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aBagorn posted:That or they just need to keep 'appearances' If you mean legally, why should they? If then-billionaire Oliver Queen gave them money, that would've been totally legal, assuming they paid taxes on it. Oliver was publicly known as a billionaire, and they both had totally plausible explanations for why he'd have dropped money on them. The fact it's actually for "superhero support services rendered" wouldn't even need to enter the equation; the source of the money isn't illicit and their visible roles as his employees aren't suspicious. Though, the entire "Oliver is now poor" plotline is absurd. His family's money can't possibly only exist in some form wrapped up in Queen Consolidated, and even if it did, the company would have to have bought Oliver out to excise him from it; it can't just swallow his shares through CFO magic. Not to mention life insurance payouts from Robert and now Moira, and the money from liquidating the Queen's estate. It's hard to make billions disappear like that. The real reason he's poor is way cooler, though: hard to be a socialist superhero when you're a billionaire. The only trick-arrow he needs now is the Marxist dialectic arrow, to smash his enemies with the truth of proletarian struggle.
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Oct 7, 2014 20:12
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TwoPair posted:How do you explain that to the IRS, anyway? "Oh my boss cut me a check for a million bucks because... Christmas bonus?" Why not? To the public, Felicity was Oliver's personal assistant and Diggle was his chauffeur and bodyguard. If Oliver insisted on giving them a huge-as-gently caress bonus for what appears to be no reason, it might be unusual, but I don't see how it'd be illegal. An eccentric billionaire giving his close personal staff an extravagant sum is a thing that could happen. The IRS would only care if Felicity or Diggle didn't declare the money, or didn't have a legal explanation for where it came from. But they would: it was willingly given to us, as a gift, by this famous billionaire whose fortune is a matter of public record. But, obviously, none of them will have money. Because "Oliver struggles with money" is a thing they're doing this season, and if Diggle and Felicity were millionaires through Ollie's charity, it'd make them look like poo poo for letting him struggle. "What's that? You can't afford carbide arrows or food or whatever? Sucks, bro...anyway, I'm off to Barcelona; thanks for the million dollars."
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Oct 8, 2014 01:07
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Scyantific posted:Honestly, I think Palmer's going to be suiting up with an arsenal of gadgets instead of the shrinking superpowers. Also, name change to Star City in the works already? Yeah, there's really no way to do a shrinking superhero character that'd make sense on Arrow. I'm sure they wanted Blue Beetle, as a well-funded tech-based hero to offset against now-poor Oliver Queen. So, I think you're dead-on: they'll probably just pay lip service to the Atom and write him as if he was Ted Kord. Even giving him "powers" in a Flash sense would feel kind of odd, since those elements now have a home on the actual Flash show. And the most absurd science fiction elements on Arrow thus far boil down to, "he's on super-steroids that make him psychotic." If not for the DC movie about Suicide Squad, I'd have said that was the third series. A Huntress show would feel pretty much like Arrow, and Booster Gold would probably feel really similar to Flash. Really, SuperGirl sounds like the most unique option. At the least, to take up the alien / cosmic setting characters.
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Oct 9, 2014 01:08
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I like the theory that Thea did it. Someone Sara would both trust and be surprised to see, who is being trained to shoot black arrows, and who has a vendetta...against the Arrow. Or it's just Ra's al Ghul. Whatever.
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Oct 9, 2014 05:32
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Phylodox posted:I'm not saying I want Ray and Felicity to get together, just providing an obviously superior portmanteau. From the upcoming episode titled, "Flashbang." Nephthys posted:How does the CEO of a company have enough power to literally rename a city? I don't care how multi-billion it is, isn't that something that only the mayor and the government can do? I think you're supposed to assume this is a political campaign he wants to set in motion. I laughed, because I grew up outside Hartford, CT. And for a long time, their city development campaign was, "Hartford: New England's Rising Star!" And come on...no it isn't. Thinking about it, you'd think after the first season, Starling City would be of way higher national interest. It's like post-Katrina New Orleans or post-economic-crisis Detroit, except because a domestic terrorist used an earthquake machine to mass-murder the poor. David Simon would be filming an HBO series in Starling at this point.
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Oct 9, 2014 19:26
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^^Seriously. Moira went out far more heroically than Tommy, or Robert, or Yao Fe, etc.MrFlibble posted:The term fridging as I understand it means a female character killed solely for the drama of a male character (usually a girlfriend of the hero). Moira and Shado both qualify for this but we can't count Sara yet because we have no idea why she was killed. It was just a stinger for a mystery at the end of the episode. Yeah, possibly. But I'd contend Shado is the only classically "fridged" character in your list. As I understand it, the term applies mostly to a woman who has no characterization outside of her male relationships; she serves *only* to motivate the (male) heroes because she has no inner life. It's not just that she died and other characters reacted to it, it's that she was designed to die and demonstrated no agency in the process. Moira and Sara were both very well-defined characters, who demonstrated clear agency and had distinct arcs in their own right. They did die, and their deaths ultimately motivate other characters to do things, but I don't think anyone can say death was their primary purpose. (Particularly Moira...she went out like a boss, and it offered very real closure for her personal story: her conflict was always the friction between her cutthroat role in business and her drive to be a good mother, and she got to choose brave self-sacrifice as a final show of love for her children.) Even if Sara was killed off just to motivate Ollie, it doesn't retroactively take away her nuances or render her character a non-agent. If anything, she was wine-coolered. And the person her death will motivate won't be Ollie...it'll be Laurel, so there's still a feminist case to be made for that wrinkle. Xealot fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Oct 9, 2014 |
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Oct 9, 2014 23:51
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Drifter posted:^^^ - having a woman die in order to motivate a woman or a man doesn't really make her death more or less feminist. Not necessarily the death in and of itself, but if someone killed Sara to "send the Arrow a message," and the actual result was turning Laurel into a more realized and empowered character, it still comments on the trope in a feminist way. Maybe the message was meant for Oliver, but Laurel being the one to respond to it would still say something about the assumption that only male characters can make active decisions in this genre. A villain attempting to disempower women and instead being crushed by one is at least *something*, right?
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Oct 10, 2014 00:22
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Aphrodite posted:Do you guys not have siblings or something? Pretty much. I fully buy that Laurel would put a bullet into a guy for murdering her sister. Also, that one line of Laurel's explains it pretty well: "when I thought Sara died on the Queen's Gambit, all I could do is yell at the ocean. Now, there's someone to blame." Laurel already has a ton of angst and violence built up over the years...being kidnapped by serial killers and psychopaths, having her apartment broken into and her life upturned a bunch of times, to say nothing of the reality that she's already lost Sara, Oliver, and Tommy before so definitively watching Sara die for real. Hell, and there's the substance abuse. She's had tons of groundwork laid down to choosing some serious violence. She has more reasons to choose vigilantism than Batman, when you think about it.
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Oct 16, 2014 19:36
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JohnSherman posted:Ollie is Network Television Poor™ Ollie has been forced to survive off his last $700,000. He has to rent a *one-bedroom* and drive a *used Honda* to get by. He doesn't even have a driver! I can't be in that much of a minority for liking Laurel's story now. The fact she's a fuckup at vigilantism is actually a super interesting choice. And consistent with her character: she's an addictive personality who makes terrible, destructive decisions to deal with her problems...and running off to beat the poo poo out of a guy is exactly that. It's Arrow essentially doing Batman Begins again. Laurel right now is Bruce trying to shoot Joe Chill. It's petty and childish, and she needs to try and fail at that to justify what her training arc becomes. (Of course, with added paternalist condescension added to the mix. I can actually see this becoming interesting in a feminist way...placing a Batman-like level of personal darkness and destructive sadism into a female character.)
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Oct 23, 2014 05:59
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Slime Bro Helpdesk posted:I'm generally liking how they're doing the Laurel plot so far- but drat I don't think it's too spergy to say DAs don't wear badges and you can't charge/threaten someone with perjury for lying to you during questioning? Yeah, that was stupid. Wildcat wasn't under oath or in any formal context for questioning. It's not perjury until he was placed in such a context. And it would be valid if she threatened him with a subpoena ("would you still say that under oath?"), but instead we got...whatever that was. The writers get superheroes. But business economics and law...not so much.
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Oct 28, 2014 07:20
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Slime Bro Helpdesk posted:Actually it seems pretty likely they'll continue to emphasize how completely out of her depth Laurel is at throughout this season, even w/ some sweet boxing lessons. Yeah, I think Laurel's whole story is really well-handled this season. She's *supposed* to seem out-of-control and crazy, because all she has is rage and determination and no skill or focus. She's Batman, from the first act of Batman Begins. Of course, the difference is, Laurel's female. At its core, my issue here is a feminist one: it's unfamiliar to see a heroic arc for a woman who's embittered, cruel, uncontrolled, or capricious. Tons of women have heroic purpose thrust on them (Buffy, Wonder Woman, etc.), but they tend to approach it with elegance or at least resigned enthusiasm. It's only the Bruce Waynes of the world who are allowed to be whiny, sobbing pissants for the first third of their stories. Female characters who are imperfect in these ways (and yet not villainous) are way more rare, and way more reviled. And don't get me wrong, there are obviously tons of Empowered Women on this show, but they usually come more fully-formed and digestible. Even Sara's training happened more or less offscreen. What we see is the quip-throwing badass in dominatrix leather she became. And it was awesome to see, but the issue isn't that fans reject *active* femininity; they reject *flawed*, uncontrolled femininity. See also how hated Thea was when she was a drugged out party girl, or how hated Huntress was when her motivations weren't rational. For these reasons, I think Laurel's story is really interesting, and honestly, transgressive. She doesn't *have* to be a hero, she wants to be. And she has no idea how and isn't very good at it. Nobody in her life supports her ambitions, but she's going to push herself anyway. And her motivations are super dark and complex and violent. In that sense, she's more like Ollie than Sara ever was.
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Oct 30, 2014 23:47
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JohnSherman posted:If you go through your life thinking that any negative reaction to a situation that tangentially involved a woman is sexism, you're going to end up a deeply embittered person. Thea's "drugged out party girl" arc was reviled because it was soapy CW bullshit. It was 100% soapy CW bullshit. My point is more people's reaction. When Roy acts like a tweaked-out rear end in a top hat psychopath, people's reaction is, "this blows. How is this gonna play into Arsenal?" When Laurel acts like a drunk piece of poo poo, a common reaction is, "ugh Laurel sucks..just drop her from the show. Kill her off; I hate this."
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Oct 31, 2014 00:19
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boom boom boom posted:Guess that explains why the tracking arrow was a ~nanotechnology~ tracking arrow. Gotta establish nanotech is also something Felicity can do. You'd think it'd be a Ray Palmer thing. Being the Atom and what-not.
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Oct 31, 2014 01:24
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Phylodox posted:Wanna see Ollie use sex as a weapon, now. He'll use sex as a commodity. "I don't know about superior archery skills, but I got a way for you to earn some money, Mr. Queen." Granny Goodness, confirmed for second half of season 3.
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Nov 1, 2014 01:41
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Captain Mog posted:...super powers are always more exciting than no super powers IMHO and they do it really well on the Flash. And plus it shares the same universe as the Flash. It's not like superpowers don't exist there. They could 100% put a character with superpowers onto Arrow, it's just that the Atom has a really silly power and it would be really difficult to present in a non-absurd way. Hence why Marvel's Ant-Man is effectively an action-comedy. The writers wanted Ted Kord. That's all there is to it. I can only assume they had a whole season arc planned out with Kord in mind, before DC shut them down. But they could use Ray Palmer, and adjusted things to fit. He'll probably use "micro-technology" in some capacity to kind of make it sound right...but he's still more Blue Beetle than anything else. Which is too bad, because I want to see them work with what they want. But it's definitely cool to build up a whole TV ecosystem that totally flies under the radar of the DCCU and MCU. By the end of this season, they'll have not-Batman (Green Arrow), not-Iron Man (Atom), not-Black Widow (Canary), Flash, Firestorm...all they're missing is a cosmic character like Supergirl and they'll have their bases covered.
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Nov 20, 2014 22:33
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Aphrodite posted:She actually looks to be in DA wear there and so can't really be wearing boots, but yeah those are likely Katie Cassidy's and not wardrobe. I'm sure it's for closer shots. It's way easier to perform stunts *not* wearing heels, I imagine. greatn posted:You know what would be an amazing mid-season ending? Ollie defeats Ras Al Ghul, doesn't want to kill him, but it does happen somehow. Nyssa walks to him ready to kill him, then kneels down because Ollie now is the leader of the league of shadows. Cut to credits, see you in a month. Alternately, Ollie takes on Ra's and Ra's guts him like a fish. Ollie dies, and Nyssa feels regret that neither she nor Ollie could avenge Sara's murder. Felicity cries. Arrow will return in January in an episode titled, "Lazarus."
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Dec 6, 2014 01:07
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Hollismason posted:Having Ras straight up kill Oliver would be fantastic. Then he comes back because " Lazarus Pit". That actually does seem like a probable scenario to me, though. It seems unlikely they'd introduce and then either kill off or eliminate Ra's Al Ghul so soon after introducing him, halfway through the season. Their agenda is to legitimize him as a threat. I'm predicting that Ra's actually does have some connection to Sara's death, or at least that he sanctioned it because of his disregard for Sara and Nyssa's relationship. That'd do a good job of convincing Nyssa to ally herself with Ollie (and probably Merlyn and Thea by extension) in an ongoing A-plot fighting the League. And, of course, if Ollie dies fighting Ra's, Nyssa would actually know how a Lazarus Pit works. Which is a more realistic reason for Ollie to be thrown into one...Ra's probably wouldn't kill a challenger and then resurrect him.
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Dec 6, 2014 03:38
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With Ollie having to take on all these metahuman ubermensch types, it seems like they're setting up a whole Dark Knight Returns aspect (where Ollie's old Batman, not GA from that story.) He's perpetually outmatched and broken down, and circling some drain of defeat all the time, but persisting in fighting because that's what he does. I don't even think it's that he's getting worse, just that all these people keep showing up who are better. Fighting against impossible odds and laughing at the reaper, and so on. The crossover event was pretty obsessed with Oliver coming to terms with his own purpose, given how physically superior Barry was. I'm sure when Ray Palmer gets to work, it'll explore Ollie's sense of relevance even more.
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Dec 9, 2014 02:46
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imperialparadox posted:Aren't they always cutting scenes with Roy due to "time" and "pacing?" Kind of sucks though, you would think Ollie's relationship with his sidekick would be a major story element. I was really hoping for a riff on Roy's addiction arc, where the fallout of taking and being cured of Mirakuru left him desperate to be as strong as he briefly was. It'd make sense for Roy to miss being supernaturally strong, and to feel overwhelmed and weak as a regular person. And tweaking on a bunch of performance drugs would totally fit the show. Of course, they went another way with it. Boo hoo he killed a cop. Whatever, Roy, you could punch through concrete; that was badass.
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Dec 9, 2014 23:05
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imperialparadox posted:Drunk Laurel was best Laurel. Agreed. Off the wagon Laurel was awesome as hell. And addict Roy would be amazing. Just, throwing his bow down and beating goons barehanded until Ollie pulls him off. Ripping car doors off the hinges again with roid strength...it'd be great.
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Dec 9, 2014 23:34
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Crunk Abortion posted:Come right this way to collect your prize, sir  Xealot posted:I like the theory that Thea did it. Someone Sara would both trust and be surprised to see... I'm totally wrong on the Nyssa part, I guess. And I definitely started to think Ra's killed Sara as the season went on. That wily Malcolm Merlyn with his mind control drugs. I wonder if it'll be Nyssa or Katana-husband-guy who throws Ollie in the Lazarus pit. I imagine the latter owes him something from HK, but Ollie clearly didn't actually kill Sara and Nyssa can't get answers from a corpse.
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Dec 11, 2014 10:53
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zoux posted:Also, I would've been like "Hmmmm Ra's the man who killed Sara Lance is named...Barry Allen?" "The murderer's name is...uh, Kyle Nimbus. He's this guy who may or may not be able to will himself into a gaseous volume of cyanide. Good luck?" Barry can punch someone at over 760mph. Ra's would still beat him because Plot Reasons...but realistically, a ~150 pound Barry punching a guy at 760mph would literally rip that guy's head off his body. Even at a lower speed, pretty much any hit Barry connected would be like the force of a car crash dispelled over a fist-sized area. Flash tends to undersell that physical reality. Because it would be extremely horrifying if Barry accidentally shattered a bank robbers' sternum and destroyed his internal organs. "Woo! Cisco, I got him!" "Take that, Captain Mischief--- wait, holy gently caress, Barry, gently caress! What did you?!? Jesus!"
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Dec 11, 2014 23:02
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My name is Laurel Lance, and I'm an alcoholic. This isn't a voiceover, I just have a serious personal problem. Every day is a struggle.
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Dec 13, 2014 07:51
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I don't see why S1 Oliver would be an ARGUS agent, because his entire goal was finding and murdering exploitive rich people. ARGUS targets are destabilizing terrorists, not mob-connected factory owners or whatever. They'd want to take out Malcolm Merlyn as a domestic terrorist, but 90% of that list of names would probably be irrelevant to their agenda. I hope Felicity does end up working for Arrow and ATOM simultaneously. And there's a whole Three's Company scenario where she's double dealing and sending them after the same villain. "Oli- um, Ray. Hit the east side of the warehouse; the west entrance has bombs." "How can you tell?" *BOOOOM* "...just a feeling."
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Dec 14, 2014 02:52
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JohnSherman posted:This would almost certainly never happen, but I don't want to be within a thousand miles of this thread if it does. The bitching over Ra's passing the LoA onto "How dare this centuries-old hyper-conservative villain character hold a chauvinistic attitude towards women! I thought Ra's Al Ghul was a feminist and now I'm so disillusioned!!!"
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Dec 16, 2014 01:11
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Soylentbits posted:Dingle will be Black Arrow. Hero, father, and ARGUS agent John Dingle.
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Dec 16, 2014 03:30
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Phenotype posted:I mean, he hasn't showed up since the club opening. Maybe that was just their idea of how to get Thea onscreen a few times before her arc comes up. Or, maybe he'll serve to affirm Oliver's philosophy that having this violent double-life makes normal relationships impossible. And she'll cut him out of her life, or he'll die as collateral damage before she can do so. It doesn't seem like Thea needs a romantic arc at all at the moment. So, it's gotta be something like that.
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Dec 16, 2014 04:19
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^^what does Merlyn get out of that scenario? Thus far, I believe that he actually does care for Thea. I mean, he has no respect for her personal agency and treats her as an object because he's sociopathic...but I don't believe they've given us any indication he wants her dead or is wiling to risk that happening. She's his only surviving child (that we know of.)32MB OF ESRAM posted:yeah that theory is seeming more and more likely Possible. Or, he just wanted Ra's dead and/or Ollie dead, and hey, win-win. Xealot fucked around with this message at 04:10 on Dec 19, 2014 |
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Dec 19, 2014 03:43
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enraged_camel posted:Ollie will never kill Ra's. I think so, too. At most, Ollie might achieve some kind of symbolic victory, and make a point of not killing Ra's. Ollie successfully killing Ra's is pretty much the least interesting possibility. I think I might have said this earlier in the thread, but it's true. Xealot fucked around with this message at 09:05 on Dec 19, 2014 |
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Dec 19, 2014 08:54
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Bruceski posted:His "I killed my first man when I was seven" speech was great too. Not boasting, not glorifying it, simply a statement of necessity. Yeah, they definitely found a unique voice for the character. He's sort of the opposite of Slade: he takes very little personally and isn't driven by malice at all. In that way, he's scarcely a villain. This Ra's is almost passive; you get the sense he'd barely have any antagonism towards Oliver at all, if Oliver had just stopped stirring the pot and avoided getting into League business. I mean, thus far. Maybe the second half will go over Ra's plan to destroy Starling City. But at the moment, I got a serious "God I hate Mondays," vibe from his battle with Ollie.
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Dec 24, 2014 01:40
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XboxPants posted:Of all the references, I can honestly say I never expected to see a Frasier call-out in this thread. Hey, baby, I hear Scarecrow's a-callin', fear gas and scrambled eggs.
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Jan 3, 2015 10:42
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I dont know posted:Just a reminder that Thea's middle name has already been confirmed as Dearden and her longstanding nickname is Speedy. So they already have used that particular winking allusion already. She also went by Mia while in Corto Maltese, if I'm not mistaken. A friend of mine decided to test the theory that everything has slashart and fanfiction, no matter how obscure or insane. He quit when he learned that eSurance erotic art exists, and plentifully. There is fanfic and slashart for everything. There is no escape. Humanity's collective consciousness is a window to the infinite multiverse, and of all possible realities, a lot of them involve an insurance mascot having sex.
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Jan 12, 2015 20:49
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ashez2ashes posted:Dorky inventor Ted Kord would fit the show quite well. I assume they would have written him and cast him differently then they have Palmer. Maybe they'll change their minds somewhere along the lines since Kord industries does still exist in the show. I'm convinced they would've done very little differently if it actually was Ted Kord. Brandon Routh is a great get, and he's playing an excitable technology-obsessed nerd who wants to use that tech to fight crime. He's more Blue Beetle than Atom by a wide margin, though I'm really only familiar with the former. But seriously: how can they introduce "shrinking powers" in a way that isn't absurd and silly, even if he has his own show? I'd way rather see them come up with some sort of weird meta power that tangentially relates. Like, he can bend and warp space around him, or do some particle-wave duality thing to phase around, or something else theoretical-physics-sounding. Though I guess some of this is Flash stuff. It's mostly that I don't care about fidelity with the original Ray Palmer, so I'd way rather they go off-book and do something cool. "Man fights a giant insect" doesn't sound like a premise for a multi-season show.
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Jan 14, 2015 01:08
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TyrantWD posted:I was wondering why Detective Lance couldn't tell the difference in height between Sara and Laurel, but it turns out that they are roughly the same height. Katie Cassidy just looks like she is 5'10. Though, as you point out, she's a radically different body type, in an outfit that's very form-fitting. I'm pretty sure if I wore tight clothing, my own parents could distinguish me from my brother, even from a distance. Det. Lance is just dumb. Or legally blind. People need to stop giving him the benefit of the doubt about Ollie...he doesn't know poo poo about poo poo. Dinah Sr. figured out Sara was dead in 3 minutes. Joe West is the only competent detective in the Arrowverse.
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Jan 29, 2015 15:25
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zoux posted:Also with all the work they did to show how bad Laurel is at Canarying at this point, of course she's not going to look pro with that staff. Seriously. Every complaint about that sounds ridiculous to me, because in no way is the show saying Laurel is actually good at this stuff. Roy isn't even good at it, he's just comparatively better. I mean, their co-op mission to save hostages ended with Canary face-planting on the roof of a van and Brickwell shooting a hostage in the face. They're bad at this. And Felicity's tacit endorsement hardly means she's all-in. She just realized that *someone* had to do it, and Black Canary is all they've got. It's also why she reversed course with Ray; the need for an Arrow figure is there even if the Arrow isn't, so she might as well help the people willing to do it in his stead. I'm kind of into this plotline, because it really hammers the Batman sense that wearing a costume to fight crime is *insane*. Also, it's going to be really badass when Ollie returns and wrecks poo poo.
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Jan 29, 2015 22:05
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Krad posted:So, was he a DJ before joining the League, or was it part of his training? We need to know. "I was just a boy when I dropped my first beat. I remember what I felt: fear, that the mix was lame and the club wasn't about it. But I also felt something else: pride, that I tore the motherfucking roof off the joint."
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Jan 30, 2015 00:58
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JasonRiverwind posted:So long as Merlyn doesn't try to make Brick confess before killing him, we should be ok. Leave the crazy flipping to Roy. "Say her name: Rebecca Merlyn! You raped her! You murdered her! You killed her children!" (I guess only the second one.)
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Feb 2, 2015 19:40
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Narcissus1916 posted:My money is still on Waller training Oliver to be some kinda crazy loving vigilante. If she just wanted a spy, there are better options. The most rational explanation for her interest in Ollie, sadly, isn't the one we're being given...which is that it'd probably be advantageous for Waller to have a young and mold-able figurehead for ARGUS, who also has some credibility with wealthy and powerful people. Ollie is a celebrity playboy who's the son of an industrialist billionaire. Prior to the island, his skills were partying hard and having connections. He shouldn't be working as some sort of black ops spook, he should be attending dinners with defense contractors. But that involves way less arrow-based torture, so... ATOM suit looks super great. I'm kind of surprised by that. Well done, art design team.
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Feb 4, 2015 04:11
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thebardyspoon posted:Ok the "doing this really dumb stuff to protect Thea" thing would work except Ras doesn't know about Thea and while Merlyn said something about having his contacts spread the word if he dies or something (he did say something like that right?) but in the last episode he said he's not been in contact with them since his "death". Also, his entire threat is ridiculous. "Do this thing for me, or after my death, I'll offer up my only living heir to be murdered by an insane despot." He's pretty sociopathic, but even a sociopath would probably want their progeny to survive, if only out of narcissism. If that's not a bluff, and he legitimately doesn't care if Thea lives or dies, what is the point of his entire plotline with her? He has at least as much invested in Thea surviving as Ollie does.
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Feb 7, 2015 04:24
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bobkatt013 posted:If he wanted that why would he use her to kill the beloved of the daughter of the demon? He knows the only way to manipulate Ollie is to his work is to threaten his family. Oh, he used her to manipulate Ollie and is generally a douchebag. But I don't think he was honest about killing his own daughter to spite Oliver Queen. Seems like that'd be kind of a Pyrrhic victory for him.
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Feb 7, 2015 08:32
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