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BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

BioMe posted:

But what is really kills me is that there are now reformist Scientologists who agree as a church the religion is corrupt and horrible, but the "core teachings of Scientology" are still important and deserve a better church around them.

"Well we don't like the forced labour or the torture but the creation myth where a space warlord flew people through space on Douglas DC-8s to earth where they were blown up by nukes in volcanos is the hill we're willing to die on"

Edit: I was just reading the Xenu article as a refresher on Wikipedia and gosh, they just obfuscate everything with technical-sounding jargon don't they. "Incident II" "R6 implant" "Operating Thetan level III" "Advanced Technology" and so on. I guess the fact that it sounds vaguely scientific is why people don't just immediately laugh it off; though I suppose it helps that the average Scientologist who makes it that far is already at least a little unhinged to begin with.

BattleMaster has a new favorite as of 11:11 on May 31, 2014

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BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Separating Hubbard from his freaky UFO cult, he really wasn't a very original sci-fi writer. The appearance of every drat thing in his stories looks like some mundane thing from present day (circa 1940-1960). I mean god forbid you actually describe how something looks without saying "oh Markabians look like IRS auditors" or "Xenu's personnel transports look exactly like a contemporary passenger jetliner but with rockets" etc..

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

The most shameful part is that it took until he was captured for someone to decide to street justice him. As far as I'm concerned his men are just as terrible as he was for not mutinying against him and executing him, even if they thought he was a butcher.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

The fact that people feel sympathy for Dahmer is the scary or unnerving part of the whole thing. Why does anyone even write fictional stories about monsters when we have real monsters wearing human skin living among us?

Obviously not him specifically since he's dead now, but who knows what any random person you walk by on the street has in a barrel in their home?

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

BioMe posted:

Most people like that do in fact cope without committing several murders, yes.

Tons of people have a high percentage of those issues and the only reason we even know about Dahmer by name is because he is in fact a very very exceptional and not at all typical example of a human.

Plus a similar guy here in Canada was Russell Williams, a decorated officer in the Canadian Forces (or Royal Canadian Army or whatever the gently caress Harper renamed it to) who achieved the rank of Colonel and ran a large military base here in Ontario. On many occasions he drove off of his base, broke into women's houses, took pictures of himself wearing their underwear, and several who were unlucky enough to be present were raped, tortured, and murdered. Then he'd just drive back to his base like nothing happened.

Or what about Anders Breivik, according to whom the worst thing that ever happened to him is that his prison is only giving him a Playstation 2 and not the Playstation 3 he demands.

Point is that being abused or having a hard life or whatever doesn't have any real correlation with turning people into monstrous serial killers; tons of people manage to cope with poo poo situations without brutalizing other people.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

All mass-produced nuclear weapons in history have been plutonium-based because they're smaller than uranium-based weapons. Unlike uranium weapons where the explosion is caused by mashing two pieces of uranium together to form a supercritical mass, plutonium weapons are built with subcritical spheres of plutonium surrounded by explosive material. When detonated, the explosion compresses the plutonium in just the right way so it becomes supercritical and rapidly releases energy.

The good news is that the detonation of the explosive material has to be perfect or there won't be a fission reaction. If the explosive is detonated by a fire or another explosion or anything like that there won't be a nuclear explosion.

Edit: On top of that the explosive is almost certainly something that can only be detonated by electricity anyway

BattleMaster has a new favorite as of 15:09 on Sep 20, 2014

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

HonorableTB posted:

The age of the Peaceful Atom:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atoms_for_Peace

It's unnerving because of how much faith people placed in atomic energy and technology. I believe that cold fusion, if a sustaining reaction can ever be created and harnessed, will be a huge panacea to a lot of society's energy needs and will be the only thing that can truly make the world get off of fossil fuels. But the Atoms for Peace campaign was nuclear everything.

Cold fusion isn't a thing. It refers specifically to a hoax paper by previously-respected electrochemists Stanley Pons and Martin Fleischmann that managed to get published in a respected journal. Pons and Fleischmann thought that palladium, a metal which absorbs hydrogen, could be forced to absorb so much hydrogen that fusion occurs within it. They couldn't get it to work in the laboratory but thought they had something revolutionary on their hands nonetheless so they falsified the results and published the paper anyway in the hopes that someone else could make it work while they got to keep all the credit. No one could make it work, though, and they were disgraced after the deception was uncovered.

What's scary and/or unnerving about this affair is that cold fusion caught on with pseudoscientists and conspiracy theorists as an example of oil companies/the government/big pharma/the pope/the new world order suppressing non-fossil fuel energy research. Adherents now call it "low energy nuclear reactions" in order to sidestep the stigma behind cold fusion (it's still an identical process though) and sometimes it catches on with a reputable scientist who doesn't know better; if I recall correctly, there's a guy at NASA who thinks he can make it work.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

That's actually a good case study on why torture doesn't work. In the end though the entry of the Soviet Union to the war against Japan had more to do with their surrender than anything else; the US blowing away entire cities in a single day was just business as usual whether it came from one bomb or thousands.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

nucleicmaxid posted:

That is an argument against the bombs. However, there is evidence both that it both is and isn't legitimate. If we're going to have this argument, then we should make our own thread thought, it's one of those topics that can get tempers going and would massively derail this thread if it got started in earnest.

The only argument I would make against the bombs is that it was actually the strategic bombing of Japanese cities by any type of bomb that contributed to the end of the war. I think people give way too much credit to the Manhattan Project. Without nuclear bombs the US would have kept up the firebombing campaign to similar results. (Also, the Soviet Union entering the war was the tipping point because even with cities burning the leadership thought they could hold out until they brought their vast reserves of weapons and manpower to the home islands. With the Soviets fighting them on the mainland those hopes were dashed)

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Solice Kirsk posted:

Is there a way to convert solar energy into a synthetic solid or liquid fuel? That sounds absolutely fascinating.

Nothing used in the (for example) space shuttle and its launch system used anything derived from petroleum products or that couldn't be prepared in a chemical plant with just simple stuff and electricity as an input. At that point it doesn't matter where the electricity is coming from so it could be solar or wind or nuclear or coal or whatever.

The shuttle's main engine just used liquid hydrogen/liquid oxygen which can be made through electrolysis of water. The hydrazine monopropellant for the thrusters can be produced by mixing bleach or hydrogen peroxide and ammonia together. The solid rocket stuff is ammonium perchlorate (made by ammonia and perchloric acid) is mixed with aluminum (most common metal on Earth by composition) and a binder.

You're not going to get into space by mixing household cleaners together in a bucket but chemical plants really aren't that far off from that in concept.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Pharnakes posted:

I don't think it was seriously trying to say we are going to cook ourselves any time soon, it was more making the point that what we are looking forward to as sustainable is only being measured in very human timescale, assuming we want to survive as a species indefinitely we are eventually going to have to start thinking in millions of years, not hundreds. If we continue to grow our energy demands and keep doing it for thousands and thousands of years, then presumably eventually that will all add up to something significant. I'm sure the direct heat released from human activities is negligible so far, but we've only been doing it for a couple of hundred years.

I think you have a seriously tortured understanding of global warming if you think anthropogenic heat is going to be a contributing factor to it. We're talking about a scale where minor changes in snow albedo from carbon pollution are causing the sun to melt the Arctic ice but a CANDU power plant putting 2 gigawatts of heat into the surrounding environment only raises the lakewater by a couple of degrees for a half-kilometer radius.

Our generating capacity is not going to increase infinitely either, it will foreseeably only multiply by several times before reaching a maximum due to several possibilities - we kill ourselves off and it drops like a rock, it stays there because Earth has reached a carrying capacity and everyone has reached an industrialized quality of life, or we take conservation seriously and it drops to a newer maximum.

It's not like 30,000 years in the future Earth will host a population of 7 trillion consuming a million times more energy, releasing enough heat into the environment to melt the crust or something.

BattleMaster has a new favorite as of 13:24 on Dec 15, 2014

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

LawfulWaffle posted:

Well, I happen to have a bit of experience with the Nipponese legal system, and it's quite a bit different from the judicial practices held here in the states. Most of my experience comes from my short term as an assistant to a defense attorney, and their responsibilities go far above and beyond what our counterparts are tasked with.

First, since 2012, the Japanese courts switched to an Inquisitive System, which has helped them push through cases in a very quickly (too quickly, perhaps) fashion. How quickly? Attorneys only have three days to convince the judge (having done away with the rabble box we call a jury) whether or not the accused is guilty. This adds a lot of pressure to attorneys, specifically defense attorneys who may have an innocent person's life in their hands. Further streamlining the system is a tight relationship between the Japanese police force and the legal system, and since public defenders usually have one case per three days, attorney's sometimes step into the shoes of an investigator. I know it sounds crazy, but first hand knowledge of the crime scene, witness statements and relevant evidence is vital in the heated back-and-forth that fills a Japanese courtroom. It can get pretty exciting as a bystander, but the pressure on the defense makes for a relatively high turnover.

Anyway, I bet there's someone here who can give you more pointed examples of people people screwed/absolved/eaten by Japan's Inquisitive System. I only spent a few months there as part of a work-study program.

Do you have a citation on any of that? You've pretty much exactly described a Phoenix Wright game but those games started coming out long before 2012.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Silver2195 posted:

Pretty sure that's :thejoke: (although Phoenix Wright is less exaggerated than one might think; the Japanese criminal justice system is pretty stacked against the accused).

In fact, Japan reintroduced jury ("lay judge") trials in 2009, having abolished them in 1943.

:downs:

I think it would have worked a bit better if the year was the release year for the first game.

I knew the Japanese system was hosed (police allowed to use coercive methods to get a confession, guilt being the default state upon a trial starting, and such) but Phoenix Wright is just a bit worse.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Random Stranger posted:

Also on the subject of the Japanese legal system, they have an over 99% conviction rate. That is a conviction rate more typically encountered in kangaroo courts where dictators want someone to vanish.

Yeah the way I've heard it is that they never go to court without a confession... and the police are allowed to hold you and heavily lean on you until you confess. And once you're in court the assumed state is guilt and you have to prove someone else actually did it to be considered innocent.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

WickedHate posted:

Fine, the nuclear football stays as it is, but using it activates a device in the aide's heart that kills him anyway.

I'd volunteer for that; I wouldn't want to survive to see what would be left of the world when the nukes were done being tossed around.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Hijo Del Helmsley posted:

And for true :magical: level, imagine the North Korean nuclear program.

Given the seismic data from their previous tests it's possible that they faked the tests with loads of conventional explosives buried underground and only killed a mass of slave labourers in the progress.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

I'm studying nuclear engineering (4th year undergraduate) and I've found these projects to scare off future explorers to be really silly and irresponsible. They're all predicated on the idea that you'll be trying to communicate with primitive hunter-gatherers, with concepts like "no honor here" and other things like you're talking to a Klingon.

I think there are two problems with that. First, almost anything you can try will just make people curious or wonder what treasure you're trying to hide. Second, why the hell are you putting your waste somewhere that primitive tribesman can find it?! Even if they don't find it or your warnings work, it will be close enough to the surface that you're risking contaminating the water table in the event of a leak.

Just stick that poo poo so deep that anyone who finds it will be advanced enough that they'll have radiation detection equipment.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Atmus posted:

It also doesn't get a group of 'scientists' paid.

Haha yeah I didn't want to say anything but this project looks like a make-work program for anthropologists.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

atomicthumbs posted:

re: containing nuclear waste: I always liked the idea of a grid of enormous black concrete cubes with narrow passages between them that heat up in the sunlight and become impossible to traverse.


the real problem here is that you haven't taken enough anthropology classes!! the intent is not to communicate with klingons, it's to try to communicate the idea that this site is not to honor a person, event, or thing, it's there to contain bad things.

Nah, the problem is that if you're storing it close enough to the surface that you need a scary warning then you're risking contaminating people/animals/water even if the warning works and people stay away.

Many radionuclides in spent fuel waste have half-lives of thousands of years, and the majority of it is heavy metal that lasts forever. Do you think that the containers the waste is in will retain their integrity that long?

This whole thing is an irresponsible wankfest by artists and anthropologists when it should be treated as a science and engineering problem. Maybe the social scientists should work towards figuring out how to make sure our society doesn't collapse that far instead of working on their Fallout fantasies?

BattleMaster has a new favorite as of 13:49 on Jan 9, 2015

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Freudian posted:

A big sign saying "DONT DIG HERE WE hosed UP AND YOULL DIE"

This is about as useful as any of the weird Monuments of Dishonour that heat up and jag and have a billion skulls on the door.

Probably even more useful since more advanced explorers could possibly understand it as something other than a place to poke around in.

But seriously, the long-term storage of nuclear waste is a real problem that governments don't want to pay for because the proper solutions (deep underground vaults) that have already been proposed too expensive for the politicians to stomach. That's why they're cheaping out and going with fields of cubes/spikes/gibbeted skulls which won't do a drat thing for long-term safety.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Jack Gladney posted:

It has some hallmarks of fraud, like going the media route before establishing a business to make or sell the stuff and never letting anyone do more than some initial testing, plus being a huckster showman about it. Plus, it really plays into the lone maverick genius myth that Americans love so much, but what could some guy do in his garage that dupont couldn't? It's not like there aren't lots of people trying to make heat shielding.

Plus, why wouldn't his family use the stuff to make money now that he's dead? Or sell what's left of his notes?

Yeah my instinct upon reading that is that it's more showmanship than science. Who knows though, some people are crazy.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Kenning posted:

We are definitely not running out of aluminum.

Aluminum is one of the top 5 most abundant elements in the earth's crust, but we mostly get it from bauxite which could conceivably become short. I don't know if that's the case though. If we're talking about apocalyptic wars over resources in the next few decades aluminum isn't one of the things that comes to my mind.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Eh the Soviets starved millions of people to death on purpose and killed millions more in gulags (not always on purpose) so I have a hard time getting unnerved about a couple of dogs.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Is it really civilian medical doctors' faults that government-sanctioned butchers brutalized blacks in the past? I mean, I doubt that Jews in Germany are wary of medical doctors because of Mengele's concentration camp horror show.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Serious Cephalopod posted:

The average medical doctor still believes that black people do not feel pain the same way whites do.

quote:

Also, the average medical model is a white dude, leaving all other people with inaccurate and dangerous health models.

I feel like there's two different and opposing messages there

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Steampunk iPhone posted:

This is horrifying. The pictures in the article are NSFW and may ruin your day.


[url=http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=dog+vision+http%3A%2F%2Fgoatse.info%2Fhello.jpg]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Springfield_Three[/url

literally 15 year old jokes

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Wasabi the J posted:

It was littorally disintegrating at the docks where it was built.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Stick Insect posted:

Links are potentially :nms:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viktor_Yushchenko#Dioxin_poisoning

Dude campaigned to be president of Ukraine, was poisoned. Unnerving part is that whoever poisoned him, knew he could survive it if they got to it on time. So they used dioxin, which, apart from being really bad for you, also makes you ugly. As a lasting reminder and maybe with the idea that people were less likely to vote for an ugly candidate.

His face now isn't as bad as it was, but still clearly scarred.

He still got to be president though :unsmith:

Similarly, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acid_throwing

If it doesn't kill you, you're still pretty hosed up for the rest of your life. Not just directly from the injuries, but sometimes also from the stigma that comes with it:

It also happens in countries where women are valued at less than the dollar value of the acid thrown at them which is bad enough to have to deal with.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

I think Everest works okay as flypaper for middle managers.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Bushmeister posted:

The article mentioned photos from 1904-1905 taken by French soldiers and turns out they are entirely GIS'able :stare: You are not too far off.

Mazzatello was a new one for me.

It's kind of weird to me that smacking someone in the head with a mallet is considered "one of the most brutal methods of execution ever devised" when it's contemporary to a large number of countries outside of Europe using impalement as an official execution method.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impalement

The wiki article used to be more detailed in how impalement worked a few years ago so you can dig back through the edit archives if you want. But for the squeamish, let's just say that an execution method where the victim has a spear driven through most of their body and yet still survives long enough for thirst to become more of a complaint than the pain is going to rank far higher than getting knocked out in one blow by a hammer :stare:

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Wild T posted:

Sort of like the mentality of Dr. Gatling, who hoped that inventing a mass-producable machine gun would paradoxically save lives since one man could provide the volume of fire of dozens. The Gatling gun worked. His plan didn't.

I guess the thought was that there would be fewer men on the battlefield rather than a larger number of men being killed more efficiently as they charge a single guy with a machine gun.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

8 Ball posted:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffin_birth

The article is pretty dry but basically 'coffin birth' is when

Yikes, spooky.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Nth Doctor posted:

Crosspost from the Everest Thread. Not Wikipedia, but unnerving as gently caress.

"This is my hole! It was made for me!"

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Remember that he locked the other pilot out of the cockpit before flying the plane into the ground, if it was an aneurysm or something the passengers would have survived. Someone killing themselves is terrible and sad, but I can't pity them when they take down others with them; that's where it becomes murder.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

The only reason Japan was still fighting is that they thought they could bring their forces on the mainland to bear if they held out long enough; their hopes of doing that were dashed by the Soviets entering against them. They were already having cities burned down so the nukes were just business as usual. To them it made no difference if it was thousands of incendiary bombs or one nuclear bomb doing the deed.

The idea of the US losing hundreds of thousands of soldiers in an invasion was predicated on the idea that Japanese civilians were going to arm themselves with makeshift spears and charge the beaches. If the Japanese were really that fanatical then no number of destroyed cities would have made them surrender.

I don't think that the nuclear bombs were necessary, but it was likely that without them another couple of cities would have been burned down by conventional bombs before their surrender anyway. What I don't know is if they were going to surrender without any amount of aerial bombardment.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Going back to the wikipedia article theme of the thread while not deviating very far from the current topic:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_nuclear_weapon_program

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_nuclear_weapon_project

The German nuke program was a complete non-starter that wouldn't have gone anywhere even if it wasn't starved for resources by politicians and didn't have prominent members drafted to die as infantry in Russia. And that's not to mention the other more serious problems like the bias against nuclear science as a "Jewish science" and the fact that the Jewish scientists working in the field were chased out or killed. On the other hand, something you never hear about is that the Japanese program was on the right track and only faltered because of the resource starvation that set in when the Siege of the Japan home islands started.

BattleMaster has a new favorite as of 17:31 on Apr 6, 2015

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

muscles like this? posted:

I think the creepiest thing about that were the religious figures who voluntarily did it, leaving just enough room to receive food and water.

Isn't that just a slightly more extreme version of what monks and nuns were doing anyway?

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

AnonSpore posted:

I like how the wiki page notes "The fruit is edible if the stinging hairs that cover it are removed." Some madman looked at this plant that drives animals to kill themselves and thought "Hmm, I wonder if I can eat this thing."

There's a lot of food out there that arose from some ancient person saying to another ancient person "dude I'll give you a nickel if you eat that"

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

KozmoNaut posted:

I just can't over how goddamn AMERICAN everything put out by Scientology is.

As a nation, you guys really do love your fancy graphics, dynamic go-getter type soundtracks and pumped up narrators.

Have you ever read anything by or seen any quotes from L. Ron Hubbard? He can't describe anything without directly comparing it to something from real life so it makes sense that his religion is super-derivative too.

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BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Lazlo Nibble posted:

The Yanango accident (:nms: for medical images later in the pdf) is the one that I've literally had nightmares about. So, you're welding pipe on a worksite and notice this bit of cable lying around:



Odd. Might be part of someone's equipment? Maybe you'll ask around later, but for now you shove it into your back pocket and get back to work. No big deal, right? Ha ha, wrong! You are now walking around with one buttcheek nestled cozily next to a naked 1.37 Terabecquerel industrial radiography source! A radiography source that's usually transported in a container that includes 35kg of depleted uranium shielding! Enjoy the remaining time you have with your blood lymphocytes...and your leg!

The SI unit for absorbed radiation dose is the Gray (Gy). Wikipedia lists the average dose from an abdominal x-ray as 0.7 mGy. Estimated dose to our unlucky welder by the time he took his jeans off that evening: ~10,000 Gy for the area of skin closest to the source, falling off rapidly to a "mere" 23 Gy in the gonads. From a random-looking length of cable you wouldn't give a second thought to if you found it in an old coffee can in your dad's garage.

I read that report and it looks like he tried to steal it. The source can only be removed from the camera with a key, or if you disassemble the lock with a screwdriver which is what seems to have happened (Not good design but not exactly likely for it to be laying around). Dude pocketed it, took it home, and when guys from work with radiation detectors showed up at his house he realized what they were there for and took it out to them.

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