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nimby posted:This is terrible because even just one person playing against you in galaxy creation or the first crucial turns can and will ruin the game for you. Obviously if players get tunnel vision and irrationally hate on you more than makes sense, sure. Most gamers, especially ones excited by a 12 hour game, will be able to act with some degree of subtlety and balance. Besides, convincing people that yes, you were ahead, but now another guy is we need to get him is always a big part of space diplomacy. That's just always the nature of the game, with whichever 8 you choose.
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Jul 23, 2014 23:18
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I feel generally that it is better to organically create a villain through the course of a game rather than have one randomly decided at the start.
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Jul 24, 2014 08:47
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Plus, if you play with the original cards you have Warfare I, which is arguably even worse than Imperial I.
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Jul 24, 2014 12:39
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Love this game, this is the most hard core board game.
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Jul 24, 2014 13:22
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Hey me and my group are going to play a 3 player game this saturday and then probably a 4+ player game next saturday. I recently got all of the expansions, so i'm trying to basically kitchen sink them all into the 3 player game. Is there anything I should watch out for when doing this? Will I be dumb by replacing all the strategy tiles from their "1" versions to their "2" versions? Also I was going to use the 3 player map in here unless I was put on to a better one. here is the preset we will be using.
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Jul 24, 2014 15:49
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KongMu posted:Hey me and my group are going to play a 3 player game this saturday and then probably a 4+ player game next saturday. 1) If "going play a game" means "going to play our first game then do not kitchen sink it. Stick mainly to the basics. 2) Go ahead and use the II strategy cards. The original set is bad. 3) Three player games are basically not recommended ever, they're kind of dumb. However it could at least familiarize most of you with the rules before you play your real game with four players.
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Jul 24, 2014 17:43
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Should clarify that we have played before. A 6 player game. Once. And it was without any expansions. Our main mission for this weekend is to familiarize ourselves more with the rules for the next weekend. A 3 player game shouldn't be that terrible, right? KongMu fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Jul 24, 2014 |
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Jul 24, 2014 18:44
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KongMu posted:Should clarify that we have played before. A 6 player game. Once. And it was without any expansions. It's OK, but just be aware the politics are pretty one dimensional and can degenerate.
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Jul 24, 2014 19:00
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hoobajoo posted:It's OK, but just be aware the politics are pretty one dimensional and can degenerate. Into an evening of unbounded passion! Clothing discarded, galaxy tiles all askew... Just don't be selfish. Your dreadnought doesn't always have to be parked in the middle. You need to be generous and patient. A sense of humor always helps. Above all, don't be afraid to ask for what *you* need to get to 10 victory points first. If you're shy about your needs, that's when an amazing experience can become awkward. It's ok to put a fleet on someone's wormhole without asking, but don't fly through it until you're sure it's ok with them. You'll figure out the rest as you go.
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Jul 24, 2014 21:42
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3-player games aren't terrible, but definitely not optimal. How many people here regularly mix the strategy cards? I'm inferring from a lot of posts that people play either/or with regard to the sets. My group regularly uses a mix, and in fact usually changes the mix from game to game.
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Jul 24, 2014 22:58
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KongMu posted:I recently got all of the expansions, so i'm trying to basically kitchen sink them all into the 3 player game. Is there anything I should watch out for when doing this? Will I be dumb by replacing all the strategy tiles from their "1" versions to their "2" versions? Do: Use the new objectives, put the old objectives into permanent storage. This will make your game less of a turtlefest. Use facilities. You guys will need to learn when it is opportune to build them and when the opportunity cost is higher than the future income. Use Mercenaries. They've got fun abilities and can swing battles. Do NOT Use flagships. In a 3-player galaxy they'll be a trap. Some are amazingly powerful, but you'll lack the resources to build them and a fleet. Use racial techs. For the same reason as flagships. Use Space Mines. They are super-fun in big games, but a 3-player galaxy is too small, they'd become a fun-sink. Use the expanded politics system. With 3 players, whoever has the best spy/bodyguard will completely dictate politics. My group always plays with the following set-up: Leadership Diplomacy II Assembly Production Trade III Warfare II Technology II Bureaucracy. I'd play with Assembly II, but I have a seriously AP-prone player and I don't want to add 20 minutes per vote into the game.
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Jul 24, 2014 23:14
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TipTow posted:How many people here regularly mix the strategy cards? I'm inferring from a lot of posts that people play either/or with regard to the sets. My group regularly uses a mix, and in fact usually changes the mix from game to game. Well, you can swap out Diplo/Diplo II, Trade/Trade II/Trade III, Tech/Tech II, and Warfare/Warfare II in either set without loving it up, but the combo Init/Imp (II)/Logistics/Politics (II) must be substituted entirely for Leadership/Bureaucracy/Assembly (II)/Production because of the various things they do being shuffled around the numbers in a way that only makes sense as a set. So if you're a sane person, you're going to run Leadership/Bureaucracy/Assembly/Production and you can choose which of the others to put in. Diplo: Diplo 2 is clearly better. I cannot possibly imagine taking Diplo 1 over any of the other strategy cards without a bunch of bonus tokens on them. If you want your SCs to be at least somewhat balanced, run Diplo 2. Trade: Why would anyone ever want to trade with you if they had to spend precious triangles to get their money? Trade 1 is clearly underpowered also. Trade 2 or 3 is the way to go. Tech: Tech is bad after a certain point in the game. If you are constantly spending 6/8 resources on tech instead of building fleets, you lose. If you play with Tech 1, I can't really imagine anyone buying tech (apart from the free one if they take Tech) after round 3 or so. That's boring. I much prefer Tech 2, so people might get a bit more tech late in the game. Warfare: This one is a lot closer; I think I prefer Warfare 2 but wouldn't object to playing Warfare 1. So, long story short, I can't really imagine wanting to play with any set that isn't just "the Shattered Empire set." Except possibly swapping out Warfare.
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Jul 24, 2014 23:15
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DontMockMySmock posted:Warfare: This one is a lot closer; I think I prefer Warfare 2 but wouldn't object to playing Warfare 1. Warfare I is stupid strong. In round 1 you can use it to expand like a locust swarm if you played well during galaxy creation. In further rounds you can get away with a single Death Fleet. The worst part is that you can take back the Command Counter, meaning your first strike doesn't really cost you anything other than casualties (which should be low if you are playing smart). Warfare II has its own set of issues, but at least it is manageable if you know what to do.
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Jul 24, 2014 23:57
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I just finished a marathon 11-hour game. It was close as gently caress. I was playing Winnu vs. Naalu, Sol, and Arborec. Crazy poo poo goes down and everyone ends up at ~8 points on the last round. I am slightly ahead at 9 points, while the Arborec have Bureaucracy and are about to get 2 more points for the win. Because I was in the lead earlier, I got stomped really hard and ended up with 2 ships left, but I had rebuilt a meager fleet. Now, I've been sitting on a really juicy action card for literally the entire game (it was my very first action card). But in order to make it work, I have to Cultural Crisis the Naalu. They lose their psychic abilities (turn order number = 0, +1 to fighters, and the ability to retreat before the battle even begins) and I take Leadership so I go first in the round. So before the Naalu or anyone else can do anything to gently caress me up, I take my lovely fleet with destroyers and other crappy things and fly over to a small fleet that contains the Naalu flagship, the Matriarch (which is relatively undefended after an attack the Naalu had made against my fleet last round). He can't pyschic retreat, so I get to take some shots at him. Fortunately my lovely things don't fail miserably and I destroy the flagship before he can retreat. And so I play the Moment of Triumph, which I have been holding since round 1, and win the game.  (Moment of Triumph, for those who don't know, is "play after you blow up a flagship or war sun: get 1 victory point.")
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Jul 27, 2014 12:12
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And nobody sabotaged it? Or threw a spy onto it? Nice victory, one of the better ways to win 
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Jul 27, 2014 16:42
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nimby posted:And nobody sabotaged it? Or threw a spy onto it? Nice victory, one of the better ways to win Fortunately not; a lot of crazy poo poo had been happening so what sabotages there were hit other things in the previous couple rounds.
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Jul 27, 2014 21:07
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So our three player game went well. The map set up on the link I provided earlier made for a very aggressive game. I ended up losing pretty bad due to some serious goofs on my part, but fun was had by all. I do have two questions. We couldnt remember the following: 1. Can the player using the strategy tile he picked actually use the secondary ability as normal by paying a strategic allocation counter for it? I.E. Universities player uses technology primary ability then spends a token to use the secondary ability of the technology tile. Is this legal? 2. We couldnt remember what all trade goods were used for. We know they can be used as a substitute for resources but can they be used for influence as well? The rule book is lovely and I can't seem to find clarification.
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Jul 27, 2014 22:24
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You can only use the primary of your own strategy cards. Trade goods can be used as influence for buying counters and objectives, or other instances where you pay x influence. They can't be used as votes.
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Jul 27, 2014 22:37
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KongMu posted:So our three player game went well. The map set up on the link I provided earlier made for a very aggressive game. I ended up losing pretty bad due to some serious goofs on my part, but fun was had by all. I do have two questions. We couldnt remember the following: 1. No. You can only do the secondary if the primary ability says you can (Leadership, Diplomacy II b option). 2. They can be spent as influence as well, for the purposes of Leadership/Logistics secondary and Diplomacy II secondary, as well as "spend influence" objectives and anything else where you spend influence (but not things where you count and don't spend influence, such as voting on political stuff).
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Jul 27, 2014 23:27
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KongMu posted:1. Can the player using the strategy tile he picked actually use the secondary ability as normal by paying a strategic allocation counter for it? I.E. Universities player uses technology primary ability then spends a token to use the secondary ability of the technology tile. Is this legal? DontMockMySmock posted:1. No. You can only do the secondary if the primary ability says you can (Leadership, Diplomacy II b option). Hold up, hold up. This is technically correct but wrong in regards to KongMu's specific example. It is true that normally you can only execute the secondary ability of a strategy card after the primary if the card specifically says it's allowed. However the example KongMu used is whether the Jol-Nar can use both the primary and the secondary ability of Technology, and they can. The Jol Nar usage of it is a special case clarified in the errata. They can absolutely buy a technology as normal from the secondary, and then use their racial ability to snag one from the primary as well. From the Fantasy Flight errata... quote:A: When the Jol-Nar player resolves the secondary ability of DontMockMySmock is correct about the general rule regarding primary/secondary abilities, but it doesn't apply to the specific case that KongMu mentioned.
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Jul 27, 2014 23:56
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Chomp8645 posted:Hold up, hold up. This is technically correct but wrong in regards to KongMu's specific example. It is true that normally you can only execute the secondary ability of a strategy card after the primary if the card specifically says it's allowed. However the example KongMu used is whether the Jol-Nar can use both the primary and the secondary ability of Technology, and they can. The Jol Nar usage of it is a special case clarified in the errata. They can absolutely buy a technology as normal from the secondary, and then use their racial ability to snag one from the primary as well. The Jol-Nar ability only works when you do the secondary ability of the Tech card. If the Jol-Nar player picks Tech, then the ability does not function.
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Jul 28, 2014 00:01
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DontMockMySmock posted:The Jol-Nar ability only works when you do the secondary ability of the Tech card. If the Jol-Nar player picks Tech, then the ability does not function. You're right, I didn't read that the Jol Nar was the one who chose the technology strategy card, probably because it should never happen. Still, important to note that exception.
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Jul 28, 2014 00:42
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To clarify, we were confused all game and allowed even the player that picked the tile and executed the primary ability of a tile to also execute the secondary ability. Which apparently is incorrect. hosed up a major rule this game. Oh well. That's what these small scale games are for. We will be playing a 4 player + game on Saturday and I certainly wont let that one slide next time. In the case of the universities of jol nar they only really benefit if they DO NOT choose the tech tile and let another player take it, benefiting from the primary ability for free and only then being able to execute the secondary ability as well.
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Jul 28, 2014 02:40
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Eh, they still need to pay a CC to use the secondary, have no control over the timing of tech and someone else gets tech for free. Plus there is a card that lets you,execute your own secondary. If rich and lucky enough, the Jol-Nar can research 12 techs in 1 go.
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Jul 28, 2014 03:13
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nimby posted:Eh, they still need to pay a CC to use the secondary, have no control over the timing of tech and someone else gets tech for free. There are absolutely no conditions in which the Jol Nar should regularly choose technology themselves. Maybe once in a blue moon if they are last pick and nobody has taken it yet. That's it.
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Jul 28, 2014 03:21
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Oh I agree, it's just that there are times when they do.
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Jul 28, 2014 04:51
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So I'm setting up for Twilight Imperium game next weekend. I have the hare brained idea that at the end of the game, I'm going to take it and spin it into a roleplaying game set in the resulting universe. There is alledgedly a Twilight Imperium roleplay system but I'll probably just use one of the generics, maybe FATE or Cortex.
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Aug 1, 2014 20:16
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ZorajitZorajit posted:So I'm setting up for Twilight Imperium game next weekend. I have the hare brained idea that at the end of the game, I'm going to take it and spin it into a roleplaying game set in the resulting universe. There is alledgedly a Twilight Imperium roleplay system but I'll probably just use one of the generics, maybe FATE or Cortex. Well, I mean that definitely sounds unusual but I guess if the group is all into the lore then why not? Especially if you're just doing a "plug and play" of an existing RPG system and not making your own. THAT would be hair brained.
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Aug 1, 2014 20:24
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Rogue Trader but fluff everything to TI? Probably too much work, but probably the best fit.
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Aug 2, 2014 00:58
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ZorajitZorajit posted:So I'm setting up for Twilight Imperium game next weekend. I have the hare brained idea that at the end of the game, I'm going to take it and spin it into a roleplaying game set in the resulting universe. There is allegedly a Twilight Imperium roleplay system but I'll probably just use one of the generics, maybe FATE or Cortex.
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Aug 2, 2014 02:04
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Pierzak posted:Where do you even find the more in-depth fluff? It's not like there's much of it in the boardgames. I think TI is just dune with lion dudes as the Sardaukar or Atreiades or whatever. The planet in the center is Dune. It's part of why there's this diplomatic angle to what's going on that is part of getting victory points. Also the other TI universe game, where you're on the surface of the planet jockeying for position is a rerelease of a Dune game. Rogue trader can be just about anything. It's focused on generating random encounters with human worlds, but if you ignore the chaos side of things, I think you could bend it however you like without needing to do odious stat conversion. The main thing that makes it different than Dune is that I don't think in that universe there's private shipping as we conceive of it. The navigator guild is your one-stop shop for all travel. At least until the sexy mind control ladies from beyond the galaxy come back. Or the computer planet reappears. I don't recommend reading that far. This might sound hokey, and it depends on whether you like palladium stuff, but I could picture the Turtles in Space RPG being a great place for a TI adventure. Or Phase world, I guess, if you want more meat, but the TMNT in space book was always great because it was kind of built around the idea of creating weird creatures and the built in ones were really fun--The Triceratons and Krang aliens were unique and weird, with rules like how triceratons would go into comas to adapt to alien atmospheres before invasions, and how the krang guys had different kinds of utility robots they would ride around in.
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Aug 2, 2014 02:22
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ZorajitZorajit posted:So I'm setting up for Twilight Imperium game next weekend. I have the hare brained idea that at the end of the game, I'm going to take it and spin it into a roleplaying game set in the resulting universe. There is alledgedly a Twilight Imperium roleplay system but I'll probably just use one of the generics, maybe FATE or Cortex.
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Aug 2, 2014 02:51
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TheCosmicMuffet posted:I think TI is just dune with lion dudes as the Sardaukar or Atreiades or whatever. The planet in the center is Dune. It's part of why there's this diplomatic angle to what's going on that is part of getting victory points.
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Aug 2, 2014 13:00
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Played a game today, would people actually be interested in a writeup? It was a pretty interesting game.
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Aug 3, 2014 08:49
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Absolutely.
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Aug 3, 2014 10:29
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God I love this game. Me and my friend tend to play one 6 or 8 player game every six months or so, though it takes quite a lot of organising. One game a few years ago we filmed in time lapse which is here, if anyone's curious: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1P7DUug3Bs Fluffwise there's books written in the universe isn't there? I thought I saw some somewhere once. Eh, it's just Rome anyway. Sardine Wit fucked around with this message at 14:44 on Aug 3, 2014 |
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Aug 3, 2014 14:42
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Elyv posted:Played a game today, would people actually be interested in a writeup? It was a pretty interesting game. Definitely, and always. TI is great for narratives.
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Aug 3, 2014 14:46
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Sorry about taking so long to post this, I've been busy the last few days. So the game had 5 players of medium experience(~6 games) and one with more. I was the Arborec, to my left were the Naalu, to their left the Winnu, to their left Sol, to the left Muaat, and to their left Jol-Nar. We were playing with Guardians of Mecatol Rex(does anyone not play with this?), Mercenaries, Flagships, artifacts, diplomats, mechs, and random things on planets and space. In addition, we also had a pruned political deck(it's an experiment we're trying, where we took out a lot of the assembly cards that are irrelevant 95% of the time), look at 2 secret objectives and pick one, look at 2 races and pick one(Ysaril banned, of course). Notable things about the galaxy: planet light, especially production light. The ring around Mecatol Rex consisted of 4 empty space, 1 Ion Storm, and 1 system with actual planets. Also we had 4 artifacts and they all turned out to be real. Turn 1: Fairly quiet. Notable things: Winnu lose 2 cruisers to a single neutral fighter, Arborec get their representative assassinated but use the secondary of diplomacy to take a neutral 0/3 planet near Jol-Nar. This annoys the Jol-Nar player a lot, and he responds by building PDSes and upgrading them, preparing to take the planet. Early midgame: Muaat gets their War Sun damaged in a fight with neutrals and Jol-Nar feels that they see an opportunity and go to take it out. They succeed, but lose their entire fleet in the process. As a result, Sol and the Arborec sweep through the area, leaving Jol-Nar with only a few systems and the Muaat with 2 planets and a trade station. No one really wants to eliminate Muaat, though, and Jol-Nar is turtled behind 4 PDSes with Deep Space Cannons. Meanwhile, the Naalu skirmish with both the Arborec and Winnu, attempting to gain some territory(he was in an awkward position, as there was an ion storm between him and Mecatol Rex). The “Publicize Weapon Schematics” law also comes up at some point in here, giving everyone access to War Suns. Midgame: Objectives start to come up, most interestingly “blockade a space dock”. The Naalu blockade one of the Winnu space docks and the Arborec attempt to break the blockade(so they can blockade it themselves) but fail. Later, the Arborec attack one of the Naalu space docks, blockading it with intention of leaving with Skilled Retreat on the next turn. However, when the Naalu attack, they also have the card that stops action cards from being played, and it results in both fleets being destroyed. Meanwhile, the Muaat player has put himself in a decent position again, as Sol has been focusing on the Arborec and Winnu, and the Arborec fleet was destroyed in the aforementioned battle with the Naalu. At this point, Sol and Arborec are leading, with Muaat and Naalu behind them, and then Winnu and then Jol-Nar. Lategame: Winnu are able to grab Naalu's home system, effectively eliminating them from contention. Sol, Arborec, and Muaat all accomplish their secret objectives, pulling all three far in front. Despite a couple of opportunities to grab Bureaucracy, the Arborec are not able to convert into points, although they almost get a win on the second to last turn. Muaat lose most of their fleet to the Lord of Mecatol Rex political card(all units in the home system of the controller of Mecatol Rex die and the controller gains a VP). Last turn: Sol is at 9 VPs with Bureaucracy, Muaat at 8, Arborec at 7. There are 4 artifacts on the board, an insta-win objective(capture two home systems), and no one has managed to get the “destroy a space dock” mission done. Arborec move to get it done, forcing Muaat to grab Sol's artifact so that he can't just flip Bureaucracy and instantly win. Sol responds by attacking Winnu and destroying one of their space docks, setting himself up for the victory next turn. However, then the Jol-Nar player activates Production, and the Muaat player sees an opportunity. He builds some ships and sails them to a space artifact which means that the controller needs one less VP to win, stealing the win from under Sol's nose. He then proceeds to exultantly jump out of his seat, saying, “I am the Lord of Mecatol Rex!” It was a great game, and all of us were surprised that, after his numerous setbacks, the Muaat player won.
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Aug 6, 2014 03:49
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We've had a couple house rules proposed and I wanted to bounce these off some other folks. I'm not really opposed but want to know that I'm not overlooking something. These are all combat rules. 1) Undamaged Dreadnaughts get two shots. The player that proposed this wanted to balance out the usefulness of Dreads, especially against cruisers with mines. Another player suggested that this was too much of a boost, especially to races that already get bonuses to dreads, but thought that it would be alright after a player has War Suns. I'm inclined to approve this one as is, I don't like the extra bookkeeping of the second option. 2) Shock Troops don't "level down." Proposed as to simplify bookkeeping and make shock troops a little more special. Mostly I'm just concerned that I'm missing some potential wild cheat this would enable, the shock troop rules always struck me as having that as a weird caveat. 3) Mercenaries don't turn planets neutral. As much as I like the idea that a mercenary army just up and starts pillaging your planet the rule that a mercenary left alone on a planet strips it back to neutralaity just rubs me the wrong way.
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Aug 7, 2014 21:46
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Elyv posted:“I am the Lord of Mecatol Rex!” Nice writeup! I love how this game can seesaw wildly in the final few turns.
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Aug 7, 2014 22:13
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