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Spoke a little too soon on that clip installer I guess. It's made of plastic and it's pushing a stiff metal ring into a metal piston so it kind of self-destructs as you use it. Got one clip into an assembled piston and it's just shredding itself now. Ordered another one so I guess I'll be assembling these things next weekend. So loving aggravating.
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May 14, 2023 20:40
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Redemption. Well, redemption's a little strong. Got the locks in, though. I realize now that you guys might not know what I'm talking about when I keep referring to locking clips and the installer tool. Quick rundown on that: Basically, the wire lock clip goes into a groove in the piston on either side of the pin to keep it in place. Some pistons use snap rings, some use spiral locks, some use wire locks. Mine are wire locks. I've seen all the instructions and videos online of guys installing these by hand just pushing them in with their thumbs, but those locks must have been made of skinnier wire, because when I tried that all I got was a pair of sore thumbs.  Luckily, I found a tool that's designed specifically for this job. I didn't feel like dropping $100+ on the steel version (I'm not opening a drat machine shop) so I sprung for the considerably cheaper plastic version. Basically, the diameter of the working end of the tool matches that of the clip once it's set in the piston groove so you seat one end of the clip and then kind of rock the tool around to shove it in the groove and set it in place. It's got a nice sharp lip to ride the clip and help to compress it:  I got one side done of all 8 pistons plus one more completed piston before the tool had worn down enough to where it could no longer push the clip into place. I mostly blame myself for a lack of technique causing undue stress on the tool, but it is made of plastic so that wasn't doing me any favors. Didn't take a pic of the worn out tool before I hucked it in the trash, but essentially, the working end had worn down to a single slope kinda like this:  New tool showed up yesterday in the mail so after taking care of some other stuff, I went to work assembling the rest of my pistons. First step is finding a nice place to work and set out all needed supplies. Parts, towels, lubes, solvent, and refreshments. I set up shop in the basement as the workbench in the garage is a bit crowded at the moment.  I'd already marked my pistons and rods to make sure things were matched up and pointing the right way and all that so it was purely just putting poo poo together. Lube > insert pin > set up lock > tool > done  Repeat six more times and here we are.  Tool's still in decent shape, too. I'm sure my technique improved as I did more. Next step will be getting the rings on. They're already filed to final size so it's just a matter of getting them assembled. Gonna try to get that hammered out Saturday and then maybe I'll get these things in the block on Sunday.
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May 19, 2023 13:39
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those are some drat beefy rods
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May 20, 2023 08:23
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Productive day today. Wanted to get the rings done and I did, but then I just kinda kept going. Got the rings installed in the basement and then moved back upstairs to the garage. Prepped to pull the rod bearings and give them a final clean before installation.  Then it was lube the bearings, clean the crank journals, clean the bores, lube the journals, oil the bores, and sink all the pistons.  Still had time before dinner reservations so in went the cam and on went the timing chain and oil pump.  Tomorrow will be spent playing with the windage tray and most likely massaging that for stroker clearance. Oil pan and pickup tube should be here on Monday so I'll most likely button up the bottom end once that arrives. Then it's back up top for lifters and cylinder heads. The backordered timing cover I ordered from Summit should hopefully be shipping soon. They're projecting the 29th now and it was projecting June the last time I checked, so maybe I'll get lucky and get that by the end of the month.
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May 21, 2023 03:31
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Got the windage tray/oil deflector/whatever the hell you wanna call it buttoned up today. Had to massage it a little here and there to clear the rod bolt heads due to the longer stroke, but that's pretty standard stuff. It's even called out in the book I've been referencing. Big chisel and a BFH were the tools of the day. Middle driver-side nut is left loose since it also holds down the pickup tube bracket and that should be here tomorrow. 
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May 21, 2023 17:39
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Somehow I've missed this thread for almost nine whole years. Glad I noticed it, this has been super fun. Probably helped that I could burn through it in a few days rather than experiencing it in real time. So impressive that you've been able to do all this poo poo on your own. I'm in awe. And also I'm hoping you start driving it a lot more soon.
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May 21, 2023 20:00
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ought ten posted:Somehow I've missed this thread for almost nine whole years. Glad I noticed it, this has been super fun. Probably helped that I could burn through it in a few days rather than experiencing it in real time. So impressive that you've been able to do all this poo poo on your own. I'm in awe. And also I'm hoping you start driving it a lot more soon. poo poo man, you and me both. Thanks for dropping by. Yeah, it's been a (way too)long project, but I'm proud that I've done everything outside of the machine work and re-covering the rear seat.
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May 21, 2023 20:58
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One oil pan with all the fixin's:  May go out and try to at least get the pickup tube on this evening.
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May 22, 2023 19:48
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It's a series of tubes.  Had to 'massage' the oil deflector a bit to clear the pickup tube bracket, but that wasn't really unexpected. Threw some tape on it just to keep any potential crap out of the tube while I'm monkeying with stuff. Might get the rear cover/main seal on later this week.
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May 23, 2023 14:37
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Really nice progress! I can't wait to get back into my Dart, but have to renovate the house where it's at first so I can actually stay there while working on it (and so we can use the house for family gatherings...). That engine paint looks really good.
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May 23, 2023 17:15
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Saturday was very productive. Today not so much, but tomorrow should be good. Summit finally got timing covers in stock so they shipped me one since I'd already ordered it like a month ago. Now, there are a couple super duper official J-#### GM tools to get these things installed perfectly, but if you know anything about those J-number tools, you know that I'd have almost a grand wrapped up in just those two. gently caress every bit of that. What you can do instead of using those is get the cover lined up and get all the screws started, lay a straightedge along the bottom of the block and make sure that the bottom of the timing cover is no more than .020" higher (or lower with the engine upside-down) than the block. Easy enough. For side to side, they say you can install the crank pulley/damper and then torque it down to center it side-to-side, but I just used a set of calipers between the crank snout and the seal in the cover. Snug down all the bolts finger tight and then give it some taps with a light rubber hammer until it's centered and the height is right. Piece of cake. Once the timing cover is on and torqued (along with the rear cover that I did the other day), the oil pan can go on. Torque the baffle bolts, filter bypass, filter adapter, etc., glob on a bit of RTV where the front and rear covers meet the block, and drop the pan on.  And that's it for the bottom end. Give it a flip and let's prep for heads. Lifters and lifter trays go in first. I do still have the original lifter trays from this engine, but they're cheap enough that it didn't make sense to reuse them. In this pic, you can also see the cam sensor plug that I got. The Gen III engines like this one have the cam sensor in the top of the block. Lots of guys will swap to a Gen IV setup where the cam sensor is in the timing cover and reads off the cam gear. That's what I did. Unfortunately, that leaves a bigass hole in the top of the block, but ICT makes this lovely little piece that fits in there very nicely and seals it all up.  With the lifters and trays in and torqued down, let's drop on a head. 15 bolts, stepped torque in sequence, blah blah blah, but it's on. This thing's starting to look like something.  So that was that for Saturday. I was out and about pretty much all day today, but tomorrow is wide open so I plan on getting pretty much the rest of my parts installed. Second head, valve covers, and valley cover. That'll just about empty my tub of parts, which is awesome.
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May 28, 2023 23:35
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Boaz MacPhereson posted:That'll just about empty my tub of parts, which is awesome. 
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May 29, 2023 02:13
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Second verse, same as the first.  Kinda funny, I managed to not cut myself on either head gasket like I figured I would. I got my knuckle a while back just while moving one of them around in the tub so I figured I'd slice myself to ribbons actually messing around with both of them. Not so much as a scratch. Once the heads were on, it's time for the rockers. Factory LS rockers have bronze bushings for the pivots and are essentially held together by friction. A common upgrade is replacing the bushings with bearings and slightly longer pivots with snap rings. Multiple companies make kits with all this stuff so you get a bunch of rockers, break them down, then press in all the new crap. Or you can just buy stock geometry rockers already with the upgraded bearings and rings from Melling. That's what I did. Yes they're different; Gen IV heads have offset intake rockers so you have to buy 8 of each.  Didn't grab a pic of the rockers installed because I was on a roll and forgot. They all get dunked in oil with some assembly lube in the pushrod cups and then torqued down. Then the valve covers go on and the valley cover goes on along with the knock sensors. Gen IV blocks moved the knock sensors to the outside so they get the nice pretty flat valley covers. Oh well, can't win 'em all.  And that's pretty much it. It's mostly a sealed unit now. Outside of a couple of smaller things (steam crossover, motor mounts, starter), it's pretty much just $$$ for the intake/coils/computer and $$$ for the front drive stuff (crank pulley, water pump, etc.). I've got the dipstick tube to mount but don't have a bolt for it. I'll probably pick that up from Bolt Depot with a couple other things. I am beyond happy to see this thing built.
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May 29, 2023 19:55
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drat, looks nice. i like the orange block / natural heads / wrinkle black valve covers. what are you planning for engine management? flashed stock ecu, mega/microsquirt, or one of the fancy third party kits?
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May 29, 2023 20:36
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Raluek posted:drat, looks nice. i like the orange block / natural heads / wrinkle black valve covers. Fortunately for my brain, but unfortunately for my wallet, fancy third party. I'm going for the full intake/throttle body/injectors/ecu/other doodads wombo combo. Same deal with the front accessories.
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May 30, 2023 21:57
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Boaz MacPhereson posted:Fortunately for my brain, but unfortunately for my wallet, fancy third party. I'm going for the full intake/throttle body/injectors/ecu/other doodads wombo combo. Same deal with the front accessories. drat dude that's gonna be sweet but sure not cheap  interested to see how it goes for you
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May 31, 2023 03:01
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Raluek posted:drat dude that's gonna be sweet but sure not cheap Yeah, that's kinda how it goes. I haven't actually priced out what it would take to kind of build the whole thing myself, so maybe I'll try to do that just to see where it lands. For the air/fuel/ecu, anyway. Been kinda thinking about things and I came to the realization that I don't know what all these drat holes in the cylinder heads are for. These things are lousy with threaded holes.  The blue one there goes all the way to the cooling jackets and those get a plug on one side and a temp sender on the other. That's what I'll do and use the sender to feed a temp gauge. Black ones are exhaust manifold bolt holes.The red ones are all M10x1.5 and about an inch deep. They just dead-end in the aluminum and don't connect to any chambers. One of them on the passenger side is used for the dipstick tube and I assume some of the front holes are used for accessory mounts in various factory configurations, but I'm not sure what the other red ones on the sides are for. Did some digging online and the general consensus that I found in the LS forums is "random stuff based on the vehicle they're in." I guess that sounds about right, but they had me pretty baffled for a while there. Anybody here got better answers?
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May 31, 2023 16:37
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First, gonna throw out a recommendation for getting some studs for the manifold/header bolts, it is so nice having those to hang the headers on instead of trying to hold the header and bolt it down at the same time. That top row, I think I have an engine ground strap run to at least one of them, but other than that I'm pretty sure I don't have anything bolted to them in my C10. Front holes are indeed for accessory brackets.
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May 31, 2023 16:55
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IOwnCalculus posted:First, gonna throw out a recommendation for getting some studs for the manifold/header bolts, it is so nice having those to hang the headers on instead of trying to hold the header and bolt it down at the same time. That... is a really good idea. Any recommendations on brand? Edit: Obviously, everybody loves ARP, but $150 for a set of studs is quite the snack to choke down. Guess we'll see what's out there. Boaz MacPhereson fucked around with this message at 17:19 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 17:14
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I got a set from Alper.
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May 31, 2023 17:39
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IOwnCalculus posted:I got a set from Alper. How'd that stainless nut on stainless stud work out in practice? Any issues there?
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May 31, 2023 17:47
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Boaz MacPhereson posted:
For the red holes I'm pretty sure you're right, they're all just for various accessory configurations. The front ones are for PS/AC Compressor/Alternator/whatever brackets on the front accessory drive, an the ones on the side are for Plug wire holders or manifold heat shields, or whatever else. I'd put some plugs in them (ie set screws with some liberal antisieze) just to keep the holes clear if you do need to use them
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May 31, 2023 17:49
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Commodore_64 posted:How'd that stainless nut on stainless stud work out in practice? Any issues there? Haven't had any reason to remove them yet.
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May 31, 2023 17:52
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IOwnCalculus posted:I got a set from Alper. Now that's pretty wildly different, but I wonder what kind of alloy they're using. I can get basically the same thing as those (studs+serrated flange nuts) from Bolt Depot in 316 stainless for just under $40. 18-8 stainless is just under $18. Interesting stuff. boxen posted:For the red holes I'm pretty sure you're right, they're all just for various accessory configurations. The front ones are for PS/AC Compressor/Alternator/whatever brackets on the front accessory drive, an the ones on the side are for Plug wire holders or manifold heat shields, or whatever else. That's not a bad idea. Boaz MacPhereson fucked around with this message at 18:41 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 18:38
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There's always the Stainless bolt/stud and bronze nut option, though I don't know about the long term clamping ability with that unless you were going to use Nordlocks or similar washer.
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Jun 1, 2023 03:11
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Been picking up little things here and there. Got some mounts (and plates) and a starter so I got all that on this morning while it was still halfway cool out. I realize now after taking this picture that I still need to take the tap with the cylinder numbers off... Ordered some header studs and nuts so I'll have those on hand when it's time for that.
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Jul 29, 2023 17:57
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Progress on the engine build has slowed dramatically since I've had to drop a bunch of money on other frivolous bullshit this fall like a furnace and a water heater. I've started work on another thing I've wanted to do for a while, though. Moving the battery. Got a box and some cables and some ends and some other doodads and started moving poo poo around. Started with a pile of parts and got to this point yesterday:  Hit a bit of a wall as I don't have a drill bit big enough to make holes for those bigass cable grommets. I'll pick that up tomorrow and see if I can make a bit more progress. Then I'll get the car up in the air and work on running the cable north to the engine bay. Once there, I've got a power distribution block to split it off to the starter and also run the alternator feed to. I'll have one more available output to eventually feed a little auxiliary relay block that I'll build. The nicest change will be having my battery cables actually be the correct color. Thanks, previous owner!
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Nov 23, 2023 18:53
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don't put any plugs in the motor unless they are junk to plug the holes until after the headers are in and 100% mounted. They can crack a plug insanely easily then you'll be hunting a misfire as what happened to me.
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Nov 24, 2023 17:39
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Mr-Spain posted:don't put any plugs in the motor unless they are junk to plug the holes until after the headers are in and 100% mounted. They can crack a plug insanely easily then you'll be hunting a misfire as what happened to me. Good call. I've got plugs in it now but I'll be sure to pull them before I go swinging header flanges around.
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Nov 24, 2023 18:34
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Last weekend was cold as hell so I didn't get anything done. Went and picked up the step bit and a few other needed greeblies last night to try to make a little progress this weekend. Napped off a killer headache and then went out and put a couple more holes in the car. Must have been the right size because the grommets were a pain in the rear end to get seated properly. I think maybe I'll go around them with some RTV or something just for a little peace of mind, but they really shouldn't go anywhere with the cable secured on both ends. Ground cable is totally done - bolted to the frame rail under the trunk - and the positive is ready to get run up to the engine bay. Got a bunch of stainless adel clamps and some self tappers so I'm going to try to get the car up in the air tomorrow so I can knock that out.
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Dec 2, 2023 23:18
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Welp, I got the car up in the air and very quickly realized that my drill would not fit between the frame rail and the bodywork to run the screws in for the clamps. I have a cordless ratchet - let's try that. Fitment was totally fine, but 250 rpm left me with nothing but a little divot where the screw was turning and a couple of sore forearms from shoving on the drat thing. That was the end of that day. Time to look for a right-angle drill. I could have went and picked up an M12 right-angle, but I really didn't feel like dropping a hundred bucks on that when I already have an M12 drill that's worked well for me so far. Did a bit more looking around and rental places nearby have some right-angles but they're 1/2 inch monsters that are probably just as compact as my regular drill. Eventually my searching took me to Harbor Freight and they've got a 3/8 Bauer right-angle for 40 bucks. Advertised 1300 RPM? Sure, let's do it. Chucked up my shortest 5/16" nut driver and it clears. Just. Then it was just a matter of routing wire and spinning home screws. Yes, it clears both the spring shackle and the exhaust hanger. It's not touching any moving parts.   Once I made it far enough north, it was time to pick a spot for the power distribution block. Got that tucked in and that's the main battery run done. Banged out a couple 4 gauge lengths for the alternator feed and the starter wire and that's the battery moved. The wires are even the right colors, now.  I've got one more open slot in my power block that I'll use to power a little relay panel that I'm gonna build to run some accessories. I'll probably need to make another alternator feed wire once I get the LQ in, but I've got like 20 more feet of wire and plenty of ends. No big deal.
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Dec 9, 2023 22:58
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So I was doing some thinking earlier and I don't think I'm quite done with the battery move. The ground used to run from the negative post straight to the alternator bracket. Now the ground runs from negative post to the chassis and the engine has rubber mounts. I think I should probably run a ground from the engine to the frame. I've got lots of extra cable and ends so I think I'll figure out a good spot for that this coming weekend and bang that out.
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Dec 11, 2023 02:27
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Ok, NOW I'm done with the battery move. Knocked up a ground cable real quick out of the old positive cable (that was black) and some new ends. 4 gauge should be plenty for a ground strap. Ran it from the bellhousing bolt behind the starter to a fuel line clamp bolt. Cable's about 9-10 inches long. Sprinkle in some star washers and it's all done. Piece of cake. 
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Dec 17, 2023 21:22
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More goodies inbound. 
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Feb 24, 2024 02:37
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Control, the goodies have landed.  Ordered on Friday, dropped off on Sunday. Good stuff. Full front accessories set. Couldn't do a whole lot with it as I'm waiting on a tool (damper installation tool, should be here today) and it didn't show up until like 4:00, but I did get everything unpacked and just made sure that all parts were present. Installed the NPT to hose adapter for the steam line vent in the back of the pump. This will connect to the barb on the steam lines between the heads with some 1/4" heater hose. I'll need to see how much I need once it gets mounted, but it should be less than a foot.  Then the pump housing gets flipped and the water pump gets installed. Apparently this is a GenV-style pump where the housing is fairly permanent and then the spinny part with the impeller is its own unit that can be replaced. It's pretty nice. Uses a GM gasket as well so it's nice to know I can just go buy this thing if I need to. I saw an old review or two online that said that the stamped impeller vanes had come off the shaft and caused some problems so I figured I'd take a look at things when I got it and see if maybe I could stake it for some cheap insurance, but it looks like there was a revision at some point as there were couple tack welds holding things in place. Good stuff. I took a picture of this and how it goes together, but apparently my phone decided to eat that picture so I've just got a picture of after it got installed.  Installed the hardline on the power steering pump as it goes on before the pulley gets installed. Need to go borrow/rent a pulley installer once it's time for this to go on. I'll probably go do that after it gets mounted. Low pressure return inlet is on the back side of the reservoir there and the high pressure line is now -6 AN so I'll head to the local hydraulic hose joint when the time comes and have them bang me up a new feed line.  Like I mentioned, damper install tool should be here today so I'll probably head out there after work and get that done and maybe get a couple other things bolted on as well. Overall, a pleasant day. 
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Feb 26, 2024 14:33
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Crank install tool showed up as expected and the weather has been alarmingly nice so I went back out to get some of this poo poo hung off the block. Install sequence for LS crank pulleys (for those not in the know): - Get pulley started with install tool - don't forget to lube your washers - Run it home with the old crank bolt (or a new one if you bought a second one for this exact purpose like I did) and torque to 240 ft/lbs. Side note - I'm gonna have to rent a torque wrench when I get the PS pulley installer because mine only goes to 150. - Yank that bolt out and install new bolt, torque to 59 pounds + 125 degrees. So it's on there now, but not fully "Installed". Probably get that done this coming weekend.  With that on, time for the water pump manifold. Six bolts, snicker snack.  Next up is heater hose fittings and the thermostat. This setup has 2 options for hose placement - side of the pump or the bottom, depending on your hose layout. You can see the 2 plugs they included installed in the bottom there.  Alternator's in next. 2 bolts. It occurs to me that I'm going to need to redo that batter feed cable since this is going to the other side of the engine. Oh well. Still got lots of wire and ends left.  Power steering pump and reservoir. Again, need a pulley installer.  Then on goes the AC compressor and the belt tensioner. Tensioner is actually a Gates model so it can be easily changed in the future if needed. There are quite a few standard GM parts or similar so it's nice to know I won't be totally hosed with proprietary stuff in the future.  So yeah, it's looking like something now. Need a couple tools and then I can throw the belt on and call the front drive done. Oh, got a nice cover that goes on the tensioner, but that obviously has to wait until after the belt goes on.
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Feb 27, 2024 18:17
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Coming together really nice. Love to see it.
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Feb 27, 2024 18:22
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Borrowed some tools and got the bolt torqued, swapped, and re-torqued and installed the PS pulley.  Then on went the belt and the cute little tensioner cover. It's a bit silly, but it does make it look nice.  And that's it for the front accessories. Nice to have that done. Next big bite will probably be trans install goodies and then we'll see what happens.
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Mar 2, 2024 21:33
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Looking good!
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Mar 2, 2024 22:30
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lol as someone who's played with LS a bunch in truck applications and nothing else, the car accessories always have kind of an uncanny look to em cause it's all the same stuff just packed down where it should be rather than all stacked way up top. Having em in matte black on an orange block all 60s-like looks excellent though.
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Mar 3, 2024 06:34
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