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MassivelyBuckNegro posted:West coast ports are on the verge of a lockout. Shits about to get real(expensive and delayed in the midst of post holiday restocking) haha this is like the perfect d&d bait on the one hand unions are good on the other they make six figures i really dunno what way they'd jump
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Jan 4, 2015 09:02
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Two Finger posted:haha this is like the perfect d&d bait Are you kidding? Of course they'd jump with the unions. Don't you realize that a six figure salary is considered a livable wage, especially on the West Coast?
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Jan 4, 2015 09:45
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i love california but yeah the living expenses are nuts. 142k a year is not really all that insane for living on the coast
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Jan 4, 2015 10:29
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ElMaligno posted:I wish I rook a picture of the bay area a couple of weeks ago, so many cargo ships at anchorage. Yeah, it's been pretty surreal going across the Bay Bridge and seeing a dozen container ships anchored out there.
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Jan 4, 2015 12:57
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Larry Parrish posted:i love california but yeah the living expenses are nuts. 142k a year is not really all that insane for living on the coast Long Beach is not Laguna Beach.
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Jan 4, 2015 13:59
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Wire chat- I pretend all the actors from the Wire wjo show up on the office are the same people under new Identities.
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Jan 4, 2015 14:18
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Two Finger posted:haha this is like the perfect d&d bait Well, they're causing massive losses for companies across the country, which is good because gently caress capitalism. But, those companies are laying people off on account of the ILWU's unwillingness to compromise on health care and jurisdiction over waterfront jobs so that's bad.
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Jan 4, 2015 14:37
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Panzeh posted:I ain't gonna bedgrudge somebody the ability to get fat checks for not doing a whole lot. A lot of guys in suits manage that. Also IT.
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Jan 4, 2015 15:26
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Stuart Scott really took his eye off the ball on the old prostate and testicular cancer checks, eh?
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Jan 4, 2015 16:37
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justice4trayvawn posted:Hint: They're educated, in demand and probably don't smoke a ton of meth what color is the sky in your world?
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Jan 4, 2015 17:22
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Larry Parrish posted:i love california but yeah the living expenses are nuts. 142k a year is not really all that insane for living on the coast Yup. LB might be cheaper than the surrounding area but rent is still pretty high. Food prices are pretty high, gas is more out here. Raising a family here on a poo poo salary has to stressful as gently caress.
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Jan 4, 2015 17:56
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Obama Africanus posted:Stuart Scott really took his eye off the ball on the old prostate and testicular cancer checks, eh? Jesus... I'm going to hell.
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Jan 4, 2015 19:40
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Panzeh posted:I ain't gonna bedgrudge somebody the ability to get fat checks for not doing a whole lot. A lot of guys in suits manage that. Also IT. Their profession is probably doomed anyway (at least the nonskilled laborers). Most dockwork will probably be handled by computers and robots in another 20 years. Amazon's already working on a similar system for their warehouses (and has already implemented an early version of it in some locations), and it wouldn't be too much to expand it to logistics hubs. psydude fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Jan 4, 2015 |
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Jan 4, 2015 21:37
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psydude posted:in another 20 years I wouldn't expect it to take that long. Your major hurdles there are going to be labor unions and whatever political backing they may still have. The technology is already there and I seriously doubt someone like Hanjin or Maersk is sitting on their hands in terms of finding ways to implement. Some company was talking about a fully autonomous cargo ship that they want operating within 10 years like a year or two ago, that's a far more complicated setup than offloading conex boxes.
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Jan 4, 2015 21:48
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http://www.joc.com/port-news/port-productivity/us-ports-weigh-value-terminal-automation-investment_20141002.html I don't know if you'll be able to see this or not without a subscription. But, yes, the longshoreman have started pricing themselves out of jobs.
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Jan 4, 2015 22:09
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MassivelyBuckNegro posted:http://www.joc.com/port-news/port-productivity/us-ports-weigh-value-terminal-automation-investment_20141002.html Unfortunately I can't, but I'm certainly interested in what the article has to say. Any other reporting sources?
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Jan 4, 2015 22:37
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http://pastebin.com/PGKCCSLX
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Jan 4, 2015 23:08
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Thanks. Good article. I'm sure ILWU is watching like a hawk, but when Middle Harbor and TraPac complete their automation efforts, and I think it mentioned a third one that was doing a study, I'd expect to start seeing other large terminals pushing that way. The hold-outs will likely be the Great Lakes terminals and river terminals. Smaller volumes so much less of a push / economic requirement. The surprise in that article is that ILWU doesn't seem massively opposed to it.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:17
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krispykremessuck posted:I wouldn't expect it to take that long. Your major hurdles there are going to be labor unions and whatever political backing they may still have. The technology is already there and I seriously doubt someone like Hanjin or Maersk is sitting on their hands in terms of finding ways to implement. i doubt we'll ever see fully autonomous ships, such a bad idea in just about every imaginable way
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Jan 4, 2015 23:42
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Two Finger posted:i doubt we'll ever see fully autonomous ships, such a bad idea in just about every imaginable way people in the tech thread in gbs jerk each other off about automated driving/cars I dont see it happening
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Jan 4, 2015 23:51
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iyaayas01 posted:e: If nothing else the series finale is well worth watching, and the exploration of the newsroom is very interesting if a little flawed. Remember that David Simon made his living in part as a reporter, so if there's one thing that he knows it's a newsroom. Season 5 is still the best exploration of the newspaper business depicted on TV. But I didn't like the characters. That one reporter/editor was an unbelievable Mary Sue, and the senior editors were pretty obviously based on editors he worked with and didn't like. Doesn't have nuance. And I didn't believe in the reporter's motivations for making up poo poo. Fabulists are inherently dishonest and manipulative people, but Simon seemed to make it about the changing nature of the news biz. Wasn't buying it. The shift to lean, digital media makes it more likely to publish unverified bullshit. (See: Gawker) But outright making up quotes requires a certain sociopathic personality. Narcissistic, persistent liars. Like Stephen Glass. Not honest people corrupted by the system. The running theme that institutions compromises/corrupts individuals doesn't translate in this instance. Journalistic institutions compromise people in other ways, especially with biases toward particular stories that make sure they get told (and told in a particular) way and not other stories. I'm nit picking here but yeah. BrutalistMcDonalds fucked around with this message at 01:30 on Jan 5, 2015 |
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Jan 5, 2015 00:02
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What The Wire does so well is handling a character when their story is done. These people never go away. They continue popping up in the show as they go on with their lives. No forced manner of keeping somebody around after they've logically fulfilled their purpose.
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Jan 5, 2015 00:09
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Two Finger posted:i doubt we'll ever see fully autonomous ships, such a bad idea in just about every imaginable way That was kind of my point. It's a far-fetched idea for a variety of reasons, but not because it's technologically insurmountable. Automated driving of cars/trucks is something vastly different and complex-for-different-reasons than ship driving. The questions about shipping are more political in nature, e.g., if it's completely automated how is sovereignty affected during ports-of-call operations, who is ultimately responsible in the case of an onboard accident, piracy prevention measures, certifications of masters, etc. Harbors, seas, and oceans aren't changing at an appreciably fast enough rate where it's truly a technological problem. And as far as ship-ship interactions, a long haul freighter probably sees less crossing-situations overall on a 8000 mile voyage than you do on a 10 mile drive. That says nothing about hybrid solutions like remote operations where it picks up pilots and/or tugs at an anchorage which make the rest of the voyage in. Your only question at that point becomes a logistics question re: underway repairs. Do you keep a mate/chief engineer on board to oversee that? That's still cheaper than paying a master to be drunk in his cabin with three helmsman to actually drive the ship for the whole voyage. Ship handling isn't simple, but it's a simpler on a macro level than driving a car. This says nothing about general port operations. There is no reason it can't be automated, and indeed it is being automated in places. I'm not jerking off about automation, it's just an inevitability. All this said, we're just some dudes on the internet. Real people at real companies get paid a lot to think about this, and they wouldn't be floating the idea of autonomous ships / hybrid solutions if they weren't serious possibilities. krispykremessuck fucked around with this message at 00:20 on Jan 5, 2015 |
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Jan 5, 2015 00:18
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Two Finger posted:i doubt we'll ever see fully autonomous ships, such a bad idea in just about every imaginable way There's a pretty cool Economist article (still behind the paywall) in the end-of-year edition about modern shipping and it also agrees with this, but the ships and unloading process are already quite automated. Big ships are neat. Edit: VVV I read it in the magazine and have been having a hard time finding it, but it was in the last one of the year. It's more broad than the conversation here but it's a cool read and I'll see if I can find it online. Johnny Five-Jaces fucked around with this message at 00:46 on Jan 5, 2015 |
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Jan 5, 2015 00:36
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AgentSythe posted:There's a pretty cool Economist article (still behind the paywall) in the end-of-year edition about modern shipping and it also agrees with this, but the ships and unloading process are already quite automated. Big ships are neat. Can you link this article?
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Jan 5, 2015 00:39
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krispykremessuck posted:I wouldn't expect it to take that long. Your major hurdles there are going to be labor unions and whatever political backing they may still have. 
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Jan 5, 2015 04:07
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MassivelyBuckNegro posted:http://www.economist.com/news/technology-quarterly/21598318-autonomous-cargo-vessels-could-set-sail-without-crew-under-watchful-eye Thanks, bud. Good reads. I don't really take away from these what AgentSythe did, but maybe I missed something.
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Jan 5, 2015 06:05
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just from my personal experience there is absolutely no substitute for having a person there. a machine might pick up a pressure drop but it might miss that the pressure drop is from a fountain of oil. There are just so many situations where having a person there is irreplaceable. Firefighting, for example. Day to day operations absolutely can and should be automated, but the whole reason a crew needs to be there is for the out of the ordinary situations
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Jan 5, 2015 06:17
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Two Finger posted:just from my personal experience there is absolutely no substitute for having a person there. a machine might pick up a pressure drop but it might miss that the pressure drop is from a fountain of oil. There are just so many situations where having a person there is irreplaceable. Firefighting, for example. Day to day operations absolutely can and should be automated, but the whole reason a crew needs to be there is for the out of the ordinary situations I agree. The human element can be minimized but it wont likely be eliminated in the near future.
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Jan 5, 2015 06:48
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MassivelyBuckNegro posted:I agree. The human element can be minimized but it wont likely be eliminated in the near future. theres always gonna be a need for human operators and watchers but the days of unskilled manual labor getting 200+k wage/bennies because they can hold poo poo hostage is going to be over. RonMexicosPitbull fucked around with this message at 07:43 on Jan 5, 2015 |
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Jan 5, 2015 07:40
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And also 50 longshoremen will be replaced by a few technicians and a couple of operators who oversee everything. I guess the moral of the story here is use your GI bill.
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Jan 5, 2015 14:06
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psydude posted:I guess the moral of the story here is use your GI bill. Yep, because the world needs more rhetoric or film majors.
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Jan 5, 2015 15:21
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Nick Soapdish posted:Yep, because the world needs more rhetoric or film majors. Yeah because clearly that's what I was advocating instead of getting the training and education required to become an equipment technician, machinist, mechanical engineer, systems engineer, or any of the other trained and educated professions that are involved in what I was just talking about.
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Jan 5, 2015 15:28
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psydude posted:Yeah because clearly that's what I was advocating instead of getting the training and education required to become an equipment technician, machinist, mechanical engineer, systems engineer, or any of the other trained and educated professions that are involved in what I was just talking about. Underwater basket
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Jan 5, 2015 15:51
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When I graduate, I'm going to follow my dreams and open a yarn shop!
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Jan 5, 2015 22:05
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WarpedNaba posted:When I graduate, I'm going to follow my dreams and open a yarn shop! I guess grannies need lovin too.
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Jan 5, 2015 22:49
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WarpedNaba posted:When I graduate, I'm going to follow my dreams and open a yarn shop! Build 5" wide looms for under $20 in parts and sell them for $145. http://www.mirrixlooms.com/store/5-mini-mirrix-loreli-loom/
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Jan 5, 2015 22:52
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Probably good money in owning a Jo-Ann Fabrics.
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Jan 5, 2015 22:58
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WarpedNaba posted:When I graduate, I'm going to follow my dreams and open a yarn shop! Lots of yarn shops up in Washington. Get good w/ some alpaca farmers, live out your days in some quiet Puget Sound town, drink beers, smoke weeds.
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