|
 Releases(courtesy of The Green Calx) -As of 10/17 , v.25 is the most recent release and requires a purchase/pre-order/donation. You can grab it from the KSP Store or Steam. -The Demo is v.18.3 (as of 2/12) and can be found on the download link on the KSP main page (Steam too). It's the same as .18.4 except you can't load mods, your limited only to rocket parts, you can only have three concurrently running missions, and only the Sun, Kerbin, and Mun are available to visit.  NEW FEATURESVERSION 0.25 BRINGS:
[/list] Click here to skip right down to the Mod sectionClick here to skip right down to the FAQClick here to skip right down to the video tutorialsWelcome to Kerbal Space Program! Kerbal Space Program is an indie project by developer Squad. Let me let one of the devs (Mu) tell you about what KSP is: Mu posted:At its heart, Kerbal Space Program is a game about creating your own space program from scratch. You construct spacecraft and launch them off into the cosmos, attempting to further the science and achievements of Kerbalkind. That or explode spectacularly on takeoff. Or you could let illectro demonstrate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEvWsPYd4tU For advanced students of physics and crazy, I'd also like to direct you to this video made by our own Abyssal Lurker: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzttgJPrZec Explosions and failure are just as much a part of this game as success. If NASA could spend $1.37 billion to fail to launch anything but the escape tower off the first Mercury rocket, you can get past a false start. Sometimes you'll get this:  Or random events (known to experienced players as The Kraken) may occur:  Or a promising design idea doesn't quite pan out:  Or it's revision:  But eventually, you'll get there  Planned future updates can generally be found here or you can keep tabs on recent dev posts. The previous thread was over 500 pages and can be found here. Thwomp fucked around with this message at 18:11 on Nov 28, 2014 |
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 04:46
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 5, 2024 00:23 |
|
|
Mods This game is about trying and failing hard at rocket physics and orbital mechanics. But it's also about using terrible mods to make spectacular engineering feats. You can find all the available mods over at Kerbal Space Port or at the KSP forum's Mod section but here are some goon favorites (note: especially after new KSP updates, it may take some time for all of these to be updated): MechJeb 2.0 - An autopilot plugin pack. Offers a ridiculous amount of automated functions. I would, personally, advise you hold off on this one until you've made it to Mun and back on your own but some people have a hard time with orbital mechanics so it can be useful to show how things work. MechJeb assumes you at least have competent rocket designs. Dev/Beta builds can be found here Protractor - Our own Enigma has put together a planetary rendezvous calculator to help get you to the other bodies in the solar system. Strap a TI-83 to your rocket and click the '?' button on the Protractor screen for a guide on how to successfully use it. Note: It only gets you most of the way there. Once you're in the general area of an encounter, use a maneuver node to plan your final intercept burn. Kerbal Alarm Clock - Allows you to set an alarm for a certain event on a current mission (next maneuver node, next apopsis, etc). KAC will then stop any time warping on whatever other mission you are currently working on to remind you that it's time to go back and check on the original mission. Really handy for running simultaneous missions (average time from Kerbin to Jool is 1 year, same for waiting on the window to return to Kerbin from Duna). Karbonite - Adds a resource (Karbonite) to the game that can be refined into fuel (among other things). The mod adds ton of specific parts to build satellites to locate, drills to harvest, and refineries to refine Karbonite. Gives you something to actually do in space (outside of crash and burn) with the possibility of self-sustaining outposts. Kerbal Attachment System - Adds mechanized parts like robotic arms and winches to help attach stuff. Helpful for bases and large stations. Ferram Aerospace Research Pack - Fixes a lot of what's wrong with KSP's default aerodynamic physics. If you want planes that don't suck, this'll help. Warning: you will need to re-learn how to launch and build rockets and the below Procedural Fairings mod is recommended. If you want a better aerodynamic model that isn't quite so punishing, try NEAR (get it?). Procedural Fairings - Generates fairings to fit whatever payload you put on top of a fairing base. Will re-generate the fairing to fit your payload after you change it too (seriously, that's amazing). No need to futz with static fairing parts. Here's a tutorial on how it works. Bonus that it works with the above FAR mod for super-usability. Kerbal Engineer - Provides good figures for the delta-v your rocket will produce while you build it. Also can tell you the delta-v on other planets/moons. Helpful for maximizing your efficiency. Quantum Struts - Lets your Kerbals strut up your orbitally constructed rockets so that they don't shake or wobble to pieces while enroute to the far solar system. RemoteTech - Want to really sperg out and get realistic? RemoteTech adds realtime communication as a requirement for unmanned probes/rovers. You'll need a relay network of satellites around Kerbin and around your destinations before your Kuriosity rover can take its first step or if you plan to transmit any of the sweet science home. PartCatalog 2.0 - Organizes all your mod parts. Really helpful when you've got more and more mod parts installed and you can't tell stock engines from special station parts. Note: Ctrl+Click the icon in the VAB to switch between horizontal and vertical setups. Goon Approved Spacecraft Here is a repository of some goon-made spaceships for KSP. These should be all stock (unless otherwise noted) so just take the .craft file and drop it into your savegame (KSP dir->saves->[your saved game]->VAB(rockets)/SPH(planes)). Courtesy of 0x0hShit.  Goes Nowhere, Does Nothin' Stock Shuttle Note: It really needs MechJeb's SASS to fly properly. There's instructions included to help you fly it to orbit. NASA had computers programmed to do this function for the astronauts in real life. You have to do it in terrifying real time. Courtesy of 0X0hShit (again)  Because even years after it's final flight, to many of us "Spacecraft" will still mean "massive gently caress off space-plane that both barely flies and is totally awesome when doing so." Thanks for all the memories, NASA.    Craft File and a YouTube'd flight, with annotated instructions. Surprisingly way more balanced then the last version and able to be flown manually, but you've still got so many things to watch at once that MechJeb is pretty much a necessity. Alternate Engine Configurations Via Abuse of Clipping Note: these will not improve efficiency over the large Mainsail engine. They just look cool. Alehkhs posted:Report: They still still work in 0.20 Flags Save-As into GameData/[Your Game Save]/Flags              
Thwomp fucked around with this message at 17:57 on Nov 28, 2014 |
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 04:46
|
|
|
The FAQ - Rocket science for dummies Sweet jesus there's a lot to this game. Where do I start? The best advice I can give is to follow in NASA's footsteps: 1) Start trying out different rockets. Find a design that doesn't blow up consistently. 2) Slightly modify your non-explody design so that you can reach orbit reliably. 3) Continue with slight modifications to match your next goal (orbit and safely return, orbit and transfer to Mun/Minmus/other solar bodies, transfer to and land on other bodies, return from said bodies, etc). 4) Avoid spaceplanes unless you're really bored and want to punish yourself. What keys are used? WASDQE - for pitch, yaw and roll [SHIFT]/[CTRL] - throttle up and down controllable engines (not solid boosters). [T] - turns on SAS (Stability Augmentation System) modules [F] - temporarily turn SAS off (if it's already on) or vice versa - this is a good way to update what direction you want the ship to point. [M] - orbital map, double-click the planet/moon to centre it on them, [TAB] to centre back on your ship. [G] - Deploys collapse-able landing gears/wings/panels. {B} - Brakes your spaceplanes upon landing. [R] - Turns on the RCS (reaction control system) RCS transverse thrust controls (note these will only work if RCS is turned on and you've added RCS thursters and fuel to the rocket): [H]/[N] - forward/backward {I}/[K] - down/up [J]/[L] - left/right [,] - Slow Time [.] - Accelerate Time [F1] - Screenshot [F5] - Quick Save [F9] - Quick Load What's the Navball and how does it work? The nav ball is at the bottom center of your screen. It is designed to help you figure out where you're going. This graphic should help (courtesy of Shanakin):  The purple/pink markers on the Navball indicate the direction of your current target. By default, this is the KSC. You select a target in the Map view by double clicking on anything. The blue markers, which are new in v.18, indicate the direction you should point your craft after you've created a flight plan. And as seen at launch, the cardinal directions on the Navball are thusly:  You'll note that North is counter-intuitively to the bottom at launch. How do I know which way my ship will turn? The two blue windows on the large command module mark the "up" position for the pitch up 'S' or down [W] control. All ship controls are relative to that position. What's the difference between SAS and A(dvanced)SAS? Standard SAS uses just a ship's internal (and external, if any) Reaction Wheels to keep you pointed in one direction. It also prevents (or attempts to prevent) any spinning. The command pods have Reaction Wheels built in and probe cores/smaller pods/landers have smaller Reaction Wheels built in. Adding an ASAS changes this: Enabling ASAS by itself only allows you to use RCS thrusters if you added them (and mono-propellant fuel) to your ship. This can be useful if you want to translate the position of your ship (move slowly in just one direction). When ASAS is installed and SAS is enabled, the ASAS attempts to keep the heading constant and spin at zero using all available methods to do so: Reaction Wheels, wings and flaps, RCS thrusters, and gimballed engines. Manually adjusting your heading and spin (using WASD-QE) always uses all available methods, exactly the same as ASAS. It'll use RCS thrusters too if ASAS is on. So I'm doing okay with my non-sucky design. Is there a better or more efficient way to design rockets? Sure is! It's all about fuel management and dumping excess weight. See this graphic below. Asparagus stalk staging is more efficient than crossfeeding which is more efficient than non-crossfeeding.  How do I adjust my orbit and use that flight planner feature? First off, see this graphic courtesy of Cojawfee:  Note: Your current orbit is the Black line. the orbit you want to transition to is the Blue line. It is best to adjust your orbit when you are halfway to your "destination". To create a flight plan (or manuever), click on your current orbital path in the Map to create a Maneuver node. It'll give you six axis to play with. You pull on each one to indicate burning in that direction. Watch with glee as it predicts where you'll go. Once set, you'll have a burn timer (burn at 0 for short burns), a Δv calculator (this much change in speed is required), and a blue marker on your nav ball (burn while pointed in this direction). Stop burning once the Δv is 0. Note: for long burns (like transferring to another planet), begin your burn so that you're halfway done when the start timer hits zero. The burn calculator assumes you reach your speed instantly so you'll have to compensate. How do I get to those new planets/moons?! Our own Enigma has put together a helpful tool called Protractor that helps calculate when to launch and burn to encounter the new solar system objects. Hit the '?' button on the Protractor screen for a guide on how to use it. Kerbal Spaceport link here Even with the new flight planning mechanic in v.18, Protractor is still useful and awesome at providing direction on when to launch (launch when Θ equals zero). I'm headed towards Duna/Jool/Eve/Moho and I've heard I can save fuel when I get there. What's this witchcraft? This is called aerobraking and it involves using the drag of passing into the atmosphere of your destination to slow you down into an orbit. How close to these should I pass to lose some speed? Moho - There's no atmosphere to begin with so aerobraking is out of the question. Bring lots of fuel instead. Eve - Atmo starts around 90km up but turns into a pot of molasses on a winter's day around 60km. Don't go any lower. Duna - Atmo starts around 45km but it's really weak unless you go down much farther (around 15-20km is good). Excellent candidate for aerobraking. Jool - Atmo appears to start around 200km but you won't really get any effects until about 138km. However, anything below 125km will almost always result in certain crushing death but if you can hit this window, excellent fuel savings can be had. What altitude is Kerbal Stationary Orbit? 2900 km How does the new Science system work? First off: There's a fixed amount of science for each task and it's never lost. Transmitting just means you have to do it multiple times.There are two units involved in science: Science, and Data. Science is the resource that you use to buy new parts in the tech tree. Data is what your Kerbals and science instruments actually collect when out on a mission. The farther out from Kerbin you travel, the higher the Science value is for the Data you collect. There are also many, many different locations to gather science from (both on and around Kerbin and out beyond it) so keep doing experiments. When you give the order to collect Data, the report screen pops up, giving you some details about the experiment and the option to either trash, keep, or transmit the data. The heading along the top (eg: "Crew report while flying over Kerbin's oceans") is important is it tells you what "zone" you are in for this experiment. The larger text box gives you some flavor about the experiment itself. The Data Size tells you how large/complicated the experiment is, and this translates to how much electrical power it will take to transmit the data back to Kerbin. The Science Value tells you how much the experiment is worth in total. Return the data to Kerbin for the full value or transmit it for partial science. Note: Experiments will be worth significantly less once you gather the full initial amount of science (via recovering the experiment on Kerbin or transmitting the data back enough times). What science experiments are available?
How does transmitting science back to Kerbin work? You're going to need two things to transmit data back to Kerbin: an antenna and electricity. At Tier 0, you'll be able to transmit about 1.5 crew reports. However, the base engine will generate electricity while running so you could eek out maybe 2 or 3 reports. Later tiers will unlock batteries for greater electricity storage and solar panels for infinite electricity generation. There are two antennas to use, a small and large. The differences are the amount of data each can send on a 'pulse' and how much electricity is used for each 'pulse'. The small antenna sends smaller pulses at a small electricity cost while the larger one sends more data at higher electricity costs. You can queue up multiple data reports for transmission, but if you run out of electricity, the transmission will pause and wait for you to generate enough electricity for the next pulse. What are the planned features of the game? This is stuff the developer is planning or at least considering for future updates: - Contracts and an actual economy to add cost to your rockets. - Management, research of better parts, and training of astronauts to improve future piloting abilities (all the way up to autopiloting craft for you) - Building surface bases - Missions and goals for the program - A simulator mode that lets you start out in orbit or in a particular situation
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 04:47
|
|
|
Basic KSP Tutorial Videos/Guides Welcome to the SA KSP Learning Station. These have all been made by illectro and he's many, many other KSP-related videos on his YouTube channel. Check it out if you want more Scot-narrated goodness. Tutorial - Basic Construction, Flying & Orbiting https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=puC-YV_h9Us Tutorial - Moon Landings https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOMS8Y3ULdY Tutorial - Flying Spaceplanes Into Orbit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUQXqG_edKQ Tutorial - Orbital Rendezvous https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=St515zjUZHY Tutorial - Docking https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srsiLZLPiv0 Tutorial - Advanced Rocket Design https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yky0UN8h0YE General overview videos: IVA only Mun mission https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0c-gx03DpM Flypast of Every Planet & Moon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bxsVGrbNTmU Doing Science! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIjqvLcsz8g
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 04:47
|
|
|
Great thread, Whomp!
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 04:53
|
|
|
The last thread started with flags discussion which goes to show how old it had gotten. Time for some fresh chat. New players: don't be afraid to dive in and ask questions. Orbital mechanics is a tough thing to get your head around. We're here to
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 04:54
|
|
|
 I made a flag.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 04:56
|
|
|
Haven't tried ARM yet, but how are the mods working with it? Are any confirmed to have been broken by the update?
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 04:58
|
|
|
Nice job with the thread, as usual. I've got sixty days to attach a chair to this asteroid and give Jeb a front row seat to the end of the world. Let's do this.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 04:59
|
|
|
Two important mods for docking in particular: RCS Build Aid - Balance your RCS and engine thrust. Docking Port Alignment Indicator - Popup window when docking that actually indicates the docking ports' alignment and translation instead of center mass that navball uses.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:01
|
|
|
Ground floor new KSP thread let's break our minds trying to catch asteroids.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:02
|
|
|
Luneshot posted:Haven't tried ARM yet, but how are the mods working with it? Are any confirmed to have been broken by the update? It's hard to tell. MechJeb has, apparently, a hotfix or new nightly build out somewhere to address some issues. It's always best to assume all your mods are broken until they eventually get updated in the coming weeks.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:02
|
|
|
Kerbal Engineer worked after a redownload, and KAC seems to be working fine for me. How fast are asteroids spawning for other people? I'm up to 40 already, and every time I go to the tracking station, it seems like there's more.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:04
|
|
|
From the last thread, where I asked if you could grapple a kerbal.Maxmaps posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2arWYu1_9CY 
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:06
|
|
|
Ground floor for one of the fastest moving threads on SA. Crazy. I gotta say I'm a bit less than 100% enthused at some of the balance issues (ion engine is crazy, nasa parts not as much to my liking) but that's just my own opinion. And the thing that matters much more is the asteroid code which is amazing. I can take out parts or mod some balance changes to my liking.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:06
|
|
|
Question: Is it possible to grapple on to something other than an asteroid, and if so, can I merge the Mun and Minmus into one by way of high-speed collision?
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:09
|
|
|
Pyroi posted:Question: Is it possible to grapple on to something other than an asteroid, and if so, can I merge the Mun and Minmus into one by way of high-speed collision?
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:10
|
|
|
I've only made two attempts at doing an asteroid rendezvous in the sandbox and already I'm terribly aware of how bad I am at launching at anything other than a zero degree inclination.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:14
|
|
|
Woo mission flags and flag decals and new rockets and big rocks to grab. I'm already redesigning my lifting system and making an asteroid intercept vehicle, it is beautiful. edit: yeah the new engine effects on the NASA bits is pretty awesome too. Spaceman Future! fucked around with this message at 05:18 on Apr 2, 2014 |
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:15
|
|
|
Klyith posted:I gotta say I'm a bit less than 100% enthused at some of the balance issues (ion engine is crazy, nasa parts not as much to my liking) but that's just my own opinion. And the thing that matters much more is the asteroid code which is amazing. I can take out parts or mod some balance changes to my liking. Yeah, we're starting to balance things around where they're placed in the Tech Tree so some parts will be flat out better than others at doing the same job, because people will have to work for a while to get them. We understand that it's not ideal for the sandbox only players, but we've left our system open to modding so people can tweak KSP into a better game for themselves.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:19
|
|
|
Quick note for all you penny-pinchers (or student-loan-havers...  ) like myself: 40% off this week on Steam! Just $16.19, if you haven't pulled the trigger yet.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:23
|
|
|
I love that flags go on the rockets now. I just have a suggestion related to that... would it be possible instead of having it auto-placed to select where the flag is. Perhaps some sort of stamp tool. And if we can do that, maybe allow us to paint the ship's name on it too. Very useful for Space Shuttles.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:29
|
|
|
I just spent the past couple hours getting back in to the game. With a fresh career up and running, already making orbit with tier-2 parts in a nearly SSTO. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:30
|
|
|
I'm gonna sing the new thread song! New thread, new thread, new threeeaaa-aaa-aaaaaad! Glad to hear Kerbal Engineer works. I actually haven't touched KSP since I got my space station Mk. II into orbit, and this is the ultimate addition to suck me back in (to the vacuum of space, that is). I'm so looking forward to wrangling an asteroid and trying out all these shiny new parts in the process!
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:31
|
|
|
Thwomp posted:I've only made two attempts at doing an asteroid rendezvous in the sandbox and already I'm terribly aware of how bad I am at launching at anything other than a zero degree inclination. Yeah, other than direct-to-Minmus missions I usually launch due east. I think I've only done a polar launch once or twice. I've managed to engineer an encounter with a C asteroid, but I'm probably didn't use a very efficient method to do so. It was coming in on a slightly retrograde orbit, so I did a launch to the southwest. On the way up I got the orbits aligned, and just hung out in low-Kerbin orbit for it to make its close approach. I then did a burn to take me out to it. Ended up getting to within 1.8km of it before having to break the rendezvous because I was running out of fuel. I'm sure using MechJeb would help things. It'd probably be more efficient to send a probe out and drag it into an orbit slightly more suitable for a manned mission.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:40
|
|
|
Decided to start a new career up to go with the new update, somehow managed to build a rocket that, by part-clipping from the antenna being placed on the parachute or something, wouldn't stop accelerating even after it ran totally out of fuel  Time to try again! 
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:47
|
|
|
New thread? Time to re-install and start chucking asteroids at Kerbal Command!
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:50
|
|
|
Venusian Weasel posted:Yeah, other than direct-to-Minmus missions I usually launch due east. I think I've only done a polar launch once or twice. Apart from one launch to put a dinky little satellite into polar orbit, I have only ever launched eastward. I bet manually trying to line up with an asteroid's orbit is going to be a cakewalk
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 05:54
|
|
|
Maxmaps, I love you guys, but goddamn it I don't have a working computer right now and THE CLAW is calling to me! I need to harass some of my friends for a loaner to play KSP now
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:03
|
|
|
Oh, and guys, since mission flags are now a thing Ill just kick this out there: http://imgur.com/a/rRUZp#161 Note the Duna, Mun, Minmus and Eve flags, you know for mission specific awesomeness.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:06
|
|
|
In case it was missed in the dying moments of the previous thread, after the hotfix my career mode game somehow sort of transformed into a sandbox game more or less. Back up your saves and hide the moonshine folks!
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:07
|
|
|
The new lifters are basically better than anything KSP has. They pump out loads of TWR and are very fuel efficient. Only downside is you have to be careful not to escape Kerbin with your first stage.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:09
|
|
|
LeJackal posted:New thread? Time to re-install and start chucking asteroids at Kerbal Command! Yeah, this is basically my reaction. I hope it still runs on my dinky-rear end old system, it was starting to chug around the time the new space center was debuted. Now there's apparently all these science things that can happen? e: A White Guy posted:The new lifters are basically better than anything KSP has. They pump out loads of TWR and are very fuel efficient. You call that a downside?
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:11
|
|
|
It's absurd what you can do with the new parts. And poo poo looks really, really nice with the new joints; I can actually build tall without building wide.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:22
|
|
|
Ground floor, bitches
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:25
|
|
|
I guess it's time to nuke my mod folder once more and start a clean campaign again
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:31
|
|
|
SynthOrange posted:From the last thread, where I asked if you could grapple a kerbal. The first thing I wondered on watching this is "is that pulley system in stock now". Does that make me weird? 
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:33
|
|
|
PerrineClostermann posted:It's absurd what you can do with the new parts. And poo poo looks really, really nice with the new joints; I can actually build tall without building wide. I feel like the new and improved staging is a prelude to eventual aerodynamic fixes. As it is, aerodynamics in KSP favor parallel staging (most engines are too underpowered to get into space inside of one stage). So, with this new vertical engines that's waaaay more powerful than current engines, I'd be willing to wager that aerodynamics fixes are in the offing that will make parallel staging far less effective.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:34
|
|
|
Dareon posted:Yeah, this is basically my reaction. I hope it still runs on my dinky-rear end old system, it was starting to chug around the time the new space center was debuted. Now there's apparently all these science things that can happen? We tweaked a -lot- of stuff under the hood, so you may be looking at a performance boost! Ciaphas posted:The first thing I wondered on watching this is "is that pulley system in stock now". Does that make me weird? Give us an update or two, will ya?
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:36
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 5, 2024 00:23 |
|
|
Is it odd that I'm personally more excited about the large parts than the whole asteroid capture deal? (Although that's still cool.) Should be quite helpful for boosting larger things to orbit. I remember when I first started the game, I decided to put a 150 ton interplanetary craft into a 600 km orbit. This was before I knew about asparagus, so I ended up with something around 24 mainsails and orange tanks for the first stage.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2014 06:37
|
|
