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Shoehead posted:Is it weird that I want to read it cos of this post? Read it if you want, loads of people like it.  Back to William Gibson; re-live Cayce's worst nightmare with this pictoral history of Bibendum: the Michelin Man  http://www.fastcodesign.com/3036541/the-secret-history-of-the-michelin-man#1
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Oct 25, 2014 22:09
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Snak posted:Literally about a dude who thinks katanas are better than guns and is the best virtual reality swordfighter AND hacker in the world who delivers pizzas for the mafia. Every character is written exactly the same. ...whose name is - and this is no spoiler (it's on the back and on page 1) - "Hiro Protagonist." There are a lot of neat ideas in Snow Crash, though, like criminal sentences including having to be tattooed on your forehead with "Poor Impulse Control."
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Oct 26, 2014 03:43
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ulmont posted:...whose name is - and this is no spoiler (it's on the back and on page 1) - "Hiro Protagonist." To me that's just another "look how edgy/quirky this thing is". The only actually engaging idea in Snow Crash was that ancient traditions and codes of conduct were conceptually similar to to functions or subroutines in programming, and that just like mechanical production, religious devotion could be automated. Also the robo dogs. Those were great. And idea that criminal organizations might become legally recognized corporations without their operations ever being interrupted. I think that Stephenson's greatest strength as a writer is taking a concept and weaving a half-dozen examples of it together in a story. He's a writer who's great at coming up with an interesting argument, and building support for it in the reader's mind before he even explains it. He researches his ideas and subjects meticulously and puts a lot of thought into what he writes. But when he tries to write "badass" things, he really loses me.
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Oct 26, 2014 04:05
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The Sumerian stuff in Snow Crash is easily the best part of it. Most everything else is 90s as gently caress. And to be fair, Hiro Protagonist being "goony" with the katana fighting and so forth is supposed to be a parody of people who think that stuff is cool, it's just not very well realized parody and can come off as straight-faced I suppose. What I found to be more awful than that was just the style of the prose, not so much the details. The Raft is still an awesome concept and I think it would be pretty interesting if Stephenson revisited that now that he's much more mature.
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Oct 26, 2014 05:14
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precision posted:The Sumerian stuff in Snow Crash is easily the best part of it. Most everything else is 90s as gently caress. I don't really have a problem appreciating Snow Crash as a parody of cyberpunk cliches, but people who recommend it or sing its praises seem to mainly consider it "awesome" in its own right. as was mentioned a little while ago... (In response to the question "In a fight between you and William Gibson, who would win?") Neal Stephenson posted:You don't have to settle for mere idle speculation. Let me tell you how it came out on the three occasions when we did fight. ...That's Stephenson trying to be funny and badass at the same time and it reads like Tom Clancy scifi fanfic. And yet this is the man who wrote Anathem, which redefined my concept of reality.
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Oct 26, 2014 08:37
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Snak posted:I don't really have a problem appreciating Snow Crash as a parody of cyberpunk cliches, but people who recommend it or sing its praises seem to mainly consider it "awesome" in its own right. Wait, Snow Crash isn't parody? Says who? Maybe parody isn't quite the right word, but it's quite obviously taking the piss a lot of the time. Elector_Nerdlingen fucked around with this message at 02:17 on Oct 27, 2014 |
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Oct 27, 2014 02:13
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AlphaDog posted:Wait, Snow Crash isn't parody? Says who? I always thought Snow Crash was a parody in the vein of 40K: parody when someone calls it out on its nonsense; completely in love with itself when it's not. Not that I have any problem with that, mind. I think there's room enough for stories that amount to kids smashing action figures together an telling me about how badass they are.
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Oct 27, 2014 03:15
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Which book is the one with the kid who really likes watches? Because that one is the best.
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Oct 27, 2014 14:46
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corn in the bible posted:Which book is the one with the kid who really likes watches? Because that one is the best. All Tomorrow's Parties last book in the Bridge trilogy.
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Oct 27, 2014 16:11
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Snak posted:
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Nov 2, 2014 00:49
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Snak posted:...That's Stephenson trying to be funny and badass at the same time and it reads like Tom Clancy scifi fanfic. I think that's him merely trying to be funny and intentionally being a caricature of his writing and the fans he has who don't understand he's goofing around and not honestly trying to be "badass".
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Nov 2, 2014 06:40
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What'd folks think of The Pheripheral?
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Nov 4, 2014 03:56
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builds character posted:What'd folks think of The Pheripheral? Still reading it. But I am a slow reader. It's moody. I like it, but I don't yet really know what it's about. Gibson has a questionable understanding of game design, not that it matters. I like the idea of an EVE Online style shooter with persistent characters that don't reset until the end of a campaign, but the "game" of shooing paparazzi away from a dark tower seems like some terrible early-access thing with not content. But maybe that's the point?
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Nov 4, 2014 04:18
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ZorajitZorajit posted:Still reading it. But I am a slow reader. It's moody. I like it, but I don't yet really know what it's about. Gibson has a questionable understanding of game design, not that it matters. I like the idea of an EVE Online style shooter with persistent characters that don't reset until the end of a campaign, but the "game" of shooing paparazzi away from a dark tower seems like some terrible early-access thing with not content. But maybe that's the point? You should keep reading it. 
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Nov 4, 2014 04:31
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Yeah, seconding keep reading. I liked it overall. Felt like a hybrid (in terms of writing style) of the Bridge and Bigend series, with a dash (maybe a dollop) of Stephenson. Definitely gonna have to give it a re-read, cause I know there's a bunch of details I missed.
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Nov 4, 2014 23:12
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I forgot it was already out! Just nabbed it. Probably end up staying up all night reading it. edit: It's really good to again be reading a Gibson novel where I have no loving clue what 3/4 of the words or people being discussed even mean. drat. precision fucked around with this message at 02:45 on Nov 5, 2014 |
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Nov 5, 2014 00:04
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thetechnoloser posted:Yeah, seconding keep reading. Yeah, I definitely need to reread. I had no idea wtf at the beginning but then it all came together quite well, I thought.
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Nov 5, 2014 05:34
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I'm on Chapter 18 and this is the most engaged I've been in a Gibson book since Mona Lisa Overdrive. Amazing stuff. e: ahaha Gibson hates goth/steampunk people so much. I love it. precision fucked around with this message at 06:21 on Nov 5, 2014 |
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Nov 5, 2014 06:08
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precision posted:I'm on Chapter 18 and this is the most engaged I've been in a Gibson book since Mona Lisa Overdrive. Amazing stuff. He gets in a bunch of little digs all over the place. It's great.
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Nov 6, 2014 16:26
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Around chapter 57 now. I like how his writing has become bite-sized, even though rapidly switching between two viewpoints is kind of a cheap way to make it seem like the flow is broken up (because by this point the chapter demarcations aren't signifying any change in venue or time jump at all, just switching to another POV of the same events) it really works for me. As a fellow Southerner I also enjoy that he always includes someone from Knoxville or the South in general (I can't actually figure out where Burton and Flynne are) and that he trends toward having the "smartest" people in his books making the most stupid decisions. I do hope there's a good payoff to whatever the gently caress happened in the first few chapters with Daedra.
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Nov 6, 2014 18:14
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 How is Wintermute supposed to stalk Case now?
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Nov 9, 2014 22:25
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The smartphones of the next few people Case walks past. Siri continues the conversation, her voice jumping from phone to phone. I just finished Pattern Recognition, and I really enjoyed it! I want to get into the rest of the trilogy, but my "ooh, but this is brand new!" urges are telling me to pick up Peripheral...what does the thread think I should go for next?
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Nov 10, 2014 01:19
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Spook Country and Zero History are distanced enough from Pattern Recognition that it's not really urgent to keep going with the trilogy right away. That said, The Peripheral is so much better than them that you might feel disappointed when you go back. A lot of why I think it's "better" is that it's much more dense with information to absorb, because it takes place in the Actual Future rather than The Day After Tomorrow. So it's really a question of whether you're in the mood for more current-day adventures or something a bit (a lot) weirder.
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Nov 10, 2014 01:31
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I don't know if you guys know, but he's been doing a book tour for The Peripheral. He was at RPI on Sunday and the crowd was about what I expected: Over-30, glasses, beards. More women than I was expecting though, which was nice to see. He's way more spry than I was worried he'd be after No Maps For These Territories, which was also nice to see. I think someone took video of the whole thing, so hopefully that'll be up at some point -- the questions I thought were mostly good (and his response to a kinda-ehh question about video games was interesting, even). Anyway, I think he's in New York City right now? I got my old paperback of Count Zero signed; I love the hell out of Zero History (especially how the last quarter turns into an awesome present-day Notgothic fucked around with this message at 17:28 on Nov 11, 2014 |
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Nov 11, 2014 17:24
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Gertrude Perkins posted:The smartphones of the next few people Case walks past. Siri continues the conversation, her voice jumping from phone to phone. I think Vincenzo Natali basically said that's how it would go down in his vision for the film when someone asked about translating the book to the big screen. edit: I'm also really early on in The Peripheral - am I supposed to feel way confused because I feel like I have no loving clue what is going on between the two storylines. I have no idea what a Michikoid is outside of some kind of robot and the poo poo with Daedra is super weird. The Flynne end of things are way more clear but I'm kind of lost on the other half. Not that it's a huge spoiler or anything but for reference I'm just past what appears to be Daedra fighting with people on the giant floating garbage heap? The Mechanical Hand fucked around with this message at 14:41 on Nov 12, 2014 |
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Nov 12, 2014 06:48
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The Mechanical Hand posted:edit: I'm also really early on in The Peripheral - am I supposed to feel way confused because I feel like I have no loving clue what is going on between the two storylines. I have no idea what a Michikoid is outside of some kind of robot and the poo poo with Daedra is super weird. The Flynne end of things are way more clear but I'm kind of lost on the other half. Not that it's a huge spoiler or anything but for reference I'm just past what appears to be Daedra fighting with people on the giant floating garbage heap? You're supposed to be super confused. You get a much more clear "OHHHHHHH OK" moment around Chapter 20, and by the halfway point roughly everything makes sense, though the thing you spoilered doesn't really get talked about again until the last act of the novel. I don't know what a Michikoid is either but "some kind of robot" is all you need to know about it yeah.
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Nov 12, 2014 19:36
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precision posted:You're supposed to be super confused. You get a much more clear "OHHHHHHH OK" moment around Chapter 20, and by the halfway point roughly everything makes sense, though the thing you spoilered doesn't really get talked about again until the last act of the novel. Awesome. Thanks -- I know his writing can be pretty "blink and you miss it" at times but I've been really confused some 9 chapters in now.
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Nov 12, 2014 21:04
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precision posted:You're supposed to be super confused. You get a much more clear "OHHHHHHH OK" moment around Chapter 20, and by the halfway point roughly everything makes sense, though the thing you spoilered doesn't really get talked about again until the last act of the novel. I think you can infer what michikoids are from early on - daedre has one wearing a sailor outfit and then Flynn sees "Classic anime robot babes, white china faces almost featureless." when she's running security.
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Nov 13, 2014 18:34
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builds character posted:I think you can infer what michikoids are from early on - daedre has one wearing a sailor outfit and then Flynn sees "Classic anime robot babes, white china faces almost featureless." when she's running security. I think what threw me off is that at the end of the one early Daedra chapter one suddenly went all HR Giger on us and got creepy so I wasn't sure what exactly they were.
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Nov 14, 2014 01:21
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Yeah I was a little confused about them too - but that's Gibson for you, you're not sure if he's referencing something real but obscure, or something he made up!
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Nov 14, 2014 02:25
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The Mechanical Hand posted:I think what threw me off is that at the end of the one early Daedra chapter one suddenly went all HR Giger on us and got creepy so I wasn't sure what exactly they were. Well to be fair Netherton also flips out when that one sprouts six legs or whatever it does and he lives in a world where LEGO bricks turn into spheres and back.
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Nov 14, 2014 02:34
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The Mechanical Hand posted:I think what threw me off is that at the end of the one early Daedra chapter one suddenly went all HR Giger on us and got creepy so I wasn't sure what exactly they were. Yeah, but it's one of those creepy because it's normally just garden variety robot things. That said, in fairness I just started reading again and didn't figure it out until much later the first time. precision posted:Well to be fair Netherton also flips out when that one sprouts six legs or whatever it does and he lives in a world where LEGO bricks turn into spheres and back. Just eyes! And guns. More importantly, I would really like that set of Legos. He does a lot of neat stuff like that though, like flynn's phone is also a snap bracelet and then you see the tech progression with tiny implants/phones you use your tongue to control.
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Nov 16, 2014 06:07
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It took me an embarrassingly long time (like, Chapter 90-something) to realize that Flynne and Burton's continuum is not even supposed to be ours.
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Nov 16, 2014 09:27
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In what sense? I don't recall anything that would rule it out. Unless you mean you didn't realize it was set in 203X instead of the present?
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Nov 16, 2014 17:27
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It just seemed like there were a bunch of little clues to that effect; he mentions a second Korean war that I thought was implied would have taken place by now if it were "our" continuum is the one that stuck out the most. And while he may have just done this for purely legal reasons, I can't imagine Wal-Mart changing their name to "Hefty Mart". It seemed to me like the implication was that theirs had diverged from ours at a significantly earlier point than the novel lets on, given the conversation about people who mess with continua for very long periods of time and so forth. Or at least that he was leaving it open as a possibility. I do also appreciate his propensity for happy endings.
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Nov 16, 2014 23:54
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Hm. I thought some of the Burton's marines were in Korea II, and I think the older (1950s) war is referred to as "the real one." I took it to mean there had recently been some sort of even-more-vague "police action" that went down with little public awareness and was a lot shorter/more limited in scope. I agree with you about Hefty Mart, and I think there was an interview with Gibson where he says the 2030s in the book are a little more drab and sad than ours probably will be. So I guess you're right. However I'm pretty sure that it's stated outright that for some reason they can't access continua before sometime in the mid 2030s. So I don't think the implication is that the reality was our own and was then "altered," since that couldn't happen until about when the story kicks off with Burton's game. Or if there had been another alteration it still could have only happened a few years before that.
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Nov 17, 2014 00:20
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Whoops, you're right, I forgot the little aside of "we can't go earlier than around 2028 because Reasons". I wonder if he's setting things up for another trilogy? I really liked both worlds in this one and am totally down for Wilf Netherton, Action Bullshit Artist part 2 and more of Burton's Buddies. e: I mean if there's never a sequel it's kind of odd that he had the whole mystery of where the stub server even is just not get resolved; explaining it is unnecessary but I did think there would be some revelation about who literally created the server. e2: Ah poo poo, I bet they can't contact anyone further back before 2028 because that's when quantum computing takes off or something. precision fucked around with this message at 00:48 on Nov 17, 2014 |
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Nov 17, 2014 00:35
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precision posted:I wonder if he's setting things up for another trilogy? I'm pretty sure he's said that The Peripheral a standalone, since the multiverse shenanigans they get up to is too complex for a series.
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Nov 17, 2014 02:02
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Zweihander01 posted:I'm pretty sure he's said that The Peripheral a standalone, since the multiverse shenanigans they get up to is too complex for a series. Eh, I guess, I just think that from where the book ends, you could totally just extend the characters and their interactions into another novel or two without even getting into shenanigans though. I guess I'm just kind of pissed the book ended. Really great characters in this one. I thought Wilf had a good arc and the book pretty much ended just as he was getting really interesting and we were seeing his personality as more than just "dude that hates posers". Though he did tie the ending off in a neat bow considering the ending was literally "and then they all lived happily ever after". (Almost) literally every character got paired off with a love interest, and somehow it didn't even feel forced. I was surprised that Wilf didn't end up with Ash though, I thought he was setting that up pretty hard near the end. Having Rainey just come back from nowhere was a bit awkward. Flynne ending up with Tommy was a bit too predictable, I thought there might have been some kind of Wilf/Flynne peripheral relationship happening. I don't remember ever hearing Tommy's last name, is there any chance it was Rydell?
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Nov 17, 2014 02:24
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precision posted:Whoops, you're right, I forgot the little aside of "we can't go earlier than around 2028 because Reasons". They know jack about the server so it's not a huuuuuuge stretch to imagine whoever owns it can go further back. Unsupported, I think, but not totally crazy. precision posted:Eh, I guess, I just think that from where the book ends, you could totally just extend the characters and their interactions into another novel or two without even getting into shenanigans though. there's foreshadowing for Rainey at the beginning though, and she sticks around to help him out throughout when she probably should have cut and run, but yeah.
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Nov 17, 2014 04:19
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