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The only good thing about T4 was the opening battle. That was just sex with the use of nukes and the A-10s making runs. It was like you know, a proper bit of war. Then it got ruined the moment Conner steps off the soon to be one of many crashed helicopters Conner rides for 10 seconds, with a M4 assault rifle, not a converted plasma weapon, just a slug thrower. The rest of the fights were just dumb poo poo and for me it was especially so when the A-10s lost in a 2 to 1 advantage they never bothered to use in low level flight where it excels in. There was a surprising lack of skulls too. Sure T1~3 went a little over board on the skulls, but no skulls?
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Dec 5, 2014 19:40
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Gavok posted:To Salvation's credit it's still not as bad as the Terminator/RoboCop: Kill Human comic from a couple years ago. I actually got mad by how bad the story was in that. The SNES Robocop vs Terminator game is kind of awful gameplay-wise, but what little of the comic's story was left in it was so cool that I kept renting it until I beat it.
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Dec 5, 2014 20:04
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Lurdiak posted:The SNES Robocop vs Terminator game is kind of awful gameplay-wise, but what little of the comic's story was left in it was so cool that I kept renting it until I beat it. One of the few instances where I find the Genesis version is superior. Surprisingly good on Game Gear too. Terminator is akin to Alien in that unlike other licensed properties it's actually had a lot of REALLY good video games over the years (though the typical trash is in there as well).
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Dec 5, 2014 20:30
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The thing with Terminator 3 I can not get over is Arnold's performance. He gets way too emotive, like he's a robot who wants to be human. The great thing about Terminator 2 is that Arnold's charm or likeability is almost entirely a reflection of what John projects on him. Aside from stuff like the final thumbs-up to throw in some ambiguity, he really is just a robot on a mission. Then T3 kind of ruins that in an attempt to follow up on that. A far more interesting take, I feel, would've been the robot firmly establishing that he's a different model than the other one and giving him a slightly different characterization. Salvation does a similar thing with the weird Helena Bonham Carter AI who is completely emotional to a robot they themselves made.
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Dec 5, 2014 21:28
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The effects in Terminator 3 are not bad they just don't look so hot with the terrible lighting. T3 looks like a made for tv movie it's so cheap looking. Terminator Salvation is the first and only time I've been at a midnight release where a large part of the crowd loudly booed a movie when it was over.
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Dec 5, 2014 21:44
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davidspackage posted:A far more interesting take, I feel, would've been the robot firmly establishing that he's a different model than the other one and giving him a slightly different characterization. They literally do this.
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Dec 5, 2014 21:52
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LaughMyselfTo posted:They literally do this. Well, they try. They have him not be beholden to him, be more aggressive (thus ironically less robotic) and mention he's the one who terminated him to make it seem like he's less friendly than the one we all know and love from 2, but then he starts yelling all over the place and having clear emotional attachments and poo poo.
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Dec 5, 2014 22:04
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I only pray we will one day get a legitimately great Robocop vs Terminator movie starring the robot dancing dude from Step Up 3D (if Weller dont want to do it) and old Arnold as T800. Start in Detroit and end up in the future war...theN Alien Queen and her Xenomporph show up and a couple of Predators go after them. Why they didnt do this? I dunno.
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Dec 5, 2014 22:40
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All of you are forgetting the best scene ever in Salvation. 10 second Terry Crews out of nowhere. quote:"No, no. I had no clue," he said in an exclusive interview at Comic-Con last week in San Diego, where he was promoting his upcoming sci-fi movie Gamer. "No clue. And you know, ... after it came out, and I was like, 'Dude!' You know? ... I had people coming up to me in the street, like, 'What was that?' You know what I mean? And they were like, 'Well, uh, well, McG was supposed to call you.' And I was like, 'This is bull.' ... When I saw it, I was like, 'You've got to be kidding. You guys. You don't know what you're doing.' Vintersorg fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Dec 5, 2014 |
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Dec 5, 2014 23:00
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To be fair the actress is saddled with arguably the worst character in GoT (and definitely the worst plot) so I don't really hold that against her.
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Dec 5, 2014 23:00
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Vintersorg posted:Crews blamed the situation on too many cooks. Smarf, no! 
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Dec 5, 2014 23:47
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Battle: Los Angeles was everything that Terminator: Salvation should have been.
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Dec 6, 2014 00:16
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ephori posted:Battle: Los Angeles was everything that Terminator: Salvation should have been. You know something, I agree with this.
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Dec 6, 2014 00:17
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Gavok posted:Smarf, no! We've come full circle!
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Dec 6, 2014 00:29
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I see T3s seemingly more emotional Arnie as a by product of his unit being active a lot longer than the one in T2. If a robot could reflect emotion and is a "Learning computer" I don't see why it couldn't learn to gather all those reflections into a more pseudo-persona. Its that or the director didn't care enough beyond having Arnold spew his lines. Arnold can act and he does know his limitations but he does need some director support to get 100% out of him. Salvation is still bad trash.
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Dec 6, 2014 01:21
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Wait, if Skynet is a distributed computing system why would it nuke almost all of its own brainpower?
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Dec 6, 2014 01:53
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MechaStalin posted:Wait, if Skynet is a distributed computing system why would it nuke almost all of its own brainpower? It uses the Internet of Things to distribute independently capable copies of itself? I mean it's already cloud computing software that thinks on a collective level.
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Dec 6, 2014 01:56
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Vaall posted:Another good thing about Terminator 3 was that it was one of the last action sequels of an R-rated franchise that never caved into the pressure of having a PG-13 rating by studios/modern film makers. It was a really tame R, wasn't it? I recall hearing that it was shot so that it could be cut to a PG-13 as easily as possible if that's what WB decided on. I also recall rumors that an entire climactic action sequence involving the T-850 fighting the T-X endoskeleton was filmed and cut, but I have no idea if that's true or not.
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Dec 6, 2014 02:34
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My favorite aspect of T3 were the quotes by Arnold that could be Hallmark Cards in an alternate universe: Just got divorced card: "Anger is more useful than despair." You just got friendzoned card: "Desire is irrelevant." Condolence card when a loved one dies: "Your levity is good, it relieves tension and fear of death."
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Dec 6, 2014 03:04
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Neo Rasa posted:If you know more about Bale possibly effecting the course of the movie do you have a link or anything to post? http://uk.reuters.com/article/2009/05/08/film-us-terminator-idUKTRE5476A020090508 They asked Bale to be Marcus, Bale decided he wanted to be John Connor, then Bale decided they needed to rewrite the script so that he would be as important as the main character rather than play the role he demanded he have.
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Dec 6, 2014 03:25
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Count me among the T3 lovers, and I agree fully with those who say that the biggest strike against it at the time was that it wasn't T1 or T2. Salvation was bullshit just as everyone had said, but I disagree with people on the point of it not looking like the post- Judgment Day future shown in the first two movies. It explicitly took place a decade before that (and Judgment Day took place later than it "had" in those movies), so things just hadn't descended to that level yet. Just as the T800 was coming on line too early, they should have thrown in some little bone about the resistance working on energy weapons but just not having gotten there yet. That's enough time wasted defending a bad movie, though. Greatest thing in T3: Arnold's pronunciation of "Katherine Brewster."
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Dec 6, 2014 03:35
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Catrinn Brloosta?Defiance Industries posted:http://uk.reuters.com/article/2009/05/08/film-us-terminator-idUKTRE5476A020090508 Christ what an rear end in a top hat.  This was the movie where that weird "I'M A PROFESSIONAL!" rant happened too isn't it?
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Dec 6, 2014 03:45
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Barry Convex posted:It was a really tame R, wasn't it? I recall hearing that it was shot so that it could be cut to a PG-13 as easily as possible if that's what WB decided on. I haven't seen it in years but IIRC the TX both graphically punches through a dudes chest and shoots an older lady to death with both victims dying slowly.
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Dec 6, 2014 04:14
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Yeah it had some scattered gore moments (her punching through that cop from the back seat and then steering the car with that arm was awesome) but knowing this information, I can definitely see how the major sequences were filmed around it possibly being PG-13.
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Dec 6, 2014 04:19
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Terminator Salvation is actually really good because it has fantastic cinematography, and robot designs that trade menace for sheer surrealism. The story is both functional enough to make basic sense, and dysfunctional enough to be weird and interesting. Folks complaining that Connor ends up in a hand-to-hand fight scene, and that Skynet gets a face, are really trying too hard to find a 'jump the shark' moment. Skynet's 'face' is the traditional skull with faces ripped from your memory and grafted onto it. Folks miss that, in a different sequence, Skynet is more accurately visualized as an abstract constellation of nodes. I like that its attempts at communication are clumsy. And then, the prolonged fight scenes fit the tone of this film, where a rehash of Terminator 1 would be inappropriate. This is a film where the baddies built, essentially, an extremely large man to physically pick people up and put them in baskets. Tactical realism is right off the table. That's War Of The Worlds imagery. The motorcycles are H.R. Geiger things with skeletons welded into a rigid bullet shape. The impression I get is not of the usual zombie-film demand for hypervigilance, but of a languid Skynet that moves with dull confidence. That's personality.
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Dec 6, 2014 04:39
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Seriously reaching. But that's what you do.
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Dec 6, 2014 04:58
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Sasquatch! posted:It was set it post-apocolyptic "future war", which everyone was looking forward to seeing. No it didn't. It was just some brown and bloom wasteland.
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Dec 6, 2014 05:26
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oohhboy posted:Seriously reaching. But that's what you do. No, he is right. I disagree with him on most points but the common take on T:S is wrong.
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Dec 6, 2014 05:34
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:Terminator Salvation is actually really good because it has fantastic cinematography, and robot designs that trade menace for sheer surrealism. The story is both functional enough to make basic sense, and dysfunctional enough to be weird and interesting. Hahahahaha! No SMG, in no way shape or form is this true. Where to begin... well I'm going to start with your comments on the robot designs. You make the assertion that trading menace for surrealism is a good thing, and frankly that is bullshit. Like pretty much everything in Terminator Salvation, the robot design not only completely flips off and fails to recognize the success of the aesthetics established over the previous three films, but it replaces it with something that is at once nonsensical and lovely. The 'extremely large man' design is something totally out of keeping with both the skynet we are shown and told about, as well as the skynet we can infer from what we saw in previous films. Take this quote as an example. quote:Listen, and understand! That Terminator is out there! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead. This is the type of machine that Skynet develops. A merciless, cold, unfeeling killing machine that shoots you five more times after blowing your brains out because it wants to be absolutely sure. Skynet isn't careless or stupid, it is methodical and doesn't waste resources. Tactical realism (as real as a walking cyborg with human skin can be) was the name of the game for Skynet, and acknowledging that aspect of the villains was what gave us two outstanding movies and one pretty good one. Ignoring that, as they did with salvation, is what left us with a critically panned piece of garbage that jumps all over the place. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0xjc_OSJms That is the single strongest scene in all of Terminator Salvation. It has its weaknesses, most notably that the t-600 really likes throwing him around, but there are a bunch of points in that scene where it comes damningly close to the feel of the good terminator films. When he is on his back, rolling from side to side, with really strong audio cues filling you in on just how utterly hosed he would be if this thing managed to land a hammer fist. At no point in the Arnold fight, or any of the silly chase scenes with giant mecha, is there the same sense of danger as there is from this single cut in half terminator. If this thing actually lands a solid blow, he's done. And no, people who complain about Connor 'ending up' in a hand to hand fight aren't looking for a jump the shark moment. That is the single weakest part of the film because it goes against everything we've been told across multiple films about Skynet and against everything we have seen in how it operates. This is the machine that nuked the entire human race out of the fear that they'd pull the plug, but when faced with the man it (somehow) knows is going to kill it, Skynet puts him in a room with a naked t-800. Why? For irony? Just like the scene with the 'face' of skynet, this shits on everything that has been established about the franchise. Skynet doesn't bargain. As far as the plot, what was Skynet's plot exactly? No really, what was its plot. Marcus (somehow) gets activated after quite some time. He is full of metal and would almost certainly get detected if he tried to go into a rebel base, so its clear he isn't there as a new form of terminator to kill John. The speech at the end of the film seems to indicate that the plan had worked exactly as intended, but did Skynet's plan really rely on Marcus somehow accidentally running into Kyle Reese, failing to save him, meeting up with John Connor, being revealed as part machine, offering to help John break into skynet HQ and then... Okay I've gone a little cross-eyed. Terminator Salvation does not have a functional plot. It has the illusion of a plot that turns to dust in your hands if you view it at any angle other than head on.
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Dec 6, 2014 05:54
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T3 was a great flick, glad to see it's getting some love here.
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Dec 6, 2014 06:11
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So how bad is Genisys gonna be?
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Dec 6, 2014 07:03
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Caros posted:Hahahahaha! No SMG, in no way shape or form is this true. Where to begin... well I'm going to start with your comments on the robot designs. Since I don't give a whit about canonicity or hyperbolic vitriol, there's nothing in this post for me to glom on to.
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Dec 6, 2014 07:06
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A shocking role reversal, that.
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Dec 6, 2014 07:07
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I think Arnold's 'I AM... A MACHINE' scene in T3 is quite good as well.
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Dec 6, 2014 07:08
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What does SMG think of Terminator 3, then?
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Dec 6, 2014 07:12
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Axetrain posted:So how bad is Genisys gonna be? Well, since this movie is already currently beyond any form of positive critical reception—I'm going to be pissed if the asian T-1000 doesn't at least morph into Robert Patrick for a finger wag cameo.
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Dec 6, 2014 07:15
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Axetrain posted:So how bad is Genisys gonna be? I... am cautiously optimistic. My biggest takeaway from the trailer was that it feels a lot like Terminator 3. It is entirely possible it is going to be a garbage film, but I went into that trailer with zero positive expectations, and I'm vaguely coming around. It won't be a modern Terminator or T2, but it could very well be a satisfying action flick/popcorn movie and I would be entirely okay with that. My biggest worry is if they don't stick the time travel mechanics the whole thing is going to fall apart into a shitheap. quote:Since I don't give a whit about canonicity or hyperbolic vitriol, there's nothing in this post for me to glom on to. It really isn't about the canonicity though, its about taking everything that was at the soul of what made the Terminator franchise successful and abandoning it. Terminator Salvation wasn't bad because some plot points didn't really match up. The fact that the machines didn't act like they did in previous films isn't bad because it disturbs Canon, its bad because the way they acted in the previous films was entertaining and threatening, while the way they acted in Terminator Salvation simply wasn't. Skynet was a neutered hollywood villain ranting about its master plan instead of an unknowable sentience that wants nothing more than to exterminate mankind.
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Dec 6, 2014 07:27
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Why did the T-850 crush the gay pink star glasses for making him look silly when earlier in the same scene he literally thinks he's supposed to talk to the guy's hand? Why didn't Marcus realize something was up in the several days between waking up and getting blown up by that landmine when he didn't have to eat or go to the bathroom? What did that group of unseemly rapists mean when they told Moon Bloodgood "machines don't bother us, we don't bother them" just before they try to rape her? Weren't machines constantly patrolling and killing any human they came across in the very ruins the rapists lived in? Did you remember Common was in Terminator Salvation? Does anyone?
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Dec 6, 2014 07:30
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LaughMyselfTo posted:What does SMG think of Terminator 3, then? It's really ugly and weirdly focused on gender and sexuality humor that's shockingly devoid of camp. I've only watched it in bits and pieces because I just found it really unpleasant. It's like a generic 90's movie released a decade too late, right down to having the chupacabra from Species as an antagonist. Caros posted:It really isn't about the canonicity though, its about taking everything that was at the soul of what made the Terminator franchise successful and abandoning it. Terminator Salvation wasn't bad because some plot points didn't really match up. The fact that the machines didn't act like they did in previous films isn't bad because it disturbs Canon, its bad because the way they acted in the previous films was entertaining and threatening, while the way they acted in Terminator Salvation simply wasn't. Skynet was a neutered hollywood villain ranting about its master plan instead of an unknowable sentience that wants nothing more than to exterminate mankind. Nope, still don't care. I like things that are different.
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Dec 6, 2014 07:30
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Wolfsheim posted:Why did the T-850 crush the gay pink star glasses for making him look silly when earlier in the same scene he literally thinks he's supposed to talk to the guy's hand? Why does Kyle Reese tell Marcus that HK's hunt better at night, despite telling Sarah Connor the opposite in The Terminator. SuperMechagodzilla posted:Nope, still don't care. I like things that are different. Bully for you. Considering your take on most films is best described as 'Delusional' or 'Viewed while on Acid' your opinion thankfully carries precisely zero weight. Back on the ignore list you go! Caros fucked around with this message at 07:36 on Dec 6, 2014 |
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Dec 6, 2014 07:32
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