Who What Now posted:This really stands out to me as trying to romanticize (not the best word but I can't think of an alternative) suicide by framing it as a logical and perhaps even laudable choice. At the very least the OP frames suicide in a much more favorable light than the other examples of "life-ruining" actions despite the fact that tattoos and piercings are only life-ruining because of social stigma that has started to disappear, addiction is a treatable illness, and bankruptcy does not necessarily mean one will be homeless (although this happens depressingly often), meaning that none of them are truly as permanent to suicide and are thus false equivalences. And it's not like plenty of other people haven't romanticized suicide as well, pop culture does it all the time and has forever, although this is the first time I've seen the argument that it is necessarily and inevitable conclusion if one just thinks of life objectively and logically. Which is also an incorrect conclusion because there really is no more objective reason to kill oneself than there is to stay alive. If people can convince society that they have a good reason for killing themselves, like people with debilitating terminal illness, then honestly I don't believe they should be stopped. But "because I feel pretty 'meh' about this whole life thing" is not a sufficiently good reason like the OP asserts. Frankly, given the high possibility of suicidal ideation by the OP, posts like these are dangerously, possibly even criminally irresponsible.
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Jan 30, 2015 19:49
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One of my friends ended their life a few years ago. From his character, I don't believe it was an impulsive thing, but rather something that he reasoned himself into. He didn't tell anyone in advance, and it came as a complete shock. Another friend attempted but failed. As a result of this she was effectively imprisoned for something that has not been a crime for decades, forcefully drugged, and placed on suicide watch (this is where you are placed in a room with constant illumination, no possessions, and are woken up every 3 hours until your mental state improves  ). I'm fairly certain she was sexually assaulted while there too. I'm aware that isn't part of the official program, but when you have people that believe they know what's better for other people and can act without their consent, that breeds a mindset that can foster all kinds of abuse.Maybe it's because I don't believe in an afterlife, but I have a feeling which of the two had the better overall experience. The perverse incentive that this system creates is that if you want to end your own life, it's 'best' to not tell anyone and to use the fastest and most reliable means at your disposal. This is awful for all kinds of reasons. Maybe we as a society need to get over the pro-life thing and allow people to end their life in a controlled and consensual environment. One where people can talk about it in advance, let people know without being told that they are insane, get their affairs in order without needing to be secretive, and maybe change their mind (but not be treated like a criminal if they don't). One where multiple appointments are required to ensure it isn't an impulsive thing, but which admits at the end that there is only one person that owns your body and that they are not the judge of what is or isn't a good enough reason. It might at least encourage people to talk about it in the open more, and prevent botched and public suicides. Rime posted:Should have posted in GBS instead.  "
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Jan 30, 2015 19:51
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Effectronica posted:Frankly, given the high possibility of suicidal ideation by the OP, posts like these are dangerously, possibly even criminally irresponsible. I was saying that it's a bad thing to do, not that he should continue.
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Jan 30, 2015 20:04
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Who What Now posted:I was saying that it's a bad thing to do, not that he should continue. *whoosh*
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Jan 30, 2015 20:08
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Either stop being a bitch and just loving kill yourself already or grow some balls and call somebody, anybody and get help right now. Friends, family, suicide hotline, doesn't matter just find support. But really if you're making such a poo poo thread you already know you should kill yourself. -GBS
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Jan 30, 2015 20:40
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Guavanaut posted:One where people can talk about it in advance, let people know without being told that they are insane They aren't generally "insane" but they generally have some sort of mental illness (generally treatable) and it is absolutely not correct that we should pretend that's not the case. I'm sorry your friend got lovely psychiatric help, but what she should have gotten is better psychiatric help, not assistance killing herself.
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Jan 30, 2015 20:52
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I disagree first with the premise, that society currently enables "life-ruining actions." While it is true that you can do these things without legal intervention, there are other forms of social intervention, from family members, friends, co-workers, classmates, teachers, church members, etc. While life-ruining actions are encouraged by certain (harmful) people, which is especially bad when encouraged amongst the impressionable, these are generally contrarian views that go against the mainstream. For instance, many musicians might promote alcoholism, but mainstream culture says that alcoholism is bad. Whether people should have the liberty to end their lives or not, I think everyone ultimately does have this freedom, insofar as they have access to means to end their life. But whether more effective and painless means should be made available -- such as, say, a suicide pill available over the counter -- this might prove to result in a lot of unnecessary suicides. And by "unnecessary" I mean, something wherein if they had not done it in a moment of weakness, they would have gone on to live a satisfactory life.
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Jan 30, 2015 22:02
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Guavanaut posted:The perverse incentive that this system creates is that if you want to end your own life, it's 'best' to not tell anyone and to use the fastest and most reliable means at your disposal. This is awful for all kinds of reasons. The people you are describing are not rational actors making the best decisions for themselves, they're people with hosed up brain chemistry. There's a homeless man I regularly encounter in my area with schizophrenia, who is making the decision to avoid treatment because he has psychotic delusions about medical practitioners. Would you shrug your shoulders and say that it's fine because it's his choice? No, because he's unable to understand his own situation. When children want to eat nothing but candy for every meal, do we let them because it's their bodies? No, because we understand that their brains are still developing and they're not in a position to make the best choices for themselves. Do we encourage people to make important decisions under the influence of drugs or alcohol? Again no, because things are physically degrading their ability to make decisions. I know people who would have gone through your whole end of life process and very calmly and consensually come to the decision to kill themselves. Instead of that happening people intervened, they got on the right medication and therapy regimes and are now happy with their lives.
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Jan 30, 2015 22:24
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The closest thing I have heard of to a rational choice to end one's life other than in cases of terminal illness is this Belgian rapist and murderer who says he is unable to put a stop to his impulses: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...on-9961262.html He may have a point, but his request has been denied for reasons I find compelling. The state shouldn't even give the implicit impression that it is encouraging anyone to commit suicide.
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Jan 30, 2015 22:53
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evilweasel posted:I am not aware of any statistics to this effect,. However if there were, the more logical assumption is that high intelligence and mental illnesses are comorbid -- that the genes/environmental factors/etc that cause high intelligence (however defined) also tend to cause depression. I would not come to the conclusion that the more intelligent you are the more likely you are to realize suicide is the rational choice. If memory serves there is a connection between high intelligence and being a negative, depressed grumpy butt though it isn't a direct link. Humans tend to form social groups with peers and that includes intelligence. We don't generally like to hang around people that make us feel like idiots so people of average intelligence aren't likely to hang around people that are extremely smart. Similarly people that are far off on the end of the bell curve are more likely to find dealing with average people frustrating. There are also more problems when you consider that the very intelligent tend to become better educated. Suddenly "peers" becomes a smaller group. Meanwhile ten people with PhDs in the same field have a lot to talk about but a person with a PhD and an perfectly average person with no college education may have absolutely nothing to talk about. The very intelligent end up with a much smaller pool of potential friends and are also more likely to focus very heavily on their field. Humans are extremely social creatures after all and the things that make us happiest are having friends and having sex. Give a person a smaller pool of potential friends and mates and the next thing you know they have an insufficient social circle which increases the risk of depression. Social isolation and sexual frustration can do absolutely terrible things to people on a psychological level. There is also the problem that, in a lot of times and places, the kid who focused hard on their studies was likely to be bullied and mistreated by the other kids. That can lead to long term psychological problems. No idea if this is bullshit or not, I just read it in a few places. It seems to make sense.
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Jan 31, 2015 02:56
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You're thinking in the wrong direction. We should try to prevent people from ruining their lives and rehabilitate them if they do. We should not "allow people to sink further and further into ruination and not lift a finger." If the motivation for suicide is the pointlessness of the "rat race," we should change the rat race. No one should ever have their life ruined if they run out of money: that's a political issue.
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Jan 31, 2015 02:56
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Sizone posted:If sanity is a measure of seeing the world objectively and intelligence is, at least partially, a measure of clarity of taking in and processing information, then sanity and intelligence are correlates. Very creative or ingenious people also have a higher chance of getting schizophrenia and other mental disorders.
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Jan 31, 2015 04:38
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ToxicSlurpee posted:Similarly people that are far off on the end of the bell curve are more likely to find dealing with average people frustrating. "Intelligence" is a dubious and vague measurement of people, in my opinion. America Inc. fucked around with this message at 05:05 on Jan 31, 2015 |
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Jan 31, 2015 05:02
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LookingGodIntheEye posted:I know this is completely anecdotal, but I hear this quite a lot and I wonder how true it really is. I have an IQ of 133 (not really the best measurement of intelligence, but a commonly accepted one) which is apparently within 5% of the population (statistically speaking, that is an outlier) and I don't find it difficult to talk and make friends with most people, even people that clearly aren't very intelligent. Some people do get intimidated or overexaggerate you as a person though, which can be alienating. It's probably not very true and people are likely thinking the social isolation people far from the norm generally experience as children is continued in adult life.
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Jan 31, 2015 05:13
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Effectronica posted:It's probably not very true and people are likely thinking the social isolation people far from the norm generally experience as children is continued in adult life. It can for some, it does not for others. From what I read I remember the stuff basically saying "this is a tendency but not an absolute rule." Like it's one of those things that is statistically significant but like most things psychological it isn't "be born smart -> die young of depression." Some of history's best geniuses lived to be really loving old while leading social lives.
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Jan 31, 2015 05:31
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I'm pretty sure averagely intelligent people find it pretty frustrating to deal with averagely intelligent people too. And stupid people. And very smart people. Because people are loving frustrating. If you can't come to terms with that and learn to enjoy other people anyway then you really have hosed up the whole life thing.
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Jan 31, 2015 06:09
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More recent research has found there's really nothing to back up the claim that smart people can't mingle with people of "normal" or even subpar intelligence. First off, intelligence is more than just a number, it's pretty flexible. Most people are smart in one area and maybe lacking in another, I'm not suggesting I'm hyper intelligent but for example my talents lie in psychology and academia but a non college educated carpenter could kick my rear end at every turn in knowing how to construct a home. Second, we have different friends that w hang out with for different reasons. "Smart" people are not instantly incapable of, say, enjoying a football game like everyone else. Theres nothing to suggest they can't find common ground with less "Academic" activities, and have another circle of college educated friends. What there is a correlation for is that people with higher IQs are more likely to suffer from mentalr illness, and vice-versa. Why that is is an excellent question with a lot of possible answers but it does basically say that "smarter" people may be more likely to suffer from clinical depression and other illnesses that would lead to suicidal thoughts than someone of average intelligence. RagnarokAngel fucked around with this message at 09:53 on Jan 31, 2015 |
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Jan 31, 2015 09:51
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GhostofJohnMuir posted:The people you are describing are not rational actors making the best decisions for themselves, they're people with hosed up brain chemistry. There's a homeless man I regularly encounter in my area with schizophrenia, who is making the decision to avoid treatment because he has psychotic delusions about medical practitioners. Would you shrug your shoulders and say that it's fine because it's his choice? No, because he's unable to understand his own situation. When children want to eat nothing but candy for every meal, do we let them because it's their bodies? No, because we understand that their brains are still developing and they're not in a position to make the best choices for themselves. Do we encourage people to make important decisions under the influence of drugs or alcohol? Again no, because things are physically degrading their ability to make decisions. I know people who would have gone through your whole end of life process and very calmly and consensually come to the decision to kill themselves. Instead of that happening people intervened, they got on the right medication and therapy regimes and are now happy with their lives. That sounds like circular reasoning to me, not to mention highly reductionist. I wouldn't want a society where we can dismiss people's agency or their higher thought processes so easily. Philipp Mainländer ended his life after finishing his treatise The Philosophy of Redemption and concluding that living was a fruitless endeavor. Was that 'messed up brain chemistry', or was he actually right? He proved it to his own satisfaction, and I don't believe I can discredit his philosophy just because I personally disagree with his final application of it. I also think some modes of thought get categorized as 'abnormal' because "they're different and I don't like them". I recall some studies that people with moderate depression have a more realistic analysis of things than typical people, so-called 'depressive realism'. Of course, this then had to be shot down with a variety of hasty rationalizations after-the-fact, because god forbid that optimist-biased thought isn't best thought. (Maybe the optimists have a disorder where they always have to think that they are right, we should investigate their brain chemistry.  )We shouldn't be encouraging undecided people to end their lives, but if they have proved to their own satisfaction and will not be discouraged, then keeping them alive against their will seems cruel and unusual. And getting the whole process out into the open might mean that there are less people ending their lives by trucker or train driver or cop or public building, methods that have profoundly negative effects to others. Philip Nitschke (admittedly far from unbiased as a euthanasia advocate, but a man with direct experience) even believes that people would be less likely to end their lives if there was a formal process in place, because the spur of the moment fervor gets replaced with "it's there if I need it."
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Jan 31, 2015 13:22
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Guavanaut posted:Philip Nitschke (admittedly far from unbiased as a euthanasia advocate, but a man with direct experience) even believes that people would be less likely to end their lives if there was a formal process in place, because the spur of the moment fervor gets replaced with "it's there if I need it." I think this might be the best solution. I don't really see the difference between crippling, untreatable depression and a crippling, untreatable physical pain. That said depression/bipolar disorder can frequently be treated with medication so I doubt euthanasia for depression would be approved very often. It might also make depression seem like a normal problem and have more people seek treatment, which would be good.
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Jan 31, 2015 20:04
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The thing is though that depression is very rarely "untreatable". Even severely depressed people can be taught coping skills or have their lives improved. In very rare cases electroshock therapy, while extremely unpleasant, has worked as a last ditch effort to people suffering from depression. It's romanticizing depression to claim they absolutely totally understand their own situation. They certainly have a better grasp on it than most but almost always depression is a temporary problem, suicide is a permanent solution. Someone suffering from terminal cancer and is on life support has a permanent problem, a permanent solution is apt. Depression stems from brain chemist, bad relationships, poor financial situations, or any number of problems, these can be fixed. It might not be easy but it can be fixed, sometimes the issue is at a societal level which means it can be changed, as opposed to say cancer which is biological and you cant convince cancer to stop. And you will never get a situation where people can choose to end their life in some legal fashion because people are not an island. We value personal agency especially in the west but most people have families and they have friends, I cannot ever imagine there being a situation where someone comes out to their family and says "Mom, dad I've decided to commit suicide" and it would be accepted, even if it was legally permitted.
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Jan 31, 2015 20:11
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Glenn Zimmerman posted:I think this might be the best solution. I don't really see the difference between crippling, untreatable depression and a crippling, untreatable physical pain. That said depression/bipolar disorder can frequently be treated with medication so I doubt euthanasia for depression would be approved very often. It might also make depression seem like a normal problem and have more people seek treatment, which would be good. Depression is hardly ever untreatable, it just seems that way because depression impedes your ability to seek help.
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Jan 31, 2015 20:13
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RagnarokAngel posted:The thing is though that depression is very rarely "untreatable". Even severely depressed people can be taught coping skills or have their lives improved. In very rare cases electroshock therapy, while extremely unpleasant, has worked as a last ditch effort to people suffering from depression. quote:It's romanticizing depression to claim they absolutely totally understand their own situation. They certainly have a better grasp on it than most but almost always depression is a temporary problem, suicide is a permanent solution. Someone suffering from terminal cancer and is on life support has a permanent problem, a permanent solution is apt. Depression stems from brain chemist, bad relationships, poor financial situations, or any number of problems, these can be fixed. It might not be easy but it can be fixed, sometimes the issue is at a societal level which means it can be changed, as opposed to say cancer which is biological and you cant convince cancer to stop. Question: would you support euthanasia for people suffering from chronic, horrible physical pain that is also not terminal? Theoretically there could be a treatment in the future but it strikes me as cruel to force them to wait for one if they don't want to. quote:And you will never get a situation where people can choose to end their life in some legal fashion because people are not an island. We value personal agency especially in the west but most people have families and they have friends, I cannot ever imagine there being a situation where someone comes out to their family and says "Mom, dad I've decided to commit suicide" and it would be accepted, even if it was legally permitted. - Popular Thug Drink posted:Depression is hardly ever untreatable, it just seems that way because depression impedes your ability to seek help. I agree. I was speaking more in a philosophical "Would this be moral?" not a pragmatic "Will this be common?"
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Jan 31, 2015 20:30
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I'd support it in that situation sure, but mental illness is a lot harder to analyze than a medical problem. We can do CAT scans and such but we don't truly understand how the brain works, determining truly untreatable depression versus "very hard to treat" depression is a lot trickier than "well we tried every pill we got and your chronic pain isn't stopping" (Even if pain is also psychological in nature, it's a much more sudden and obvious problem then being depressed). Many of the truly untreatably depressed will, unfortunately, eventually silently kill themselves anyway when they don't tell anyone and just do it. It happens far too frequently because we can't watch over someones shoulder every day for the rest of their life. I also disagree with your notion that people would "understand" state sanctioned suicide. It'd only take one psychiatrist making a mistake to mess it up. Things like terminal illness get scrutinized badly enough and that's pretty cut and dry that the person would have eventually died soon enough. Someone deciding to commit suicide, and then follows through, leads to very messy open ended situations about "could this have been prevented?".
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Jan 31, 2015 20:38
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RagnarokAngel posted:The thing is though that depression is very rarely "untreatable". Even severely depressed people can be taught coping skills or have their lives improved. In very rare cases electroshock therapy, while extremely unpleasant, has worked as a last ditch effort to people suffering from depression. That's a platitude though, it's arbitrary and fallacious to say that we "know better" than someone considering suicide. For example, if a prisoner in gitmo tries to kill themselves what are we supposed to say to dissuade them? Live as an example of stoic endurance to others? Nurture false hope in a way out of their predicament? They're almost certainly clinically depressed, but at the same time they are making an informed choice.
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Jan 31, 2015 20:45
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Guavanaut posted:Your evidence for their 'messed up brain chemistry' is that they didn't want to continue living, because 'correct brain chemistry' requires wanting to cling on to life, so their brain chemistry is not that, which means that they shouldn't be allowed to make their own decisions on the subject of whether they should continue living. No my evidence that they have hosed up brain chemistry is because if you give them the right mix of selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors they no longer have the crippling feelings which bring on the desire to kill themselves. I'm not going to buy into your "maybe they see things with clearer eyes" rhetoric because I have a friend who I just met for dinner and bowling last night who three years ago couldn't leave her house due to crippling depression culminating in an attempt to overdose on pills. Instead of considering whether or not the person who couldn't muster the energy to leave bed for days at a time was truly the wisest of us, we kept her the gently caress away from sharp things, worked to get her the help she needed and after a lot of work and pain she's doing much better. Again, when a schizophrenic who has thought long and hard and come to the conclusion that he has to disassemble his car because all the signs point to that being the avenue the Illuminati is using to spy on him, he is not given the benefit of the doubt. The path you are advocating is shrugging your shoulder and saying that the mentally ill should be left to struggle through life on their own because who are we to say what a functional brain looks like. Maybe we're all just blinding ourselves to the machinations of Satan and Quetzalcoatl and this is the one guy who has managed to see past all the bullshit.
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Jan 31, 2015 20:53
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SedanChair posted:That's a platitude though, it's arbitrary and fallacious to say that we "know better" than someone considering suicide. For example, if a prisoner in gitmo tries to kill themselves what are we supposed to say to dissuade them? Live as an example of stoic endurance to others? Nurture false hope in a way out of their predicament? They're almost certainly clinically depressed, but at the same time they are making an informed choice. Most depressed people are physically capable of seeking help, their depression just holds them back. Snuffing out your entire life due to that reason alone is wasteful.
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Jan 31, 2015 20:55
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It's not like once you've stopped someone from doing it, their free will in the matter is terminated. They can try again once their 72 hour hold is over if they really want to. Yet most people who attempt don't go on to actually do it, so presumably there was some change in their state of life value calculation.
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Jan 31, 2015 21:44
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ewxhKEuz3Q
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Feb 1, 2015 01:08
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zoux posted:Because suicide is almost never made by a rational mind, but a sick one. It's one thing for a person with a terminal diagnosis to choose to end their lives with dignity, it's another for a healthy 20 year old with treatable depression to kill themselves. I don't buy that. http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21099039 I knew someone who killed themselves because they didn't want to face the drudgery of a life's work, two people possibly. I've thought about it routinely as an alternative to loneliness (which is not a sickness.) There's nothing inherently worthwhile about living for as long as possible. We tell ourselves these fictions about how such and such person must be tormented, must have been desperate but afraid to seek help etc to reduce the dissonance we feel from being overly attached to life. Sometimes people just get bored or the rewards from going on don't compensate the troubles. Pegged Lamb fucked around with this message at 01:57 on Feb 1, 2015 |
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Feb 1, 2015 01:52
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That link doesn't work but I assume based on the title you're conflating "irrational" with "incapable of constructing a complex plan" which isn't the same thing. Depressed people are frequently capable of thinking complicated thoughts its the premises that are wrong. If anything they end up thinking too much and obsessing over the negative qualities rather than the positives. And not to dishonor your friends memory but committing suicide because someone was bored with their job isn't indicative of a rational mind, even if it seems like they weighed their options.
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Feb 1, 2015 01:57
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RagnarokAngel posted:That link doesn't work but I assume based on the title you're conflating "irrational" with "incapable of constructing a complex plan" which isn't the same thing. Depressed people are frequently capable of thinking complicated thoughts its the premises that are wrong. If anything they end up thinking too much and obsessing over the negative qualities rather than the positives. I fixed the link. This guy was apparently incredibly methodical, so much so that I doubt he couldn't quantify what he stood to lose. He wasn't bored with his job he was daunted by the prospect of 40-50 years or ennui. Why is that irrational? Doesn't preference enter into it? He wasn't a father or custodian of a child or beholden to anyone. He simply put a bag over his head, opted not to leave a note and was done with it. Pegged Lamb fucked around with this message at 02:02 on Feb 1, 2015 |
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Feb 1, 2015 02:00
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People can obsess about one thing to the exclusion of all other things. We do it all the time in fact, its where "missing the forest for the trees" comes from. In the case of many people planning suicide, they obsess on all the reasons they should die instead of the reasons they shouldn't. And no one is an island, even without kids. Was he a friend of yours? Did you not feel some level of sorrow at his passing? People who kill themselves leave behind damages even if legally they aren't beholden to these people.
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Feb 1, 2015 02:03
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SedanChair posted:That's a platitude though, it's arbitrary and fallacious to say that we "know better" than someone considering suicide. For example, if a prisoner in gitmo tries to kill themselves what are we supposed to say to dissuade them? Live as an example of stoic endurance to others? Nurture false hope in a way out of their predicament? They're almost certainly clinically depressed, but at the same time they are making an informed choice. I think everyone has a right to die but in practice the vast majority of people who want to die shouldn't.
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Feb 1, 2015 02:15
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LookingGodIntheEye posted:There are plenty of cases when we limit someone's freedom to do something even they feel it is right for them. The argument that we shouldn't assume what drives people to suicide or decide for them is pretty weak in that regard. A kleptomaniac has a compulsion to steal but we don't let them steal just because they feel they need to. Well right, there is a perceived societal benefit to preventing suicide. You limit the grief of family members and maintain the premise that lives are intended to continue and be functional. Stealing is a pretty clear infringement on the rights and convenience of others, suicide a more inchoate one.
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Feb 1, 2015 04:07
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Pegged Lamb posted:I fixed the link. This guy was apparently incredibly methodical, so much so that I doubt he couldn't quantify what he stood to lose. He wasn't bored with his job he was daunted by the prospect of 40-50 years or ennui. Why is that irrational? Doesn't preference enter into it? He wasn't a father or custodian of a child or beholden to anyone. He simply put a bag over his head, opted not to leave a note and was done with it. Judging that eternity isn't long enough, and that eternity + 50 years is a vast improvement that is worthy of labor and dedication? No, it doesn't seem rational.
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Feb 1, 2015 04:35
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Pegged Lamb posted:I don't buy that. http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21099039 I knew someone who killed themselves because they didn't want to face the drudgery of a life's work, two people possibly. I've thought about it routinely as an alternative to loneliness (which is not a sickness.) There's nothing inherently worthwhile about living for as long as possible. We tell ourselves these fictions about how such and such person must be tormented, must have been desperate but afraid to seek help etc to reduce the dissonance we feel from being overly attached to life. Sometimes people just get bored or the rewards from going on don't compensate the troubles. Pegged Lamb posted:I fixed the link. This guy was apparently incredibly methodical, so much so that I doubt he couldn't quantify what he stood to lose. He wasn't bored with his job he was daunted by the prospect of 40-50 years or ennui. Why is that irrational? Doesn't preference enter into it? He wasn't a father or custodian of a child or beholden to anyone. He simply put a bag over his head, opted not to leave a note and was done with it. E: The dude in your link was apparently still young and was able to come up with probably one of the most disturbingly ingenious things I've ever seen. All that ability and focused dedication and yet he decides while he's still young that his life will always be the same forever and nothing will ever get better? E1: Also, let me make clear that you don't need something kitschy like "hope". All you need is perspective. There is no way you can determine how your entire life will be at 20 years old. That's like walking out of a movie because the beginning was kind of boring, except it's your loving life. America Inc. fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Feb 1, 2015 |
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Feb 1, 2015 05:31
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LookingGodIntheEye posted:How can you get bored of being alive? It sounds as if you're talking about life as if it is some videogame you can turn on and off as you choose. If you're bored with your life why don't you change it? If you're lonely why don't you change it? Are you the elephant man? If you can put in the commitment to end your own life why can't you instead do something else? A whole lifetime of things you could have done gets snuffed out in the blink of an eye. My problems are my own, as yours are yours, and I'd like to deal with them as I will. " All that ability and focused dedication and yet he decides while he's still young that his life will always be the same forever and nothing will ever get better?" or maybe he saw sufficiently far ahead that it doesn't stay better, or it doesn't get better enough, or that consuming so much in the way of resources should merit a base level of justification that he couldn't defend or didn't want to provide. It's firstly and ultimately a personal matter and I don't like the attitude that doesn't stop at telling the suicidal they're wasting something, but goes onto pressure and shame them into enjoying what the religious deem to be a gift. Non fui, fui, non sum, non curo "There is no way you can determine how your entire life will be at 20 years old. " There are cues all over the place, and most paths through life cross through what are considered to be the most worthwhile pursuits. Most travelers end up looking weary. Pegged Lamb fucked around with this message at 06:22 on Feb 1, 2015 |
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Feb 1, 2015 06:14
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Pegged Lamb posted:or maybe he saw sufficiently far ahead that it doesn't stay better, or it doesn't get better enough, or that consuming so much in the way of resources should merit a base level of justification that he couldn't defend or didn't want to provide. It's firstly and ultimately a personal matter and I don't like the attitude that doesn't stop at telling the suicidal they're wasting something, but goes onto pressure and shame them into enjoying what the religious deem to be a gift. Non fui, fui, non sum, non curo quote:There are cues all over the place, and most paths through life cross through what are considered to be the most worthwhile pursuits. Most travelers end up looking weary. I don't feel like either you or me has real license in this, this is a matter for a therapist. America Inc. fucked around with this message at 06:46 on Feb 1, 2015 |
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Feb 1, 2015 06:44
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Pegged Lamb posted:My problems are my own, as yours are yours, and I'd like to deal with them as I will. Is this a call for help or something? Your nihilism is a bit concerning.
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Feb 1, 2015 07:20
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God no, don't call the police on me. Those 72 hour isolations sound harmless enough but they end up burying you in a mountain of debt.
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Feb 1, 2015 07:24
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