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zoux posted:Dad, why did you bring me to a gay pizza parlor? The best way to protest this would be to make pizza the traditional food of gay weddings. Maybe it could become the stereotypical gay food. Scrub-Niggurath posted:All I see is a Small Business Owner being unfairly bullied and discriminated against for her religious beliefs "Excuse me, I know your restaurant is vegan, but I really want a steak. Oh and BTW, I'm gay so if I don't get it I'm going to sue you for discrimination."-How 50% of the country thinks this law works.
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Apr 1, 2015 17:31
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RevKrule posted:I just don't understand this. If the bill is just a reproduction of the federal law, why pass it anyway? Don't local laws just inherit the laws above them if there's nothing set? The federal law in this case doesn't apply to the states.
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Apr 1, 2015 17:32
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CommieGIR posted:Don't forget, Indiana also just convicted a woman of killing her fetus when she tried to commit suicide: No, she didn't try to commit suicide, just threw the baby a dumpster after delivery. Although this was an educational article in that Asian Americans can be referred to as "people of color", did not realize that.
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Apr 1, 2015 17:34
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Internet Webguy posted:"Excuse me, I know your restaurant is vegan, but I really want a steak. Oh and BTW, I'm gay so if I don't get it I'm going to sue you for discrimination."-How 50% of the country thinks this law works. Once SCOTUS makes gays a protected class, though...
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Apr 1, 2015 17:37
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TheDisreputableDog posted:No, she didn't try to commit suicide, just threw the baby a dumpster after delivery. quote:"Purvi Patel's conviction amounts to punishment for having a miscarriage and then seeking medical care, something that no woman should worry would lead to jail time," said Deepa Iyer, Activist-in-Residence at the University of Maryland's Asian American Studies Program and former director of South Asian Americans Leading Together. Different case, same state.
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Apr 1, 2015 17:39
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CommieGIR posted:Don't forget, Indiana also just convicted a woman of killing her fetus when she tried to commit suicide: Where are you getting suicide from?
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Apr 1, 2015 17:39
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The governor of Arkansas ordered the legislature rethink the religious freedom bill BEFORE he signed it? So Arkansas > Indiana now?
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Apr 1, 2015 17:39
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Samurai Sanders posted:The governor of Arkansas ordered the legislature rethink the religious freedom bill BEFORE he signed it? So Arkansas > Indiana now? What the gently caress is the statutory criteria for "rethinking".
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Apr 1, 2015 17:40
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Samurai Sanders posted:The governor of Arkansas ordered the legislature rethink the religious freedom bill BEFORE he signed it? So Arkansas > Indiana now? Hey, it's not too often that Arkansas can find a state to be less backwards than.
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Apr 1, 2015 17:40
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Spaceman Future! posted:There is no recourse against the Koch brothers Actually, yeah, there is  
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Apr 1, 2015 17:40
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Accretionist posted:Where are you getting suicide from? It was a different case, same state: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bei_Bei_Shuai Either way, we're charging someone who has a miscarriage, largely criminalizing miscarriages. Regardless, this is setting a dangerous trend, and in Tennessee, they've enacted a law where women who use drugs while pregnant will go to jail after the birth, largely criminalizing someone who needs help and counseling, not prison time and a record. quote:Shuai's case is the first in the history of Indiana in which a woman is prosecuted for murder for a suicide attempt while pregnant.[6] The feticide statute under which she is also prosecuted was intended, when enacted in 1979, to cover acts by violent third parties such as abusive boyfriends.[4] Women's groups in the U.S. warned that Shuai's prosecution could set a precedent for criminalizing a pregnant woman's actions, such as smoking or drinking, or having a miscarriage.[4] The problem with the case I linked is that multiple states are starting to prosecute stillbirths and miscarriages. That is the issue at hand. CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 17:45 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 17:41
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Samurai Sanders posted:The governor of Arkansas ordered the legislature rethink the religious freedom bill BEFORE he signed it? So Arkansas > Indiana now? arkansas has always been a liberal bastion compared to indiana at least Arkansas bothered to secede before it fought against The Union
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Apr 1, 2015 17:42
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Internet Webguy posted:The best way to protest this would be to make pizza the traditional food of gay weddings. Maybe it could become the stereotypical gay food. I've been calling for it to be a thing that gay weddings have hookahs full of pot for a while now. They would be the gay wedding what an open bar is to irish ones. A pizza buffet would go along well with that.
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Apr 1, 2015 17:43
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Fried Chicken posted:We had 100+ years of "no colored allowed" signs being fine and dandy, I don't see posting a "no gays allowed" sign having any more of an impact. The thing I think you're missing here is that unlike things like systemic racism, incarceration rates and so on, things like lynching and exclusionary signs are Clear and Obvious signs of racism to even the most ignorant of folks.
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Apr 1, 2015 17:46
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Samurai Sanders posted:The governor of Arkansas ordered the legislature rethink the religious freedom bill BEFORE he signed it? So Arkansas > Indiana now? TBF we expect this from literal shithole Arkansas. I spent an afternoon going to the Clinton library on a road trip once and the first thing I saw when I crossed the bridge from Memphis was a guy straight out of Duck Dynasty and a black teenager in one of those road crew outfits from community service chase a dog across a busy I-40W. The dog stopped at the grass median, looked at the both of them, and immediately ran in front of a semi truck. My first and most riveting experience in Arkansas was watching a dog commit suicide so it wouldn't have to be in Arkansas anymore. edit: The Clinton Library sells mousepads of Socks's face though, so it wasn't all terrible. Business Gorillas fucked around with this message at 17:50 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 17:47
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CommieGIR posted:It was a different case, same state: Last time this stuff came up there were articles from Latin America and South America basically confirming this practice as being par for the course for poo poo-headed anti-abortion countries (and states). Of course it was mostly poor women who were charged, but it was causing people to hide miscarriages and not seek medical treatment.
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Apr 1, 2015 17:49
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zoux posted:What the gently caress is the statutory criteria for "rethinking". It's a term meaning the walmart executives don't want the bill. http://m.kait8.com/kait8/db_330534/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=qWan4dh5
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Apr 1, 2015 17:50
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Ron Jeremy posted:It's a term meaning the walmart executives don't want the bill. edit: Is Indiana still considered a swing state? Samurai Sanders fucked around with this message at 17:54 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 17:51
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Samurai Sanders posted:
Indiana has been a swing state one time in the past fifty years. I think it is safe to consider '08 an anomoly.
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Apr 1, 2015 17:57
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Solkanar512 posted:The thing I think you're missing here is that unlike things like systemic racism, incarceration rates and so on, things like lynching and exclusionary signs are Clear and Obvious signs of racism to even the most ignorant of folks. The thing you are missing is that the proposal is that they put up those same exclusionary signs that are Clear and Obvious signs of bigotry even the most ignorant of folks and somehow thinking this clear and obvious sign will be different from that clear and obvious sign. Try reading the exchange before snarking
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Apr 1, 2015 18:08
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RevKrule posted:I just don't understand this. If the bill is just a reproduction of the federal law, why pass it anyway? Don't local laws just inherit the laws above them if there's nothing set?
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Apr 1, 2015 18:10
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So we have an exclusive on the "new" RFRA http://www.indystar.com/story/news/politics/2015/04/01/indiana-rfra-deal-sets-limited-protections-for-lgbt/70766920/ Key points: 1) the bill was literally written by "business leaders". The Indiana senate went to them, had them outline what they wanted, wrote it, and then went back to let them vet the language. This is also with Pence describing himself as CEO of the state and the Republicans denouncing the bill on the grounds that it is governments job to help businesses and that they should have had "business leaders" write the bill the first time. So yeah, flat out channeling Mussolini. 2) offered protections to customers, none to employees, which was one of the big points made of the existing bill. I'm shocked that "business leaders" made a point to preserve their expanded power over employees, shocked I tell you. 3) does appear to drop a heavy protection against discrimination for customers on for profit businesses so that good 4) this is preliminary language, yet to be studied by lawyers, so we will see 5) the leak to the star could be an attempt to disrupt the change; we'll see how this shakes out because it still needs to pass committee, senate, house, and pence.
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Apr 1, 2015 18:17
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Fried Chicken posted:The thing you are missing is that the proposal is that they put up those same exclusionary signs that are Clear and Obvious signs of bigotry even the most ignorant of folks and somehow thinking this clear and obvious sign will be different from that clear and obvious sign. Try reading the exchange before snarking I'm not being snarky, I'm sorry I came across that way. I read the exchange, and I disagree. If the backlash is bad from simply announcing that one's small business is going to be bigoted, the backlash about having a sign will be worse. Such provisions actually prevented similar laws from being passed in Arizona, I believe.
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Apr 1, 2015 18:20
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Fried Chicken posted:So we have an exclusive on the "new" RFRA That's funny considering the people who helped write the bill:  EDIT: I just noticed we're talking about the "New RFRA". My Mistake. CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 18:27 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 18:21
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Fried Chicken posted:So we have an exclusive on the "new" RFRA The writeup appears to suggest that only churches and other religious non-profits are allowed to discriminate but that businesses providing services used in religious ceremonies cannot discriminate. Since that's the reason the right is pushing these new RFRA bills, expect a violent backlash from the Tea Party if that's what the final language ends up being.
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Apr 1, 2015 18:22
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CommieGIR posted:That's funny considering the people who helped write the bill: The new one is written by the "business leaders", the original version (the one in that picture) that is presently law was written by a social conservative bill mill with Eric Miller and the rest signing off on it before it went to the state GOP and got signed into law. Sorry if I was unclear there
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Apr 1, 2015 18:28
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So in the end, it was definitely the business interests that made the difference and not the human rights interests. I guess I'm not surprised, but I hope people there remember that if they think about bragging about how they pulled it together to keep this law from happening.
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Apr 1, 2015 18:30
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Joementum posted:The writeup appears to suggest that only churches and other religious non-profits are allowed to discriminate but that businesses providing services used in religious ceremonies cannot discriminate. Since that's the reason the right is pushing these new RFRA bills, expect a violent backlash from the Tea Party if that's what the final language ends up being. Yeah, and on top of that Steve Deace, the go-to-kiss-the-ring-grand-high-poobah of Iowa talk radio has declared that the Indiana RFRA should be a "litmus test" for the Iowa GOP primary. poo poo is going to get nuts
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Apr 1, 2015 18:31
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Fried Chicken posted:The new one is written by the "business leaders", the original version (the one in that picture) that is presently law was written by a social conservative bill mill with Eric Miller and the rest signing off on it before it went to the state GOP and got signed into law. Sorry if I was unclear there No no, you were clear, I didn't read it properly. 
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Apr 1, 2015 18:32
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Samurai Sanders posted:So in the end, it was definitely the business interests that made the difference and not the human rights interests. I guess I'm not surprised, but I hope people there remember that if they think about bragging about how they pulled it together to keep this law from happening. The indy Dems have been pushing the "it's all about business, listen to business" line so I don't think that will be an issue.
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Apr 1, 2015 18:32
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God I hope a billion biggoted businesses speak out in support of the current bill before the wording is changed and their actions go back to being illegal. Its just ripe for so many life ending massive judgments the second they gently caress up after going on record like that, please please.
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Apr 1, 2015 18:33
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The Cultural Warrior writer Rob Dreher of the American Conservative is practically calling for a boycott of Walmart for obvious reasons. You know I may disagree with his reasons, but his arguing that this is the final showing that business is not in any way concerned for "tradition" is quite right.
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Apr 1, 2015 18:34
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CommieGIR posted:No no, you were clear, I didn't read it properly. No worries, I'm gonna use it to brings up the spin off of ALEC, ACCE, (which those shitheads are a part of) that generated the bill http://www.ibj.com/articles/52347-secretive-bill-mill-gets-local-foothold ACCE writes for smaller jurisdictions and pushes more of a social conservative edge. Plus ~*~rebranding~*~
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Apr 1, 2015 18:39
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Crowsbeak posted:The Cultural Warrior writer Rob Dreher of the American Conservative is practically calling for a boycott of Walmart for obvious reasons. You know I may disagree with his reasons, but his arguing that this is the final showing that business is not in any way concerned for "tradition" is quite right.
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Apr 1, 2015 18:40
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Samurai Sanders posted:So in the end, it was definitely the business interests that made the difference and not the human rights interests. I guess I'm not surprised, but I hope people there remember that if they think about bragging about how they pulled it together to keep this law from happening. You didn't think human rights issues would have any impact on republican politicians did you?
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Apr 1, 2015 18:50
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Samurai Sanders posted:So in the end, it was definitely the business interests that made the difference and not the human rights interests. I guess I'm not surprised, but I hope people there remember that if they think about bragging about how they pulled it together to keep this law from happening. Because I know some libertarianish people who will proclaim that this is proof that the free market winning out, I'm going to cut it off at the pass. It's not a free market victory because a group of businesses legislated the government to do something, instead of running their own business their way. I understand that the thought comes out of nowhere, but I just anticipate these sort of arguments these days.
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Apr 1, 2015 18:51
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I'd love for American conservatism to finally tear itself apart because of gay rights. It would be almost poetic.
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Apr 1, 2015 19:03
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baw posted:I'd love for American conservatism to finally tear itself apart because of gay rights. It would be almost poetic. Conservatism will never die. even if the libertarians take over the republican party, the religious right will not abandon them right away. It is important to remember that mainstream american libertarians - including the pauls and every other libertarian who has ever accumulated any political power - are more federalist/neo-confederate than anything. If the party leadership goes ostensibly ~pro-gay~, it will be expressed as sticking up for the States' Rights of hippies in Vermont and Oregon, not as any kind of imperative to fight for the civil liberties of americans. The religious right will gripe a bit but will ultimately be fine with the States' Rights line, as they will (accurately) interpret it as "we can still oppress the gays so long as we are able to take/maintain control over the state government", which they generally can in the states where they matter to begin with. A genuine fragmenting of the republican coalition would likely require the party leadership to veer left on most-every social issue - gay rights, black rights, immigration, weed, criminal justice reform, abortion, religious tolerance - all at once, while avoiding repercussions during primary season. The religious Right knows that the best way to move the needle in their direction is via primary, not abandoning the republican party and handing years worth of free victories to the democrats, who they hate. PupsOfWar fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 19:21
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baw posted:I'd love for American conservatism to finally tear itself apart because of gay rights. It would be almost poetic. I don't think that is what will do it if Civil Rights for black people didn't.
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Apr 1, 2015 19:24
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baw posted:I'd love for American conservatism to finally tear itself apart because of gay rights. It would be almost poetic. It'll never happen. (Or course, I never though GOProud would disband, so what do I know?) 
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Apr 1, 2015 19:25
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