Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
Are you a
This poll is closed.
homeowner 39 22.41%
renter 69 39.66%
stupid peace of poo poo 66 37.93%
Total: 174 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
  • Locked thread
sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









A totara has fallen in the great forest of Tane.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









merry loving Christmas!

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Ghostlight posted:

And on the gripping hand: Gareth Morgan hates cats, so gently caress him and his party. Him floating [universal basic income] is useful, but I'll get someone else to implement it, thanks. Someone who doesn't want to murder half my family.

why do you hate tuis and kaka

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Displeased Moo Cow posted:

yeah and this is sort of my point. Criminalising cannabis to the extent that we do seems a bit silly, but legalising it will transfer (a probably lesser) burden from Police to the ministry of health, who have already proven that they couldn't control the legal sale of synthetic cannabinoids - how will they cope with what will be sold with the actual thing?

then there is the home grown element. As soon as legal synnies like K2 or w/e were being sold people were already trying to flood the market with their frickin lawn clippings laced with morphine and chlorine in order to get a quick and powerful high.

Most people aren't going to be stupid about this sort of thing once real weed does become legal but it will only take a couple of stupid idiots lacing their pot with something dumb like telazol or some poo poo to get a new high and then the drums of prohibition will start beating again.

someone think
of

the children

synthetics are illegal, they passed a law that said you could sell them if they were proven safe, then changed the law to make it literally impossible to do that because you can't do animal or human testing using synthetics. so instead of having a regulated and reasonably safe market place we have an unregulated black market. it was fairly retarded.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









bike tory posted:

They were only unfunny if you don't have a sense of humour :colbert:

They were like a loud nerd yelling the parrot sketch, but politics

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Displeased Moo Cow posted:

Two people I know who are left of centre independently told me that they are no longer voting greens because of the resignations. Only two votes, but yeah, not ideal.

...and the echoing laughter of thirsting Gareth Morgans...

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Pararoid posted:

Having read an unreasonable amount of Gareth's ranting, I'm pretty convinced he would prefer to work with a National government in any case.

:frogon:

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









exmarx posted:

Kind of interesting that ardern & shaw are letting Winston do all the "petty" complaining stuff

I think it's clever, Winston can do his dog/bone act and jacinda gets to be above it all. not to mention we've just had an object lesson in What Matters for politicians so everything bill e did is potentially going to be viewed through that lens.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Varkk posted:

Pretty sure that would have been a letter to reader's digest but with Democrat/Republican back in Ronald Reagan's day.

http://welcometotherepublicanparty.tumblr.com/

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









exmarx posted:

It's treating basic consumer choice as activism/a replacement for actual positive change

That's fatuous.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Vulpes posted:

For all intensive purposes, you can take it for granite that he's a good guy.

owns so brutal you'll need to call teh armed defenders squad

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









klen dool posted:

It's a joke, intentionally mispronouncing armed offenders squad.

never change, nzd&d thread

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk











im the black dot of pure becoming

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









oohhboy posted:

Some tradie joker just about T-boned me running a hard red missing me by 200ms. gently caress that guy.

had that happen a few weeks back in Newtown some idiotic oval office just charging through a red, if I'd been paying like 10% less attention my daughter would be dead.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









El Pollo Blanco posted:

Has Morgan ever actually shown how taxing imputed rents will solve the housing crisis, which seems to be what he claims?

doesn't it take away the gigantic tax advantage of property? seems straightforward?

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









bike tory posted:

It's one of those ideas that work in pure economic theory but not necessarily in practice because it assumes people are pure rational actors. Kinda like the entire neoliberal ideology.

Taxing imputed rent only hits people living in the houses they own (or houses they own but aren't renting out I guess). The theory is that if you tax imputed rent then people are more likely to invest their money in other (theoretically more productive) areas of the economy. So people will be less likely to own their own home and demand for houses goes down.

It's dumb and would require a whole raft of other policies not to totally gently caress over most of the people who own houses, but whatever. Don't give Gareth Morgan more consideration than he deserves.

Well if their ideas are dumb then criticise them, but they seem well enough thought out. Right now you'd be stupid not to buy as many houses as you can get so you get that sweet free money, if you're loaded. Making that less desirable seems a good thing. What are the labour/national equivalent policies for addressing the housing problem?

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









klen dool posted:

I listened to Peter dunne being interviewed by John Campbell the other day, and he was talking about his approach to drug policy and it seemed really sane and progressive - he certainly wanted to change that.

yeah he was actually doing a good job on that, I spoke at a conference after him and he was talking about how much better it would be to have a public health approach and how proud he was that the new legislation he'd sponsored would do that.

then literally two days later there was a giant media freak out about stoned maoris and he flip flopped like a pair of $5 Warehouse jandals, it was magical to behold.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Based on 2014 results, this is a nice presentation of data.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









WarpedNaba posted:

Did we not know this already?

lookit Knowy "Did we not know this already' McKnowerson over here

(I agree it's not surprising at all, just a nice presentation. I'd be really interested in the same chart from this year)

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









slinkimalinki posted:

Bennett has made a career out of hounding people into making bad choices, so I'm conflicted.

have you read the anonymous accusation letter that was floating around a couple of months back? unproven, but nothing very implausible in it. Bennett is a dick.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Displeased Moo Cow posted:

I'm more interested in this Paula Bennett thing tbh I'm all for hounding out another woman who has done well for herself after living in benefits

its her turn

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Slavvy posted:

Probably the funniest thing I've seen all week.

I know geoff and he's a lovely fellow, they should have had him front a lot earlier imo

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









exmarx posted:

Pity about his dogshit politics

lol

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Varkk posted:

Internet party was excusable because of Laila and Hone. TOP is just bad.

why are we supposed to hate them again?

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









so the policies are bad, apart from all the good ones?

making rich people pay more tax is an explicit part of their tax policy afaict, for all its not 'realistic'.

i've swung back to labour personally, but I like what they've added to the mix, a sense that it's permissible to actually change assumptions and not just tinker round the edges.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









bike tory posted:

No it's the particular collection of policies that, as a whole, don't work. Like he wants to drastically reduce returns on capital (specifically in the housing stock) through an imputed rent tax, but doesn't want a capital gains tax (he wants to stop property speculation, but sets out a plan that only taxes owner-occupyers). He wants to increase returns on labour over returns on capital and to decrease income tax across the board (though more so on lower incomes) but has literally no employment policies or mention of increased protection for workers. He wants the government to very tightly regulate the rental market, but also wants to completely privatise Housing NZ. He wants what he calls a "universal" basic income targeted at families with young kids, families with low incomes, and the elderly, but wants to remove paid parental leave, in-work tax credits and superannuation (so these groups would actually get a lot less money). That's just off the top of my head, I cbf reading through his policy documents again to be more specific. The point is, he sets out this inconsistent web of policy that he claims is evidence based, but really he's cherry picking specific policies from specific countries without examining the context of those policies and why they work in the environments that they do. So, like I said, individually a lot of his policies are good, but on the whole it's a mess.

thanks, this is a really helpful and thoughtful analysis.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









truther posted:

Do not listen to the person telling people it's a waste of their vote.
Do not listen to the person who has posted racist remarks.
Do not listen to the person who tells you not to vote for TOP because Morgan has money.
Do not listen to the person who tells you TOP is "dangerous" to the country.

bike tory is literally the last person you should listen to when it comes to deciding where your vote goes.
Go read his history and then decide if he's the guy you want to depend on to be unbiased.

I thought it was a fair read on why someone might not like them, for all that I don't necessarily agree. they are a hail Mary third party without a support base so it's not a big deal either way.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









bike tory posted:

I was pointing out the inconsistencies; their basic income ($200/w for three years) is great, but removing paid parental leave (~$500/w for 18 weeks) probably means single parents won't be able to afford to take much time off work, if any because 200/week is not enough to survive on. It isn't misleading to say they're removing paid parental leave because they are, their basic income is not the same thing.

but if you're working you'd still get it, you could save it? doesn't seem self evidently absurd.
(efb)

lol at Gareth entering the culture wars, he will be scalped

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









bike tory posted:

It's ok, Morgan decided to undertake some thorough research into the Treaty and concluded that actually it's alright. He wrote a book about it. Personally I'm really glad he cleared they up for everyone.

he gave a speech about it a week or two back

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









El Pollo Blanco posted:

Gareth is done after the election, Simmons will take over TOP leadership, it seems. They might actually gain some ground next election.

Simmons is a good guy, I've done a bunch of improv shows with him.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Varkk posted:

New poll out and apparently National hasn't polled this low since Bill English was their leader.

that's a lol

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









do the Germans have a word for metiria tureis emotional state right now?

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Somfin posted:

Wow all those facts and all of them are on one side of the national/labour divide hmmmm



lolol

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Midget Fist posted:

I really just want to vote for the sweet release of death but I guess I have to vote for a legitimate party.

a stake for the heart, a hammer to the head.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









SurreptitiousMuffin posted:

Anybody got a bead on the latest poll results? I thought they weren't meant to drop until 6pm but people are already talking about them.

words like 'devastating' and swear words like 'holy loving shitballs' are being used, but that might just be people being excitable.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









El Pollo Blanco posted:

How many of them aren't middle-class white men?

National is known to be specifically prejudiced against non-white lesbians, it's true.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Wandle Cax posted:

Morgan is such a dummy that even when he might have some semblance of a point he makes himself look like such a dickhead expressing it that nobody will take him seriously. Hiring Plunket as his press guy certainly has not helped his cause either though it has provided some comedy gold on twitter

Geoff Simmons does great :smuggo: in this

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









El Pollo Blanco posted:

Lol the Reid poll was probably accurate.

English gets a big 5% jump to be 6% ahead of Ardern in preferred PM, which is clearly the important info here.

e: daily gently caress TOP update https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/20-09-2017/mike-joy-i-wrote-a-facebook-status-and-top-called-it-an-endorsement/

Editor’s note: As noted above, Mike Joy now acknowledges that he emailed TOP to discuss a statement, and TOP did not use his Facebook post without his permission.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









I think we can't deny it's been an election game and at the end of the day the team with the most points can ask Winston Posters for the trophy

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









voted, straight Ban1080 ticket.

  • Locked thread