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PRADA SLUT posted:Can we not find any instance of where any of the above ties in to board gaming? These are mostly BGG threads, mostly because those are the easiest for me to find again. Unlike SA, BGG erases posts that violate the rules so sometimes they are hard to follow or see the gross poo poo people saying dismissing these problems. https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2451239/consimworld-crushing-support-black-lives-matter-ju A wargame site removing BLM support https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2581258/daniele-tascini-doesnt-see-color-and-s-bad A famous designer thinking its okay to call black friends the Italian version of the N-word? https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2612018/can-we-talk-about-women-box-cover Poor representation of women on a box cover got responded to by massive brigades by poopy diapers https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2694874/phil-eklund-prolific-board-game-designer-has-poste Transphobia https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2526491/another-bios-game-another-essay-defending-climate Anthropogenic climate change denialism https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2477850/disappointed-alma-mater-has-no-characters-color-al Whitewashing of so-called history, even after another designer informed them that people of color actually existed at universities in history https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2711990/speaking-against-broken-token Credible sexual assault allegations. (That reminds me of the slogan I forgot: Believe Women.) https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2721966/i-have-cancelled-my-pledge-after-learning-more-abo A kickstarter using white supremacist dogwhisltes (the OK sign). This one is hard to read because the two people peddling the poo poo (the designer and publisher) deleted their posts. https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2636861/very-biased-game/page/2 A designer creates a racist board game. In a different thread he complained about this review, someone looked and saw he made racist comments in a different review, so he got banned. https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2773119/what-wrong-asian-representation Asian represenation could be a lot better in FFG stuff (who are usually one of the better companies, to be fair) https://www.dicebreaker.com/games/warhammer-40000-ninth-edition/news/warhammer-40k-gt-talavera-nazi-statement Nazis with swastikas were not thrown out at a Spanish tourney, causing a huge outrage These are all in the last year or so, and there are others. Those are just the high points that came across my radar.
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Dec 27, 2021 01:16
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| # ? May 6, 2024 00:30 |
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Dec 27, 2021 01:28
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OP should have a section on “games by black creators”. Serves the social justice angle and lists other good games. ABCon was a few weeks ago, might even be some things coming through there.
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Dec 27, 2021 01:35
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Glagha posted:I think the important thing about artifacts that is the reason they can't be better than items on the whole is just because you can play them immediately. Being able to look at the shop row and take an action that gives you potentially exactly what you need right now is pretty powerful. I agree with their reasoning, but I think some of them are bad enough or so situational that they mostly never get taken. For instance, Ritual Dagger gets you an arrow head and a card exile, which is ostensibly worth 3 compasses but costs 4. Sure, if you desperately need an arrow you might consider it, but the opportunity cost of doing that instead of exploring a Tier 3 site this or next turn is quite large. The result in games I have played is that the sub par artifacts clog up the market row and then maybe get taken for points in the last round. If they are going to be remain in the market slot, I wish they were a little more consistent or had more interesting mechanics.
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Dec 27, 2021 01:41
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Magnetic North posted:That'd be a very good choice. I did mean Antike Duellum and thought I edited that in but good catch. Only criticism for your OP is that it’s going to be a huge wall of text so I’d move the more meta-hobby stuff about publishers and all to a second post following the more informational stuff for readability.
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Dec 27, 2021 01:46
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Threadban prada slut
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Dec 27, 2021 01:58
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Some beginner recommendation lists I made recently: 1. For a couple that I briefly introduced to some games, who now want to buy more to just play with each other. They were excited enough to immediately buy the games I already showed them (King of Tokyo and Sushi Go), but already made the critical mistake of trying to pick out games on their own and accidentally bought an expansion instead of its base game. These are beginner-ish, with a little bit of rules complexity, but I feel confident that they are invested enough to learn and play the games on their own. Azul Codenames duet Onitama Patchwork (original) 7 wonders duel Morels Biblios Dominion Roll for the Galaxy For a friend who works as a high school librarian, and wants to stock the library with some board games. These are mostly games with very few rules, that can either be learned by complete novices reading the rules for the first time, or by somebody who has played at most one or two other games from this list. There's also a wide variety of player counts, and weight classes that range from "fun activity that is vaguely gamelike" (Telestrations, Concept, Just One) to "actually rewards strategy and gets deeper the more you play". Ticket to ride Azul Codenames Dixit: odyssey No thanks! Just one Star realms Century: Golem Kingdomino Onitama Telestrations Love letter Biblios Point salad Werewords Concept
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Dec 27, 2021 02:34
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I think we should show directly how white supremacy does in fact affect board games, especially with the past colonialism games that were too much of the Euro style games. I didn't read the intro as I'm phoneposting, but yes we should talk about representation in board games and its historical lack thereof.
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Dec 27, 2021 02:50
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So I dug through BGG and found a few things: Here's a list of Black game designers / artists, and some of their bigger games (at least that I have heard/played): Rising Sun, Blood Rage, Arcadia Quest, Chaos in the Old World, Quarriors, GoT Card Game, Netrunner (lead developer), Phase 10 (though not a "modern" board game). So instead of just throwing "Black Live Matter" into the wind, maybe the thread OP should add something to materially improve the exposure of Black game creators, if we're including auxiliary information in the OP. It doesn't have to specifically be black creators, I know Inka Brand did Village and the Exit games (which I enjoyed, and I think I've played all of them -- might be a good OP suggestion for puzzle nerds); T.I.M.E stories and Eldritch Horror have female developers as well. Here's a meta-list BGG did during Black History Month, which showcases many other games: https://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/282633/celebrating-black-history-2021-spotlight-meta-list PRADA SLUT fucked around with this message at 03:12 on Dec 27, 2021 |
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Dec 27, 2021 03:06
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Orange DeviI posted:Threadban prada slut
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Dec 27, 2021 03:49
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Orange DeviI posted:Threadban prada slut Not an emptyquote
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Dec 27, 2021 03:54
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PRADA SLUT posted:So I dug through BGG and found a few things: Listing out some games designed by non-white/non-male folks is a good idea, but representation in game design isn't the ONLY issue here. Also these issues aren't "auxiliary" to the people who experience them.
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Dec 27, 2021 04:11
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Orange DeviI posted:Threadban prada slut
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Dec 27, 2021 04:38
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Thanks for mentioning Rising Sun, the game that had so little thought put into properly researching its theme that they ended up including a random guy from new zealand into their game as one of the deities because of a piece of wikipedia vandalism.
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Dec 27, 2021 04:50
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Slimy Hog posted:Listing out some games designed by non-white/non-male folks is a good idea, but representation in game design isn't the ONLY issue here. It's nice to have representation in game design but that's not really the issue. Frankly any designer who we haven't seen a picture of could be Black. As Eric Lang plainly shows, just because a designer is Black doesn't mean they design "Black" games. I honestly don't like the emphasis on Black designers because it feels like there's an expectation they'll design "Black" games and let the white people design the games that actually sell. It's a feeling and I don't know why people insist that somehow having Black designers will change the hobby but I really don't like it.
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Dec 27, 2021 05:11
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Slimy Hog posted:Listing out some games designed by non-white/non-male folks is a good idea, but representation in game design isn't the ONLY issue here. No, but they're auxiliary to the "OP in the games forum of recommendations of games for new people", being that the primary focus is "games for new people only that aren't on Kickstarter, are commonly-available, and cost less than $100", which is what I recall everyone talking about before. It wouldn't be auxiliary if the thread is was in D&D and titled "Social commentary and representation in the board game industry", but that covers a different set of ideas. That's how the terms primary/auxiliary (secondary, tertiary, whatever) work when discussing an essay or other written piece. Mayveena posted:Frankly any designer who we haven't seen a picture of could be Black. I always think it's some old retired Czech professor and their cat. PRADA SLUT fucked around with this message at 06:20 on Dec 27, 2021 |
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Dec 27, 2021 06:14
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What is it that bothers you so much about a new op having a section addressing current issues in the tabletop hobby regarding discrimination
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Dec 27, 2021 06:20
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FirstAidKite posted:What is it that bothers you so much about a new op having a section addressing current issues in the tabletop hobby regarding discrimination Nothing, just that if the purpose of the OP is "recommendations for board games", that should be the easiest information for someone coming through to find, and the information that's most accessible, especially to someone skimming the OP and not wanting to wade through a wall of text. It's not a content question, it's a layout, usability, and editing question. The primary information (whatever that is) the OP tries to convey should be the most visible and accessible. Ex, "board game information and recs" in the first post, and the first reply to be everything related to social issues, representation, The Broken Token, etc. This clearly breaks the OP into the primary (recommendations) and auxiliary (social issues / etc) sections and visibly delineates each part to the reader, even at a glance. Magnetic North posted:I feel that it is a huge mistake to even respond to your bullshit, because it appears clear to me that you are just trolling. But just in case you're actually that loving insulated from how bad the trad games world is, here we go: See, this is good information to have. It adds context to the messages and shows relation to board games specifically, especially if you're a "new player looking fore their first modern game" that has no context or understanding about anything the industry has been doing the past few years. PRADA SLUT fucked around with this message at 07:10 on Dec 27, 2021 |
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Dec 27, 2021 06:32
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Prada Slut, I was gonna reply, but I've changed my mind and now think we shouldOrange DeviI posted:Threadban prada slut
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Dec 27, 2021 06:57
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PRADA SLUT posted:Nothing, just that if the purpose of the OP is "recommendations for board games", It's not. The "purpose" of the OP is to be the OP of the Something Awful Board Games Thread, which is a subcommunity on this forum. One of the things it should do is answer the question "I'm thinking about getting into board games, but not quite to the level of actually posting in the thread and introducing myself to the community - what's a good place to start?", but that's not the only thing it should do. Another important thing to do is to give an overview of the subcommunity itself, and what people should expect if they decide to participate. If you don't actually understand the thread's norms then you're not really the right person to be giving input on how they should be conveyed IMO.
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Dec 27, 2021 07:03
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Orange DeviI posted:Threadban prada slut
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Dec 27, 2021 07:03
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Old Dun Cow posted:I agree with their reasoning, but I think some of them are bad enough or so situational that they mostly never get taken. For instance, Ritual Dagger gets you an arrow head and a card exile, which is ostensibly worth 3 compasses but costs 4. Sure, if you desperately need an arrow you might consider it, but the opportunity cost of doing that instead of exploring a Tier 3 site this or next turn is quite large. I don't disagree I find I don't take the artifacts a lot either, but I will if I can use the effect right now to make another play happen, usually. I agree some of the cards aren't as good as others. Usually I don't start focusing much on them unless I get some way to discount them, then they seem more appealing
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Dec 27, 2021 07:06
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Dec 27, 2021 07:19
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Jabor posted:If you don't actually understand the thread's norms then you're not really the right person to be giving input on how they should be conveyed IMO. Then I guess I was confused as to what who was the primary audience for the OP, and the OP's primary message, especially after reading the draft posted earlier. I was under the impression from reading the thread that the primary audience was "a person new to board games who wants recommendations for modern games" and the primary message was "recommendations for new players that are sub-$100, non-KS, etc."
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Dec 27, 2021 07:21
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Orange DeviI posted:Threadban prada slut
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Dec 27, 2021 07:39
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Played Bitoku on TTS earlier this evening. Cute game, great art (Shiba in a samurai helmet a++) but the game itself is just extremely meandering. Point salad to the extreme, never really had a goal, just kinda did stuff and in the end I won with nearly double the score of second player. The rulebook was also pretty dang terrible and poorly laid out.
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Dec 27, 2021 07:47
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Morpheus posted:The rulebook was also pretty dang terrible and poorly laid out. I wish Kickstarter stretch goals would be "hire a professional copy editor / rules reviewer / layout designer" instead of "this thing was cardboard, now it's wood"
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Dec 27, 2021 08:03
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can i reiterate that we should burn this thread to the ground and start again please
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Dec 27, 2021 08:30
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Just ordered The Crew: Mission Deep Sea (thanks, thread). Should I sleeve the smaller task cards? 96 cards is quite a lot and I'm worried whether they fit back in the box. Never played any version of The Crew, so I don't know how much shuffling and handling they have to take.
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Dec 27, 2021 11:09
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Magnetic North posted:That'd be a very good choice. Youve got Inis as both a medium and heavy game. Its also almost entirely unavailable like Chex. Typo on the name of Puerto Rico. Calico deserves a place on the list, as its in print and good.
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Dec 27, 2021 11:10
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Regardless of if the new thread is up or not, I’m gonna close this thread on the first of January, earlier if the new thread is up.
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Dec 27, 2021 11:28
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High Tension Wire posted:Just ordered The Crew: Mission Deep Sea (thanks, thread). Should I sleeve the smaller task cards? 96 cards is quite a lot and I'm worried whether they fit back in the box. It's not necessary to sleeve the smaller task cards. They don't get handled much, and there's also no real issue if they get a bit worn. The big cards, though, definitely consider sleeving. They're constantly being handled, and if you have any get marked or overly worn, it can have an effect on the game.
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Dec 27, 2021 12:55
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WhiteHowler posted:It's not necessary to sleeve the smaller task cards. They don't get handled much, and there's also no real issue if they get a bit worn. Thanks! Probably won't bother sleeving the small cards then. I tend to sleeve everything, but some card games with their too small inserts and boxes have really started to bug me. The newest edition of High Society is especially bad in this regard - you can't even use deckboxes 'cause of the tarot-sized cards.
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Dec 27, 2021 13:53
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Yeah, I sleeved High Society and it still fit, but it wasn't the greatest. I sleeved all of The Crew and Mission Deep Sea and they fit the box, but yeah, from a functionality perspective, you don't need to sleeve the small cards of either game at all. One last thing: Orange DeviI posted:Threadban prada slut
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Dec 27, 2021 13:59
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Magnetic North, As you mention big box stores for availability in your OP, can I make three suggestions mostly focused on games available from big box retailers? 2-player light: Azul* (* for technically 2-4) 3-5 light: Parks (I think if RollftGalaxy is Light, so is Parks; medium with Nightfall?) Threadban Prada Slut
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Dec 27, 2021 14:21
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Don't threadban prada slut
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Dec 27, 2021 14:27
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I appreciate the input from all the thread regulars.Bottom Liner posted:I did mean Antike Duellum and thought I edited that in but good catch. Only criticism for your OP is that it’s going to be a huge wall of text so I’d move the more meta-hobby stuff about publishers and all to a second post following the more informational stuff for readability. Saving these to refer to later. The more suggestions the better, although I am curating against availability and if I've seen the thread talk about them / they have at least some buzz. Tekopo posted:Regardless of if the new thread is up or not, I’m gonna close this thread on the first of January, earlier if the new thread is up.  yessirAdmiralty Flag posted:Magnetic North, Those are two worthy inclusions. And we are thinking the same thought: I was honestly thinking of putting in a few "widely available and pretty good starting places that might not quite be 'thread approved' " for things you can find at Target like Splendor, Love Letter, and TTR.
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Dec 27, 2021 16:35
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Finally got on board with aFfO. Good lord, that's a fun game  The pacing is excellent and the switch from "oh god how am I going to fill all this" to "good lord what do I do with all these fuckin tiles?!" is extremely satisfying, especially with the visual and physical representation of your progress.
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Dec 27, 2021 17:00
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Speaking of, finally pulled Through the Desert out of the Pile of Shame after almost two years, and dang, what a good game. It's essentially "party Go", I love it. It's also so visually pleasing with all the candy colored pastel camels. It's a shame so many of these Knizias are out-of-print, because I have half a mind to pick up Tigris & Euphrates but when the cheapest option for a new copy is to ship one from Japan for almost $100, I think I'm good.
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Dec 27, 2021 17:37
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The new OP could reasonably acknowledge, and summarize briefly (in no particular order) the current issues with: (1) bigoted game companies/CEOs (e.g. Gaming Goat), (2) designers of color, (3) representations of diversity in games (e.g. Alma Mater), and (4) the decolonization of tabletop gaming. Links to fuller discussions elsewhere would be fine, nobody needs to write the decisive NYT article on it. "Community recognition of these issues is growing; many of us talk and think about these more than we used to." Also, a black designer doesn't have to make a "black game" for their voice to be relevant. They will have different perspectives, even in a "regular" (whatever that means) game. Separate from that, there's interest out there in boosting the signals of BIPOC creatives and acknowledging the decades they've been contributing to the hobby.
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Dec 27, 2021 17:40
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