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Crewmine
Apr 26, 2012

GROVER CURES HOUSE posted:

morrowind was the last tes game where you could legitimately break the main quest, get a second chance to backdoor it and break it permanently if you gently caress that up too

This was great, it'd say "wow you hosed everything up retard better load a save" and you'd just defiantly continue anyway and then many hours later find you've just straight skipped half the game with the help of that hosed up spider guy.

Game was amazing.

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Distortoise
Dec 29, 2013

The Civil War sideplot was so terribly uninteresting because of how it forced you to pick a side. You're the closest thing this culture has to the second coming of Jesus Christ if Jesus Christ slew dragons and breathed fire (and this entire civil started in the first place over banning the worship of Dragon Jesus Christ) but you can't rally your own troops and roll the opposition's heads yourself? Ulfric gets by merely on the rumours of being a dragonborn and you could march in, vaporize him by shouting at him and declare yourself king and take the war to the Thalmor yourself.

Cantorsdust
Aug 10, 2008

Infinitely many points, but zero length.
He was not born a god. His destiny did not lead him to this crime. He chose this path of his own free will. He stole the godhood and murdered the Hortator. Vivec wrote this.

SunAndSpring
Dec 4, 2013

Distortoise posted:

The Civil War sideplot was so terribly uninteresting because of how it forced you to pick a side. You're the closest thing this culture has to the second coming of Jesus Christ if Jesus Christ slew dragons and breathed fire (and this entire civil started in the first place over banning the worship of Dragon Jesus Christ) but you can't rally your own troops and roll the opposition's heads yourself? Ulfric gets by merely on the rumours of being a dragonborn and you could march in, vaporize him by shouting at him and declare yourself king and take the war to the Thalmor yourself.

Everyone cool from Bethesda is long gone. All that is left is Todd Howard and the fucker who made Cliff Racers and the Mages Guild questline in Oblivion.

Also, I love how being Dragonborn essentially means you have a part of Akatosh (who is also Alduin who is also Auriel who is also Ruptga who is also Lorkhan who is also Shezzar who is also Sep) inside of you. So when you fight Alduin, it's more like you're fighting yourself because Akatosh is loving nuts.

Crewmine
Apr 26, 2012
If they'd straight removed the civil war and put that effort into expanding the guild lines it would've been better.

Skyrim was ok though, Alduin's alright for a dragon.

Whorelord
May 1, 2013

Jump into the well...

SunAndSpring posted:

Done. More pictures for Game of the Year All Years.

Hainab stole my pants!

Raineko
Mar 12, 2012
any mods that makes the combat less rear end?

GROVER CURES HOUSE
Aug 26, 2007

Go on...

Crewmine posted:

Skyrim was ok though, Alduin's alright for a dragon.

im not sure if hes better or worse than the mustache twirler from oblivion

bethesda cant write villains for poo poo

Cantorsdust
Aug 10, 2008

Infinitely many points, but zero length.
Apparently the Civil War questline was supposed to be way more involved, with a dynamic city battle system where you could actually gain and lose ground over time. But Bethesda cut that all because lol effort. There was a mod on Nexus that was trying to restore it based on what assets/quests were left, but last I checked it was hilariously buggy and broken.

Crewmine
Apr 26, 2012

GROVER CURES HOUSE posted:

im not sure if hes better or worse than the mustache twirler from oblivion

bethesda cant write villains for poo poo

the oblivion villain was so fuckin unmemorable it's unreal

like, i remember he had a weird plastic balloon face like every other npc but that's it

Stalins Moustache
Dec 31, 2012

~~**I'm Italian!**~~
when I went to solstheim in skyrim i was actually sad because I could see the red mountain of morrowind and i was thinking to myself "gently caress you bethesda" :goonsay:

Titty Warlord
Apr 28, 2013
:butt::gas::sterv:

Distortoise
Dec 29, 2013

Cantorsdust posted:

Apparently the Civil War questline was supposed to be way more involved, with a dynamic city battle system where you could actually gain and lose ground over time. But Bethesda cut that all because lol effort.
Is there a similar excuse behind why the ending to the main plotline was so appallingly poo poo by chance? Where you curbstomp Alduin in under a minute in Sovngarde with the three random fucks from the flashback who then almost sarcastically clap for you before the big guy comes in and goes "RIGHT THAT'S DONE YOU GO HOME NOW" and that's it?

SunAndSpring
Dec 4, 2013

Crewmine posted:

the oblivion villain was so fuckin unmemorable it's unreal

like, i remember he had a weird plastic balloon face like every other npc but that's it

The books the guy wrote were really cool and interesting, but then it turns out that he was just a loving idiot who didn't even know which realms belonged to the Daedra.

Distortoise
Dec 29, 2013

Stalins Moustache posted:

when I went to solstheim in skyrim i was actually sad because I could see the red mountain of morrowind and i was thinking to myself "gently caress you bethesda" :goonsay:
You can see it from Skyrim. Actually if you noclip out of the Skyrim map proper a weird amount of the continent is actually fleshed out in low resolution, even that big ivory tower from Oblivion.

Stalins Moustache
Dec 31, 2012

~~**I'm Italian!**~~

Distortoise posted:

Is there a similar excuse behind why the ending to the main plotline was so appallingly poo poo by chance? Where you curbstomp Alduin in under a minute in Sovngarde with the three random fucks from the flashback who then almost sarcastically clap for you before the big guy comes in and goes "RIGHT THAT'S DONE YOU GO HOME NOW" and that's it?

hahah after that i was left just standing there, wondering what the gently caress just happened. i cant believe they made that ending, was happy with it and decided to release it that way.

Chuck Tanner
Nov 10, 2012

by Lowtax
so if i were to reinstall this game, what are some essential mods i should use?

calusari
Apr 18, 2013

It's mechanical. Seems to come at regular intervals.
Morrowind's dungeons are also the best. They were creepy and dark and confusing as hell. My biggest beef with Skyrim is the terrible dungeons. Only that big one with the glowy mushrooms was good. The rest all feel the same because they are essentially a single hallway leading back to the exit.

SunAndSpring
Dec 4, 2013

Mr. Mallory posted:

so if i were to reinstall this game, what are some essential mods i should use?

http://www.somethingfornobody.com/blog/morrowind-modding-guide/

Irradiation
Sep 14, 2005

I understand your frustration.

Cantorsdust posted:

but last I checked it was hilariously buggy and broken.

so Bethesda quality

SunAndSpring
Dec 4, 2013

calusari posted:

Morrowind's dungeons are also the best. They were creepy and dark and confusing as hell. My biggest beef with Skyrim is the terrible dungeons. Only that big one with the glowy mushrooms was good. The rest all feel the same because they are essentially a single hallway leading back to the exit.

Man, Blackreach was wasted potential. There's only two quests there: get the Elder Scroll and collect 30 plants. It's big and it looks good, but that's about it.

GROVER CURES HOUSE
Aug 26, 2007

Go on...
https://openmw.org/en/

:ssh:

Cantorsdust
Aug 10, 2008

Infinitely many points, but zero length.

calusari posted:

Morrowind's dungeons are also the best. They were creepy and dark and confusing as hell. My biggest beef with Skyrim is the terrible dungeons. Only that big one with the glowy mushrooms was good. The rest all feel the same because they are essentially a single hallway leading back to the exit.

Morrowind's dungeons were the last ones where everything was hand-placed as well. By Oblivion the dungeons became cookie-cutter designs that all had a boss and boss chest at the end. Morrowind had giant vertical dungeons, werewolf mazes, hidden daedric shrines within caves, sixth house cult bases with creepy music, and out of the way smugglers' holes with little boats on docks.

Chuck Tanner
Nov 10, 2012

by Lowtax

sweet, thanks

SunAndSpring
Dec 4, 2013
Well, at least Michael Kirkbride and Trainwiz are making a good mod for Skyrim that doesn't suck.

https://docs.google.com/presentatio...d.g256ae43b2_00

Stalins Moustache
Dec 31, 2012

~~**I'm Italian!**~~

SunAndSpring posted:

Well, at least Michael Kirkbride and Trainwiz are making a good mod for Skyrim that doesn't suck.

https://docs.google.com/presentatio...d.g256ae43b2_00

That..actually seems pretty cool.

Distortoise
Dec 29, 2013

I don't remember if this was a problem with Morrowind, but in Skyrim I would often stumble in to some random interesting place I found (or, you know, a hallway) and reach the end only to find out tha I was supposed to have found this place via a quest given somewhere else entire, usually a nearby town. I remember finding one place that I got to the end of and discovering I was supposed to have gone here with a random plot trinket called a Lexicon I would have gotten from some random gently caress in town. It basically put you in the mindset of ignoring discovered ruins until you are supposed to go to them by way of arbitrary instruction.

That's not what ruins should be like. They should be interesting locales in their own right that you can then explore upon finding yourself and find within whatever purpose they serve.

Denim Dude
Feb 21, 2006
I suggest tree

Mr. Mallory posted:

sweet, thanks

You could try this too, http://www.ornitocopter.net/morrowind-overhaul/

SunAndSpring
Dec 4, 2013

Distortoise posted:

I don't remember if this was a problem with Morrowind, but in Skyrim I would often stumble in to some random interesting place I found (or, you know, a hallway) and reach the end only to find out tha I was supposed to have found this place via a quest given somewhere else entire, usually a nearby town. I remember finding one place that I got to the end of and discovering I was supposed to have gone here with a random plot trinket called a Lexicon I would have gotten from some random gently caress in town. It basically put you in the mindset of ignoring discovered ruins until you are supposed to go to them by way of arbitrary instruction.

That's not what ruins should be like. They should be interesting locales in their own right that you can then explore upon finding yourself and find within whatever purpose they serve.

I seem to remember most dungeons having doors that had really high skill caps to open, but you could just pick through them and sequence break if you wanted to. A few story-related ones that wouldn't open until you did some things, but otherwise everything was open to you.

Cantorsdust
Aug 10, 2008

Infinitely many points, but zero length.

SunAndSpring posted:

I seem to remember most dungeons having doors that had really high skill caps to open, but you could just pick through them and sequence break if you wanted to. A few story-related ones that wouldn't open until you did some things, but otherwise everything was open to you.

Reminder that in Morrowind if you could unlock the level 100 door to Vivec's palace you could just walk in and talk to him any time you wanted.

GROVER CURES HOUSE
Aug 26, 2007

Go on...
there were only 2-3 door-like objects that you couldnt sequence break iirc

Doctor Dogballs
Apr 1, 2007

driving the fuck truck from hand land to pound town without stopping at suction station


Distortoise posted:

I don't remember if this was a problem with Morrowind, but in Skyrim I would often stumble in to some random interesting place I found (or, you know, a hallway) and reach the end only to find out tha I was supposed to have found this place via a quest given somewhere else entire, usually a nearby town. I remember finding one place that I got to the end of and discovering I was supposed to have gone here with a random plot trinket called a Lexicon I would have gotten from some random gently caress in town. It basically put you in the mindset of ignoring discovered ruins until you are supposed to go to them by way of arbitrary instruction.

That's not what ruins should be like. They should be interesting locales in their own right that you can then explore upon finding yourself and find within whatever purpose they serve.

Well that's the side effect you get with wanting to have hundreds of hours of "gameplay," a lot of locations are purpose made for one or two unimportant little sidequests. (I would say fetch quests, but even the main storyline is pretty much a bunch of fetch quests) Try to make every dungeon unique and interesting enough to be worth going thru just for the sake of enjoying its design, and not to kill monsters for exp or as part of a quest, and you're gonna run out of ideas pretty quick. If they kept you from being able to enter a zillion random little dungeons or caves unless the quest was initiated or you got the key, the game just wouldn't have the same sandbox feel.

It really doesn't seem to me like morrowind's dungeons were made in a different way than in Blivio or Skyrim, i.e. I'm pretty sure there's some sort of grid based level editor the company made for itself and designers can pretty much drag and drop rooms and tunnels into the level, then add details to make each room seem unique. In fact morrowind's dungeons seemed very much like a lot of the same thing, to such a degree that it was easy to get lost due to lack of detail or variety in the graphics, in the same was as the first Metroid.

Doctor Dogballs fucked around with this message at 20:11 on Feb 9, 2014

GROVER CURES HOUSE
Aug 26, 2007

Go on...

Doctor Dogballs posted:

Well that's the side effect you get with wanting to have hundreds of hours of "gameplay," a lot of locations are purpose made for one or two quests. Try to make every dungeon unique and interesting enough to be worth going thru just for the sake of enjoying its design, and not to kill monsters for exp or as part of a quest, and you're gonna run out of ideas pretty quick. If they kept you from being able to enter a zillion random little dungeons or caves unless the quest was initiated or you got the key, the game just wouldn't have the same sandbox feel.

It really doesn't seem to me like morrowind's dungeons were made in a different way than in Blivio or Skyrim, i.e. I'm pretty sure there's some sort of grid based level editor the company made for itself and designers can pretty much drag and drop rooms and tunnels into the level, then add details to make each room seem unique. In fact morrowind's dungeons seemed very much like a lot of the same thing, to such a degree that it was easy to get lost due to lack of detail or variety in the graphics, in the same was as the first Metroid.

There was copy-pasting, but a lot of dungeons weren't grid based at all. As opposed to Oblivion, where literally every dungeon was grid-based.

Not that it's much of an excuse, Nehrim uses the same engine as Oblivion, with the same grid-based mapping, and managed to create some rad looking dungeons and landscapes

bethesda is poo poo

Cantorsdust
Aug 10, 2008

Infinitely many points, but zero length.
Bethesda could make another game as good as Morrowind if they would rehire Kirkbride to write the story, hire the OpenMW guys to fix their loving engine, and hire the Nehrim guys to build the world. Make like Valve and turn modders into developers.

GROVER CURES HOUSE
Aug 26, 2007

Go on...

Cantorsdust posted:

Bethesda could make another game as good as Morrowind if they would rehire Kirkbride to write the story, hire the OpenMW guys to fix their loving engine, and hire the Nehrim guys to build the world. Make like Valve and turn modders into developers.

in other words bethesda could make a great game if they werent bethesda and bethesda didnt exist and valve bought the ip and did everything you just mentioned

i agree

GROVER CURES HOUSE
Aug 26, 2007

Go on...
also the openmw guys arent even professionals, theyre amateur programmers salvaging an ancient game

bethesda has loving carmack and a ton of well paid professionals working for them

Pewdiepie
Oct 31, 2010

SunAndSpring posted:






https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF-XMtNEudQ

Morrowind is a great game. Let's talk about it in this thread. If you don't like Morrowind that's ok, but you should probably go somewhere else.

Lol! Morrowind is bringing the Lulz today

loud dildo
Jan 26, 2011

by Cowcaster
is there a mod to make morrowind look like the neverhood? or just a neverhood mod in general that can be applied to all games

Cantorsdust
Aug 10, 2008

Infinitely many points, but zero length.
The 36 Lessons of Vivec: Volume One

He was born in the ash among the Velothi, anon Chimer, before the war with the northern men. Ayem came first to the village of the netchimen, and her shadow was that of Boethiah, who was the Prince of Plots, and things unknown and known would fold themselves around her until they were like stars or the messages of stars. Ayem took a netchiman's wife and said:

'I am the Face-Snaked Queen of the Three in One. In you is an image and a seven-syllable spell, AYEM AE SEHTI AE VEHK, which you will repeat to it until mystery comes.'

Then Ayem threw the netchiman's wife into the ocean water where dreughs took her into castles of glass and coral. They gifted the netchiman's wife with gills and milk fingers, changing her sex so that she might give birth to the image as an egg. There she stayed for seven or eight months.

Then Seht came to the netchiman's wife and said:

'I am the Clockwork King of the Three in One. In you is an egg of my brother-sister, who possesses invisible knowledge of words and swords, which you shall nurture until the Hortator comes.'

And Seht then extended his hands and multitudes of homunculi came forth, each like a glimmering rope through the water, and they raised the netchiman's wife back to the surface world and set her down on the shoals of Azura's coast. There she lay for seven or eight more months, caring for the egg-knowledge by whispering to it the Codes of Mephala and the prophecies of Veloth and even the forbidden teachings of Trinimac.

Seven Daedra came to her one night and each one gave to the egg new motions that could be achieved by certain movements of the bones. These are called the Barons of Move Like This. Then an eighth Daedroth came, and he was a Demiprince, called Fa-Nuit-Hen, or the Multiplier of Motions Known. And Fa-Nuit-Hen said:

'Whom do you wait for?'

To which the netchiman's wife said to the Hortator.

'Go to the land of the Indoril in three months' time, for that is when war comes. I return now to haunt the warriors who fell and still wonder why. But first I show you this.'

Then the Barons and the Demiprince joined together into a pillar of fighting styles terrible to behold and they danced before the egg and its learning image.

'Look, little Vehk, and find the face behind the splendor of my bladed carriage, for in it is delivered the unmixed conflict path, perfect in every way. What is its number?'

It is said the number is the number of birds that can nest in an ancient tibrol tree, less three grams of honest work, but Vivec in his later years found a better one and so gave this secret to his people.

'For I have crushed a world with my left hand,' he will say, 'but in my right hand is how it could have won against me. Love is under my will only.'

The ending of the words is ALMSIVI.

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Doctor Dogballs
Apr 1, 2007

driving the fuck truck from hand land to pound town without stopping at suction station


its more a state of mind than an actual mod

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