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You two are making me really want to get my copy of Pacific played so I can argue the merits of it 
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Sep 11, 2013 21:13
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The invasion scenarios are only 2 out of the ones available (a river crossing and a beach landing): it was actually one of the selling points for me and I think it would be hard to do the pacific theatre justice without at least one invasion scenario. I got to try one of the Napoleonic 20 battles yesterday on Vassal (Bussaco 20) and it was a lot of fun. The combat resolution is kind of swingy but it does reward good strategy/tactics and the system is easy enough and quick enough to play that the inherent swingyness of the system doesn't actually detract from the game. I can't imagine that the game takes much more than an hour to play in real life. As well as that, it didn't take that long to learn the system either: it does have a few quirks, though, like the fact that you are required to attack if you are in an EZOC and all enemies that have an EZOC on you have to be attacked. Still, makes me feel better about my (yet unplayed) purchase of Fading Glory.
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Sep 12, 2013 10:25
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Anyone wanna try and finish our hanging AA/Cuba Libre games on Vassal this weekend?  Edit: also can any of you guys recommend a really good samurai war game Dre2Dee2 fucked around with this message at 21:17 on Sep 12, 2013 |
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Sep 12, 2013 19:32
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Dre2Dee2 posted:Anyone wanna try and finish our hanging AA/Cuba Libre games on Vassal this weekend? Look up Sekigahara, Samurai (GMT), Samurai Battles, or Ran.
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Sep 12, 2013 23:48
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Got to try one of the easier Combat Commander: Pacific scenarios with another goon on Vassal and I can already see why people like this game. We stumbled through some of the rules but overall it was relatively easy to play and a lot of fun. Can't wait to give it another shot.
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Sep 14, 2013 00:54
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It was actually surprisingly easy to play once we got going, I had some apprehension going in since the rules are a svelte 24 pages but everything is set up in a very consistent and intuitive way. Oh and that rulebook owns. Really easy to look things up in when you need to. Highlight of the game was my glorious troops bravely charging through my own minefield to get into melee with the enemy 
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Sep 14, 2013 09:23
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VoodooXT posted:Look up Sekigahara, Samurai (GMT), Samurai Battles, or Ran. I've not been able to get my copy to the table yet, but some of my wargaming buddies have said good things about A Most Dangerous Time. I tend to like Tetsuya Nakamura games though, which might be why they recommended it. And you could always get in on the preorder for Warriors of Japan-it's been languishing for years now, but it just got a big push, and I'd really like to see it hit print.
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Sep 14, 2013 14:28
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 So France might fall within the year, maybe, all because the delay rolls went my way pretty heavily(I went with a risky front-loaded approach that paid off in spades). Without airpower, it's very difficult for the Germans to make a lot of progress in France quickly, though they'll eventually win under a huge weight of 3-step units. The longer it takes, the longer it takes for him to get to Axis Tide 2. The Maginot Line seems like the best approach over the long term, as opposed to modernization which only nets you an extra interceptor. The problem is, the French don't usually have a lot of time to build up every possible step.
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Sep 14, 2013 22:35
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So, is there anything you guys are looking forward to that should be coming out soon? Personally I can't wait for Cuba Libre to come out but other things I'm looking out for are the GMT deluxe edition of No Retreat 2, Fields of Fire getting reprinted and the Hunters to come out as well as for the new No Retreat based in Italy.
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Sep 15, 2013 20:31
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I'm looking forward to the OCS:Korea reprint, but it's MMP, so "soon" could mean "2050". A las Barricadas!, a tactical hex and counter about the Spanish Civil War (with expansions adding the Rif war (!) and the international brigades, Condor legion, etc). It was on MMP's P500 equivalent but they dropped it, and Compass Games picked it up instead. Sounds like it should be reprinted over the next little while. e:  Niko Eskubi counters 
Paper Mac fucked around with this message at 20:39 on Sep 15, 2013 |
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Sep 15, 2013 20:36
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Those are some nice counters. I've played the GMT Spanish Civil War operational game and I liked it quite a lot, it's a bit scripted but not too much and does seem to be able to replicate the war pretty well. The weird thing about it is that at set times you lose units from the front so you always need to find a way to rotate new troops in before the others go away. It was pretty easy to pick up as well.
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Sep 15, 2013 20:59
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Cuba Libre, A Distant Plain and Fire on the Lake are all stuff I'm looking forward to. I also preordered Sekigahara reprint and No Retreat!: The Russian Front reprint. Rising Sun, an ASL module that will cover the Pacific Theater, is coming out soonish. Eventually I want to get Crucible of Steel and Blood and Jungle by Bounding Fire Productions (more ASL), but that's further down the pipeline. I think that'll do me for war games for a while 
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Sep 16, 2013 00:44
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Oh, another thing I forgot to mention (and that I'm only interested because I got into Red Winter) is Operation Dauntless which is based on a similar system to Red Winter. The only doubts I have about it is that the scale of the fight is much larger (in terms of units present) and that, of course, a much more detailed anti-tank system needed to be implemented. However, the rules examples seem pretty good so I'm keeping up hope.
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Sep 16, 2013 10:49
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Personally, I'm a bit wary of it - I think it might lack both the unique accents and simple elegance of Red Winter. I mean, look at these playtest counters:  So. Much. poo poo. Still, I really hope Mr. Mokszycki knows his poo poo, since I really enjoyed Red Winter. Lichtenstein fucked around with this message at 13:28 on Sep 16, 2013 |
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Sep 16, 2013 11:37
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Yeah, I'm hoping they cut down on some of the stuff on those, but in terms of readability it isn't too bad as long as you know that stuff on the top is AT firepower with superscript range. It's why I've said that I'm a bit worried about it, although it still looks like it might be a good game.
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Sep 16, 2013 11:42
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Sekigahara, A Distant Plain, and Cuba Libre all came in the mail today! Sekigahara has 87 stickers and pieces to sticker on them  At least it's not like how Guns of Gettysburg has tiny pieces, and the game looks really pretty when things are stuck on.
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Sep 17, 2013 20:57
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I think Guns of Gettysburg was more effort, but Napoleon's Triumph was more annoying. Stickers do not stick well to metal pieces, I ended up having to use glue to make them keep on and it was a god-drat mess. I've never had the pleasure of having to stick C&C/Other block games though. Have fun!
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Sep 18, 2013 10:07
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The stickers usually hold quite well. I'm still trying to muster myself to sticker C&C Exp #6, though - mostly because I also need a new tackle box for it.
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Sep 18, 2013 15:41
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Tekopo posted:I think Guns of Gettysburg was more effort, but Napoleon's Triumph was more annoying. Stickers do not stick well to metal pieces, I ended up having to use glue to make them keep on and it was a god-drat mess. I've never had the pleasure of having to stick C&C/Other block games though. Have fun! Ugh, Napoleon's Triumph's metal was so bad for those stickers. Sekigahara got stickered thankfully; the wooden blocks are big enough that it really was pretty quick to do everything, even though I think it had more pieces than GoG perhaps.
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Sep 18, 2013 17:25
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I just superglued it at first and things seem like they've stayed on just fine.
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Sep 18, 2013 18:20
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I washed the metal pieces to remove any release agent that might have been on them and then painted on a couple of coats of gloss varnish. If they come off 
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Sep 18, 2013 19:37
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At least there are two sheets of stickers, one to stick on and realise the adhesive is crap, and one to glue on yourself..
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Sep 18, 2013 20:01
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I ended up using superglue as well but I did make a huge mess of it, although I guess it looked okay in the end. GoG was more effort but in the end, much easier. I'm pretty lazy though when it comes to preparing my games (sorry, no clipped corners for me!).
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Sep 19, 2013 12:01
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Perhaps you have not yet discovered the joy of the corner radius punch? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vN3KAH0GN5o
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Sep 19, 2013 18:51
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And what exactly does that accomplish? I hear it helps on wear, but I don't see how?
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Sep 19, 2013 18:58
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Counter-clipping has both an esoteric and exoteric significance. Upon inquiry, many initiates will claim that counter-clipping "reduces wear" or "stops counters from snagging on one another in adjacent hexes". Some insist that corner fluff has anticancer properties, others that removing it prevents the accumulation of disease and removes the otherworldly handles by which ghosts or djinn monkey with the counters between sessions. The inner meaning of counter-clipping, however, is related to the experience of war. Orderly, together, in their natal frame, the counters are physically attached to one another. Here they are happy, beautiful, impotent. It is only when punched, then clipped, shorn of their umbilical corner fluff and thus all memories of the womb-frame, that they can descend into the madness of the battlefield and deal death. There are deeper levels of meaning, but they are inarticulable and available only to the high-level counter-clipper.
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Sep 19, 2013 19:15
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Paper Mac posted:Counter-clipping has both an esoteric and exoteric significance. Upon inquiry, many initiates will claim that counter-clipping "reduces wear" or "stops counters from snagging on one another in adjacent hexes". Some insist that corner fluff has anticancer properties, others that removing it prevents the accumulation of disease and removes the otherworldly handles by which ghosts or djinn monkey with the counters between sessions. The inner meaning of counter-clipping, however, is related to the experience of war. Orderly, together, in their natal frame, the counters are physically attached to one another. Here they are happy, beautiful, impotent. It is only when punched, then clipped, shorn of their umbilical corner fluff and thus all memories of the womb-frame, that they can descend into the madness of the battlefield and deal death. There are deeper levels of meaning, but they are inarticulable and available only to the high-level counter-clipper. 
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Sep 19, 2013 19:17
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Just take a gander at this: http://boardgamegeek.com/image/1774845/admirals-order-naval-tactics-in-the-age-of-sail-
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Sep 19, 2013 22:38
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Ship counters with removable masts for dismasting!!
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Sep 20, 2013 04:43
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Just finished sleeving all my CC:E and CC:P cards: Europe does indeed come with a tray so it should be easy to get the counters off the sprues once I can be bothered.
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Sep 20, 2013 22:38
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Putting all the counters from Europe in the included tray is probably harder than just doing baggies. I did it when I got the game and after a couple games decided to order some more. I have one tray per nationality plus a system markers tray.
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Sep 20, 2013 23:47
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Just had a look at the A Distant Plain cards and they seem rather off-putting, strangely, but it isn't Labyrinth-level bad in terms of how the conflict is characterized. I'd like to try the game just to see how the coalition/govt dynamic works but it's becoming more and more unlikely that I will actually buy the game. There is more conflict between govt and coalition work, especially since the govt is detached from their usual job of creating support and instead just care about control/and patronage of course. Warlords seem more of a balancing mechanism but they seem to have more affinity with the govt rather than the taliban although there are events which help warlords/govt or warlords/taliban. I should have some time next week/weekend to give it a try on Vassal. I'm starting to look forwards to Fire in the Lake now.
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Sep 22, 2013 22:42
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What do you mean by "off-putting"? Mechanically, or content/theme?
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Sep 23, 2013 02:03
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Paper Mac posted:What do you mean by "off-putting"? Mechanically, or content/theme?
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Sep 23, 2013 13:06
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Just curious, what's so bad about Labyrinth (except mechanics)? I had it and thought it was pretty good, but then again, I'm not used to the current level of wargame quality.
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Sep 23, 2013 13:54
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On my side, it was the issue that it attempted to replicate how Twilight Struggle handled the Cold War, but without explicitly saying so. Twilight Struggle works on the assumption that Cold War theories and doctrine actually worked: this is reflected in the domino theory-like expansion of influence and the way that coups/realignments work. Labyrinth tries to do the same and thus works from an angle that middle east intervention is explicitly a good thing and regime changes can and do work (as showcased by the 'Gore Wins the Election' scenario, which makes it much more difficult for the US to win). This alone would probably push a lot of buttons and actually diverges from Twilight Struggle. TS is also satirical to the point of parody (The hippies are actually helping the commies by denouncing war!) instead of being overtly partisan like Labyrinth is. There's no parody in saying 'Democrats/Liberals/Etc are out-and-out wrong in regards to the Middle East'. I think the major difference is that intervention in TS is the entirety of the game while in Labyrinth, you are given alternatives but you hinder yourself if you attempt to use them. There are also some events in Labyrinth that didn't seem to be handled with the greatest of tact, either. ADP is not going to be as bad as the above, I feel, since at least it doesn't attempt to make a value judgement on interventionism like Labyrinth did.
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Sep 23, 2013 14:51
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Tekopo posted:On my side, it was the issue that it attempted to replicate how Twilight Struggle handled the Cold War, but without explicitly saying so. Twilight Struggle works on the assumption that Cold War theories and doctrine actually worked: this is reflected in the domino theory-like expansion of influence and the way that coups/realignments work. I think a lot of it has to do with more historical distance. It's a lot easier to stomach Allen Dulles fantasyland cold war(as it's a fun way to play the Cold War) with the events being over 20 years ago while Labyrinth's subject matter is something that's still very very recent and relevant.
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Sep 23, 2013 15:00
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I do understand that (which is why I feel apprehensive about ADP as well), but I think the issue for me is that instead of outright saying 'interventionism works' like TS, it provides an alternative but doesn't actually make it viable in any way. That seems to me to be more of a political statement in comparison to TS (which doesn't make value judgements on non/interventionism).
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Sep 23, 2013 16:04
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I voiced some reservations about ADP when talking about AA, and that's the sort of thing I was worried about. AA doesn't have much (any, really) historical distance between now and the conflict being represented. I played with a Colombian friend of mine who was interested in seeing the game, and although he was obviously a little weirded out by the whole thing (having lived through it), he felt that the general depiction of the factions and their interests was reasonable (although he noted that when Uribe gets elected, the level of violence should step way up above what removal of FARC zones usually creates, which I thought was interesting). Volko cites something like a dozen full length monographs on the conflict in his design notes, it's clear it was really well thought through. If Volkho designed Lab without that level of research because he felt that, as an American, he basically understood the "war on terror" (or did not need to advance beyond common media narratives), the same thing might be happening with ADP. I was extremely leery as soon as I saw that the Taliban's "terror" action is "Sharia", which doesn't reflect the military activity or behaviour of any of the disparate militias that get called "Taliban" when ISAF is shooting at them and "Afghan National Police" or "Highway Protection Units" or whatever when they're on the payroll. I think it's possible the COIN system could be used to represent post-2003 Af, insofar as composite actors like the "Cartels" faction can have internal cohesion problems, units can betray from one faction to another, etc, but it's equally likely we'll get a silly fantasy that doesn't reflect the fact that the conflict economy in Afghanistan is about regional networks of power and patronage, not clearly-defined factions with differing ideological, strategic and tactical orientations. I have friends in Af as well (civilians). I am interested in the topic of the Afghan war and if I thought that Volkho was making a serious effort to represent its nuances with COIN I'd be tempted to pick it up, but at this stage I think I'll wait to see how the Vietnam game turns out. AA was imo a bar-raiser for treating the political aspects of a conflict in wargames and I hope Volkho is able to put in the same amount of research to the later volumes.
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Sep 23, 2013 20:07
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Paper Mac posted:I voiced some reservations about ADP when talking about AA, and that's the sort of thing I was worried about. AA doesn't have much (any, really) historical distance between now and the conflict being represented. I played with a Colombian friend of mine who was interested in seeing the game, and although he was obviously a little weirded out by the whole thing (having lived through it), he felt that the general depiction of the factions and their interests was reasonable (although he noted that when Uribe gets elected, the level of violence should step way up above what removal of FARC zones usually creates, which I thought was interesting). Volko cites something like a dozen full length monographs on the conflict in his design notes, it's clear it was really well thought through. One advance I would say that's there in ADP is that they've made some events more appealing by letting the player be eligible next turn. One of the problems in the COIN games is that subtle or not-too-powerful events tend to get skipped every time because there are only so many actions available in the game, and taking an event that doesn't do a lot can really be painful.
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Sep 23, 2013 20:23
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