Uber vs Taxis: The New Urban Warfare

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Uber vs Taxis: The New Urban Warfare

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

hobbesmaster posted:

Right, Uber is a car service not a taxi service.

Quite honestly I'd be more than happy to condemn Uber's regulatory skirting if it wasn't for the fact that, at base both livery cab and taxi services in NYC are just truly awful with no real accountability.

When I have to resort to trickery and threats of reporting their badge just to get a taxi to go into Brooklyn the system is broken.

# ¿ Jul 22, 2014 22:27

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ May 18, 2024 17:15

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

axeil posted:

I think that's the real crux of the issue. If Uber was disrupting and industry that people generally like and runs well (grocery stores?) by skirting regulations people would be much more up in arms over it. Since, at least here in DC, the taxi system is an absolute mess people don't really mind Uber skirting the regulations because they get what they want/need (cab-like transportation).

My curiosity is this: does anyone live in a city that has a pretty well functioning cab system? What's the reaction to Uber there?

If you're using a highway with EZ-Pass or another transponder system you can make it mandatory, like Montgomery County's Inter-county Connector.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryland_Route_200

I'd be more than happy to keep the medallion system if there was also a brutal culling system where the bottom 20% rating of cabs lose their medallion every year.

Make it like Yelp or something where people have to justify their ire and its hard to game.

You can definitely justify the current system on an urban planning level, but id much rather take a slower car with more congestion than one with a driver that is just poo poo

# ¿ Jul 22, 2014 23:56

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Trabisnikof posted:

However bad taxis may be, doesn't mean Uber shouldn't be regulated. It doesn't meant uber gets a free pass to break the law.

I definitely agree with this. My idea wasn't serious, but rather trying to point out the opics of the situation.

Its like that whole DMV stereotype conservatives pull out to slander the government. By and large my experience with the DMV has been positive so the claim rings false. You just have to wait due to volume.

On the other hand any new yorker (and yes, ny is more relevant, because cabs are like a secondary public transport here, not a luxury) can go on and on about horrors stories with cabs.

What I'm saying is that telling people to suck it up because of regulatory fairness and urban planning is not exactly very enticing.

For example my black friends like Uber because they actually can get a ride. What are you going to do? Tell them to suck it up and deal with racist cabs because of regulatory fairness?

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 14:26

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

api call girl posted:

Well yeah, it'd be a nice thing if they actually spent the cash to make sure of things like their drivers having valid driver's licenses, but not having to do that is basically their business model. Get hosed, Uber, and gently caress your "optics".

Guessing your not black then. Nice to have that privilege of being able to hail a cab. Must be really nice

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 14:46

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

api call girl posted:

Listen to yourself: "sure my driver might not have had passed any sort of background check, or even have any form of insurance or a driver's license, but he has google maps and at least he'll pick me up!"

Uh yeah, I suppose you got me the there. I mean, what's your point here? That regulatory capture is more important than what amounts to de facto jim crow? If that's the case just own up to it.

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 15:24

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Condiv posted:

C'mon dude, someone already posted evidence of structural racism at work with uber. All an uber driver has to do is not take any fares that have black sounding names. Plus, if they're really racist they can drive by the pickup location, and if they see a black person, cancel the pickup.

Except all my black friends say Uber is way better than actually trying to hail a cab. I feel like like there's a "Don't trust your lying eyes" effect here where all the white posters are trying to force an equivalence, and discounting actual black people's experience.

I guess my question for those that say Uber is as racist is that do you actually have black friends? What have they said about it?

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 19:50

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Condiv posted:

The three anonymous internet posts show that racist uber drivers use the same techniques as racist car services/cabbies. Would you like to post some evidence that the population of cabbies are more virulently racist than the general population, or some way that uber makes the problem of the racist driver less of a problem?

My random theory is that its probably not so much there's less overall racist, but that the service itself makes it possible to match up non-racist drivers with minority client far more easily.

That or the accountability, or "naming" effect actually mitigates the expression of racism in a way that pairing up an anonymous driver and an anonymous client doesn't.

Condiv posted:

My black friends and I take the metro/buses. Never really discuss taxis. Of course, I live in paris so...

Then why are you arguing a point in an issue you have no experience with? I don't go into the French thread and argue that you should embrace our healthcare system do I?

Thundercracker fucked around with this message at 20:04 on Jul 23, 2014

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 20:01

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Trabisnikof posted:

So are these people lying?

Just because Uber isn't as bad as cabs in ___ doesn't mean they can't also provide easy tools for drivers to act on racial bias.

Do you realize that none of the article s you posted actually refuted my point. Half of them didn't even posit an experience, and instead engaged in speculative opining.

As I posted above, I'm not saying Uber drivers are less racist, but that the very service could let them aboid the racist drivers.

Anyway, you still haven't actually answered my question, and instead had to trawl google. What do your black friends say? I mean do you even have any black friends?

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 20:18

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Trabisnikof posted:

Like I said earlier, Uber doesn't service my neighborhood so we haven't had much experience here.

Do you think Uber should have to follow the laws of the communities they operate in even if the law is "unfair"?

I've made my stance fairly clear. I believe that having a taxi service that actually services minorities and has a degree of accountability that makes the experience not a poo poo show, due to cab's monopolies is more important than any fairness in regulatory capturing.

You will disagree, but I think my point isn't outrageous.

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 20:30

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Trabisnikof posted:

You didn't answer my question, do you think Uber should follow the law if they deem it "unfair"?

Yes, if the law is actually unfair. Jesus, I feel like we're arguing the civil rights movement again, and you're telling me it's wrong to break the rules even if it's to sit at a lunch counter

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 20:37

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Trabisnikof posted:

Holy poo poo, so Uber illegally operating at SFO airport is the new Montgomery Bus Boycott in your mind.

Says the guy who's apparently never talked to a single black person about this. Let's hear more speculation from the white guy on how Uber offers nothing to the black community

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 20:43

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Trabisnikof posted:

The opposite idea that companies should only have to follow the laws they agree with is more moronic than the strawman you're making. Corporations aren't true people, people can engage in civil disobedience but if we allow cooperation to do the same we've created an end-run around all regulation.

Here's what I'm talking about when I say Uber has bad political campaigning skills: http://valleywag.gawker.com/uber-is-spamming-seattle-with-unwanted-phone-calls-1532889692

I'd okay with basically like jury nullification by society. Like the above poster said and I've said multiple times, this wouldn't be an issue if there was any support for the cab companies.

Besides, you're point about corporate activism is totally bogus. Many corporations flouted Jim Crow laws as a form of protest in the past. Would you apply your logic to them?

# ¿ Jul 23, 2014 21:46

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

api call girl posted:

The best part is comparing the craven attempt to avoid accountability and liability in an ill-conceived effort to subsidize white flight taxi edition ... to Civil Rights era demonstrations.

In reality, Uber is burning through cash at a rate that exceeds $25 million a month ... doing what? Certainly not any of the actual work that goes into operating and maintaining a fleet of vehicles and paid drivers.

And yet, I've noticed every pro law and regulation poster in this thread hasn't ever talked to a black person in their life about this issue. It's incredibly incredibly easy to be to dismissive about an issue when you'll never be subjected to the indigniies of the status quo.

The mods should really change the title of this thread to whiteprivilege.txt

# ¿ Jul 24, 2014 04:17

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Actually, I'd rather everyone have unsafe rides than black people be denied rides. It might or might not be a flash in the pan, but it's bizarre and galling to see white people who've throw black people under the bus (cab?) to defend regulatory capture in favor of rent seeking cartels of all things.

It feels like I'm in bizzaro SA where even if a solution addresses a historic injustice, somehow that's worse than not following the rules.

Edit: also, seriously do none of you have like a single black friend?

# ¿ Jul 24, 2014 04:37

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ May 18, 2024 17:15

Thundercracker: Jun 25, 2004; Proudly serving the Ruinous Powers since as a veteran of the long war.; College Slice

Nintendo Kid posted:

This is incorrect. They haven't even dented the industry.

Hah, its almost like classic facist double-speak.

"The jew is depraved and crave. But we must destroy the jewish cabal because they are dangerous and cunning"

# ¿ Jul 24, 2014 05:05

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Uber vs Taxis: The New Urban Warfare