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MagnesiumB posted:Question, have we seen any of the Ivory Kings yet? I know we've seen the Black Priests and the Mapmakers so far and we've also seen that both of those two come from attempts to deal with the Incursion Events. I'm wondering if maybe The Ivory Kings aren't a possible outcome for the Illuminati, the end result in universes where they continue to battle against the Incursions by further compromising their morals? Lots of foreshadowing this week with Namor and T'Challa referring to their kingdoms and their status as fallen Kings. As far as I know though, the Ivory Kings have only been barely referred to. We know that Black Swan's key to the library nexus (from the flashback story of her and her brother) was a gift from the Kings. Anyone catch that the Justice League landed in some Apocalypse egyptian sphinx area before meeting up with our Illuminati? Maybe more foreshadowing with Rabum Alal = The Great Destroyer = Apocalypse? hope and vaseline fucked around with this message at 19:25 on May 1, 2014 |
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May 1, 2014 19:23
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The Biggest Jerk posted:So can anyone here explain what's the deal with Mapmakers and black priests? I feel like I'm missing something to their purpose other than blowing stuff up. The Black Priests are manifestations of The Norn, presumably that earth's sorcerer supreme. He summons 2 of his potential future selves and sacrifices them to conjure the priests as a defense against his homeworld. The issue previous to this had Dr. Strange engage in a faustian pact and we have yet to see if it will be related to the priests in any way. The Mapmakers are still pretty ambiguous. We know that AIM took samples from various avengers when they were incapacitated and used them to create some sort of super adaptoids that have currently evolved past their original programming and gone on to meet the Mapmakers in no-space. Whether this is an event that has occurred multiple times in different earths to create the Mapmakers or if the original ones have some other origin story, we don't know yet. Their process: quote:Mapmakers wiki edit: I just re-read NA 16. After the Norn says his words of power, the opposing Earth gets destroyed, and his 2 "selves" seem to fade away? The masks' design are nearly identical to the Black Priests, there's probably more to the story than we've seen yet. hope and vaseline fucked around with this message at 05:59 on May 2, 2014 |
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May 2, 2014 05:13
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:Swan has mentioned them at least once (maybe twice). I know she did in #12 of whichever acted as an epilogue to Infinity. All we know of the Ivory Kings thus far is that Black Swan's family are heirs to the throne of a hidden city which had a gateway into a multiversal library, the key was a gift from them. There's also a mention of the Ebony Kings; in the issue where the Illuminati are observing a Black Priest invasion, they sense them observing through the bridge, and mention if it could be the Ebony Kings observing them.
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May 2, 2014 21:53
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If we're going out on a limb with the Apocalypse/evolution/survival of the multiversal fittest game here, Beast has some history with dealing with the "no more mutants" problem (even going through alternate earths to look for explanations), Dark Beast is pretty much an insane genetic tinkerer, and Sublime even used Beast's body in an alternate timeline. It's kind of odd how right now everyone in the Illuminati has some kind of personal drama going on except for Beast.
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May 3, 2014 14:04
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Nevvy Z posted:I wonder how they'll handle having Spencer finish his stories. What No don't do this Marvel.
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May 6, 2014 06:00
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d00gZ posted:Man, this feels so much more organic than Civil War, it's not even funny. Cap losing his poo poo was great, and I loved Thor bringing as much muscle as he could to try to keep the peace. Tony was such a GIGANTIC flippant cock about it, but the way he responded "you" -- I see it, he thinks Cap's wussed out of making hard decisions. I really, truly understand and "get" both sides, and it feels totally in character. All of this. Even with half of the issue being flashback, Avengers was fantastic. NA however felt like one big cocktease :/
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May 14, 2014 19:11
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^burtle posted:Isn't that where Cap just jumped to in Avengers? Nawp, that's 48 years later, probably a kind of Days of Future Past scenario.
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May 20, 2014 04:39
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Soonmot posted:Goddamn, when will they get to the fireworks factory!!!! Haha yeah. This arc does definitely feel like a permanent case of blue balls, but then I think of how frequently we get issues of Avengers/NA without delays, and even in build-up issues there's enough interesting elements or interactions that it doesn't feel like filler.
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Jun 12, 2014 04:12
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Hakkesshu posted:Today's Avengers is probably the first time in Hickman's run where I figuratively threw my hands up in the air and asked myself "what the gently caress did I just read?" -It is not known if these future events are destined to occur or are part of a branching time-line that is avoidable. -Future Thor is no longer worthy to wield Mjolnir. -Cap has self doubts about how to face the Illuminati, being of a level of intelligence not even close to the them combined. -Ultron-Avengers were built as symbols of a communal memory for the remaining humans on earth. Being "of the past," they struggle to reconcile the ideals of the former age in a time where ideals no longer exist. Ultron-Natasha understanding the resourcefulness of her human counterpart, wishes to free herself from the Ultron hive-mind. Natasha has directives now for the next future jump and present Stark (See this wiki page on a forest that is one intertwined root system) -Cap is now a bomb (for the future? the past?) Something else is going on also. The drones they first encounter are spouting some sort of numerical code, and Ultron-Cap says, "Break the code, you get the box." At first I thought it referred to their enclosure but I'm thinking it's something else entirely. The time jumps are happening because it seems the Time Gem is trying to prevent itself from shattering, perhaps this is something they need to do to fix it and prevent more jumps? Perhaps all of this is some kind of metaphor, the shattering gem and the people of the future becoming more and more broken as time moves forward? hope and vaseline fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Jun 18, 2014 |
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Jun 18, 2014 20:04
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Gushing so much over all the NA awesomeness we got this week. The annual was BEAUTIFUL, it just conveyed that crazy magic astral plane demon psychedelic nonsense perfectly instead of the usual spreads of Strange firing magic lasers against other magic lasers artwork that we get. Blood magic Strange doing the Black Priest split consciousness stuff in the annual, and him holding the priest mask at the end of NA, doesn't spell good things.
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Jun 26, 2014 04:17
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NA #13, the blood bible.
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Jun 26, 2014 15:45
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Spiderdrake posted:He didn't use the words of the black priests. He used the words of like, whatever the term for lovecraftian horrors from beyond the veil are called in Marvel. When the Norn used the words of the black priests they weren't in english. Words of Power are Words of Power, no matter the language. That's the worrying part. His failed deal would have effectively made him a god, at the cost of his soul. The alternative, abandoning his soul to the powers of the Blood Bible, pretty much is going to turn him into the opposite, a devil, or lovecraftian horror, and isn't that what the Black Priests are in the end? It's like we saw in the previous Avengers arc with the proto-Mapmakers. Design principles essentially led to the same end result. Strange now has the mask, the words of power, and (as we saw in the annual) the ability to split into numerous selves. hope and vaseline fucked around with this message at 22:48 on Jun 27, 2014 |
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Jun 27, 2014 22:44
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IUG posted:I just recall that scene where he came back from that other realm, and we were all lead to believe he gave up his whole soul. He spoke some other language to Namor, so now I'm wondering why he did that if he came back as himself. Strange tries to sell his soul, fails, resorts to blood bible, is now black magic scary as poo poo strange, comes back, Namor seems him, speaks a word of power which is now his language. We're only getting the phonetic interpretation cause Hickman wants us to know that they are the same thing.
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Jun 28, 2014 01:07
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Dr.Magnificent posted:Ok this was poorly worded on my part. It doesn't feel earned. They go directly to murdering Earths as an acceptable option from the get go. And we all know its a truly bad idea, and will go wrong. I'm supposed to feel tension as it builds to the climax, but I'm just finding it boring and time wasting. I'm not saying Hickman is a bad writer or even that the run is bad, just that I'm not enjoying it. I'll give it another try when its finished, maybe I'll enjoy it more when its a complete work, that did happen with Hickman's Fantastic Four run. Except they're not? They're exhausting every possibility until they have to do it. This is the first instance where they'll actually be destroying a populated earth. Yes they've built an arsenal, and just the act of doing it implies deafeatism, but they are trying, but the odds are kind of stacked. hope and vaseline fucked around with this message at 01:59 on Jun 29, 2014 |
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Jun 29, 2014 01:55
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Senor Candle posted:How angry could he be at a guy who is just trying to save his world? That's a good point. Arguing about power levels for the sake of comic book consistency isn't a very interesting thing to do (it's usually relative to the needs of the plot or the whims of the writer), but if you think about it, all of the illuminati have doubts about their current mission. They don't want to destroy a populated earth, so they're unintentionally holding back. Even Namor who cast the first blow has qualms about it. Strange is the one who's conscience isn't factoring in now that he's sacrificed his soul, and that's why he's the one defeating the Great Society.
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Jul 1, 2014 22:36
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Schneider Heim posted:Was the Illuminati always boys-only club by design? In Black Swan's origin issue (NA #5), she mentions being raised by the great ladies, a trio of Black Swans, who happen to be black and white reversed versions of Emma Frost, Deathbird, and I think one of the tentacle Hydra ladies from Secret Warriors. They seem to be a mirror to our Illuminati, destroying worlds as a tribute for Rabum Alal. Instead of destroying worlds to save their own, they destroy worlds because it is inevitable, part of the great game or whatever she calls the incursions.
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Jul 2, 2014 03:00
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:That was a different one (referred as Galaktus). Wasn't there a similar panel to this early in USM's run that was also referencing an event happening in 616? (God I've got to catch up to that book) Also how does that drat sash stay on Ms Marvel's costume
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Jul 2, 2014 19:16
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Hickman, pls make Future Franklin a member of the avengers k bye
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Jul 3, 2014 19:11
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The Question IRL posted:Unless this is supposed to be some Reverse Psychology thing where the only way to make Cap listen to reason is to imply that it's impossible for him to change this and that is what gets Steve to think outside of his normal operating procedure. Ultimately I think this is what the issue is about. Franklin: Cap, you are you, and you can't change. The archetype of a Captain will persevere thousands of years in the future, for good or bad. Cap: But how do I stop Tony? Franklin: You can't, the odds are stacked, the early death of everything will happen. (But clearly it doesn't, or these future issues wouldn't exist in the first place. The Avengers would have nowhere to time skip forward to.) Happy Noodle Boy posted:I think Franklin was being both honest and leading Cap into a certain point if view. The illuminati will fail. Cap will be somewhat responsible for this. He may even kill Tony. But Earth is still there and even in the future Cap is a symbol held proudly by the Avengers Machine. So basically Cap needs to stop fighting the Illuminati and figure out the impossible himself. hope and vaseline fucked around with this message at 23:01 on Jul 10, 2014 |
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Jul 10, 2014 22:59
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PelvicNerve posted:gently caress it, these books make me feel dumb and I do have theoretical physics and engineering degrees. It almost feels like Hickman is trying to teach us to read comics in a different, more satisfying way. The way his runs are structured are like a space-time jigsaw puzzle. Each arc gives us a little bit more to piece together what's happening, and the more we know, the more we understand about past events and what is about to happen. At the same time we're learning that space-time is not linear and has ebbs and flows. Things are fated to happen, characters change and learn, but they're limited because of how archetypes last longer than the characters do. The shared Marvel universe, no matter how radical it changes, will always self-correct due to the nature of comics. You can be the type of reader that will order each comic according to each other chronologically, and go insane trying to do so, or you can accept that the Marvel reality is fluid and non-linear. Why do some writers acknowledge changes in another comic book, or ignore them? Maybe that reality is slightly out of phase. Maybe it will course-correct later in the future to make sense. Comics aren't meant to be put together like a jigsaw puzzle. If you smash the puzzle apart, it's way more beautiful to look at the pieces as an impressionistic, incomplete mess than a puzzle rigidly, forcefully put together. (Sorry for the not too sensical rant.)
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Jul 11, 2014 00:29
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Yawgmoft posted:I thought the Builders picked up the signal. Yeap, I thought it was a fail-safe for the sentient earth stuff. Ex Nihilo unintentionally started a process that would end up with a living planet that could defend itself from incursions, and when that failed to happen it signaled the Builders to come over here and destroy this backwater place.
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Jul 12, 2014 22:14
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First Bass posted:Man T'Challa, sorry your dad is such an rear end in a top hat Avengers 33 felt like a weird holding pattern. It didn't really cover any new ground that the Ultron issue didn't already get through. Maybe it's just reading it after the sheer craziness of NA left me a little disappointed.
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Jul 31, 2014 01:41
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It's really touching seeing how, even after Maximus' diatribe about the difference between heroes and kings, Black Panther is at his core a hero. I don't doubt Black Bolt would have done it, but Namor pulling the trigger is more satisfying and sort of fulfills his arc as resident rear end in a top hat/anti-hero of the Illuminati (I also guess he managed to kill the Jovian with his trident?). I will also admit to liking Larroca's Namor more than Schiti, while still disliking everything else Larroca.
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Woah, is that Earth X May Parker?
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Aug 3, 2014 19:11
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All I've got to say about NA is
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Aug 6, 2014 18:00
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Holy poo poo Hickman. Holy poo poo.
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Aug 20, 2014 16:42
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Hollismason posted:There needs to be a Namor was right t-shirt. Haha, this made me go look for Quire's magneto t-shirt back in New X-Men and found these panels.   Carry on!
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Aug 20, 2014 22:32
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Spiderdrake posted:God, it would be great if Black Bolt pointed out the Namor thing because he was like 'holy poo poo black panther you idiot, how the gently caress is that your first conclusion' and didn't want to spend three days listening to their emo nonsense while poo poo needs doing, and he just knew all along but couldn't be that patient. You mean the actual speech and layout of the Cabal? It's nearly identical to the introduction of the Illuminati in NA 2. http://imgur.com/a/jNarP
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Aug 22, 2014 16:57
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Personally I'm really curious to know more of the history of the Black Swans and why a monochromatic Emma Frost is counted as one of their members.
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Aug 24, 2014 06:11
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PelvicNerve posted:I'd love to be sold on Cap's point of view, I even want to, because I certainly don't want to root for brainwashing and planet destroying. But "lol gently caress you, Kang strawman, I may be old but I'm righteous" and "okay guys, no discussion, let's go gently caress their poo poo up" are not very convincing stances, they read more like the kind of contagious stupidity that justifies dumb event books. This whole arc is the constant repetition that Cap is one step further than any of the avengers archetypes that echo into the future; he is the living representation of hope and perseverance. He transcends his status as man out of time to being literally timeless. Hickman's telling us to trust in Cap, even though we don't have all the information yet.
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Aug 27, 2014 21:04
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It's gonna be hilarious when Tony has to explain the Cabal to him. "See, well, uh, Namor decided to kill the worlds that we couldn't morally justify taking out to spare ours. He might have a Thanos on a leash."
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Aug 27, 2014 23:05
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Saw this on reddit also, haven't read SHIELD yet but Immortus's future-palace has been seen before
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Aug 28, 2014 04:12
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Leper Residue posted:Whoa, I didn't realize that was what was happening at first. That is a serious chunk of flesh she rips out too. Jesus, I didn't get that either. Angry Sue is scary.
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Sep 17, 2014 23:59
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Obviously the baby is a Skrull
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Sep 20, 2014 00:09
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Die Laughing posted:Avengers starts with the movie characters, and sets up the foundation for the mega story. Don't let New Avengers taking place first fool you, Avengers is the better intro. It's the better intro, and it's an even bigger sucker punch when you do find out the real reason for the avengers machine at the end of the first NA arc.
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Sep 22, 2014 03:11
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Little Mac posted:New Avengers was absolutely a blast. It went from chilling to badass to full-on comic book and it all fits and works and rules. Avengers vs Illuminati vs Cabal vs Intelligencia will rule. That Xorn callback was the last thing I expected. And then they kissed...
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Sep 25, 2014 00:25
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First Bass posted:Sorry, far be it from me from getting in the way of TQIRL trashing the Illuminati for the umpteenth time because he thinks he (and now Doom) are smarter than comic book people. It's like he can't divorce Hickman's narrative from the characters in it. What does this even mean? Are you saying the narrative has no bearing on the characters? This seems like a weird snipey little post.
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Sep 25, 2014 21:25
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:
Hoooly poo poo. They're going out there to do battle against Rabum Alal. I always just assumed that this would be a New Avengers plot point, but it makes sense that everything Black Swan has been telling the Illuminati has been distraction and misdirection against the source of it all, which even she claims to worship. And Pod was one of Ex Nihilo's sentient world systems that AIM captured, right? hope and vaseline fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Oct 8, 2014 |
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Oct 8, 2014 17:21
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I love the mention of the FF kids working on the problem. I fell off the FF run around the time that Allred took up wrapping up Fraction's run, have they been featured in anything recently?
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Oct 22, 2014 22:46
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PelvicNerve posted:The Reed/Susan bits made me happy as honestly, Susan's behavior was the part that hit the hardest for me so far. X-Nation huh? So... Utopia 2.0.
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Oct 22, 2014 23:41
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I just watched Interstellar, did anyone else get strong Hickman vibes from the themes running through the movie?
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Nov 8, 2014 21:00
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