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The queen killing Bishop because she's more intelligent than a drone isn't so crazy. I could see drones like what's in Alien being stupid enough that they know an android is just a machine and to ignore them unless they become a threat or whatever. The whole "how do aliens recognize other beings" thing is pretty sketchy so how they even tell a human from an android I don't really get, but aliens being dumb and needing a queen to make them smart enough to kill the power like in Aliens isn't so weird.
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Jun 14, 2014 23:21
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It'd be cool if everything shown so far is from like the first hour of the game and you play as the alien for the rest of it.
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Jun 14, 2014 23:38
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Lassitude posted:The queen killing Bishop because she's more intelligent than a drone isn't so crazy. I could see drones like what's in Alien being stupid enough that they know an android is just a machine and to ignore them unless they become a threat or whatever. The whole "how do aliens recognize other beings" thing is pretty sketchy so how they even tell a human from an android I don't really get, but aliens being dumb and needing a queen to make them smart enough to kill the power like in Aliens isn't so weird. In the comics they key off of a kind of fear-sense that augments their ability to feel vibrations and heat. Most of the head is a sense organ. Less human androids wouldn't bother simulating emotions with a synthetic endocrine system like the W-Y models, they'd just fake it in software. lovely androids would be scentless to the alien.
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Jun 14, 2014 23:47
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Rookersh posted:Uh, but that stuff can be done well? Make it so taking out a single android is super tough, and fighting draws the Alien to the location. Bam, suddenly it's a stealth puzzle with multiple solutions, the hardest of which is combat. Since the Alien doesn't care about the androids, all you do is screw yourself over by attempting to fight them. The problem is that once you become the puppet master and use the Alien to your advantage to kill the human dudes you break the tension, at that point you're manipulating the game and the Alien just becomes a piece of a puzzle for that room and how to go about solving it. It's really really stupid if you want to keep the game scary in anyway. I mean, hell, the film the game is trying to emulate you'll notice no one has any control over anything: all plans to kill the Alien fail, attempts to flee fail, Ripley fails in stopping the self destruct sequence and they barely keep their turd of a ship functional. Everything about the film and what makes it work so well is that no one has control over poo poo the entire time and they're just trying to survive. That's how the game should play out, you're only really in control of the player character and not luring the Alien around to deal with encounters for you. Now if that happened once or twice in the game it'd be fine, just to break things up a little bit and give you a false sense of control, but so far it seems like the humans and androids are going to be somewhat frequent.
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Jun 15, 2014 13:07
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This game can't hope to match the majesty of Capcom's Alien vs Predator brawler, even taking into account genre differences
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Jun 15, 2014 13:14
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That game was incredible.
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Jun 15, 2014 13:29
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Sire Oblivion posted:The problem is that once you become the puppet master and use the Alien to your advantage to kill the human dudes you break the tension, at that point you're manipulating the game and the Alien just becomes a piece of a puzzle for that room and how to go about solving it. It's really really stupid if you want to keep the game scary in anyway. I mean, hell, the film the game is trying to emulate you'll notice no one has any control over anything: all plans to kill the Alien fail, attempts to flee fail, Ripley fails in stopping the self destruct sequence and they barely keep their turd of a ship functional. Everything about the film and what makes it work so well is that no one has control over poo poo the entire time and they're just trying to survive. That's how the game should play out, you're only really in control of the player character and not luring the Alien around to deal with encounters for you. Now if that happened once or twice in the game it'd be fine, just to break things up a little bit and give you a false sense of control, but so far it seems like the humans and androids are going to be somewhat frequent. You have to hope there is some kind of cost to making use of the alien in that way. Like maybe the Xeno isn't as omnipresent in the game as we've seen in press demos and attracting its attention makes tasks much harder for a while. I'm not optimistic that's the case though.
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Jun 15, 2014 13:37
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Neo Rasa posted:It'd be cool if everything shown so far is from like the first hour of the game and you play as the alien for the rest of it. An Alien stealth/action game would be pretty cool. I'm thinking of a mode where the game would randomly generate a starship (type could be based on difficult, with military vessels being the most difficult) and the game starts with you chest-bursting out of an unlucky crew member. Then, you must hide and pick people off until you grow stronger -- different stages in growth could give you different abilities. Think: Rogue Legacy - Aliens Enemies would level up for each time they encountered you and lived, so the priority should be on a stealth kills and quick take downs. Avoiding groups would be key. Un-l337-Pork fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Jun 15, 2014 |
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Jun 15, 2014 13:41
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Still the most fear-inducing game related to the Alien franchise: Okay, I sent Parker down to engineering to get the flamethrower, has he got there yet? Brett, where are you now - oh poo poo, there's Jones! Dammit, where's the catbox? Lambert, you go and find it - gently caress, the tracker's pinging! Did I give it to Ripley or Ash? Ripley, where are you? The alien's somewhere close to you OH loving poo poo! RUN! RUUUUNNNN!
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Jun 15, 2014 13:54
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Sire Oblivion posted:The problem is that once you become the puppet master and use the Alien to your advantage to kill the human dudes you break the tension, at that point you're manipulating the game and the Alien just becomes a piece of a puzzle for that room and how to go about solving it. It's really really stupid if you want to keep the game scary in anyway. I mean, hell, the film the game is trying to emulate you'll notice no one has any control over anything: all plans to kill the Alien fail, attempts to flee fail, Ripley fails in stopping the self destruct sequence and they barely keep their turd of a ship functional. Everything about the film and what makes it work so well is that no one has control over poo poo the entire time and they're just trying to survive. That's how the game should play out, you're only really in control of the player character and not luring the Alien around to deal with encounters for you. Now if that happened once or twice in the game it'd be fine, just to break things up a little bit and give you a false sense of control, but so far it seems like the humans and androids are going to be somewhat frequent. If [use gun on man] causes [puts you in alien stealth sequence], I'd say that's enough of an incentive not to do it? Presumably just sneaking past them would be a viable option as well, and keep you from having to sneak by the hopefully much harder to get by Alien. You can create tension by making the failstate difficult. It's why it really is dependent on how it's handled. If firing a gun/making too much noise during the human segments brings in the Alien, who then kills all the humans and turns the zone into an Alien stealth sequence, I'd consider that a pretty hefty failstate. Suddenly you aren't sneaking by humans who don't know you are there, you are trying to get past a creature that's searching for you. That's going to make getting through the section much more difficult, especially if you were midway through it before the Alien came in and started killing everyone. Same with Androids. Make them so tough to kill that fighting them is pointless, and then have it so the Alien doesn't care about them, just starts searching for you. If you make any noise during those segments then you are double hosed, since both the Androids and Alien will start searching for you. On the other hand, if the Alien just shows up, kills everyone, then leaves it's exploitable, and as you said breaks the spirit of the horror quite a bit. Same with if there just are combat sequences throughout the game where you get a Pulse Rifle and get told to kill W-Y mans to get past them. But so far I haven't seen anything suggesting it'll be either of those things. I can see how it can be done without loving it up, and I'm basically hoping they don't. I wasn't going to preorder anyway because a game like this needs to be built in a specific way to work, and I want to make sure it is before I buy it, but I'm not going to claim this is a disaster without more information.
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Jun 15, 2014 14:02
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I think they should have added mercenaries (may already be in the game?), terminator like robots, velociraptors, killer clowns, mercenary killer clowns, and maybe even more aliens to REALLY up the tension having to avoid all of them! Think of the gameplay strategies also, do I lure the killer clowns with jack-in-the-boxes so they battle the killer robots, while the alien ignores the androids and then the mercenaries hear all the fighting and show up to kill them all? Or lure the raptors to the alien with meat from the freezers? So many options! I'll email this to Fox for Alien: Isolation Two: Not So Isolated This Time. edit: also this will allow for a more full dedicated multiplayer experience, with classes for mercenaries, collectable makeup for the killer clowns, and DLC mounts for the dinos.
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Jun 15, 2014 16:25
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KiddieGrinder posted:I think they should have added mercenaries (may already be in the game?), terminator like robots, velociraptors, killer clowns, mercenary killer clowns, and maybe even more aliens to REALLY up the tension having to avoid all of them! Har Har. The problem is that a game built around a single encounter extrapolated isn't actually tense or fun. If you continuously deal with the same problem over and over again, it loses it's appeal much quicker then most people assume it would. Eventually people figure out the quirks of the enemy design, and any tension or horror is removed. This is why games like Outlast or Amnesia introduced parkour chases and puzzles. It forces the player to constantly be putting the last encounter with enemies to the back of their mind, so when they encounter the next group they aren't fully used to them. It keeps the tension fresh with each new encounter. Of course, after enough enemy encounters the tension will be gone anyway, even if you spread side tasks throughout the inbetween sections. That's why both games also introduce new types of enemies randomly throughout the game to keep you off guard as well. As you get used to dealing with spiders, suddenly you start having to deal with humanoids. As you get used to them, here's some dogs. This makes sure the horror always stays fresh, because you haven't gotten used to what you are trying to escape. People are saying they'd be cool with Isolation being a 5-6 hour game with nothing but the Alien, but they are drastically overselling just how much could be pulled from that context. Amnesia and Outlast are 6 hours long with dozens of enemy types, puzzles, parkour, and backtracking. If Isolation was just you vs the Alien, I can't imagine it'd be more then 3 hours long, even with a hefty amount of empty ship bits. That's another horror game issue. Of course you need tension building sections, where you assume an enemy is going to appear, but ultimately they won't. This builds tension rather then fear, so when the enemy does appear, it's much more terrifying. However there is a point when you realize nothing is going to show up, and the tension starts dropping. After this point, those empty hallways are just that, empty hallways to casually wander through. If Isolation was just the Alien, that'd be a huge problem for them. If the Alien shows up to often, the player stops fearing them, because they learn it's AI routines and quirks. If it shows up rarely, the player stops fearing them because they'll know as soon as they get past it again, they can go back to exploring.
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Jun 15, 2014 16:50
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This game seems to me like it will be a lot like the MGS games on "Euro Insane" difficulty or whatever, which is a challenge mode that ended the game when you were spotted (and not very fun). That IGN preview made it sound like one of the guys playing was supremely frustrated playing the same part over and over, and checkpoints are sparse to discourage dying, but playing the same plodding stealth sequence over and over may not be fun for everyone. What's interesting to me is they have shown Ripley with a huge loving Space Revolver, which would kill the poo poo out of the alien in any capacity, but probably just dings off of it in this game. Does anyone remember the game Overblood? It was a complete Aliens ripoff for PSX that ended the game when you killed invincible thing with the start-up afterburner of a spaceship that allowed you to escape. I'm predicting either that or an airlock purge. I think what I'm saying is I would've rather them made a Silent Hill With Aliens with this engine. Firstborn fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Jun 15, 2014 |
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Jun 15, 2014 17:19
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Rookersh posted:If Isolation was just the Alien, that'd be a huge problem for them. If the Alien shows up to often, the player stops fearing them, because they learn it's AI routines and quirks. If it shows up rarely, the player stops fearing them because they'll know as soon as they get past it again, they can go back to exploring. I guess then this was a game that didn't need to be/shouldn't have been made?  And I agree, it probably would get tedious, boring, and repetitive if it was just you and the alien. But, that doesn't mean the developers have to shove in a bunch of waffle to justify it's existence. If a game concept doesn't work, then, ....it doesn't work. Adding stuff to a game that fails on it's on premise, it's core ideas, doesn't really help things much.  Let's make a game based on Alien, we'll make it survival horror! But sir, with just a single alien, people will get bored and lose interest. Interactions will become repetitive and monotonous, plus AI can't replicate a controlled passive experience like a film. Ok, then lets spice it up! Androids, mercs, other humans, cats, all in baby! So, you want a claustrophobic tense horror game with a single alien, but also killer robots, soldiers, and who knows what else running around also trying to kill you? And add GUNS! Now that's a game!
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Jun 15, 2014 17:37
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Rookersh posted:Har Har. This. this pretty much sums up my thoughts perfectly.
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Jun 15, 2014 17:43
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The humans/robots are for varying the gameplay. I'd assume that the game won't be just a uniform distribution of human/robot/alien interactions, and instead you'll have some areas where the humans/robots aren't and it's stealth-focused and tense, and others will include humans/robots in fairly high numbers and it'll be more action-oriented. All the good FPS games I can think of do basically the same thing. Having more than just one alien running around lets them vary the tone/pace of the game a lot more than without them, but it doesn't necessarily mean that it's going to be one short segment of tense alien-dodging and then 100s of human/robot bad guys around every corner from then till the finish line.
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Jun 15, 2014 17:44
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Usually when these games come out, the AI is predictable as poo poo. I think the last game that I played where it wasn't too bad was Haunting Ground, but that got pretty drat annoying after a while.
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Jun 15, 2014 18:47
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Real loving pissed that the game developers aren't staying true to the pure vision of Ridley Scott's Alien, game would be much better if the alien was differently shaped and the title was changed to something else, imo.
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Jun 15, 2014 18:51
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Rookersh posted:The problem is that a game built around a single encounter extrapolated isn't actually tense or fun. If you continuously deal with the same problem over and over again, it loses it's appeal much quicker then most people assume it would. Eventually people figure out the quirks of the enemy design, and any tension or horror is removed. This is why games like Outlast or Amnesia introduced parkour chases and puzzles. It forces the player to constantly be putting the last encounter with enemies to the back of their mind, so when they encounter the next group they aren't fully used to them. It keeps the tension fresh with each new encounter. Ok, so add puzzles and chase sequences to Isolation and remove the stupid combat? It's been a while since I played Amnesia but wasn't there really only one enemy in it? Nothing behaved any differently save for the water creature that you couldn't see. Even with only one enemy the tension was high throughout the whole game. I don't see why having only the Alien would make the game short or how it'd get stale.
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Jun 15, 2014 22:18
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Palpek posted:Maybe it could be done right but at the moment it looks to me like it will end up with you making a noise whenever you see humanoids, hiding in a closet and waiting until the Alien does the job for you and goes away. Some puzzle. On the other hand if any noise lures the Alien into the room then why have weapons at all? Won't using any of them end up with the Alien ruining the party each time? I somehow suspect there will simply be levels where you shoot dudes safe from the Alien as otherwise it would end up with same outcome every time. Also I don't see anything great in hiding from Will Smith's iRobots when hiding from the Alien is the same but way more tense. One writer over at RPS detailed how the demo they played was incredibly linear, and they were stuck having to get through a section populated by human enemies that would always see him and shoot him without fail every single time, with sneaking/stealth not possible. The only way he managed to get through the section was by throwing a noisemaker to draw the alien, which seemed to be what the game was forcing him to do to progress. Things like that combined with all the other gameplay footage (such as IGN's video where all their staff played the game and had the exact same scripted experiences) is enough to kill any excitement that I had for the game. They started off having a great idea, but it looks like they've completely and utterly botched it.
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Jun 16, 2014 06:44
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Gonna wait for reviews on this one. Also if it is as tense as it is in my head, I would invariably pee myself, so maybe it'd be good if it wasn't that tense.
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Jun 16, 2014 08:59
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Organs posted:One writer over at RPS detailed how the demo they played was incredibly linear, and they were stuck having to get through a section populated by human enemies that would always see him and shoot him without fail every single time, with sneaking/stealth not possible. The only way he managed to get through the section was by throwing a noisemaker to draw the alien, which seemed to be what the game was forcing him to do to progress. That writer also said that someone else playing that section had a completely different experience.
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Jun 16, 2014 09:39
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I'm going with the safe bet and saying it sucks now. gently caress this game uninstall.
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Jun 16, 2014 09:53
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Organs posted:They started off having a great idea, but it looks like they've completely and utterly botched it. Somebody came up with this really cool level where you have no weapons, you're vulnerable and have to get to the airlock while the Xeno searches for you in the same area. It's a great level, everybody is mindblown, "this is going to be awesome", the trailer looks great etc. But then they had to create the whole rest of the game from that and it didn't really extend that well because how many times can you go through similar linear stealth sections. So instead of adding maybe some interesting objectives, a new layer of gameplay where you would have to maybe assemble parts for a repair or whatever - they simply started sprinkling what they had with things that fill video games which can be found in the franchise - androids, grunts, weapons, grenades etc. I just really don't believe in some grand vision they have with the synergy between the alien, androids, soldiers. Those will be forced sections that will require you to play the game a certain way. Oh look, soldiers are mowing you down the moment you turn the corner - reload the checkpoint and drop a noise maker this time. Oh look, a dark long corridor, this will be an Alien stealth level. This is it. This will probably be an ok game with outstanding environment design. That's already way more than people expect from an Alien game at this point. However I just don't think there are some deep levels of gameplay that we havn't been shown yet that will totally blow our minds that people speculate about.
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Jun 16, 2014 09:56
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Fangz posted:That writer also said that someone else playing that section had a completely different experience. I dunno if I'd call it a completely different experience. RPS posted:The game had plonked thee looters in a tight corridor, and in the flickering lights I couldn’t work out a way around. But no amount of stealth would let me pass: they’d spot me, open fire and I’d die. It happened again and again, and though each restart put the looters in a slightly different grouping, they were always near the spawn section, trapping me in part of the corridor. RPS posted:Then I had a chat with another player. It was interesting how his game went. The encounter with the people? He had it in a different area, it was driven by the Alien tracking everyone down. He stepped into a corridor and was shot at immediately, no warning.
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Jun 16, 2014 11:04
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I think the evil within will be a better purchase coming October. It'll probably have a decent atmosphere and more engaging game play. I love the alien movies, but this might be wise to wait for reviews and maybe for it to drop down to 20 bucks.
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Jun 16, 2014 12:04
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I'm hoping it drops real fast like Rage did where it was $20 in November. There's no way this will sell well anyway when it's being released around the same time as new CoD, Battlefield, Assassin's Creed, etc.
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Jun 16, 2014 14:36
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Predicting a twist where it turns out there's more than one Alien.
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Jun 16, 2014 17:02
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I also played the demo at E3 and frankly found it frustrating. Sometimes the alien would react to me, run up to me and kill me, other times just walk past when I was standing in the same area. That RPS article is spot on. I will say they really nailed making it look and feel like the first film, lots of clutter, steam, and lots of darkness with little pools of light. Think I'll wait for reviews, and probably pick up on sale on steam, but I'm not chomping at the bit to get this one.
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Jun 16, 2014 17:28
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It's hard for me to make a declarative statement one way or another about the gameplay. I feel though that if the alien AI is lacking it will be exposed within an hour of play. The e3 demo we had access to on the floor was so limited it's hard for me to judge too harshly. I can say the atmosphere was good and the visual look was nice. Still, this is a wait and see title for me.
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Jun 16, 2014 19:12
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soggybagel posted:It's hard for me to make a declarative statement one way or another about the gameplay. I feel though that if the alien AI is lacking it will be exposed within an hour of play. The e3 demo we had access to on the floor was so limited it's hard for me to judge too harshly. Basically how I feel too. It's also too early to tell if the combat will throw the game off for me. Sure, it will kill the atmosphere of the game if it juxtaposes moments where I mow down 20 dudes with a pistol and moments where I'm hiding under a random pipe hoping the Xeno doesn't turn around and slaughter me, but if the combat against human enemies is tense and generally the game acts like/is balance around direct combat being a last resort, I can see it being a positive for the game.
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Jun 17, 2014 04:45
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It's creative assembly so expect the AI to be complete poo poo, but they talk it up anyways.
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Jun 17, 2014 04:51
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I could see this as a great piece of Oculus Rift eye candy, but nothing else. Maybe the soundtrack'll be good since they're cribbing pretty hard from Goldsmith. Can't wait to hear how this is all another Weyland Yutani venture! Maybe there will be soldiers!?
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Jun 17, 2014 15:00
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InsanityIsCrazy posted:Can't wait to hear how this is all another Weyland Yutani venture! Maybe there will be soldiers!? You mean...somehow use the alien as a weapon?!?  Surely not, those soldiers are there to rescue you!
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Jun 17, 2014 16:32
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I sure hope W-Y doesn't try to take an egg or someone who got face hugged off of the ship! That would mean that the Xeno threat is not over, and we might have to return in another game to do battle once more!
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Jun 17, 2014 17:35
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soggybagel posted:It's hard for me to make a declarative statement one way or another about the gameplay. I feel though that if the alien AI is lacking it will be exposed within an hour of play. The e3 demo we had access to on the floor was so limited it's hard for me to judge too harshly. The android video was equal in quality to the IGN demo of Colonial Marines two summers ago. That is to say, it looked cheap and poor and had 90s FPS caliber animations (much like Colonial Marines). I love how the androids attack by slowly walking towards you and doing the same punch over and over again and how the only way to stop them is by throwing a small EMP grenade at them but they have you do all these attacks that have zero effect anyway to make it seem tense as you slowly back pedal while chucking grenades. Much like Colonial Marines, this started as a potentially good game but now, even after literally seeing footage of a the game being poo poo with our own eyes people are, again, acting as if this might be a game worthy of spending $59.99 on. I'm sure it will end on a cliffhanger of you ending up in a space with tons of aliens in it to make us excited about the sequel Alien: Isolations.
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Jun 17, 2014 17:43
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Was there actually a piece of Alien universe (maybe an alternative timeline or whatever) where the Xeno got erased for good or do they always keep the last floating-in-space egg around?
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Jun 17, 2014 18:06
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Palpek posted:Was there actually a piece of Alien universe (maybe an alternative timeline or whatever) where the Xeno got erased for good or do they always keep the last floating-in-space egg around? Well, even if W-Y was run by competent people who went around exterminating every egg/facehugger/xenomorph they came across; and nuked the crashed ship into dust ... that ship came from somewhere. So even in a scenario where the writer creates a scenario that unambiguously states that *this was the last alien*, all the next writer has to do is say *hey guys, here's another crashed ship/ancient ruins/... and guess what they found inside?*.
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Jun 17, 2014 18:19
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I wish that for once they'd have the confidence to craft an Alien story that's completely unrelated to everything before it. Completely new characters with no ties to anything from the movies etc. (no Ripley/Hicks/Bishop/WeylandYutani callbacks) and have the aliens/eggs discovered somewhere new, completely unrelated to the derelict ship on that one planet or Ripley's DNA clones.
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Jun 17, 2014 18:23
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| # ? May 4, 2024 21:04 |
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Organs posted:I wish that for once they'd have the confidence to craft an Alien story that's completely unrelated to everything before it. Completely new characters with no ties to anything from the movies etc. (no Ripley/Hicks/Bishop/WeylandYutani callbacks) and have the aliens/eggs discovered somewhere new, completely unrelated to the derelict ship on that one planet or Ripley's DNA clones. Well, we sort of got Prometheus 
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Jun 17, 2014 19:03
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