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Oxxidation
Jul 22, 2007

Jerusalem posted:

"We" can't agree on anything!

I personally still think The Eleventh Hour is a great introduction to the show, while Deep Breath definitely is not. The Eleventh Hour, by dint of being a brand new regeneration with a brand new showrunner with brand new companions in a brand new story is great because it doesn't require any excess baggage or explanations for the new viewer. Everybody gets exposed to this wonderful fairytale madman on the same level, and by the end the thumping music as the camera pans over to the wedding dress is such a great way of hooking the viewer into seeing what happens next. That's why I also still think Rose is a good intro, with the caveat that it had aged pretty horribly even 5 years ago, and only looks worse now.

Deep Breath has a good second half but a pretty appalling first half, and it's dragging a lot of baggage with it in terms of continuity and character. It's a little like The Christmas Invasion in that so much of it is NOT about the Doctor (and then he completely dominates the ending), which is still an interesting perspective but leaves any new viewer basically in the dark as to whether they would like to regularly watch this guy as the lead actor in a regular series.

I thought the first half of Deep Breath was hilarious, Vastra's pompous old-mentor bullshit notwithstanding, but out of all the series openers it might be the single worst one in the revival to introduce someone to the series since it's all about Clara's sudden character development in the face of adversity. Even The Impossible Astronaut has a lot of great moodiness and atmosphere to carry a confused new viewer through. Deep Breath's got almost nothing on offer if you don't have any familiarity with the characters and care little for ridiculous slapstick and anatomically improbable dinosaurs.

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Oxxidation
Jul 22, 2007

Big Mean Jerk posted:

Deep Breath is self-indulgent Moffat garbage. It's amazing.

There's no better garbage than indulgent garbage.

Oxxidation
Jul 22, 2007

DoctorWhat posted:

I DID IT

I "LET ZYGONS BE BYGONES"-D HIM

LET'S SEE HOW HE REACTS

Toxx would like me to inform you that I made that joke no less than three times during our viewing of this episode. Thank you, and good night.

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