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Listen, Crow, just make sure you do the theocracy right. I want knightly power armor and poo poo, ok? Don't half-rear end it, we half-assed the cyberpunk future and there are no cyborgs or walking spider tanks to be found anywhere. I can't even "chip in" and become a cyborged out synth-rock star.
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Jul 9, 2014 03:48
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Negative Entropy posted:So you would put the poor in prison for not being able to pay the tax? Sounds pretty non-Christian. Why would I do that? Prosecution would be for those that evade taxes. Garnishment would be for those that can't pay it. With sizable forgiveness of course. I'm beginning to think that you guys are a bunch of Debbie downers that only see the bad things in life.
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Jul 9, 2014 03:52
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The Catholic Church has opposed the abuses of capitalism since 1891, so it's not all bad. It did support Spanish fascism though. But then it's not like the United States has a consistent history of only supporting moral regimes either. That said I've always thought that Christianity and the state were relatively incompatible. The use of the sword by the magistrate is directly contradictory to the principles of Jesus, though it's not like anyone from Augustine onward writing about these issues cared at all. Judaism and Islam obviously don't have this issue however.
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Jul 9, 2014 03:56
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Barlow posted:The Catholic Church has opposed the abuses of capitalism since 1891, so it's not all bad. It did support Spanish fascism though. But then it's not like the United States has a consistent history of only supporting moral regimes either. I agree with this sentiment! My dream state would be a loose confederation of small communal towns built on the model of Russian peasant communes, but without the boyar. I am always saddened when I hear tales of Patriarch Kirill sucking Putin's dick when he should be calling him out for his unfaithfulness, like St. John Chrysostom did to Eudoxia.
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Jul 9, 2014 03:59
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Smoking Crow posted:Why would I do that? Prosecution would be for those that evade taxes. Garnishment would be for those that can't pay it. With sizable forgiveness of course. So the jobless would have their non-wages garnished. Gotcha.
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Jul 9, 2014 04:36
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E-Tank posted:So the jobless would have their non-wages garnished. Gotcha. You can't be jobless is a communist style system friend
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Jul 9, 2014 04:37
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Smoking Crow posted:You can't be jobless is a communist style system friend So the physically disabled just don't exist anymore?
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Jul 9, 2014 04:38
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E-Tank posted:So the physically disabled just don't exist anymore? No, physically disabled people are an urban myth. Jesus got rid of all of them during his travels in Judea.
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Jul 9, 2014 04:40
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Smoking Crow posted:I agree with this sentiment! My dream state would be a loose confederation of small communal towns built on the model of Russian peasant communes, but without the boyar. I am always saddened when I hear tales of Patriarch Kirill sucking Putin's dick when he should be calling him out for his unfaithfulness, like St. John Chrysostom did to Eudoxia. So you want distributism?
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Jul 9, 2014 04:42
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Crowsbeak posted:So you want distributism? I guess? I'm not really up on my Catholic theology. In Orthodoxy we just call this "the way things should be."
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Jul 9, 2014 04:43
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But we, who blanch with horror at the very idea of human sacrifices and cannibalism, how can we be at the same time so blind and ungrateful as not to recognize that we owe these feelings only to the law of love which watched over our cradle? Not long ago a famous nation, which had reached the peak of civilization and refinement, dared formally to suspend this law in a fit of madness of which history gives no other example: what happened? - in a flash, the mores of the Iroquois and the Algonquin; the holy laws of humanity crushed underfoot; innocent blood covering the scaffolds which covered France; men powdering and curling bloodstained heads; the very mouths of women stained with human blood. Here is the natural man! It is not that he does not bear within him the indestructible seeds of truth and virtue: his birthrights are imprescriptible; but without divine nurture these seeds will never germinate or will yield only damaged and unwholesome fruits. It is time to draw from the most undeniable historical facts a conclusion which is no less undeniable. From four centuries' experience, we know that wherever the true God is not known and served by virtue of an explicit revelation, man will slaughter man and often eat him.
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Jul 9, 2014 04:52
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Tao Jones posted:But we, who blanch with horror at the very idea of human sacrifices and cannibalism, how can we be at the same time so blind and ungrateful as not to recognize that we owe these feelings only to the law of love which watched over our cradle? Not long ago a famous nation, which had reached the peak of civilization and refinement, dared formally to suspend this law in a fit of madness of which history gives no other example: what happened? - in a flash, the mores of the Iroquois and the Algonquin; the holy laws of humanity crushed underfoot; innocent blood covering the scaffolds which covered France; men powdering and curling bloodstained heads; the very mouths of women stained with human blood. You joke, but de Maistre is really important in both socialist and sociological thinking.
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Jul 9, 2014 05:06
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buttcoin smuggler fucked around with this message at 14:47 on Dec 29, 2014 |
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Jul 9, 2014 05:11
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Look man, I like your gumption, but christian theocracy is old hat: been there, done that. We need something new, something to really bring religious dictatorship into the new century. We need something aimed directly at the youth demographic, yet acceptable to their parents. Stylistic, yet functional. Proactive, yet passive. I say, go back the roman gods, but spice them up a bit: give mercury a vespa, minerva a macintosh, etc. Retro-wave is a big thing these days, I feel a dressed-up sequel to the roman paganism can really tap into that.
rudatron fucked around with this message at 09:00 on Jul 9, 2014 |
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Jul 9, 2014 08:57
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buttcoin smuggler fucked around with this message at 14:47 on Dec 29, 2014 |
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Jul 9, 2014 09:18
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Smoking Crow posted:The Romans tried to eliminate Christianity and failed. Muslims crushed Orthodox Rome and conquered Constantinople, so Islam obviously has the Lord's favor. When are you converting?
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Jul 9, 2014 10:06
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Smoking Crow posted:
What's to stop people from converting to the 'dominant religion' for the tax benefits? Do you really want people in your church for purely mercenary purposes? What happens when people start complaining about how their religious taxes are being spent? You are seriously completely fine with making other people tithe to your church while you sit back and enjoy the tax breaks?
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Jul 9, 2014 11:12
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When I think "Successful country where I would like to live" what immediately comes to mind is the loving Ottoman Empire. Great job, OP.
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Jul 9, 2014 12:12
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Smoking Crow posted:Another good point of a theocratic government would be that war would be a complete last option as killing is banned by almost all religions. Somehow everyone has skipped over this gem in the OP.
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Jul 9, 2014 13:33
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buttcoin smuggler posted:A properly run Catholic theocracy would be preferable to the (neo-)liberal hellhole the United States is becoming. You can't murder what isn't a person, silly!
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Jul 9, 2014 13:38
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sandorius posted:What's to stop people from converting to the 'dominant religion' for the tax benefits? Do you really want people in your church for purely mercenary purposes? What happens when people start complaining about how their religious taxes are being spent? You are seriously completely fine with making other people tithe to your church while you sit back and enjoy the tax breaks? Mom and Dad fake conversion to save money and in forty years their grandchildren will be pious little Christian soldiers.
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Jul 9, 2014 14:41
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Miltank posted:Mom and Dad fake conversion to save money and in forty years their grandchildren will be pious little Christian soldiers. Mom and Dad still teach their children the one true religion under Allah in secret. 
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Jul 9, 2014 14:48
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Who What Now posted:Mom and Dad still teach their children the one true religion under Allah in secret. I see nothing wrong with this, if they speak Arabic. Arabic-speaking Christians call God "Allah."
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Jul 9, 2014 14:57
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Who What Now posted:Mom and Dad still teach their children the one true religion under Allah in secret. They might try to but Islam doesn't really work in secret. It's all about carrying out ceremonial religious actions and I think someone might notice if a family stops eating during the daytime for a lunar month every year. If they really wanna be Muslim they can pay their taxes and be good little subjects.
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Jul 9, 2014 15:04
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Miltank posted:They might try to but Islam doesn't really work in secret. It's all about carrying out ceremonial religious actions and I think someone might notice if a family stops eating during the daytime for a lunar month every year. If they really wanna be Muslim they can pay their taxes and be good little subjects. Muslims are forgiven if they are forbidden by malevolent oppressors from observing holy rites, so they could be hella secret.
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Jul 9, 2014 15:17
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I'd only live in a wise theocracy, y'know the enlightened kind of wise. Then you use the enlightenment to sell stuff.
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Jul 9, 2014 15:19
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What if the theocracy was church of scientology ? Also Com Truise
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Jul 9, 2014 15:36
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Who What Now posted:Muslims are forgiven if they are forbidden by malevolent oppressors from observing holy rites, so they could be hella secret. like I said they can give it a shot, but if they get caught they better be ready for some back taxes.
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Jul 9, 2014 15:41
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Miltank posted:like I said they can give it a shot, but if they get caught they better be ready for some back taxes. Yeah, gently caress the poor!
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Jul 9, 2014 15:45
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If they literally can't afford jizya then they don't pay poo poo's not hard.
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Jul 9, 2014 15:48
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Miltank posted:If they literally can't afford jizya then they don't pay poo poo's not hard. Because Christians have never gone out of their way to persecute religious minorities. 
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Jul 9, 2014 15:52
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Who What Now posted:Because Christians have never gone out of their way to persecute religious minorities. 
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Jul 9, 2014 16:01
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I'm sorry for misrepresenting the theocracy that doesn't exist.
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Jul 9, 2014 16:03
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I propose a Jain theocracy.
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Jul 9, 2014 16:16
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Fitzwilliam Lacho posted:I propose a Jain theocracy. only real option is to kill yourself
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Jul 9, 2014 16:24
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Cabbit posted:Would we drop balms instead of bombs?
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Jul 9, 2014 16:30
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Sorry for taking so long! I had an early class today and I wanted to take the right amount of effort into my replies.VitalSigns posted:Muslims crushed Orthodox Rome and conquered Constantinople, so Islam obviously has the Lord's favor. When are you converting? Uh, the glorious Third Rome, Moscow is still in existence, sir. sandorius posted:What's to stop people from converting to the 'dominant religion' for the tax benefits? Do you really want people in your church for purely mercenary purposes? What happens when people start complaining about how their religious taxes are being spent? You are seriously completely fine with making other people tithe to your church while you sit back and enjoy the tax breaks? This is why almost all of the Muslims converted in the beginning Grand Theft Autobot posted:When I think "Successful country where I would like to live" what immediately comes to mind is the loving Ottoman Empire. Great job, OP. For most of its existence, the Ottoman Empire was the best run state in Europe. It wasn't until nationalism came about that it weakened. fatherboxx posted:Somehow everyone has skipped over this gem in the OP. Everyone knows it's true, op Who What Now posted:Yeah, gently caress the poor! Are you saying that all Muslims are poor? I don't think that is true. Who What Now posted:I'm sorry for misrepresenting the theocracy that doesn't exist. I forgive you, pony friend! 
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Jul 9, 2014 16:36
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Your right op, we should move to the ottoman empire oh wait
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Jul 9, 2014 16:38
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If one goes back to the roots Christianity is radically egalitarian. Like lets draw lots to pick who will be in charge this year, share everything we have, community largely made up of widows, orphans, lepers, slaves, homosexuals and other outside of the social norms outcasts.rudatron posted:I feel a dressed-up sequel to the roman paganism can really tap into that. Well it's not like we don't have hidden state religion and groups that are devoted hidden cult gods right now all tied together with selfishness, ambition and overt desire for personal power. And it's not like they don't uh, name they their think tanks after some particularly lovely Romans drawing that comparison intentionally.
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Jul 9, 2014 16:38
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Smoking Crow posted:Are you saying that all Muslims are poor? I don't think that is true. They'll be poor once they are taxed outrageously and segregated into ghettos on order of the theocratic government.
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Jul 9, 2014 16:48
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