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BrandorKP posted:Ah kingship, I wonder how they feel about the implied divinity of kings. I'd imagine it never occurs to them. While I don't think she identifies as libertarian per se, "dark enlightenment" lunatic (redundant, I know) Justine Tunney has, among other things, praised the aristocracies of the past as being naturally superior ("having better code" to use her specific form of wank) and therefore naturally the US should be run by Silicon Valley autocrats generally and her boss Google CEO Eric Schmidt in particular. DeusExMachinima posted:what's praxelogy Short answer: It's bullshit, that's what it is. Longer answer: It's methodolody libertarians made up to get around the problem that their theories lead to poo poo whenever applied in the real world. Among other things, as Who What Now notes, it claims that drawing logical conclusions from a priori assumptions is the best way to model human behavior, and that when empirical evidence contradicts theory, that evidence should be ignored. Draw as many conclusions are you wish from how Jrod constantly has asserted he's only concerned with internally-consistent logical arguments, and dismisses historical analysis as a waste of time.
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Oct 6, 2014 17:36
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Who What Now posted:Oh, I don't think it should be illegal, I just saying that it's so monumentally stupid that I don't understand why anyone would do it. Something being monumentally and transparently stupid has rarely, if ever, impeded greedy idiots from trying to get rich quick. See also, any/all threads about bitcoins and other crypto-"currencies."
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Oct 6, 2014 18:56
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Sephyr posted:I think China Mieville wrote an article some years ago (on floating libertarian cities?) that described libertarians as the losers of capitalism. Big-time industrialists and entrepreneurs are quite comfortable with having a government to influence that can open markets for them, make sea lanes safe, regulate demand and infrastructure...not to mention that when push comes to shove, it's a lot easier to bribe a single authority than a bunch of smaller warlords/kings/militias/microstates. They'll piss and moan about how much they have to pay to get their benefits, but the Waltons would likely poo poo their pants collectively if the Interstate highway system that makes their whole chain of supply possible was discontinued...or owned by a private rival. You remember correctly. Among other damning and memorable passages, he describes the libertarian utopia as "an Orange County of the soul." quote:None of this is surprising. Libertarianism is not a ruling-class theory. It may be indulged, certainly, for the useful ideas it can throw up, and its prophets have at times influenced dominant ideologies–witness the cack-handed depredations of the “Chicago Boys” in Chile after Allende’s bloody overthrow. But untempered by the realpolitik of Reaganism and Thatcherism, the anti-statism of “pure” libertarianism is worse than useless to the ruling class.
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Oct 7, 2014 03:28
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Who What Now posted:So in this metaphor if I'm America and Brandor is Iran, who represents the Kurds and ISIS? I'm the EU, in that I too find common cause with Brandon uncomfortable and limit my involvement in the larger matter to occasional, feckless sniping.
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Oct 9, 2014 03:19
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archangelwar posted:How exactly does one have a productive debate against praxeology? Demonstrating logical inconsistencies and contradictions, I'd suspect. Or, if you'd rather get to the crux of things quicker, just punching them.
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Oct 22, 2014 20:25
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SedanChair posted:Whatever it is that Ted Cruz jerks off to in private, I doubt it is something that the average human being could learn of and remain sane. It's got to be a photo of himself, let's be serious here.
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Oct 23, 2014 21:58
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CharlestheHammer posted:Stop posting articles at us and argues something. I assume you already know this but just in case: Jrod isn't here to argue; he's here to proselytize.
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Oct 28, 2014 01:33
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Babylon Astronaut posted:Jrod, what beer should I drink this weekend? I like lagers and ales with lots of hoppes. I think HHH would approve of IPA, both due to the name connection and also for what the P stands for.
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Oct 28, 2014 01:41
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Perfidia posted:This "mix my labour with [thing]" phrase is so goddamn weird it creeps me out every single time. Where does it come from and what cult invented it? They have broken the NAP inscribed on my heart and must pay. I doubt she invented it, but it was a large part of Ayn Rand's justification for why brutally stealing land from the Native Americans was not only necessary, but also moral and correct.
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Nov 3, 2014 21:31
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Mr Interweb posted:Is Jrode one of those people who doesn't think that the New Deal got us out of the Depression, but WWII did? Or does he not even go that far? He posts such staggeringly dull walls of text I don't blame you for missing it, but he did claim last page (I think) that it's a given that economic interventions in the 30s failed at best and made things worse at worst, and that conventional history agrees with him on that. It was only one, out of many, things he is entirely wrong about.
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Nov 3, 2014 21:53
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paragon1 posted:So let's say I have undeniable, indisputable proof that AgriChemicals LLC factory waste has killed all of my immediate family, my livestock, sterilized my land, and rendered all water in my land undrinkable. Who is going to hear my lawsuit against AgriChemicals LLC in Libertopia? And how will they compel AgriChemicals LLC (who may be chartered in another country entirely) to pay without violating the NAP? I think you already know the answer. 
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Nov 4, 2014 02:07
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jrodefeld posted:This is another reason why that study is so bogus. I don't know a single libertarian who voted for Romney. Not a single one. In the circles I travel in, the very concept of voting for Romney was so repugnant that it was never even seriously considered. Oh, well if you don't know of a single libertarian who voted for Romney then that changes everything now doesn't it, what with you being king poo poo of Libertarian mountain, right?
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Nov 4, 2014 02:43
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DrProsek posted:Um, did you ever consider that without regulation, healthcare would get so cheap grannie could have afforded it? For the purpose of my question, please ignore all evidence of universal healthcare providing healthcare for all in almost every other nation on Earth, but do pay attention to the 1960s in the USA where healthcare was really cheap (assuming you only need treatment that was available in 1960)! Heh, look at you, empirically deriving useful data from past experiences and applying it to future events. Don't you know we don't need that bothersome drivel so long as we can logically conclude certain irrefutable things from first points such as *prolonged, squeaky faaaaaart*.
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Nov 6, 2014 20:03
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SedanChair posted:Let's continue to buy accounts for increasingly high-profile ancaps and humiliate them. While I concur that we should continue to humiliate AnCaps and other strains of libertarians, the market should decide whether or not they have accounts.
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Nov 7, 2014 20:12
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SedanChair posted:B-but the most doctrinaire ancaps tend to be the poorest ones. Korner Kelly: "Priced Out."
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Nov 7, 2014 20:15
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Mr Interweb posted:How would universal healthcare work in libertopia? Clearly there would be no government run programs like medicare and medicaid, and there would be no regulation, and thus nothing to artificially alter prices on the private market. Because the health insurance market is now unfettered, prices for insurance plummet so that even though there's nothing like a mandate to buy health insurance, presumably everyone will buy health insurance because it's so cheap. Often they also include something about medicines being much less expensive and/or obtainable without having to get a prescription as forced by evil Statist drug regulations/medical licensing requirements. As to why this didn't happen pre-LBJ, I think you know the answer: The State. It's always the State that made the bad things happen. It's only the State that makes bad things happen.
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Nov 7, 2014 22:06
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jrodefeld posted:The Soviet System produced bread lines due to a lack of market delivery of food, while the market permits grocery stores full of food. There are still some hungry people, but far fewer due to the market. This is the opposite of reality, you doofus. Russian food intake dropped dramatically following the Big Splat and introduction of a market economy, and even by the turn of the millennium they still lagged behind what they'd been at the formal disillusion of the USSR in 1992. Part of why things were even starting to get back to the baseline they'd been at was, in addition, because of several substantial foreign aid packages from Western governments, not natural market improvements. Shocking, I know, to hear Jrod has once again shot his mouth off about things he doesn't understand. Captain_Maclaine fucked around with this message at 01:39 on Nov 9, 2014 |
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Nov 9, 2014 01:37
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Caros posted:[Citation loving Needed]. I'm going to go into why DiLorenzo was an idiot, but to suggest that Lincoln was this huge racist who was going to support deporting africans etc etc is absurd. The irony of you playing the race card while supporting people like HHH, Murray Rothbard and even DiLorenzo is insane to me. He's probably going to bring up Lincoln's earlier flirtation with the American Colonization Society, which almost everyone with any abolitionist sentiment did prior to the war to one degree or another, as rock-solid proof that Lincoln was really a white nationalist who wanted them all gone. You know, among the other oceans of poo poo Jrod has gotten and, I predict, will get wrong about the War of the Rebellion. 
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Nov 10, 2014 20:42
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Mr Interweb posted:This confederate apologism is fun and all, but to go off topic real quick, a couple of pages ago we were talking about how Keynesianism failed in the 70s. Can someone elaborate on this? The problems that happened in the 70s I thought was mainly due to the oil embargo by OPEC and the fed jacking up interest rates by the end of the decade. Via the Austrian perspective, Keynsian economics cannot succeed, therefore it didn't.
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Nov 11, 2014 01:32
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Perfidia posted:Ever wonder why you never see Eripsa and jrodefeld posting at the same time? In the last iteration of this thread, they actually both did start to get into things and oh, how the word salad started to fly. It could have been glorious, but Jrod ducked out after only a brief exchange as I remember it. A pity, I had such high hopes.
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Nov 11, 2014 03:50
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19th Century benevolent societies: a cutting-edge idea who's time has come! No seriously, he's previously suggested mutual-aid societies like impoverished urban minorities used to create to keep from starving all the way to death are capable of entirely filling the gap that would be left by restraining the violent hand of State social programs. It's almost as if he doesn't understand history at all! EDIT: Someone post that Chuck Asay cartoon about feeding bears/the poor.
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Nov 11, 2014 20:08
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jrodefeld posted:No we ARE talking about the legal right. If I say that the Boy Scouts have the right to not hire a gay scoutmaster, what I am saying is that it is not morally defensible to use force against them to deny their right to freedom of association. Ah yes, the time-honored practice of the marketplace solving racist issues which totally is a thing that has ever worked, examples of which I will now list in alphabetical order: quote:By the same argument that you are using against Hoppe, I could claim that YOU are a racist because you presumably endorse the right of individuals to discriminate on who can enter their home based on race. Why don't we pass a law instituting a racial quota for my private dinner party I am having at my home? Because, compassionate individuals that we are, we'd rather not inflict you upon racial minorities. They have it hard enough in this country as it is.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:58
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Caros posted:The thing is, he has an incredibly simplistic worldview. Thats why he can make claims like "If you subsudize something you get more of it" without batting an eyelash, even though there are thousands and thousands of examples where that is not the case. Hell, I'll take a crack at how he'd square that circle: "While superficially providing subsidizes medical care for the elderly appears to be a human and benevolent State-solution, all it's doing is disincentivizing proper planning for the future when people are younger. Since they know the nanny state will take care of them, more people will fail to properly prepare for their own long-term care, which everyone knows there's a good chance they'll need some day. If they knew, earlier in life, that the State wouldn't be there, they'd wisely set aside funds and buy insurance when they were young and healthy from all that choosing-to-not-get-influenza they did during their productive years. All the while, the State is funding this via violent confiscation of earned wealth, which I've
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Nov 12, 2014 02:43
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Caros posted:And then I'd point to the fact that before the advent of Medicare less than 50% of our elderly had healthcare, and that without programs like social security 2/3rds of our elderly lived below the poverty line. Then you'd probably ignore it or repeat it back snarkily and talk about something else. I...I really don't want to be the Jrod proxy as a thing. I read the Freep thread, I've got enough mind-wrenching awfulness in my life as it is.
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Nov 12, 2014 04:46
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SedanChair posted:You've learned many forms, and sacrificed your humanity to gain them. Now look upon my final form. *becomes Peter Schiff* We have stared too long into the abyss.
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Nov 12, 2014 06:03
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TLM3101 posted:Also, it's an excellent setting and quite fun to play. Agreed, chummer.
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Nov 12, 2014 18:46
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Baronjutter posted:That would be ok because we're all private citizens, not a "government" ? Even after we buy up an entire continent? Still not a state, just a huge private property? It would cease to be ok the minute it impacted Jrod's walle-err, freedom. I meant to say freedom. Honest.
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Nov 13, 2014 20:02
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Fans posted:Last one I promise. George Reisman solves the nature of the universe in eight tweets. Libertarian genius and, to quote Jrod, "one of the most brilliant living economists and historians": functionally indistinguishable from a burnout's  revelation.
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Nov 14, 2014 23:25
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Fans posted:It's weird how Liberarians claim to be Rational but also reject overwhelming Scientific Consensus on things like Climate Change, how do they square that away exactly? They do know what Rational means right? Option 1: "Those things don't count because The State somehow made them happen." Option 2: "While those things look bad, they're actually good!"
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Nov 14, 2014 23:43
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Rockopolis posted:I think we may appreciate you all the more, by contrast. Pretty sure it's an assumed name.
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Nov 15, 2014 01:30
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Jack of Hearts posted:Does he actually admire Hayek or Smith? I've seen him write dismissively about Hayek before as just piggybacking on von Mises. Smith I really doubt. He admires whomever is most convenient to admire for the duration of whatever point he thinks he's making, after which they cease to matter at all and it's really intellectually dishonest for the rest of us to constantly bring up the crippling character flaws of those individuals you guys.
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Nov 15, 2014 20:16
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StandardVC10 posted:Wait, Hans Hermann Hoppe is alive and writing today? His writing makes it hard to remember that no, he's not a 50's klansman reacting to the civil rights movement, but rather a modern person who just so happens to be awful.
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Nov 17, 2014 05:29
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Heavy neutrino posted:In what universe is left-libertarianism about strong individual property rights? We literally explicitly argue for collective ownership of land and other means of production. The same universe where any of Jrod's feverish delusions about history, economics, human rationality, race relations, and pretty much everything else hold even a drop of water.
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Nov 17, 2014 23:15
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SedanChair posted:I am a homesteader with a yurt. But I need a new head for my rake! Ah! I didn't realize Valhalla DRO had added an airborne detachment!
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Nov 19, 2014 02:51
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Raskolnikov38 posted:Aren't they a monarchy now But are they a ~*benevolent monarchy*~? If not, Jrod won't want anything to do with them.
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Nov 19, 2014 05:37
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Pope Guilty posted:I'm feeling nostalgic for undergrad ethics, so jrod: since you're hung up on deontic ethics, how are you determining which rules are the right rules? Well the right rules are the ones that are right, because if they weren't right, then they wouldn't be the right rules now would they? 
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Nov 19, 2014 05:48
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SedanChair posted:Can relationships be free of coercion. My mother gave birth to me, CHOOSING FOR ME the date of my existence. I stand against such aggression. Fortunately, there's at least one politician out there who's sympathetic to such libertarian sympathies generally, and that issue in particular. 
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Nov 19, 2014 19:16
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RocketLunatic posted:Curious how a libertarian society would handle immigration, refugees, and so on. Mile-wide tire fires, automated turrets, self-healing mine fields. You know, all the reasonable stuff we've come to know and love from libertarianism.
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Nov 21, 2014 05:22
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I have a couple of friends who used to be minarchists of one flavor or another, but the events of 2008 and since have thoroughly disabused them of such madness. In particular, they tended to be the sort who were initially enamored of Ron Paul before they knew anything about him beyond the superficial, and once the discovered he was only one or two costume changes removed from a klansman that ended pretty quickly.
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Nov 23, 2014 19:24
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LuftWaffle posted:You guys are such assholes on this board that most libertarians found that it was not worth posting here, so now you just make threads where you discuss ideas that none of you actually hold, which really just amounts to a really dumb strawman circlejerk. Ahhhh, the out-of-nowhere surprise meltdown. Been quite a while since we've had one of those. 
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Nov 24, 2014 18:20
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