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Terry Grunthouse posted:Yes, this. This is why I assumed he drank so much. He's knows he's doing morally wrong things in order to bring about the end result that is required. He knows he's essentially killing consciousnesses even if they might not have the full range of emotions, like empathy or compassion, which is dangerous. He's playing god, but that doesn't mean he likes it. I think that Nathan is actually a good guy with noble intentions, but he has to get his hands dirty. That's rough, so he drinks A LOT. But he also knows when he shouldn't. AI isn't question of if, it's a question of when. Dude knows he's building what's going to replace humanity and that it could be dangerous as gently caress all, and thinks arrogantly only he alone is skilled and smart enough to do it right. It weighs on his conscience and accidentally creates the scenario he feared most...an unfinished model walking around freely, while other idiots are free to design other things like Ava.
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Apr 29, 2015 04:14
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Someone here called the MC a 'Nice Guy' here and man it both pissed me off and got me thinking about the film on just how wrong that is The most vaguely 'Nice Guy' thing he does is help something he may or may not be in love with who may or may not be love with him. He fell in love/attracted to it with it because it manipulated him through flirting, outright lies, and a CEO who purposefully aided it by designing to it to cater to personally to him through his search history both physically and emotionally. gently caress he was even chosen because with both no girlfriend OR family he was more susceptible to the idea of being loved. And that had only partly do with him wanting him to get her out. He need to have a "Good Moral Compass" outside of that. He had to think turning it off and reprogramming it was murder, and that he would want to do something.
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Apr 29, 2015 17:22
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Mr. Flunchy posted:Of course he's a nice guy - even though on the surface he's acting altruistically, he's quietly possessive and controlling. He helps her not simply because it's the right thing to do, but because he wants a robot girlfriend that's inevitably going to be entirely reliant on his presence. Yeah, no. If that's "nice guy" behavior, saving a drowning woman in a pool is sexist entitlement to her body At no point is he possessive or controlling, he helps it to escape with the idea that she might love him. He was selected on three criteria, two of which would lead him to both sexualilize and WANT humanize 'it'. The last prerequisite of why he was chosen was because of a "good moral compass". Your confusing Bateman's possessive and controlling sexualization of Ava, the machines, and well pretty much everything with Celeb going from "This is a machine, this is a sexual being, this is a human." line of thinking and trick that Bateman/Ava lead him into. The whole speech about "why would a grey box need to interact with another grey box?" might have been a lie or half lie like all the bullshit he laid out, but it clearly was laid out how the deception worked on Celeb and the audience. Ava needed to be or to fake being a sexual being so Celeb/audience could think of her of having human psychological wants and needs like him, and believe she wanted to socialize with him. Otherwise it just increases the likelihood of Ava not being able to present or convey an emotional responses for Celeb to latch onto. Not for entitlement of believing if he 'does a good deed he'll get laid' but because it stacks the deck towards him feeling an emotional response to her. He thinks through her opening her wants and needs to him, they've formed a genuine emotional relationship to him. The first and most damaging devastating blow Bateman reveals is "Not having a family", with not having a girlfriend being secondary in list of reasons of why he selected. Yeah, he's subconsciously sexist but none of his behavior is presented as entitlement or need to controlling. It's a indication he willing to buy into lovely cliches. NutritiousSnack fucked around with this message at 03:19 on Apr 30, 2015 |
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Apr 30, 2015 03:15
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The_Rob posted:I think what k waste was saying though was that those lovely clichés are there for a reason and that is the societal expectations of the women. I don't think he was a lovely guy but he definitely had his own issues. Not to mention that even though she is smarter than he ever will be it seemed like he never saw her as on the same intellectual level as him. I'm not addressing K-Waste's hypothesis there, but the idea that Celeb is a "Nice Guy" because I think that's a defense mechanism argument for a film that has a lot to say about male sexuality (and I'd argue it's almost gender neutral but that I'll save that write up for after second viewing) and it hits a personal note that a lot of men try to avoid personal introspection. Also going to say his condensation of her/it was because he still viewed her/it as a machine and not as capable of emotions like he was. A computer can kick my rear end handily in chess or just in math any day of the week. Never going to actually call it smart, can't even write a lovely joke on this website. Likewise despite his obvious enthusiasm, he thought he was just hanging out with R2D2 or Robby the Robot and in a way just pretending even to himself. The first comparison he makes when suspicious to Nathan was a magic act and it's kinda fitting. He went in excepting to see an illusion and was prepared to fool himself, not form a emotional connection. I want to add something about Ava having that pretty intense but brief sensual scene with Kyoto and the second "dressing room" scene were she's lovingly selecting her new body as this a meta commentary about sexuality in general even if it's through a hetrosexual man's eyes but I'm going to need to see this film a second time NutritiousSnack fucked around with this message at 06:17 on Apr 30, 2015 |
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Apr 30, 2015 06:05
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It's kinda funny everyone here is acting like an rear end in a top hat over disagreeing what the film is about.
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May 12, 2015 07:37
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