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Who What Now posted:I hate to break it to you, but nothing good will come of it, and hoping that a pile of poo poo won't end up smelling like poo poo is way more unhealthy than acknowledging reality. I mean, if they could upset a couple of incumbents, i think that's a win in my book. If that tea party guy could upset Eric Cantor with almost no resources, i don't see why Lessig et al couldn't do something similar.
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Jul 7, 2014 19:33
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Mister Fister posted:I mean, if they could upset a couple of incumbents, i think that's a win in my book. If that tea party guy could upset Eric Cantor with almost no resources, i don't see why Lessig et al couldn't do something similar. They'll be electing people agreeable to Mark McKinnon.
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Jul 7, 2014 19:34
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Mister Fister posted:I mean, if they could upset a couple of incumbents, i think that's a win in my book. If that tea party guy could upset Eric Cantor with almost no resources, i don't see why Lessig et al couldn't do something similar. Upset them with who? You can't elect people who want money out of politics by pumping more money in politics. That's like trying to douse a fire with kerosene.
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Jul 7, 2014 19:34
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Who What Now posted:Upset them with who? You can't elect people who want money out of politics by pumping more money in politics. That's like trying to douse a fire with kerosene. Well i don't know the particulars of everyone who donated, but i was under the impression that the big donators were guys like Woz, and he seems like a pretty good guy, but in any case, is there any evidence that the SuperPac is going to pressure the candidates to do special favors for plutocrats?
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Jul 7, 2014 19:38
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I hope that Jack Abramoff has turned over a new leaf and will wisely spend 5 million dollars battling corruption in Washington.
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Jul 7, 2014 19:38
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Mister Fister posted:Well i don't know the particulars of everyone who donated, but i was under the impression that the big donators were guys like Woz, and he seems like a pretty good guy, but in any case, is there any evidence that the SuperPac is going to pressure the candidates to do special favors for plutocrats? The actual big money in this country can simply buy out any MayOne candidate with a trivial amount of money. Not that any will win, because five million dollars is absolutely nothing. It's a matchstick in forest fire.
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Jul 7, 2014 19:54
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Mister Fister posted:I mean, if they could upset a couple of incumbents, i think that's a win in my book. If that tea party guy could upset Eric Cantor with almost no resources, i don't see why Lessig et al couldn't do something similar. It's also not just about the process of getting them into office, it's all the things that go on once they're in. The "money in politics" isn't just in electoral campaign finance, but in lobbying as well. 20% of Americans own more than 50% of the wealth. The top 1% own over 37%; more than a third of the wealth of the country is held in the hands of 1% of its citizens. Five million dollars is coffee money to those guys. The Koch brothers as an example, two guys, are worth a collective $100 billion. The median family net worth, if I'm reading Wikipedia right, is around $109,000. You'd need the total net wealth of 917,431 families at the median, to match the net wealth of Charles and David Koch, which, I remind you again, are two individuals.
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Jul 7, 2014 19:56
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Any organization that put someone with an Internet history like Boyko's into an important position is hopeless.
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Jul 7, 2014 19:59
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Mister Fister posted:I don't know who's more cynical, the people who post in this thread or the overwhelming majority of goons in the Community thread who bet their lives that a meteor was more likely to hit the earth in the next hour than the show coming back (it came back It's not "negative" to use similar events from the past to predict future results: http://www.cjr.org/united_states_project/americans_elect_predictable_failure.php http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/07/03/1311427/-Lawrence-Lessig-s-Trust-Me-I-Know-What-I-m-Doing-SuperPAC
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Jul 7, 2014 20:00
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), but in any case, i hope SOMETHING positive comes out of this superpac. What that something is, I dunno, but I don't think it's healthy to be so negative.
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Also, someone already mentioned him, but Jack loving Abramoff bears repeating. Dude is scummy as hell even by politician standards.
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Jul 7, 2014 20:04
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And you've already got Congresspeople who want reform. Lots of them. Just look at the co-sponsors for the pending amendments. Trying to win a few districts won't change much of anything.
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Jul 7, 2014 20:06
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Jul 7, 2014 20:11
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A Fancy 400 lbs posted:Also, someone already mentioned him, but Jack loving Abramoff bears repeating. Dude is scummy as hell even by politician standards. Any hope that this wasn't a complete loving scam evaporated when his name showed up. Jack Abramoff would steal the dollars off a corpse's eyes.
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Jul 7, 2014 20:12
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OMGVBFLOL posted:Any hope that this wasn't a complete loving scam evaporated when his name showed up. Jack Abramoff would steal the dollars off a corpse's eyes. The ferryman thinks he's such a hotshot with his monopoly on plying the Styx. WELL WE'LL SEE ABOUT THAT!
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Jul 7, 2014 20:15
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Mister Fister posted:I don't know who's more cynical, the people who post in this thread or the overwhelming majority of goons in the Community thread who bet their lives that a meteor was more likely to hit the earth in the next hour than the show coming back (it came back Is it healthy to desire things that aren't going to happen, particularly when you know they won't? Also, mayone.us led to the creation of some amazing .gifs, so that's definitely something positive
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Jul 7, 2014 21:37
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Who What Now posted:The actual big money in this country can simply buy out any MayOne candidate with a trivial amount of money. Not that any will win, because five million dollars is absolutely nothing. It's a matchstick in forest fire. I don't know, the average House of Representatives race is about 1.5 million spent by the winning side. With severe targeting, you could totally fund candidates in three districts. Your point is well taken, mind, because Lessig et al. are just going to embezzle most of the cash, in all likelihood, but saying that it couldn't swing any races is an exaggeration.
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Jul 7, 2014 21:48
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SedanChair posted:They'll be electing people agreeable to Mark McKinnon. So whats up with Mark McKinnon, I haven't heard of him?
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Jul 7, 2014 22:17
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KomradeX posted:So whats up with Mark McKinnon, I haven't heard of him? Campaign advisor for Bush 2 and McCain, has since run or founded mega-centrist and scammy organizations like No Labels and Americans Elect, and voted Libertarian in 2012.
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Jul 7, 2014 22:45
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Interview with this poo poo right now on NPR marketplace with kai rysdall
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Jul 7, 2014 23:07
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Leroy Diplowski posted:Interview with this poo poo right now on NPR marketplace with kai rysdall This Mayday stuff is perfect for NPR liberals who desperately want to feel like they're helping by buying a $15 dollar totebag.
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Jul 7, 2014 23:30
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Mister Fister posted:I don't know who's more cynical, the people who post in this thread or the overwhelming majority of goons in the Community thread who bet their lives that a meteor was more likely to hit the earth in the next hour than the show coming back (it came back
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Jul 8, 2014 00:22
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You know, reading this depressing thread, i think i understand why conservatives are able to elect tea partiers (sometimes against all odds) and liberals can't do poo poo.
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Jul 8, 2014 01:27
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Mister Fister posted:You know, reading this depressing thread, i think i understand why conservatives are able to elect tea partiers (sometimes against all odds) and liberals can't do poo poo. You've got a ways to go before you can make a convincing troll. Tone it down to 65% and you might be believable, and spread it out over several pages.
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Jul 8, 2014 01:38
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Little Blackfly posted:Tell us more about the century of the self and the NWO. Century of the Self is a great documentary that everyone should check out. I wonder if Brian Boyko has seen it? Or would he immediately be turned off because it doesn't worship the free market? The only times I've discussed the 'New World Order' has been in reference to President Bush's 1991 speech, which isn't really relevant to this thread. Mister Fister posted:You know, reading this depressing thread, i think i understand why conservatives are able to elect tea partiers (sometimes against all odds) and liberals can't do poo poo. We just need to buy everyone a copy of 'The Secret' , that's the ticket. Also what 'against all odds' tea party victories are you talking about?
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Jul 8, 2014 01:43
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McDowell posted:We just need to buy everyone a copy of 'The Secret' , that's the ticket. Eric Cantor's loss for one. Notice OWS is such a disorganized mess while the Tea Party actually gets elected and makes the GOP piss their pants? Liberals harp on how disgusted they are that plutocrats secure elections in their favor with their giant war chests but when the chips come down, we keep electing the same idiots over and over again and never follow through with threats. I actually have more respect for conservatives in that regard. OwlBot 2000 posted:You've got a ways to go before you can make a convincing troll. Tone it down to 65% and you might be believable, and spread it out over several pages. So in other words, you want an echo chamber here.
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Jul 8, 2014 01:49
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Mister Fister posted:Eric Cantor's loss for one. You know it was a primary, right? 65,017 people voted in that race in a state with a little more than 5 million registered voters. David Brat still has to actually get elected. You definitely earned that title.
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Jul 8, 2014 01:59
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Mister Fister posted:You know, reading this depressing thread, i think i understand why conservatives are able to elect tea partiers (sometimes against all odds) and liberals can't do poo poo. Um, because the tea party is being astroturfed by billionaires?
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Jul 8, 2014 02:00
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McDowell posted:You know it was a primary, right? 65,017 people voted in that race in a state with a little more than 5 million registered voters. David Brat still has to actually get elected. You definitely earned that title. Are you seriously saying that incumbents getting primaried by extremists don't matter? Chomskyan posted:Um, because the tea party is being astroturfed by billionaires? Too some extent, yes, but the overwhelming majority of millionaires and billionaires aren't happy that the tea party got elected. "Chamber of Commerce" CEO's want mainstream Republicans to win, not a bunch of rag tag extremists who shut down government or threaten to end handouts, it's not good for business.
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Jul 8, 2014 02:07
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Mister Fister posted:Too some extent, yes, but the overwhelming majority of millionaires and billionaires aren't happy that the tea party got elected. "Chamber of Commerce" CEO's want mainstream Republicans to win, not a bunch of rag tag extremists who shut down government or threaten to end handouts, it's not good for business. The rich aren't homogeneous. Locally powerful millionaires in southern states often support the Tea Party (along with the Kochs), and multinational corporations and billionaires usually support more mainstream republicans. http://www.salon.com/2013/10/06/tea_party_radicalism_is_misunderstood_meet_the_newest_right/ quote:The Tea Party right is not only disproportionately Southern but also disproportionately upscale. Its social base consists of what, in other countries, are called the “local notables”—provincial elites whose power and privileges are threatened from above by a stronger central government they do not control and from below by the local poor and the local working class. OwlBot 2000 fucked around with this message at 02:13 on Jul 8, 2014 |
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Jul 8, 2014 02:09
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Mister Fister posted:Are you seriously saying that incumbents getting primaried by extremists don't matter? When the incumbent is complacent and puts zero effort into the primary campaign it isn't that surprising. And even then Cantor only lost by 7000 votes.
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Jul 8, 2014 02:10
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Mister Fister posted:So in other words, you want an echo chamber here. No, he's saying you making a post bemoaning tone in this thread as the reason for left-wing loses is a lovely troll by being too up-front. He's giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you are a troll instead of someone who actually believes that somehow this thread is indicative of our political system. Because the latter is a naive, idiotic horseshit excuse which reflects poorly on people who suggest it seriously. Mo_Steel fucked around with this message at 02:16 on Jul 8, 2014 |
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Jul 8, 2014 02:12
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OwlBot 2000 posted:The rich aren't homogeneous. Locally powerful millionaires in southern states often support the Tea Party (along with the Kochs), and multinational corporations and billionaires usually support more mainstream republicans. And that agrees with my point, but as you can see in the Brat vs. Cantor fight, the rich backed the mainstream republican by an overwhelming margin. Cantor had a 26 to 1 advantage in the amount of money he had and lost in what most people called a shocker: http://www.politico.com/story/2014/06/2014-virginia-primary-big-money-eric-cantor-107699.html Nobody's saying that there isn't money thrown at the tea party from the rich, but the entrenched institutional power that's sucking the majority of money out of the government, pushing for more tax loopholes, causing the most pollution, edit: not to mention the military industrial complex/wars etc. is sweating buckets because they're losing influence. Mister Fister fucked around with this message at 02:22 on Jul 8, 2014 |
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Jul 8, 2014 02:15
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Mo_Steel posted:No, he's saying you making a post bemoaning tone in this thread as the reason for left-wing loses is a lovely troll by being too up-front. He's giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you are a troll instead of someone who actually believes that somehow this thread is indicative of our political system. Because the latter is a naive, idiotic horseshit excuse which reflects poorly on people who suggest it seriously. I didn't say this thread solely was what made me depressed, it's just a general observation about liberals and it's yet another example.
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Jul 8, 2014 02:18
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OwlBot 2000 posted:http://www.salon.com/2013/10/06/tea_party_radicalism_is_misunderstood_meet_the_newest_right/ You know what, if i had the choice between 'local' millionaires controlling the GOP vs. millionaires/billionaires who control multinational corporations that gently caress up the entire world, i'd actually rather have the tea party in charge vs. mainstream Republicans.
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Jul 8, 2014 02:21
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Yeah, a lot of liberals are easily duped and will gladly pony up cash to an obvious scam like Lessig and McKinnon and Abramoff's PAC, in spite of their involvement in previous such scams like Americans Elect. ...well, I hope that's what you're implying!
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Jul 8, 2014 02:22
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Mister Fister posted:I didn't say this thread solely was what made me depressed, it's just a general observation about liberals and it's yet another example. By all means, elaborate on your insights. I'll even assume your premise for the sake of argument, so give us some conditions. Liberals can't do poo poo and Tea Partiers can because...
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Jul 8, 2014 02:24
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Mo_Steel posted:By all means, elaborate on your insights. I'll even assume your premise for the sake of argument, so give us some conditions. Liberals can't do poo poo and Tea Partiers can because... Crippling cynicism, lack of focus (yes, i get it's hilarious that guy is a brony, but i think 10 pages of making fun of him is enough), disorganization, fear of taking chances, blaming money all the time but not doing anything about it, the fact that everyone thought Obama's presidency was going to change things but his disappointment made us lose all hope, etc. etc.
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Jul 8, 2014 02:38
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Y'all know it's a troll yet you keep engaging him. There is no Tea Party.
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Jul 8, 2014 02:42
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Mo_Steel posted:By all means, elaborate on your insights. I'll even assume your premise for the sake of argument, so give us some conditions. Liberals can't do poo poo and Tea Partiers can because... Because liberals will wander aimlessly (possibly with lanterns) looking for a honest man to make their leader.
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Jul 8, 2014 02:42
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Wait, if Liberals are so ineffective, how is it they control the media and the school system up to and including university?
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Jul 8, 2014 02:46
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