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Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





If you're going to mess with multiple detachments and min-maxing troop choices, why aren't you just going Unbound? The Objective Secured benefit (and it's not much benefit if you aren't making those Troops central to your army) is really all you get for juggling the FOC requirements. People are still going to bitch that you're cherry picking the best stuff from multiple codexes. People bitched that 2000 point lists were allowed to double the FOC, you think they aren't going to bitch if you use three FOCs at 1500 points?

Feel the freedom, fight the power!

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Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





Slimnoid posted:

As many detachments as you want, eh?

Librarian (ML2) - 90
2x Scouts - 110
3x Thunderfire Cannon - 300

Librarian (ML2) - 90
2x Scouts - 110
3x Thunderfire Cannon - 300

Librarian (ML2) - 90
2x Scouts - 110
3x Thunderfire Cannon - 300

Librarian (ML2) - 90
2x Scouts - 110
3x Thunderfire Cannon - 300

500pts per, 2k on the nose.

gently caress everything.
If someone actually builds 12 Thunderfire Cannons, they deserve a win (not that this list would win).

Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





ThNextGreenLantern posted:

Please help, I have no idea what I'm doing. Trying to put together a 1000 point list of Blood Angels, here is what I have so far:

Troops
10 Death Company w/Rhino (250 pts)
2 Death Company Dreadnoughts (250 pts)

Heavy Support
5 Devastators w/4 Missile Launchers in Razorback w/Twin-Linked Lascannon (220 pts)

I almost threw Mephiston in there, but then I realized I'd be spending nearly 1000 points for 20 models. My buddy and I have been playing Purge the Alien, so I'm not too concerned about Death Company not scoring right now.

I mean, this is for a casual game, so maybe I should JUST PLAY?

Are you proxying models, or limited by what you own? Drop pods are the way to go for Dreads. 2 regular librarians would probably serve you better than Mephiston.

Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





Space Wolves and Blood Angels can't use their unique psychic powers anymore. Say goodbye to Mephiston flying or hitting at S10.

I'm kind of shocked that Shadow in the Warp and Tzeentch Daemons not getting any update on how they affect psykers.

Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





JerryLee posted:

I think that the objective cards are a great idea in principle but I have zero problem believing that this is the sort of outcome that can result because, y'know, GW. I would love to have some better (amateur) game designers take a stab at making some homebrew cards and/or modifications to the card usage rules.

e: maybe while they're at it they can come up with some objective categories that aren't a hair away from being perfect synonyms for each other

It might be a cool variant to pick 10 (or so) cards along with your army, and those become your tactical objective deck. You don't always have the same objectives in your hand, but you can weigh them towards to good ones, and the ones your army is good at nailing.

Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





Combat Doctrines
Through discipline and training, your army's leaders have tamed the chaos of battle.

Steady Leadership - 25 pts: Instead of rolling, your Warlord can choose which Warlord Trait he wants from any table he could ordinarily roll on. If your Warlord has a pre-determined Warlord Trait, he can pick a new one instead.

Psychic Mastery - 25/50 pts: One Psyker in your army can become your Master Psyker. Instead of rolling, your Master Psyker can choose his powers from the Psychic Discplines available to him. For 25 points, he can choose his first power instead of rolling randomly (the remainder of his powers are randomly generated as normal). For 50 points, he can choose all of his powers instead of rolling. If your Master Psyker generates powers during play, or with nonstandard rules, this ability allows him to choose which powers he knows within a Discipline, but not which Disciplines he can access at any particular time.

Counter-Intelligence - 25 pts: After armies are deployed and objectives are determined (including starting tactical objectives), and before the first game turn, your Warlord can choose to swap the locations of two numbered Objective Markers. If multiple Warlords have this ability, resolve them in the same order as player turns (i.e. the player going first swaps objectives, then the player going second swaps them). A pair of objectives that were swapped can't be swapped back, but one of the pair can be exchanged for another unaltered objective.

Coordinated Assault - 25/50 pts: One of your units (or formations that deploy together) in Reserves can Coordinate their deployment. For 25 points, you can choose which turn they arrive on (including turn 1), without the need for a Reserve roll. For 50 points, you they can also arrive in the location you choose - if they Outflank, they do so from the table edge of your choice (even the opponent's own table edge); if they Deep Strike, they do so without scattering.

Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





If you make assault easier to get into, you need to make it less deadly/one-sided. For all everyone's bitching, they don't seem to mind when their 200 point lovely assault unit wipes out a 250 point shooting unit in one turn with no casualties.

Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





Von Humboldt posted:

The big problem is that Overwatch is not what is prevent units from hitting CC. It can make it more difficult, sure, but Overwatch is not what is keeping Orks/Genestealers/Berserkers from getting into CC. Rather, the problem is that many armies can just sit there and obliterate them before they even reach their positions, and the methods most armies use to compensate suffer mechanically. Cover can be ignored and slows down units heading into assault doubly - both on the move and on the charge. Vehicles need to be assault transports, or else you aren't seeing CC before turn 3 at the very best, and many assault transports are either fragile or expensive. Outflanking and Deep Strike both net you a full turn of standing around with your dick in your hand as every Lasgun in a 24" radius zeroes in on you. Even mobbing up and walking up, saying hell to all that bunk about transports or cover, this is Warboss Pickett's WAAAAAGH across an open field, has models experience a conveyer belt effect where the first rank is cut down and the unit ends up with less movement overall.

Overwatch from a block of Necrons does not stop me from murdering them in CC - it's being shot to death by Annihilation Barges.

Fixing assault (so that all reasonably effective forms of assault are functional) would require overhauling a lot of the mechanics doing with movement and shooting.
When I say "lovely assault units," I mean stuff like Berserkers and Genestealers. They can't get into assault reliably because they are slow, they are overkill against the pansies you want to assault (like AM Command Squads), and aren't good enough to beat actual good assault units head-to-head. It sucks that there are a bunch of "trap" choices in a lot of codexes, but the solution isn't to make assault better as a whole, it's to make the lovely units better, possibly by reducing their points costs, or by bringing in more effective delivery methods.

Nobody's complaining that their Assault Terminators or Canoptek Wraiths or Khorne Hounds or Nurgle Biker Lords are being shot off the board too easily. If you want to assault, you need a fast unit, and/or an assault transport. Or else, use a more versatile unit that can shoot on turns 1-3 and consider getting into assault on turn 3-4 as a bonus.

Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





Post 9-11 User posted:

You've been able to keep the squad inside the transport since, if I recall correctly, FAQ's beginning in 5th Edition. Before then, especially in 3rd Edition, units inside transports were in a pocket dimension of retardation, GW has slowly crept the unit into the same dimension as any other models even when they're not physically on the table. It began with measuring just about everything from the edge of the hull- leadership bubbles, psychic tests, throwing blood packs out the hatch, et cetera. That open topped transports take hits is the latest step of the trend.

It's still a boost due to Objective Secured, but the pulpy insides could remain in their tin can.

In 7th, you don't even need the squad inside. Dedicated transports have the same FOC as the unit that purchased them. So the empty Wave Serpent has objective secured, and the squad can hide in ruins back home.

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Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead





It would be better if it had 5-8 boobs. 2 just isn't natural.

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