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Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
Is this missing content? I don't see the list of Feats or any martial maneuvers.

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Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
The fighter's ability to grant disadvantage to an enemy attack against an ally still requires a shield. I just do not understand this, what kind of sense does that make? Especially if you prefer a two-handed weapon.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
It's like the designers have this weird design blindness where Fighters have to either do more things, or get better at doing things, while full casters get to do both. Like it doesn't occur to them that some techniques are harder for a fighter to master in the same way that a level one Wizard is not going to be comprehending a 20th Level spell.

Rexides posted:

I wonder what they 10-year plan is. Are they even planning to release another version after this? Dropping the edition version from the name and saying that the whole point is to try and get all players on board makes it seem as if they want to create the edition to end all editions. In that case, what are they going to do, business wise, to keep making money out of it? Just licensing?
Maybe they'll actually make 5th Edition. :v:

(By which I mean an edition that that actually builds on 4th Edition and refines the D&D game along a set of design goals, rather than the DDN method of deciding that design goals are for babies.)

Chaltab fucked around with this message at 02:25 on Jul 5, 2014

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
edit: drat double post

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Azran posted:

Haha, the only hobby store in my area is getting a shipment of 5e because someone managed to convince 5e is the best of 4e with some minor 3.5e stuff on it :allears:
How did they do that when the PHB doesn't even have a Warlord class?

I mean that's like a glaring omission given WOTCs earlier stated intention to have every class and race that had ever been in an edition's PHB1. I'll let them squeeze by not having the Eladrin because of the High Elf thing, but the lack of a Warlord is inexcusable.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Jack the Lad posted:

The Battle Master's level 15 feature, Relentless, has been heavily nerfed.

Before: If you tart a turn with 0 Superiority Dice, regain 2.

Now: If you have 0 Superiority Dice when you roll initiative, regain 1.
Wait... when you roll initiative--? So you only get them at the start of an encounter and are SOL for the rest of the fight?

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
Some of these rules, especially the last minute nerfs, make the game feel really slipshod. Like, in trying to placate the various grognard factions they seem to have no idea how the math works out for anything other than a d20. On the other hand, all those complaints about ADEU and how it seemed as though every class has a spell list... They solve it by giving nearly every class, including non-arcane combatants like Paladins and Rangers, an ACTUAL spell list.

There's a HUGE difference in 'recover two at the start of a round' and 'recover one at the start of an encounter'. That they could miss some supposed balance issue (or change their minds that drastically between Alpha and publication) doesn't bode well. That's the sort of poo poo I'd expect from a Paizo playtest, not WOTC.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Fenarisk posted:

4e was a good system for what it was, but didn't lend to much else. I loved 4e but I would never work on making it for settings its not a fit for (a lot of them). I tend to play more story/narrative games these days and its better to use a system with mechanics that enforce/boost that.
Depends on what you mean by setting. D&D 4E is adaptable to any setting in which the actual game-play centers around adventures and tactical set-piece battles starring badasses. It's not hard to tweak the system to do heroic sci-fi or urban fantasy, for example.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Jack the Lad posted:

No picture, sorry (they're not mine) but second-hand, it can duplicate any 8th level or lower spell without using components, and has a handful of additional effects: creating a non magical item of up to 25k in value, healing large groups, forcing a reroll on an action in prior turns (this seems to work retroactively, I have no idea how it's supposed to be handled). Also allows reality shaping effects, prone to DM shenanigans, with severe drawbacks including a chance of never being able to cast wish again.
Why is this a spell and not a ritual?

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

ProfessorCirno posted:

I guess it's up to me to be relentlessly negative~!
I'd say this post would be posted in grogs.txt by now if not for the no-hell dump rule.

Gort posted:

I think the biggest thing that has me coming back to D&D edition after edition is the sheer quantity of stuff available for it. There's always mountains of classes, adventures, feats, magic items and all that stuff available. It's simultaneously a strength and a weakness, and I don't think there's another RPG that matches D&D for sheer quantity of material. Not to mention a large player base, which allows you to steal awesome stuff like this from other players.
It's also one of the reasons I think fans of 4th Edition, for the most part, aren't flipping their poo poo to the same level as in prior edition wars? I mean, I'm iffy on DDN, but on the other hand there's more 4E material than I can ever hope to possibly use. I'd have liked for an actual D&D5th Edition to streamline and fix up the previous edition, but since that's clearly not what DDN is, I'm content to wait.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

MartianAgitator posted:

This is the kind of DMing Wizards wanted to represent 4e; 5e is proper hosed.
Or Chris Perkins just made a mistake and I rather doubt it was meant as a statement of intent. Because while I don't have any rulebooks handy I did find this on the Comendium:

quote:

Objects don’t have any universal resistances or vulnerabilities, but the DM might rule that some kinds of damage are particularly effective against a certain object—the object has vulnerability to that damage. For instance, a gauzy curtain or a pile of dry papers might have vulnerable 5 fire because any spark is likely to destroy it.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
So does Next have a Warlord yet?

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

ProfessorCirno posted:

Mearls absolutely hates the warlord, so 5e does not have it, and likely will not ever have it.
Seriously? It's a good class and it doesn't even have to heal if that's too objectionable for the grognards. I thought Mearls himself said that every class that had ever been in the PHB would be this game.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Agent Boogeyman posted:

Healing Potions should have been surgeless so you at least feel urged to use them if you're in a pinch to regain a tiny bit of HP, especially if you've run out of surges entirely.
I can see that one one level, but on another limitless healing was what surges were trying to prevent. Granted there's a hard limit on 'how many potions you have' but I can see what Heinsoo and co. were going for by making potions require a surge. One thing my group has done to sort of make them not-quite-ueseless is basically 'free refills' in that you're always assumed to have one use of potion per bottle and those uses are refilled off-screen whenever you wind up in a town. that way you're not wasting money on them repeatedly but have something to heal you in a pinch if none of the leaders can reach you.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

gradenko_2000 posted:

Reading it more closely, the idea is actually that you roll initiative every round. People declare their actions, the DM will assign a modifier based on what the character wants to do ("quick, easy actions should grant a bonus, while slow, difficult ones should incur a penalty"), and you process actions starting from initiative 30 on down. Rolling initiative every round!
Well that does mean Superiority Dice get a slight buff if you roll initiative every round. :unsmith:

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
Alternatively you could just house rule Superiority dice to refresh at the start of every round like they did in every sensible iteration of the playtest.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

gradenko_2000 posted:

I guess what I'm saying is, wasn't the "problem" of stats constantly increasing but not really since everything increases right along with it mostly a 3rd and 4th Edition phenomenon?
In a sense that the math itself was flatter in TSR D&D than it was in previous WOTC D&Ds, yes. Though IIRC there were other factors like some monsters just could not be harmed at all without a sufficiently powerful magic sword.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

ProfessorCirno posted:

Written in part by the most disgusting people in the hobby.
Byron Hall and James Desborough?

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
Bahamut is supposed to be both Platinum and a good guy right? Because that looks like an evil dragon with tin scales.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Mendrian posted:

I think this succinctly explains the problem with the 5e development process. But then, consider this: the rules market to grogs, but the uninitiated have no investment in things like Wizard supremacy or Saving Throws. In theory you could write the rules to appeal to grogs and then market the game to appeal to the masses but I feel like they still haven't really figured out how to market DnD. Which is funny because videogames pretty much have worked every time and it's not really a mystery.

Dear WotC. Make a videogame.
The problem is finding a developer. Black Isle got shut down, Bioware and Obsidian have their own IPs now, and investing the kind of time and money it would require to make a serious modern D&D contender in an untested studio is not an inviting proposition to the bean-counters at Hasbro. Much safer to pretty up Capcom's arcade games and reissue the Infinity Engine collection.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Kylra posted:

Anything major or important happen with regard to next the last 4 months?
It came out?

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Really Pants posted:

A DM who disallows creative and appropriate non-combat uses for combat powers is a lovely DM.
Yeah pretty much. If a power can do something during combat, it can do it out of combat--just know you'll be unable to use it again without an appropriate rest.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Roadie posted:

"Adventurer's Handbook" is a painfully useless name. They might as well have gone with just "Player's Handbook II" again if the idea was just to throw out a bunch of generic options for all characters.
It says it's to create characters with Elemental power, which sounds like it should have been called... well Elemental Power or something. Adventurer's Handbook makes it sound more like some kind of strategy guide.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

MonsterEnvy posted:

Well despite the blurry image I can make out the Elemental Evil logo in the corner.

So I guess it could be nicknamed the Elemental Evil Adventurer's Handbook.
Apparently it was called that early on but they changed it? Either way "Adventurer's Handbook" is a terrible name for something with such a specific focus.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

ImpactVector posted:

Also the one playtest where he was on the other side of the screen he played a dwarf fighter named "MC Killsalot" wearing a steel top hat and steel tuxedo.
Okay that part actually sounds amazing. I'm sure he found some way to screw it up though.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

ProfessorCirno posted:

It's the whole DM EMPOWERMENT thing. IT'S IN THE DMG! ONLY THE DM DECIDES IF YOU CAN USE IT OR NOT!

Yes, this is a hobby where they intentionally withhold information because otherwise human beings would have to talk to each other, and that's to be avoided.
...Wait what? That doesn't even make sense. Witholding information from the PHB means the players and DM have to talk to each other.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
"Intolerant Dragonborn Fighter from the city post office who deserted the army"

Perfect, the army would never think to look for me in a different government office!

edit;

"Check this poo poo out, I'm going to be a loving

Machiavellian Half-elf Fighter from an unpure bloodline who has a bad gambling problem"

Chaltab fucked around with this message at 06:20 on Jan 9, 2015

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Fuschia tude posted:

Yeah I uh wasn't exactly thinking of DW or 13A when I said "simpler systems". I mean, they may be simpler than 3.pf, but that's not exactly a low bar to limbo under. And wasn't DW literally some dude's house rules to Apocalypse World, like he just looked at the book and said "You know what this game needs? Ability scores and Vancian casting." :yum:
Have you even played Dungeon World?

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Sage Genesis posted:

Well, first of all you're now stuck with two entirely obsolete subclasses (Champion and Eldritch Knight). In the old playtest every Fighter had maneuvers and expertise dice, now only the Battlemaster does. They weren't that great to begin with but if the Battlemaster can pull all that off every round then the other two really don't compare.

The effects themselves also don't seem really suited for having that many dice available all the time. You run into some action economy issues because you only have so many bonus actions, reactions, and attacks to make. You could find a few maneuvers that work pretty well together but overall I'd say you'd have to really re-engineer the entire maneuver section from scratch to really make it work.
What about just crowbaring that playtest version back in there, maneuvers and all?

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

gtrmp posted:

They're paying money to run a survey that's not going to get them any useful information. "Is class X more powerful than class Y" ought to be less important to the designers than "is class X more fun to play than class Y". How useful, exactly, is it to ask people to rate every single class feature and every single feat from 1 to 5?
The survey asked me my age and then that was it. :psyduck:

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
Okay I mostly just filled out the survey so I could remind them that they still don't have a Warlord class and that they should get on it immediately.

It's my lance I'll tilt it at windmills if I want to.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
So I've played maybe 7 sessions of 5th Edition, though I've watched plenty of Critical Role and High Rollers and have a decent handle on the rules... But the DM of my current campaign is drawing his game to a close soonish and I've volunteered to take over DMing for the group. And while I have extensive experience DMing 4th Editon, I'm a complete newbie to doing so for 5E.

My biggest thing is that while I appreciate certain aspects of the metagame design for 5E--no magic item treadmill, fewer fiddly bonuses, less feat bloat, etc.... there's a certain tactical depth I feel is missing especially for martial classes. Does anybody know of some good resources, third party or otherwise, that I could offer as options for players? Or anything, official or otherwise, that I should avoid letting players use?

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
Terrain and alternate objectives are somethings I usually already do, I was wanting something with a bit more mechanical weight on the player's side. That factory with the barbed devils is a really great idea that I'm probably going to borrow, though!

Libertad! posted:

Books by Kobold Press are overall high quality for 3rd party material. ... If you aren't interested in the Midgard setting, the weapon option rules are sold as their own product called Beyond Damage Dice.

Self-promotion alert: I also wrote a book of my own, The Martial Disciple, which takes inspiration from the Tome of Battle/Path of War system in creating fighting schools and "special moves" in battle.

Thanks! I'll give these a look.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Spiteski posted:

So despite this being a garbage fire of a game, I've been talked into running another campaign in this system.
Can someone remind me of all the houserules I need? I vaguely remember "Don't start at level 3"

What's bad about starting at level 3?

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
God you think some of these Warlock issues could have been hammered out in that massive public playtest. :v:

I'm thinking about adding the following feats as house rules but obviously, I've not had a chance to playtest them so they're probably over/underpowered as gently caress.

quote:

Defender’s Mark
Any Fighter, Barbarian, or Paladin can choose this feat. A Defender gains the following benefits:

- Whenever you make a weapon attack on a creature within five feet of you, hit or miss, you can place a mark on that creature. You can mark as many targets as you attack in a turn.
- A target marked by you suffers disadvantage on any attack roll that is not made against you.
- You may punish a target for violating a mark with an opportunity attack as a free action. Paladins may use Divine Smite on this attack.
- If you also have the Sentinel feat, you gain advantage on opportunity attacks provoked by the violation of your mark.
- At level 10, the attack provoked by violation your mark does 3[W] Damage if it hits.
- At level 15, the attack provoked by a violation of your mark does 6[W] Damage if it hits.

Leader’s Word
Any Bard, Cleric, or Druid can choose this feat. A Leader gains the following benefits:

- Once per short rest, you can use your bonus action to speak Words of Inspiration to a creature who can see or hear you. You can choose to either restore hit points equal to 3d4 + your Charisma modifier, or allow the creature to make a saving throw against an ongoing effect.
- At Level 7 and Level 15, add an extra 2d4 to hitpoints recovered.
- At Level 10, you also grant advantage on saving throws granted with this ability.

Controller’s Stratagem
Any Monk, Wizard, or Ranger can choose this feat. A Controller gains the following benefits:

- Once per short rest, on any successful attack that does not require a saving throw you can slide a target fifteen feet, or add fifteen extra feet to any push, pull, or slide effect the attack already carries
- At 10th level this effect can be used twice per short rest.
- At 15th level this effect can be used three times per short rest.

Striker’s Ravage
Any Sorcerer, Warlock, or Rogue can choose this feat. A Striker gains the following benefits:
- Once per short rest, you may maximize the dice of any successful hit, or double the result of damage dice from an effect that requires a saving throw.
- If using this ability deals more than half a creature’s total hit points in damage, that creature must make a DC 10 Constitution saving throw or die outright.
- At level 15, you may use this ability twice per short rest.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
There was another thing in the playtest I recall, Great Weapon Fighters getting Strength Mod damage on a missed attack, which was changed to something much more fiddly and less evocative in the final version. Probably gonna make that a houserule because I like that way better than rerolling ones and twos.

Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!

Bhodi posted:

E: Maybe it'd be good if you can find a way to have it float 20 feet above an enemy so their top half is in darkness and everyone shoots at their feet.
Cast darkness on the bow of an enemy archer and they're not going to be doing poo poo with it until the spell ends.

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Chaltab
Feb 16, 2011

So shocked someone got me an avatar!
For the language/ethnicity.

Uh... Though if you want to heavily use the Vistani in your Strahd game I'd encourage you to distance them from anything remotely Romani because their portrayal in the book is shockingly racist, like hitting on every negative gypsy stereotype to the point I can barely believe they actually released it in Current Decade.

Give them, I dunno. New Jersey accents. Nobody likes New Jersey, right?

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