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I'd focus on just surviving. Lief will probably be dead sooner or later. It's amazing the game spawns super powerful barbarian units from thin air, can you disable them like you can in Civ?
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Feb 25, 2015 06:40
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The snippet from the manual states:quote:Unit Types So it looks like I have an edge with Light Galleys (wonderful, the dudes live in the desert), and elephants which I may not even get to show you. The elephants can only be produced in forest (jungle) cities, and they are going to be entirely useless since they need to walk through the desert to get to the barbarians. Anyway, update incoming. Anything you want to see more of? poo poo, I haven't even started building roads yet since I've been too focused on survival.
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Feb 25, 2015 13:48
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Turns 49 to 60 The barbarians have been nothing but trouble, and it's because it takes 4 or 5 of my light infantry that are supposed to be stronger than others to kill a single one of his infantry.  I've been accumulating knowledge in my island-starting cities while my mainland cities have been focused on shoving out warriors and gaining knowledge specifically for warfare. In this screenshot you can see all the stuff I can build. Library, Temple, Warehouse, Workshop, crap like that. Not able to build a Wonder of the World yet, but that'll come.  God damnit Lief, leave me the poo poo alone. See my ships there just above the city? They are my  See that? I have 1 spearsman now. But Spermy, you ask, where are the other 5 that were in that stack just a mere second ago? I'll tell you where. Dead. They fricken died attacking a stack of two light infantry of Liefs. Yes, he killed 5 of my units, I killed 1 of his. This loving game...  Operation "give that barbarian rear end in a top hat something to think about at home" has commenced. I need to find his cities, build a chain of cities all the way down to his, then attack without having to walk through the desert. I need the chain of cities to act as supply dumps for the troops to not starve. Basically they'll be building the warehouses and stocking up on food until my army comes to town, then they'll empty the warehouse feeding the troops and giving them some backpacks full of food for the road.  Ooooh, hey Lief. What up buddy? Looks like you're throwing assloads of armies into this little gap down here. Wonder why? Is our barbarian friend bending you over?  And then he kills my horsey. What an rear end in a top hat.  7 cities shoving medium and light infantry into a stack barely saved my towns from further asskickings.  The philosophers and merchants continuosly get killed on the mainland so it makes things kind of tough to trade resources and food to cities that are supporting armies. And that's where we stand. I fought them to a standstill, managed to push back some with my crap units, and now I've got (what I hope) is a hammer unit that is going to punch through all their cities like a knife through a prostitute. They have light infantry, I have heavy cavalry and catapaults. This is a guess as to howo the next update will go: Me: Attack! Me: His 7 light infantry killed 22 of my heavy cavalry? gently caress this game, I quit and gently caress the LP forever.
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Feb 25, 2015 14:01
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Spermy Smurf posted:This is a guess as to howo the next update will go:  I knew there was a reason we stopped playing this game.But if nothing else thanks for the nostalgia trip.  My dad was a Sierra fiend, he got about two dozen of their games and even collected their magazine for the like 3 years it existed. So when we got this one, he, my brother and I played it twice with the multiplayer, us against the AI. That ended up being too easy, so I played it once on my own as the Celts, and basically built up to heavy infantry and bulldozed everybody else. Nothing else ever really seemed worthwhile.I don't remember the barbarians ever being much of a problem, maybe it's a difficulty setting/map size thing? I don't remember what options the game has in that regard, heh. Two suggestions: any way to record the music (like maybe capture video with FRAPS and then export the audio out)? If not, no worries; I just remember some of the BGM actually being pretty good. And two, maybe use IrfanView to crop the window/menu bar out? The only thing it's getting you is keeping track of the active turn and that's not essential. PS - 1983, huh? Made in 1982 here.  
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Feb 25, 2015 15:24
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We're on a magical journey.
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Feb 25, 2015 16:14
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I have a folder full of RAW music files and sound effects, but I'm unable to play them for some reason. If I can convert them I will throw them on Tindeck or something. I'm sure someone smarter than me has already done that. I should google that now... I could crop the window, but since I'm playing within Windows Virtual PC Irfanview is taking odd screenshots (keeping the title bar, sometimes keeping the Virtual PC title bar with CTRL+ALT+DEL up top). I'll see if I can do a batch edit with the next dozen screenshots, but I'm far, far, far too lazy to manually do it. VVVV No, not possible to turn them off. Spermy Smurf fucked around with this message at 16:53 on Feb 25, 2015 |
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Feb 25, 2015 16:18
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Wayne posted:
I loved Sierra at the time too, and the Civ games. This seemed like a no brainer to be awesome. Not so much. This and Outpost really soured me to Sierra. Outpost was even more of a mess then this, though. I don't remember Barbarians at all, but that might be because it's possible to turn them off?
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Feb 25, 2015 16:36
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syzpid posted:I loved Sierra at the time too, and the Civ games. This seemed like a no brainer to be awesome. Not so much. This and Outpost really soured me to Sierra. Ha ha, yeah, us and the rest of the world. It's pretty surreal to look at the Sierra guides again, like in 1998/99 where they published 20+ games a year... and then it basically fell apart overnight. Just a trickle into the early Oughts and they closed down for good until Activision brought it back last year. Ken Williams bailed in '97, you have to assume he saw the writing on the wall.syzpid posted:Outpost was even more of a mess then this, though. No kidding. I don't remember what the problem was (...that kept us from playing it properly, not all the problems in the game itself), but it had the dubious honor of being the first game we had to patch. We didn't have Internet when Dad bought it (late '97), so I had to bring some 3.5" disks to school, download the patch, and then install it at home. It also has the "honor" of being one of the fastest games to unintentionally game over. You start the game by selecting a star to send Earth's only colony ship to, and you don't know if they're habitable, just a percentage chance. There are a couple of options that have no planets, leading to an instant loss. It was, uh... quite the experience.
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Feb 25, 2015 17:05
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Got a few turns to write up, and holy poo poo they take forever. This gif is what happens when I hit end turn. The computer moves, poo poo happens, then all my units move. Its annoying and takes forever.  I will post an update in a minute, but I want you all to know that my heavy cavalry has been kicking rear end. Took out a dozen of his armies and 3 cities before being down to 6 units.
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Feb 25, 2015 17:54
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Hey, look what I found: There is also a 1-in-25 chance during a given turn that barbarian hordes will appear on the game map. Barbarians usually come by sea, but will land for exploration. Barbarian units are stronger than similar troops from other cultures and can wreak havoc on any city or army they encounter. Random events can be turned off in the Options menu. Whoops. As I said, I haven't touched the game in forever so I didn't want to tweak settings that would make the game too easy. Barbarians killing 2/3 of the opponents made it easy though.  Turns 60 to 69  There was a tidal wave on my second city. This kills my troops in the city. Or one troop anyway. I've had grassfires, starvation, tidal waves, wolf attacks... No floods or avalanches though!  My horse-army charges toward Lief's jillion armies. They run out of movement points, so they dig in and defend.  Look who I found! I believe these are Chinese or the other civilization that was wiped out. The barbarians are just holding onto them for me.  That's my city now, bitch.  Different architecture, and they don't like the barbarians at all, so this city is 100% mine unless they take it back.  I take a city from Lief and push forward.  That city I just took from Lief is broken. 3 population. My memory is hazy, but I believe 3 population is the "broken" population. That city will never grow nor shrink until the end of the game. Maybe. I don't know.  Barbarians have 2 or 3 or 10 cities down here. Time to explore a bit!  Sending an army south to help defend my new city that I just took over. Barbarians have light cavalry so they're likely as strong as my heavy cavalry. Argh.  Barbarians have 4 cities ripe for the taking!   I use the city I took from the Barbarians to build settlers and make new cities. Saves me from marching them all the way south with their super-impressive 3 movement points.  My horse/infantry army takes another city from Lief and then camps for the night.  My main horse army charges into the fray. gently caress Lief, and gently caress his thousand stupid armies that scatter like cockroaches when I come to smash them.  Another city spawned from the first down south. My army arrives to defend them until the cities can protect themselves.  See? My Heavy Cavalry army charged in there, he scattered and a few units sneak by to attack what he thinks is undefended bases. Hint: They're plenty protected. I have another horse army almost ready to go.
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Feb 25, 2015 19:26
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Turn 70 Just a couple things here.  I think I kicked the hornet nest. Lief has a lot more units showing up out of nowhere. Going to take forever to hunt them all down.  Same for the barbarians, they're everywhere.  And it's time to build me a war elephant. I'll name him Stampy.
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Feb 25, 2015 22:00
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If you can spare the production, you should build a new settler on your island. One or two more invulnerable research/barracks cities could be handy. (Disclaimer, I have no idea if that's at all a good use of your time)
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Feb 25, 2015 23:35
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I can definitely do that, but it won't accomplish too much I don't think. Micromanaging to move all the units off of the island to the mainland is already annoying enough. I am considering grabbing 3 or 4 settlers on a boat and going way to the left side of the map via ship, then building another set of cities on the other side of Lief and then executing my famous pincer move from the Lords of the Realm LP I did a while back. Then again, this is a lot of cities to check every single time. Ugh. So annoying already. Slider bars here, slider bars there, academic slider bars, import/export of food to check, just shoot me now.
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Feb 26, 2015 14:04
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Turns 70 to 74 I continue moving an army down south to bolster the defense of the new towns I'm creating/stealing.   Lief fires a shotgun full of random armies at my towns. All smaller than 4 units each.  HorseArmy1 pushes forward, snagging towns and destroying everything it can catch. The towns defect back to Lief who starves them to create more bullshit armies. If they would stop defecting I'd feed the populace, but noooooo, they'd rather starve. This loving game...  quote:A moment later another foreigner rose into view, pausing at the top of the gangway. Lief's breath caught, a sudden chill flowing through him, as if Death himself had arrived, his cold breath whispering across the back of the ruler's neck. Lief's heart was thudding hard in his chest. They have delivered a champion, a challenger to his rule. Stampy stepped onto solid ground. From the buildings beyond the harbor front, birds rose suddenly, hundreds, then thousands, voicing a chorus of shrieks, and beneath Lief's feet the stones shifted with a heavy, groaning sound. Something large collapsed far into the city, and distant screams followed. Stampy loosed a thunderous trumpet, as if enjoying the welcome the land gave him. Stampy has arrived.  HorseArmy1 continues pushing, they seem unstoppable and their lost numbers are being constantly replaced by a trickle of 8 cities. Their numbers shrink despite my best efforts.  In an astounding move, Lief brings a settler to the fight.  Cut to the south: I smack a few armies down and grab a nearby city. I desperately need more troops here. His light cavalry is about the same strength as my heavy cavalry. If I run into a stack of 5 or 6 I will probably lose.  That's a bad city! I feed you, you ungrateful peasants!  HorseArmy1 clears the immediate area (4 armies), then takes the city back.  Why don't they love me? I feed them and murder them when they revolt. That's a win-win for them right?  Wooooo! This city loves me!  This one too!  Wonderful. A stack of 5 light horses by the barbarians. I have 6 heavy cavalry. This should be aggravating. Time to send another army of cavalry south!  He was expecting my horses to fight his horses. Instead I threw my infantry at him and somehow won only losing 1 infantry unit.   The barbarian town is put to work building whatever the hell units I can as fast as I can. Desperately need troops down here.  I try to park an army in the cities I just took over because I thought it would help them revolting. It doesn't and I lose a few armies before I realize that. HorseArmy1 still moves forward.  He dodged my horse army and attacked the city itself. Ah well, I'll take it back next turn.  My screenshot looks weird. Showing the area down south, my cities, more of his horse armies trickling north.
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Feb 26, 2015 15:17
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Grrr I went to save the game and the game crashed. Had to restore and replay from turn 70 (the last update got replayed). Things are going about the same up top against Lief, but I'm being crushed by the barbarians in the south this time around. I guess I didn't get lucky with the RNG combat calculator this time  So you'll all see that soon.
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Feb 26, 2015 17:59
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So does the manual really go on about India's advanced early knowledge and architecture and then only give them better light infantry? I wonder, were the developers at Sierra angry at Gandhi from Civ?
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Feb 26, 2015 18:17
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Pvt.Scott posted:So does the manual really go on about India's advanced early knowledge and architecture and then only give them better light infantry? I wonder, were the developers at Sierra angry at Gandhi from Civ? Yes. And the goons picked that civilization for me. Can't say I was shocked by the choice. Every other culture gets one or more units that are good, and if they only have 1 unit that is good then they get two starting knowledges. Greeks are by far the best in the game. Their Heavy Infantry is way better than anyone else's.
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Feb 26, 2015 18:46
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Turns 74 to 77 maybe? When we last left off I was doing super-awesome down south against the barbarians. After the crash and replay this is where we are:  They're destroying my poo poo and I have like 5 light infantry here.  Stampy doesn't take no poo poo from nobody. He (and his 3 brothers) stomp their way south to engage, stem the tide of puny horses and crush the barbarian hordes.   We trade that large town 4 times in 4 turns. The barbarians bypass my little towns which are busy cranking out the shittiest of units (and the only ones they can make) in hopes of survival.  STAMPY TO THE RESCUE. EAT poo poo YOU STUPID loving HORSES. Stampy trumpets and mauls the two puny horses that dare to get close enough.  Then he loving dies. Seriously? It was 4 of the strongest cavalry in the game versus two light cavalry. This loving game.   After nearly rage quitting, I send other horses south with more coming to help.  I have my work cut out for me.   Up against Lief things are going swimmingly. No problems here!
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Feb 26, 2015 19:01
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Remind me to show you how the army movement works. I have about 40 diff armies. Move one a single tile and it autoselects a different unit (usually on the other side of the map) even though your first unit has plenty of movement points. So then you need to go find that unit, select it, click 'cancel' for some fuckshow reason, then continue moving it. If you kill 4 enemy armies in a turn you need to do this 4 times per turn. I dont think I am explaining my frustration properly. I move an army one tile. They have no other standing orders, but for some stupid reason they are still trying to move NOWHERE forcing me to find them on the map again, hit cancel for absolutely no reason, attack another enemy, then repeat it all again. Then do this for every military unit while it autoselects philosophers and transport ships and merchants instead of letting you move the same army multiple times. The worst part? You never want to have an army moving in enemy territory past your turn. They might auto-move away from the enemy who moved after my turn. So once you are done moving each individual unit you have to cancel all orders (so you dont accidentally run away from an army that moved behind you) and then dig in and defend. Digging in gives a bullshit bonus to defense, and for some reason doesnt require any movement points so you might as well do it. I will gif an entire movement turn of one of my armies in about 12hrs, but it will be huge so it will be linked and not embedded. Spermy Smurf fucked around with this message at 02:37 on Feb 27, 2015 |
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Feb 27, 2015 02:34
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I can't wait.
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Feb 27, 2015 02:53
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Klingon w Bowl Cut posted:I can't wait. If no one replied I wasn't going to bother doing it. Thanks, dickface. 
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Feb 27, 2015 03:59
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Doing this off of really poor memories, the trick to making a city love you is to just shove food down their throats. So you need to have a merchant with a ton of food go to the city almost immediately and just give them a ton of food. Of course since you have to protect the merchants on the way. So this probably isn't too useful.
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Feb 27, 2015 04:33
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You are pretty much correct. The only issue is that people can only be fed a certain amount, so even if I bring 300 food to them, they'll only like me for the part they eat which is usually the first 5 or 6. The best way to do it is to actually trade/philosopher with them before you take them over. Then they will already know of your civilization and develop an affinity for you which makes them like you a bit more so when you do take them over you can just cram food down their throats and in one turn the city will be yours. The issue I had is "try to survive" which botched that plan right from the start. The way I'm doing it is to take over a city, then feed them and park a decent army (6 units or more) there if the city is large enough to feed them. That way they can't defect back to Lief because my army is there to prevent it. The other way I have to do it is just to attack the same city 4 times and feed them as much as possible every time while they defect back to Lief between turns. He rarely feeds them, so that lowers his rating in the city while mine goes up.
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Feb 27, 2015 14:01
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Spermy Smurf posted:You are pretty much correct. The only issue is that people can only be fed a certain amount, so even if I bring 300 food to them, they'll only like me for the part they eat which is usually the first 5 or 6. The best way to do it is to actually trade/philosopher with them before you take them over. Then they will already know of your civilization and develop an affinity for you which makes them like you a bit more so when you do take them over you can just cram food down their throats and in one turn the city will be yours. The issue I had is "try to survive" which botched that plan right from the start. This is known as the McDonald's-Hollywood Gambit in chess.
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Feb 27, 2015 14:08
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Haha, Sierra doesn't like India much I take it.
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Feb 27, 2015 14:13
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Fast forward to turn 85 This is how I move my armies. Every single one of them. Seriously. I do this to 12-15 armies per turn, the others are auto-moving themselves to band together and then I get to do this with that big band.  The Gif starts with me cancelling the "dig in and defend" order on a group of 3 horses. Things have gone well against Lief, I'm now using his captured cities to crank out light infantry, combine them, and send them to take more cities. Apparently Lief has like 5000 cities or something because the dudes keep coming out of the mist. It's incredible and annoying. I've turned it around against the barbarians. My cities defected back to me which helped, and I've got 3 horse armies and Stampy2.0 who is being backed up by 10 infantry. I'm now pushing south and trying to crank out as many horses as I can from all of my top cities and send half of them left against Lief and the other half south against the Barbarians.
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Feb 27, 2015 14:35
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Mini-update, turn 86 to show you what I missed with screenshots from turn 79 till now Yay a mudslide took out a newly created unit in one of Liefs old cities. It's a fight to keep these, they really like Lief so I'll have to park an army in them sometime. The problem is that a city cannot feed an army that is 100% within the city. If the army steps 1 tile outside of the city, the populace is able to feed the army and itself just fine. I have no idea why. This makes me have to find a fine balance between "army big enough to stop them from defecting" and "army small enough to not starve and not starve the population while inside the walls." Remember that 3 population city from ages ago? Still 3 pop.  My armies are pushing south, taking cities and destroying Barbarian cavalry. I'm losing a lot of heavy cavalry doing it though. They have stacks of 4-5 light cavalry and I lose 2-3 Heavy Cavalry every time I hit those armies of theirs.  I can't kill every single army he throws at me, so I go on the offensive and take a few cities. He'll waste troops trying to take them back now that I'm in the defensive 'dig in' mode.
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Feb 27, 2015 14:57
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Turns 86 to 91 The map as it stands now. I think I'm close to the end. Lief can't have many more cities. One thing that confuses me is that we had 4 civilizations. I've only seen three types of cities so far. Someone is missing, and as far as I can tell their cities must have been wiped completely off the map.  Pushing south, snagging more cities. The waves of barbarian cavalry have slowed dramatically. I used to take 4-5 attacks on my dug-in armies when I hit end turn, but now it's 1 or 2 max.  Stupid peasants don't understand that I'm a benevolent and caring ruler. Now I have to go kill a few hundred again to prove my benevolence. Holy poo poo that's a word; it didn't underline so it's a word.  A barbarian horse ran into the fray. Just where he wants to be; between Lief's crappy armies and my hammers that will crush them all next turn.  Ugh, more cities to the left.  Starving armies really suck. The towns are too small to hold them and feed them, so I lose a few units out of the army to starvation every turn.  Yes, I get it. They hate me.  This may seem like overkill for 2 units of enemy horses, but I'm sick of it already.  I snag Lief's towns to the left and find even more over there.  These used to be Lief's towns. Now they are mine and producing a respectable army.  I know, stop it stop it stop it   This is what happens when you gently caress up and don't leave any movement points for your army to get outside the city walls. Starving populace and a starving army. If I was one tile away everyone would be fed and happy. But nooooooo  I lose and retake cities like it's my job up with Lief's towns.  Lief's ex-towns created a large army in just two turns. Time to send them into the fight. They aren't pure-blood Indians like we are, so they're very expendable. They'll be the ones to cross the desert and starve.  Stampy2.0 hanging out with his crew, stomping barbarians and poo poo.  See that little snake-looking thing up-left of the cursor? That used to be a town. I wiped it off the map with my last attack. I didn't even know that was possible.  Ending map
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Feb 27, 2015 18:03
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I could have finished a while ago, but here's a gif of how long my "end turn" button is now. It's pretty big so I'm linking. http://i.imgur.com/pGWL1lE.gif And the smaller gifv http://i.imgur.com/pGWL1lE.gifv
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Feb 27, 2015 20:21
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Alright, 9 posts in a row but whatever. Finally finishing!  Lief ran and hid, or maybe this was his starting island?  Barbarians come to trouble me on the left side of the map.  I am nearly done making the Wonder of the World: Great Shiva!  Barbarians land, and it takes 2 full armies of heavy cavalry to kill them. Holy poo poo.  Created the wonder of the world, the incredible Great Shiva!  When i click it the virtual machine sorta skips, so there must be some kind of sound but since it's a virtual machine I cant really get the sound.  They hate me, so I park an army there and starve the populace. gently caress 'em.  This one loves me.  Stampy2.0 and crew head to the island to stomp some Celts.  I was just sitting there minding my own business and fricken barbarian ships came and tore up some boats. I killed them next turn, it was just 2 ships.  And then I finished him off by taking the last city that defected. What an underwhelming finish. 
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Feb 27, 2015 21:33
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Congratulations. A Winner is You! Play Again? God. Sierra was just hitting the  button towards the end there, huh?
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Feb 27, 2015 21:37
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Christ, that's a mess. What does the wonder do? Just be neat?
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Feb 27, 2015 22:00
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Arcturas posted:Christ, that's a mess. What does the wonder do? Just be neat? Supposedly it helps my cities love me and other civilizations will gain affinity toward me if they are close enough to the Wonder. And yes, the game screen is a huge mess. Most of it is my fault. I could have stopped my cities from sending troops automatically which is what half the problem was, but it's just so annoying to click back into the cities I just let them go.
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Feb 27, 2015 22:04
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Spermy Smurf posted:Alright, 9 posts in a row but whatever. I think everybody was just waiting for you to put the AI out of its misery. Not much to add besides things like "Don't forget to build more horsies" and "Hope you don't lose too many troops taking those worthless towns in the desert/mountains."  But yeah, good job.  You reminded/showed us all that no matter how bland and uninspired strategy games can get, there was always this one first.Arcturas posted:Christ, that's a mess. What does the wonder do? Just be neat? I don't remember Stonehenge (the Celt Wonder) making a lick of difference when I played. Then again, I didn't have the starvation/rebellion issues Smurf did either, so maybe it did grant a "pacification" bonus of some kind?
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Feb 27, 2015 22:21
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I never doubted you or the might of India for a second. Great job!
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Feb 28, 2015 01:18
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There was no way I would have the patience to fight 3 other civs. That was brutal. One was bad enough. I am glad the barbarians did what they did.
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Feb 28, 2015 01:49
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Hopefully not stepping on Spermy's feet, but since it's a Win95 one of the big selling points were the videos, which are all here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6HNP2h4T6Y I believe the final video clip is supposed to be the clip for winning the game. But all those videos would play constantly as stuff happened. Got annoying real quick.
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Feb 28, 2015 01:58
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Dang. Yeah, that really felt like an anticlimax.
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Mar 2, 2015 20:51
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I can hardly believe you finished that game, there were so many moments I would have given up, it looked so incredibly tedious. And I'm guessing the ending video not showing is due to emulation, it's really disappointing otherwise. The barbarians is the strangest thing with this game though, I could understand a few units spawning, but that endless flood of them kills the game. Surely they had enough QA testing to know that might be an issue, and simply tone down some values? Enjoyed the LP all the same though, good job.
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Mar 2, 2015 21:31
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Zyrden posted:I can hardly believe you finished that game, there were so many moments I would have given up, it looked so incredibly tedious. And I'm guessing the ending video not showing is due to emulation, it's really disappointing otherwise. My 13 year old self would have been angry at my 32 year old self if I quit. Time to go dig out a bunch of other games from the back of the closet and finish those. This one seems to be calling my name. Top down Dark Suns game, Thri-Kreen or some poo poo... insect warriors and giants and terrible animations.
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Mar 2, 2015 21:37
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