the situation didn't seem as bad back then. poo poo.
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Aug 10, 2013 01:08
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Yeah, it's 100% true. De Valera was a piece of poo poo.
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Aug 10, 2013 01:20
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From forever back, but there's a misconception that I feel I should correct. The NPD is a laughing stock. I think they got like two seats in Parliament and can't do poo poo there. They don't even have election posters up right now. Compared to the Golden Dawn or BNP or whatever? loving amateurs. No, seriously, Germany's got far-right thugs, but it's in no danger of them getting any further into government or into any sort of power. Someone will Godwin them before long and they'll slink off. The rest of Europe and the former USSR have forgotten (or seem to have forgotten), but Germany remembers. I'm pretty sure most fascist marches are met with antifa marches. I'd be joining antifa organisations if I could loving walk, frankly, pacifism be damned. The difference between fascists and me is that I'm knocking in heads that could go on to outlaw me and mine, while I don't give a poo poo who the fascists gently caress, who they marry, who they descend from, where they're from or what language they speak and will knock in the head of anyone who dares suggest those things matter and make our hypothetical fascist a danger to society. EDIT: the Battle of Cable Street was amazing and inspirational. weavernaut fucked around with this message at 14:12 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 14:08
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They're still a laughing stock. Just a better-organised one than the BNP?  No, seriously, I've heard no news of right-wing violence in Germany, especially not on the scale of Hungary, Greece, Russia et al, so posting photos of the NDP to prove me wrong when I say that Germany is very much unlikely to go fascist is idiotic. Germany is stable and the last time it was unstable was directly thanks to the Nazis. They're not keen on repeating the experience.
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Aug 10, 2013 14:31
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Well, poo poo. I was genuinely unaware of any of that, because I'm in Western Germany.  I withdraw my previous comments.
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Aug 10, 2013 14:59
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Coriolis posted:
I hope you mean forward-thinking as in people who want to prevent this sort of scum from grasping hold of power and "the shape of things to come" as "poo poo we need to be still vigilant for".  I do not understand fascists and neo-Nazis in particular. Germany got chopped up into little pieces and utterly wrecked, after bulldozing most of continental Europe and committing genocide. What part of it screams "successful ideology"? What part do they want to emulate? The shame their descendants will carry? Urgh. I hope they all fall down open manholes. I try to have empathy and compassion for every human being, but it's drat loving hard to have such for people who would see me dead and my people eradicated. (Ahem. It's a super interesting link, thank you for it! I have a paradoxical fascination with fascists and Nazis/neo-Nazis. I guess it's kind of like poking roadkill with a stick. Except sometimes it turns out the roadkill isn't dead.)
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Sep 26, 2013 11:32
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So, who wants to see how a modern neo-Nazi party works?
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^^^Backfired how? Did the Mafia unite with the Italian equivalent of the Resistance or something? I didn't know that about the Volkswagen! I know a lot of poo poo the Nazis did allegedly well, like the Autobahn[1], was an elaborate propaganda exercise, but I didn't know the details. I agree with you that fascism is basically organised crime that wants to be on the ballots. I had a point somewhere about how fascist parties are always accompanied by a paramilitary arm, but that was also true of Sinn "we're basically communists" Fein, so I don't think it's exclusive to fascists or a mark of fascism, but it does seem to be a common theme. Which reminds me, has anyone here seen Bertholt Brecht's The Resistable Rise of Arturo Ui? It's a fantastic allegory of the rise of fascism/the NSDAP in Germany, as portrayed by Chicago gangsters.  Brecht had a very interesting approach to making a point, so you do get hammered over the head with it, but it's a fantastic, chilling play.And this bit from the epilogue is relevant now, as it was when the play was written: Bertholt Brecht posted:Therefore learn how to see and not to gape [1] The Autobahn is fantastic and far-reaching now, but 1930s Germany needed a motorway system like a fish needed a bicycle. Nobody had cars. Apparently nobody got cars, either and the Autobahn couldn't support tanks, either, IIRC, so it was all a big propaganda thing.
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Sep 26, 2013 11:55
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It's kind of hilarious of how poorly fascism works. Or would be, if not, you know. That whole mess.
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Sep 26, 2013 12:07
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What were the dates? When was the program implemented and when was the due date for the first wave of cars bought by installment? Because I think what you described counts as pocketing the money and blaming the war. We could go ask the Nazi thread in A/T, I guess, but I'm a bit scared of them.
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Sep 26, 2013 12:16
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I learned about it as the Beerhall Putsch. High school history was a long time ago, but didn't Hitler literally stand up on a table in a loving tavern and announce he was taking over Bavaria?
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Sep 29, 2013 17:42
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Yeah, no, I'm not gonna honestly believe that an ideology based on chauvinistic racism is not gonna produce mass slaughter should hell freeze over and the stars align again. Never loving again.
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Sep 29, 2013 19:21
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The Weimar thought it had bigger problems than Hitler. 
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Sep 29, 2013 22:06
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Yeah, but early 1920s NSDAP didn't look like a threat in the least, when you have the whole world breathing down your neck to repay a debt for a war you didn't start and sure as hell didn't finish. I still think a portion of the blame for the rise of Nazism lies with the Allies for driving Germany into such a condition, just like Germany et al are to blame for the conditions in Greece right now, which certainly contribute to the rise of GD.
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Sep 29, 2013 22:25
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Also, I'd wager there's a significant amount of people who are no fans of anything even vaguely left-wing or populist, after the USSR. Though I imagine there are very few fans of capitalism left, too. I'm gonna stop now, because this topic feels me with incoherent rage.
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Sep 29, 2013 23:30
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ReV VAdAUL posted:Austria had a general election the other day and the far right "Freedom party" secured 21.4% of the vote: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-24321045 this makes them the third largest party in the legislature and due to a grand coalition seemingly the official opposition. They're not third by much either with the two bigger parties getting 27% and 23% respectively. Well. Never going back to Austria, either, looks like!
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Sep 30, 2013 17:24
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Skin colour and culture are not serious obstacles to business partnerships, friendships, romance and peaceful co-existence, why do you think they are, what loving planet are you from. 
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Sep 30, 2013 21:16
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I'm a Russian immigrant, of Slavic/Tatar descent, living in Germany, previously having lived in Ireland for a decade. I'm also converting to Judaism, but I'm not ethnically Jewish by descent (as far as I know, one side of the family's history is forever lost, since nobody talked about anything and then died). You're still Nazi scum.
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Sep 30, 2013 21:35
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Istanbul is full of SCARY BROWN PEOPLE, guys. Keep up. 
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Sep 30, 2013 21:39
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Emden posted:Okay so you've lived in fairly white countries. Russia, Germany, Ireland. All good places. So you've probably never had to interact with a non-white person before. So let's talk about culture. Dude, I just said I was part Tatar. I'm white, but my grandfather and his family aren't. They're also about as Muslim as my other set of grandparents are Orthodox Christian, which is to say kind of, if something is really wrong or there's a funeral/wake. A good portion of people in school that I hung out with were other immigrant children (mostly from the Philippines, but also Pakistan, India and various parts of the Middle East). My partner's younger brother was adopted from India, as were a couple of his cousins. Ireland actually had a fairly good amount of immigrants when I was still in middle and high school equivalents. My partner and I currently live in a college town in an area heavy on Turkish and FSU immigrants. Where the gently caress did you get the assumption I've only ever interacted with white people? If your solution to intolerance is segregation, you're a moron. Segregation doesn't increase tolerance. Also, apparently you know poo poo-all about European demographics. weavernaut fucked around with this message at 21:57 on Sep 30, 2013 |
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Sep 30, 2013 21:55
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Captain_Maclaine posted:He's a Nazi, he knows poo poo-all about everything dude. How can he not loving know about the large Middle Eastern immigrant presence in the EU, though? Jesus gently caress, aren't all right wingers pointing to Europe as being taken over Islamofascism? Why does he think Russia is entirely white, did he miss the huge chunk of Russia that's in Asia? Has he not ever looked at a map?Strudel Man posted:Without talking about what 'ought' to be, the persistence of racism, bigotry, and religious violence in societies across the globe seems like a fairly strong demonstration that cultural differences frequently are an impediment to peaceful coexistence. It can be accomplished, but it ain't easy. And yet NYC hasn't imploded. (Humans, unfortunately, tend toward an us-vs-them mentality, but as seen the world over, that mentality is harmful and usually leads to bad things. So our goal should be to find ways to overcome such mindsets and work towards peaceful coexisting with others without stomping out anyone's culture.)
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Sep 30, 2013 22:05
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I've honestly never encountered anyone both so ignorant and so certain that they were in the right. Not even online.
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Sep 30, 2013 22:07
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Emanuel Collective posted:What makes Ireland white? 120 years ago there was open debate as to whether the Irish and Spanish could even be considered white. Should Irish and Spanish immigrants to america have been committed to ghettos and kept there? Hell, ditto Slavs. And Italians. And Greeks. I can go on.
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Sep 30, 2013 22:45
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| # ¿ May 10, 2024 18:50 |
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If Emden is representative of modern fascists and neo-Nazis, I think I can rest easy, they won't be flattening the continent again any time this yuga.
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Sep 30, 2013 23:26
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