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tater_salad
Sep 15, 2007


if I for some reason decide I want to get back into this.. and I played before they charged actual dollars for this "game" do I still own it for free or do I gotta buy it.

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Orange DeviI
Nov 9, 2011

by Hand Knit
Gotta buy it or you're bopped back to demo status

30.5 Days
Nov 19, 2006
Have they ever gotten this game to run decently? It's really weird fun but man it's so hard to deal with (A) the lack of players and (B) jittery 30fps, and it's hard to fix A when I'm not willing ot recommend it to anyone because of B.

EDIT: Answered my own question- it's not great!

30.5 Days fucked around with this message at 00:20 on Aug 10, 2021

FreeWifi!!
Oct 11, 2013

Okay, that's true. Good point, Marquess. Point for you. But you get a point taken away for being a dick. So, back to zero.

30.5 Days posted:

Have they ever gotten this game to run decently? It's really weird fun but man it's so hard to deal with (A) the lack of players and (B) jittery 30fps, and it's hard to fix A when I'm not willing ot recommend it to anyone because of B.

EDIT: Answered my own question- it's not great!

Is he still charging 40 bucks for this game?

Has he made any progress?

Can you still have sex with a elf in the middle of town...?

30.5 Days
Nov 19, 2006
Yes, yes, ...maybe?

Freakazoid_
Jul 5, 2013


Buglord
which elf? half of them have sex with you if you get your rep far enough.

cmdrk
Jun 10, 2013

Freakazoid_ posted:

which elf? half of them have sex with you if you get your rep far enough.

I thought you had sex with them to get your rep up in the first place!

pixaal
Jan 8, 2004

All ice cream is now for all beings, no matter how many legs.


cmdrk posted:

I thought you had sex with them to get your rep up in the first place!

It's the circle of sex~

RottenK
Feb 17, 2011

Sexy bad choices

FAILED NOJOE
i understand why 40 bux is a high barrier of entry for an ugly indie game, but IMO its worth it.

game's fun and full of stuff to discover, and if im going to play a game for a long time id rather pay 40 bux once instead of having to pay subscription, and this way i don't feel like i have to play a lot to not "waste" money i paid for the sub

a free trial that lets you get a good feel of the game would be nice though

FreeWifi!!
Oct 11, 2013

Okay, that's true. Good point, Marquess. Point for you. But you get a point taken away for being a dick. So, back to zero.

RottenK posted:

i understand why 40 bux is a high barrier of entry for an ugly indie game, but IMO its worth it.

game's fun and full of stuff to discover, and if im going to play a game for a long time id rather pay 40 bux once instead of having to pay subscription, and this way i don't feel like i have to play a lot to not "waste" money i paid for the sub

a free trial that lets you get a good feel of the game would be nice though

There's a demo of it on steam.

I downloaded it and within 2 minutes of putzing around, decided it wasn't for me.

Blacktooth
Apr 13, 2007

Any goons still playing this? I picked it up a couple of days ago, and having a pretty good time of it.

In as Blaquetooth

Mr. Pickles
Mar 19, 2014



Blacktooth posted:

Any goons still playing this? I picked it up a couple of days ago, and having a pretty good time of it.

In as Blaquetooth

Do you happen to be Aarghul Blacktooth, or is it just coincidence?

Also, is this game ever on sale? Its been in my wishlist for a few months but I don't think I ever saw it sold at bargain price

Tsurupettan
Mar 26, 2011

My many CoX, always poised, always ready, always willing to thrust.

Mr. Pickles posted:

Do you happen to be Aarghul Blacktooth, or is it just coincidence?

Also, is this game ever on sale? Its been in my wishlist for a few months but I don't think I ever saw it sold at bargain price

it was 25% off at the end of jan/start of feb

Freakazoid_
Jul 5, 2013


Buglord

dev blog posted:

And of course the main way to get high-level players is to keep low-level players playing longer! Most players don't reach max-level combat skills -- they quit sooner than that. (This is the norm for every MMO, of course, but I think we can do a lot better.)

It's been a while since I sat down and just worked on "smoothing everything out". So that's what I'll be doing for a few months. Two goals here: removing irritants that cause players to quit in frustration, and making content more accessible, discoverable, and useful, so players don't quit from boredom.

How about removing the irritant that is your 40 dollar price tag?

pixaal
Jan 8, 2004

All ice cream is now for all beings, no matter how many legs.


They like free to play and seem to still think you have to charge once or monthly with no other way to fund.

I like this game it's like a little gem trapped in the 90s still being refined. With all the weird quirks that 90s games had.

I've never hit more than I dunno 20 in any skill but I pick it up for a few weeks every few years because it's an experience.

That said I'd be willing to throw $5 for that month if they wanted but then they'd have less money than the $40 they already got from me. I'm not even sure that's what I paid, it wasn't on steam when I bought it.

pixaal fucked around with this message at 13:03 on Feb 25, 2022

cmdrk
Jun 10, 2013
paid $40, played some jank, got bored.

f2p tier that caps your skills when?

Freakazoid_
Jul 5, 2013


Buglord
They have an optional monthly fee now. Let the whales spend, reduce the buy-in to like 10 bucks.

FreeWifi!!
Oct 11, 2013

Okay, that's true. Good point, Marquess. Point for you. But you get a point taken away for being a dick. So, back to zero.
https://shop.projectgorgon.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=51


Let's buy a package that's not in the game yet?

desudrive
Jan 10, 2010

Destroy All Memes
This is on sale for another week so it's "yikes 20 dollars".

It's a very interesting game even with its extremely obtuse systems but at least it's not Shroud of the Avatar.

Freakazoid_
Jul 5, 2013


Buglord
:siren: it's on sale for 10 bucks right now (finally)

too bad I'm busy with another mmo, but I picked it up for later

Aster0ids
Oct 13, 2018
Glad i refunded Elden Ring for this, kind of jank but certainly will be interesting for a while. Would be nice to see a big B movie-game of the systems in this game.

Frog Act
Feb 10, 2012



So I’m gonna hop into this tomorrow after getting it on sale, I usually play support or healer builds and it sounds like this game requires a lot of soloing, what would that look like? I played way back in the day when it was free and only serbule was available and found it very charming, so I’m curious to see what it’s like now

Tanners
Dec 13, 2011

woof
iirc mentalism was support/heals but youll need another thing for damage

cmdrk
Jun 10, 2013

Aster0ids posted:

Glad i refunded Elden Ring for this, kind of jank but certainly will be interesting for a while. Would be nice to see a big B movie-game of the systems in this game.

Project Gorgon: Glad I refunded Elden Ring for this

:v:

It's a good game. I could take or leave the sexy elves but kudos to the developer for making the best of what they had available from the asset store.

Harold Fjord
Jan 3, 2004
I think I paid for this, but do I have to buy it on steam now anyway?

30.5 Days
Nov 19, 2006

Frog Act posted:

So I’m gonna hop into this tomorrow after getting it on sale, I usually play support or healer builds and it sounds like this game requires a lot of soloing, what would that look like? I played way back in the day when it was free and only serbule was available and found it very charming, so I’m curious to see what it’s like now

It doesn't require a lot of soloing- there's a lot of weird exploration in terms of figuring out how to pick up skills and stuff and that is best done solo, and solo is always an option. The overworld is solo-friendly, and you can usually set up shop in some hallway near the entrance of a dungeon and pick off mobs one at a time/flee for the zone line if you get mobbed. However, the best way to level is still to push deeper into a dungeon with multiple people. There's some non-combat grinds that are better with others too (for instance, the ability to craft tools when I played was locked behind the ability to get level 50 in the goblin language which required collecting card drops from goblins, one for each level, from the goblin dungeon. There are benefits to doing this with other people where you can trade cards.)

At least this was the case when I played a very long time ago. One thing I'll warn you about is that when I've tried to play again recently, looking toward serbule from anywhere in the zone caused my framerate to falter.

30.5 Days fucked around with this message at 20:59 on Jul 4, 2023

30.5 Days
Nov 19, 2006
Dungeons usually have multiple levels with the deeper levels being fairly solo-unfriendly and having better XP and rewards. However, there are often also some skills that are gated behind your ability to advance deep into a dungeon at least once. So for instance, when I played, the serbule starter dungeon had some good solo grinding against spiders on the top floor, but also had the ability to become a spider at the bottom level. And I think there's some quest objective at the bottom of the goblin dungeon but I forget what that provides.

Frog Act
Feb 10, 2012



Interesting, I’m wandering around the tutorial item acquainting myself with the mechanics and it’s all very silly in a way I find kinda compelling, eager to get to the mainland and learn more

Tanners
Dec 13, 2011

woof
its a very silly game

tater_salad
Sep 15, 2007


Hmm for 10bux I may buy.. I played this ages ago, and probabaly wont' touch it for abit but it's 10bux lower than it's lowest.. and 10 is throwaway money.
Seam Deck Verified ? LOOOL
edit: it says playable.

tater_salad fucked around with this message at 14:36 on Jul 6, 2023

Hyzenth1ay
Oct 24, 2008
Picked this up in the sale as I’ve had it wishlisted since… oh, since this thread mentioned it moving to steam. It’s insane and silly and my guy needs a product manager (I laughed out loud at how obvious a failure of dev time that “casino” was).

But I’ve also now played it for several hours a day and I’m having fun. It really brings back that tiny little burst of private joy one felt upon discovering something new in a video game. Which is not a feeling I’ve had for 30+ years. So that’s cool.

Also I like that you’re always getting more points in something. Even if it’s death.

Inimicul
Oct 14, 2006

Shenanigans!
Tempted to log back in again purely because of how much fun it was to play a cow. I just hated that there wasn't (at the time) a decent way to farm gear or get the stats you wanted. I remember something about augmentation at one point but I wasn't able to really figure it out before something else distracted me again. How's the community now?

tater_salad
Sep 15, 2007


Lol oh poo poo I forgot I own this from the sale.

Freakazoid_
Jul 5, 2013


Buglord
Trip Report!

Got my alpha account reactivated and tied to my steam account. The alpha account password reset doesn't work, so you'll need to email support.

First thing I noticed: A little more inventory space! Although the game deceives you with extra bags, apparently those are folders for organization and not actual spaces. Your total spaces are listed separately at the bottom of the inventory window. After looking through all the poo poo I've been hoarding over 4 npcs... I think an intervention may be in order. Or maybe I needed those for some future task? It's hard to tell.

Cartography got reset at some point. Every zone got some sort of rework as none of my old map pins pointed to the correct locations anymore.

First thing I did was hop over to Eltibule and get my riding skill. 6k for the skill + the prototype mount. It's definitely faster than running but it's got a slow acceleration and deceleration. Leveled it to near 20 in about an hour while I worked on uncovering all of serbule to get some carto skill back.

In my attempt to make some money, I saw that Sun Vale got a complete revamp. None of the mobs I used to hunt were there and bananas seem uncommon, which is what I used to collect to make decent food for my level. hosed around anyway, ran into a kraken and got killed by it, got bonus xp for death skill because it was the first time I got killed by seafood before. Then I logged off.

I'll probably take another stab or two at this game, see if I can earn some more money to uncap my main skills. Training is still expensive!

Freakazoid_
Jul 5, 2013


Buglord
After a few more attempts I realized why I wanted to stop playing in the first place: The game is too grindy.

I know, it's an MMO, it's supposed to be grindy, but this is a level of grind that rivals old school MMOs, just in a different way. Instead of group mandatory progress with death penalties and bad parties ruining hours of work, the rate at which you can earn things is limited by money.

It didn't seem so bad at the start. There's nothing blocking you from leveling your skills, you get a decent amount of money along the way and can try different things. You do spend an unusually long amount of time just in serbule, partly to earn favor, partly because of dungeons that help get you at or near 30 in skills, and the fact that Serbule was designed as a hub city that has most everything.

By the time you're mid-level, you need to focus on money. Your main skills get very expensive very quickly and the money you earn isn't really getting you there. That's also when a bunch of very tempting side skills open up, things that could help you get a little more money and things that help with quality of life. There's just so much money sink going on it's become prohibitive to anyone but the most dedicated poopsockers.

There are also key npcs the game doesn't really emphasize but are necessary to keep money flowing. Getting favor can take a good long while and interfere with earning money, but getting all of serbule's storage npcs and unlocking the highest tiers of favor with shop npcs are the two things you really need to make progress at a decent clip. Storage npcs outside of serbule are arguably optional, but you will want shop npcs at near max favor to take advantage of higher sell limits. They all have a budget of how much you can sell to them and it gets reset only once per week. To get an idea how dramatic it is, there's an armor/weapons npc in Eltibule (level 30-50 zone) that starts at 10,000 max but at the highest tier reaches 120,000.

When I picked up where I left off, I actually had 180k. I dropped down to 160k for a while because I picked up horse riding, a new tier of mushroom gathering, and some other cheaper skills. I have since managed to make that back and slightly exceeded 200k in the past few days. What will I do with that money? Pay for my next tier of archery and animal handling, both at 95k each. There will be at least one more tier after that. Also, I probably have to level carpentry and fletching because each new tier of archery needs new arrows.

The player economy right now is largely focused on end-game products. There's little demand for mid or lower tier items in bulk and when they do, they're fairly lowball offers. Conversely, player shop npcs are fully stocked on low/mid tier items and charge a decent amount, but it seems like nobody really buys them in bulk. The exception seems to be mushrooms for some reason, but you basically need mushroom growing to participate and demand is based on the lunar cycle.

The grind aside, the developer is so laser focused on being an ideas guy, he can't really step back and look at the big picture. How one progresses in this game feels uneven and haphazard at times. There are roadblocks that don't make sense. The wiki kind of helps but there are missing bits of information. There are a couple things that are obviously better than it was 5+ years ago, but some of it is locked behind the grind, and the ones that aren't were added in a half-way measure, probably because the developer at least sort of recognizes how dumb some of his ideas were but won't admit it.

Strotski
Dec 29, 2013

I like PG precisely because of how dumb his ideas are, sure it comes with a lot of cons, like everything being paywalled behind layers of grind. But we got playable animals, and lots of memorable weird poo poo as a result.

It's like seeing alternative AAA mmo that is still in alpha stages being unshackled from chains of good management and someone with enough sense to say "no", with just horrible ideas executed left and right. It's the best. (Not to mention super refreshing for first timers)

What you're describing just made me quit faster, since I speedrun through my mmo cocaine cycle and become disillusioned relatively fast. And it just doesn't hold up in that treadmill cycle (unless you're turbo into crafting, then it's the best game that ever existed for you, right after SWG)

Thanks for breaking my mmo addiction, Citan.

Inimicul
Oct 14, 2006

Shenanigans!
I have to wonder how the whole unity drama is going to affect PG. It deserves a better engine.

Freakazoid_
Jul 5, 2013


Buglord
According to the lead dev they are too small to be affected. I'm not sure that's the correct read but that's what he thinks. They are considering dropping their pro license to save 4k a year with the only drawback being adding a unity splash screen.

Freakazoid_
Jul 5, 2013


Buglord
Things aren't looking good: https://forum.projectgorgon.com/entry.php?47-Game-News-2023-11

quote:

We've written a lot over the past few years about our development plans, about Statehelm and orcs, about housing, about what comes next and what we need to get us across the finish line. It's an uncomfortable position -- we're so *very* close, but we're not there yet so we ... Just! Keep! Pushing!

But life doesn't always make it easy to push. Today we need to share some bad news with you, and to talk about how that's going to affect game development. But first I need to briefly fill in some history.

The past few years have been rough. 2020 was a bad year for a lot of people -- the pandemic disrupted all of our systems, including mine. I have really bad ADHD which makes it hard to buckle down and do hard work. Over the years I've created lots of tricks and techniques to get around the ADHD and get work done -- I was really proud of myself for those tricks! But in 2020, when Covid hit and my family started getting sick and -- well, you know what 2020 was like -- my mind-tricks stopped working on myself, and Sandra wasn't herself either. 2020 was a very low-productivity year in terms of new development.

Then 2021 came along and was even worse: Sandra's health declined rapidly; she would eventually be diagnosed with stage 4 cancer. The only bright spot in development was Nick, the programming contractor we'd found. He was amazing to work with, leaving me to focus more on design while he did the hard work. He helped make 2022 development more productive than 2021, bringing the UI and interface up to a high bar... but there wasn't a ton of new game content that year either.

In terms of productivity, 2023 has been better! Sandra is still dying of cancer, sure, but she's been able to work more of the time, and so have I. However, the second half of the year we've run into a new problem: we've run out of cash. In the past when money was tight, Sandra and I would stop paying ourselves from the company funds and survive off of savings. But there's no more savings: cancer is stupid expensive, even with health insurance. At the same time, money from the game has slowly dwindled over the past three years, owing in part to the lack of new game content. Our big sale this summer was a lot of fun, but it didn't hit the goal we needed to keep everything going. At this point, we're out of money to pay for full-time development.

This doesn't mean the game is shutting down! Thanks to the influx of monthly VIP money, we can afford to keep the game running indefinitely with basic support and bug-fix updates. But we no longer have any full-time employees, and our part-timers have reduced hours.

This means that right now, we won't be able to devote significant time to developing major new content or features. Instead we're switching to part-time development while we regroup, save up some money, and figure out the best way forward. We aren't pausing development -- we have a brand new dungeon we've just launched, and we're going to support that dungeon with fixes and improvements. We also have seasonal content and events planned through the end of the year. Next year, we'll see where the finances are and look at our options.

In the longer term, yeah, this could be the end of Project: Gorgon. But not necessarily! Our playerbase is cyclical, which is something I've always liked and encouraged due to our extremely long development time. Our players get bored and wander off for a year or two, then come back and get involved again. That's why we've just launched a new mega-dungeon and level-cap increase, to give returning players something meaty to sink their teeth into. My hope is that we'll see an uptick in VIP memberships. It really wouldn't take a lot more VIPs to let us continue full-time development in some form. In the meantime, we'll keep the servers running and the smaller updates coming.

So we'll see. We haven't given up yet! But if this is the end, I want to say how sorry I am that I couldn't complete the game I promised. And how grateful I am that you supported us all these years. Thank you. I will never forget what you've done for us.

- Eric

PS - if you have questions, please visit our Discord and ask them in the town-hall section. I'll do my best to answer them. We'll update this dev blog with a FAQ section, after we find out what the frequently-asked questions are.

tl;dr: the covid shutdown, followed by his wife still being treated for cancer, has sapped their savings. They have enough cash to keep the servers going, but they probably won't reach the finish line.

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shirunei
Sep 7, 2018

I tried to run away. To take the easy way out. I'll live through the suffering. When I die, I want to feel like I did my best.
:911:
Just another dream killed by the american healthcare system. God bless our freedoms.

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