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KittyEmpress
Dec 30, 2012

Jam Buddies

I dislike events because I have no interest in buying 20 books a week to get w full complete story. I will buy a self contained book each time it comes out, but I'll wait for entire events to be on Unlimited before I'll read an actual event.

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Gaz-L
Jan 28, 2009

LordPants posted:

What are the great Marvel books right now? I'm out of the loop and instead I'm reading terrible X-Books.

Are you reading Wolverine? It's pretty good. Otherwise, Mockingbird, Ultimates, Black Widow, Spider-Woman, Silk, New Avengers, Squirrel Girl and Hellcat are all books I look forward to reading each month (well, 2 of them only have 1 issue, but they're awesome). Spider-Man, ASM, ANAD Avengers and Power Man & Iron Fist are like one tier below.

Blockhouse
Sep 7, 2014

You Win!
New Avengers is probably my favorite Marvel book right now

anything Al Ewing writes is gold

X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!

Captain Marvel is my favorite, but Contest of Champions and Ultimates are in my Top 5 as well (along with Amazing Spider-Man and Spider-Woman),

Aphrodite
Jun 27, 2006

Captain Marvel is good now?

That's nice to hear. I'm way behind and haven't been paying attention to current stuff.

X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!

Aphrodite posted:

Captain Marvel is good now?

That's nice to hear. I'm way behind and haven't been paying attention to current stuff.

Yes. Plus having Puck as a supporting character doesn't hurt.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!
CM also made all of Alpha Flight awesome.

Lurdiak
Feb 26, 2006

I believe in a universe that doesn't care, and people that do.


I have been informed by someone in the know that "Marvel hasn't been any good for at least 15 years and their sales prove it, they're doing worse than they ever have."

He then cited the female Thor as an example of driving readers away.

Wanderer
Nov 5, 2006

our every move is the new tradition
Yeah, I've seen a couple of people bring that up, most of whom were salty over Sam as Cap, Jane as Thor, Laura as Wolverine, or Miles in the 616.

http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-02.html

Actual data seems to indicate that Marvel's doing rather well, and that Jane as Thor sells respectably. Marvel's market share obviously owes a great deal to Star Wars books, but even without them, they'd command a sizable chunk of the market.

I suspect that for every older fan who's annoyed over the current Marvel line-up, there may be a new reader or two to take his or her (but probably his) place.

twistedmentat
Nov 21, 2003

Its my party
and I'll die if
I want to
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-01.html

Quick google shows comic sales for january, the last full month. It takes until position 8 before a DC book comes up, and that's loving Batman. Its pretty much all Marvel books until 24 which is Batman and TMNT. Basically, unless its a Batman book or Batman related, and its DC, its after pretty much everything Marvel puts out, and lower than Image stuff like Walking Dead.

Anecdotally, I'm seeing this in my store and in my friends store. Lots of people are dropping DC stuff from their pulls, except for Batman stuff, but Marvel stuff is still on there.

EDIT: haha, same idea there. But most of my customers and generally people I talk to outside of SA about comics, they love the crap out of the new characters they've introduced. It probably helps that Jane and Laura's books have been super strong. I'm not the only one who doesn't care if they ever return to the old ways. I admit I would like to see Steve as Cap again, but I know that's coming, but It's not something I would get upset about.

Speaking of Jane Foster Thor, in the last issue, is that Ultimate Thor's hammer in old Asgard that I figure Odinson was trying to get? What's the story there?

twistedmentat fucked around with this message at 06:48 on Mar 20, 2016

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

twistedmentat posted:

http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-01.html

Quick google shows comic sales for january, the last full month. It takes until position 8 before a DC book comes up, and that's loving Batman. Its pretty much all Marvel books until 24 which is Batman and TMNT. Basically, unless its a Batman book or Batman related, and its DC, its after pretty much everything Marvel puts out, and lower than Image stuff like Walking Dead.

Anecdotally, I'm seeing this in my store and in my friends store. Lots of people are dropping DC stuff from their pulls, except for Batman stuff, but Marvel stuff is still on there.

Speaking of Jane Foster Thor, in the last issue, is that Ultimate Thor's hammer in old Asgard that I figure Odinson was trying to get? What's the story there?

Read Secret Wars: Law and Hammers

twistedmentat
Nov 21, 2003

Its my party
and I'll die if
I want to

bobkatt013 posted:

Read Secret Wars: Law and Hammers

Cracka-doom Cracka-doom!!!!

I need to grab that. It's the only SW book I wanted to pick up but didn't because I already had too many on the go.

Wanderer
Nov 5, 2006

our every move is the new tradition
Although all that aside, the prices on the books cannot be helping. Individual issues just aren't a good value for money, regardless of how fun they are to read, and you can definitely see that reflected in the general sales.

Open Marriage Night
Sep 18, 2009

"Do you want to talk to a spider, Peter?"


I was worried about Marvel not having Hickman, Remender, or Fraction, but they are doing insanely well. Not a dud in the bunch besides maybe the X books.

X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!

Nah Hercules is for sure a dud. At least the writing is, the art is pretty great though.

Teenage Fansub
Jan 28, 2006

I dunno. After a few years of Hickman, I'm missing something really compelling in the Avengers books. Pleasant Hill sure ain't no Infinity.
I like a few things. I love Vision. But I'm definitely not feeling for ANAD what I was at the start of the Now! era.

Teenage Fansub fucked around with this message at 11:52 on Mar 20, 2016

Open Marriage Night
Sep 18, 2009

"Do you want to talk to a spider, Peter?"


X-O posted:

Nah Hercules is for sure a dud. At least the writing is, the art is pretty great though.

That's gotta be on the chopping block. I think what I'm trying to say is that Marvel currently has some good editors. They're a well oiled machine while DC is trying to reinvent the wheel.

PaybackJack
May 21, 2003

You'll hit your head and say: 'Boy, how stupid could I have been. A moron could've figured this out. I must be a real dimwit. A pathetic nimnal. A wretched idiotic excuse for a human being for not having figured these simple puzzles out in the first place...As usual, you've been a real pantload!

X-O posted:

Nah Hercules is for sure a dud. At least the writing is, the art is pretty great though.

Hercules is better than Amazing. I can't believe anyone would top 5 that book, except Slott himself. I don't even really hate the idea of successful Peter Parker, but ugh. Hercules has some missed but I like someone trying to do American Gods in comic form in the Marvel U.

Hakkesshu
Nov 4, 2009


Well I caught up with Captain Marvel based on the response here and yeah it's good. I was initially annoyed by all the "HURM HUR ALIEN DIPLOMACY BOOORING DESK JOB JUST WANNA PUNCH THINGS DUR" but that's just for the first issue and it already has good hook to it and most importantly, unlike anything KSD ever did on the book, it has a strong supporting cast.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!

PaybackJack posted:

Hercules is better than Amazing. I can't believe anyone would top 5 that book, except Slott himself. I don't even really hate the idea of successful Peter Parker, but ugh. Hercules has some missed but I like someone trying to do American Gods in comic form in the Marvel U.

Have you been keeping up on it? I'm Dan Slott hateboy #1 and even I love it.

Silver Surfer is still bad though. Aside from the art.

irlZaphod
Mar 26, 2004

Kiss the Joycon to Kiss Zelda

All I want from Civil War II is someone telling Carol that she doesn't know what Snapchat or UFC are.

Bendis' events have mostly been bad, House of M was just sort of badly paced, Secret Invasion was pretty disjointed and just really unsatisfying, Siege was at least short.

Veg
Oct 13, 2008

:smug::smug::xd:

Rhyno posted:

Have you been keeping up on it? I'm Dan Slott hateboy #1 and even I love it.

Silver Surfer is still bad though. Aside from the art.

No, no, no. Noo. If you 'love' it, we're taking your membership card.

gently caress Dan Slott.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!

Veg posted:

No, no, no. Noo. If you 'love' it, we're taking your membership card.

gently caress Dan Slott.

He's clearly back on his meds dude.

Threep
Apr 1, 2006

It's kind of a long story.
Creative team on Vote Loki is Chris Hastings and Langdon Foss, and for anyone worried Hastings didn't read the Ewing run:

Chris Hastings posted:

So much of a presidential campaign is about perception and narrative. Truth can get muddy depending on context or lost details, and sometimes the truth even gets flat out ignored by the media and the people because there's an easier narrative that's slightly less true but easier or more attractive to follow. Loki isn't just the god of lies, he's the god of stories. Manipulating narrative will be what this is all about.
Also:

quote:

We want Loki to remain mysterious and keep some tricks up his sleeve throughout this story, so we're framing it from the point of view of a political journalist who reports on Loki throughout the campaign. She has a voice the reader can trust.

And Marvel Universe political satire is exactly what we're going for!
http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/c2e2-exclusive-hastings-urges-america-to-vote-loki

It sounds pretty great.

X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!

PaybackJack posted:

Hercules is better than Amazing.

Well that's just wrong.

Edge & Christian
May 20, 2001

Earth-1145 is truly the best!
A world of singing, magic frogs,
high adventure, no shitposters
A complete and detailed run of how all of Marvel's current books are:

Good Current Books: ANAD Avengers, Daredevil, Ms. Marvel
GREAT Current Books: Mighty Avengers, Squirrel Girl, Red Wolf
TERRIBLE Current Books: Old Man Logan, Punisher, Silver Surfer
REAL TERRIBLE Current Books: All-New X-Men, Illuminati, Thor
BONKERS Current Books: Hercules, Black Widow, Gamora
MAKES ME WANT TO PISS STRAIGHT IN THE AIR Current Books: Ant-Man, Agents of SHIELD, Power Man & Iron Fist
BLOODPISS INDUCING Current Books: Guardians of the Galaxy, Spidey-Man, Spider-Woman, Hulk
NOT EVEN BEING PUBLISHED CURRENTLY RIGHT NOW WHAT THE gently caress Books: New Avengers, Captain Marvel, All-New Wolverine

vvv EDIT:Forgot about Amazing Spider-Man, Iron Man, and Howard the Duck.There's all solid Ds out of 5s

Edge & Christian fucked around with this message at 22:38 on Mar 20, 2016

SirDan3k
Jan 6, 2001

Trust me, you are taking this a lot more seriously then I am.
I don't read spider-man anymore but Hercules is worse then anything I endured clinging to Spidey under Slott's garbage work.


Before anybody starts telling me how I should pick up amazing because it's better, I don't care get off mah porch.

X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!

Edge & Christian posted:

A complete and detailed run of how all of Marvel's current books are:

Good Current Books: ANAD Avengers, Daredevil, Ms. Marvel
GREAT Current Books: Mighty Avengers, Squirrel Girl, Red Wolf
TERRIBLE Current Books: Old Man Logan, Punisher, Silver Surfer
REAL TERRIBLE Current Books: All-New X-Men, Illuminati, Thor
BONKERS Current Books: Hercules, Black Widow, Gamora
MAKES ME WANT TO PISS STRAIGHT IN THE AIR Current Books: Ant-Man, Agents of SHIELD, Power Man & Iron Fist
BLOODPISS INDUCING Current Books: Guardians of the Galaxy, Spidey-Man, Spider-Woman, Hulk
NOT EVEN BEING PUBLISHED CURRENTLY RIGHT NOW WHAT THE gently caress Books: New Avengers, Captain Marvel, All-New Wolverine

Why don't you go bloodpiss somewhere else if you're that bothered.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!
What does any of that even mean?

X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!

Rhyno posted:

What does any of that even mean?

It means he doesn't like people talking about liking or disliking books unless they can write a 2000 word post on why they do or don't like something.

Edge & Christian
May 20, 2001

Earth-1145 is truly the best!
A world of singing, magic frogs,
high adventure, no shitposters
I think that's wrong, but I respect your opinion.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!

X-O posted:

It means he doesn't like people talking about liking or disliking books unless they can write a 2000 word post on why they do or don't like something.

Oooooh, so same poo poo as 10 years ago. Got it.

X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!

Edge & Christian posted:

I think that's wrong, but I respect your opinion.

Nah, I think it's right. You always pull this really passive aggressive whiny poo poo when people just want to express to their opinions in some offhand way. You do it all the time. I'm sorry that you think everyone should have to defend every one of their opinions down to the last detail but they don't. Sometimes people want to say what they think in a short concise way and move on. An opinion isn't any less valid because it's not backed up by three paragraphs of reasoned arguments. If you don't like that kind of conversation then that's just too bad. It's going to happen on any forum whether you like it or not. And bitching about it passive aggressively with bullshit posts like the above is likely to have the opposite effect you want it to have. There are times when people will want to discuss things in detail and times when they won't.

Edge & Christian
May 20, 2001

Earth-1145 is truly the best!
A world of singing, magic frogs,
high adventure, no shitposters
I feel like there's a happy medium between "2000 word posts" and "it is good", like "literally providing a sentence or sentence fragment describing what you like or dislike about something" but it's not up to me.

Wanderer
Nov 5, 2006

our every move is the new tradition
Now, is wanting to piss straight into the air a good, bad, or neutral thing?

<has clipboard out, pen uncapped, wears jaunty fedora with 'PRESS' card wedged under brim>

Edge & Christian
May 20, 2001

Earth-1145 is truly the best!
A world of singing, magic frogs,
high adventure, no shitposters
Question from the audience: "Pissed straight into the air" is a reaction described by noted wrestling journalist/dad Bryan Alvarez upon seeing a wrestling match. I do not remember if he ever clarified what it meant, but it stuck with me. I believe it means whatever the viewer wants it to mean, which is how the best reviews work.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!

Wanderer posted:

Now, is wanting to piss straight into the air a good, bad, or neutral thing?

<has clipboard out, pen uncapped, wears jaunty fedora with 'PRESS' card wedged under brim>

I guess it all depends on if you can determine how much blood will be in it before you start.

X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!

Edge & Christian posted:

I feel like there's a happy medium between "2000 word posts" and "it is good", like "literally providing a sentence or sentence fragment describing what you like or dislike about something" but it's not up to me.

I get that. I also think there's a happy medium between just ignoring the parts of the ongoing conversations you don't like and posting poo poo like this:

Edge & Christian posted:

A complete and detailed run of how all of Marvel's current books are:

Good Current Books: ANAD Avengers, Daredevil, Ms. Marvel
GREAT Current Books: Mighty Avengers, Squirrel Girl, Red Wolf
TERRIBLE Current Books: Old Man Logan, Punisher, Silver Surfer
REAL TERRIBLE Current Books: All-New X-Men, Illuminati, Thor
BONKERS Current Books: Hercules, Black Widow, Gamora
MAKES ME WANT TO PISS STRAIGHT IN THE AIR Current Books: Ant-Man, Agents of SHIELD, Power Man & Iron Fist
BLOODPISS INDUCING Current Books: Guardians of the Galaxy, Spidey-Man, Spider-Woman, Hulk
NOT EVEN BEING PUBLISHED CURRENTLY RIGHT NOW WHAT THE gently caress Books: New Avengers, Captain Marvel, All-New Wolverine

vvv EDIT:Forgot about Amazing Spider-Man, Iron Man, and Howard the Duck.There's all solid Ds out of 5s

I mean just let people have their opinions and jump in when you have one of your own or want to ask them expound on something they posted. You don't have to post garbage like this that helps nothing.

Edge & Christian
May 20, 2001

Earth-1145 is truly the best!
A world of singing, magic frogs,
high adventure, no shitposters

X-O posted:

I get that. I also think there's a happy medium between just ignoring the parts of the ongoing conversations you don't like and posting poo poo like this: I mean just let people have their opinions and jump in when you have one of your own or want to ask them expound on something they posted. You don't have to post garbage like this that helps nothing.
I feel like the alternatives are "just don't read the forum" (which I realize is probably the logical one) and "post multi-sentence opinions that are just ignored" and you're right, neither of them are "post garbage".

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X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!

Edge & Christian posted:

I feel like the alternatives are "just don't read the forum" (which I realize is probably the logical one) and "post multi-sentence opinions that are just ignored" and you're right, neither of them are "post garbage".

Well I don't want you to go with "just don't read the forum" because I generally actually enjoy the things you post about. The thing is, it's kind of hard to reconcile the person that posted that above is also the person that posts something great like:

Edge & Christian posted:

The "TV season" model was actually a thing a lot of creators talked about circa 2000 or so.

The big proponent I recall was Priest while talking about his run on Black Panther, which for what it's worth ran continually for 60-odd issues without any renumbering.

The issue was that writers had sort of all adopted this "I envision this to be a big epic run a la Sandman/Starman/etc. etc." and were planning so hard for that HUGE payoff in issue 30 that they forgot to tell a particularly compelling story in the first six issues and the book got canceled and they would go online and bitch about how IF ONLY people had waited for that payoff, all that bricklaying in the first few issues would be so so so worth it.

The "TV season" model was based on the idea that initially he was given twelve issues on Black Panther, but both he and the editor hoped it would run longer, so he plotted out the first 'season' so it would work both as a standalone twelve issue series but also set up storylines for the "second" season, and he could adjust the last issue or two accordingly when he got to the end of each 'season'.

This seems more like best practices for writing a work-for-hire series than any sort of imposed numbering scheme, and even though there's kind of a defacto "six issues per arc" sort of logic imposed, it's not to say I think everyone should be forced to write in 12/22/whatever issue increments. I think most creators seem to have figured out not to fall into this trap, so maybe any further reinforcement of this wouldn't really help anything.

What's also funny along these lines is that I remember all sorts of people (retailers mostly, but also some creators) complaining about companies (mostly DC's) unwillingness to renumber back in the same period, the argument being that it'd be much easier to sell people on BATMAN #1 BY JEPH LOEB AND JIM LEE than "Batman #607, but don't worry, you don't need to buy issue #606" or whatever. I remember one local retailer in particular being incensed by Hush not starting with a #1 issue and worrying DC undercut themselves saleswise, which is funny in retrospect.

I definitely see the logic (outside of sales motivations) behind doing hard resetting of numbers when one run ends and another begins. It makes logical sense and is accessible to have Fraction/Aja do 22 issues of Hawkeye, that ends, Lemire/Perez do X issues of All-New Hawkeye, and then in 2017 you get a third #1 with a new creative team's Hawkeyes or something. Ditto having Hickman's Avengers stuff start with #1s instead of being Avengers #68 and New Avengers #106 or whatever. The issue, as other people have pointed out, is more when they jump to the big numbers for five minutes, or when you have Paul Cornell writing two Wolverine #1s within a year or so of each other. That only confuses things.
Are you thinking of the "Season One" OGNs from a few years ago? The only book I remember being explicitly labeled "Season" other than that was when Terry Moore took over Spider-Man Loves Mary Jane and they labelled the relaunch "Season Two" for some reason.

The "Season One" line was just a branding to indicate that they were redoing the origin stories for their big characters in a modern/accessible/streamlined way. They were all pretty inessential but then again, I'm not the target audience of people looking for primers on characters they've just been introduced to in movies/television/games. There were a few fun ones though:

-Dr. Strange by Greg Pak and Emma Rios was gorgeous if nothing else
-X-Men by Dennis Hopeless and Jamie McKelvie was Exhibit A for "Dennis Hopeless is a perfectly decent superhero writer" and it was fun to see McKelvie do something outside of his wheelhouse
-Hulk by Fred Van Lente and Tom Fowler had some good art and was an interesting tweaking of the Hulk origin to reflect recent interpretations of Hulk/Banner that seemed to be cribbing heavily from Breaking Bad of all things

The rest were pretty forgettable.

I mean I love reading the stuff you post when you're not doing that passive aggressive poo poo. So I'd rather "just don't read the forum" not be your chosen alternative.

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